From marco at metm.org Tue Sep 1 07:31:53 2009 From: marco at metm.org (Marco Scoffier) Date: Tue, 01 Sep 2009 07:31:53 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] UPS / battery backups In-Reply-To: <328101B2-DB7A-4B96-91F0-40A10996A726@kithalsted.com> References: <4A9C6B9D.8040604@kc8onw.net> <328101B2-DB7A-4B96-91F0-40A10996A726@kithalsted.com> Message-ID: <4A9D0629.9010902@metm.org> Hi Kit, I think you may be comparing old backup unit to new backup unit. You have to replace the batteries every 2 years on any backup unit. Most people don't, but if you want to guarantee the uptime you must. The APC units even the smaller ones make replacement relatively easy, and you can easily find reduced prices on batteries for the APC. Not so sure about the two models you mention. I found a bunch of APC's in the trash and have been replacing the batteries for years. Marco Kit Halsted wrote: > After the 3rd time my old APC took down my entire rack, I replaced it > with either a CyberPower or a Tripp LIte. I'm a little foggy now, as a > month earlier my other ancient APC had started taking down my home > entertainment stuff, so I replaced that with the other brand. Either > one is *way* better bang for the buck than APC. > > I will never use another APC unit after seeing them fail this way. > (I.e. wall power still working fine, but UPS stops supplying power.) > Kinda defeats the purpose of buying one in the first place, no? > > Okay, I looked. I bought a 485VA CyberPower on sale at Staples to use > with my AV gear and a Tripp Lite Smart 1000 LCD 1KVA unit from New Egg > for my rack. The big one was right around $150 shipped. It's not > rackable, but the LED does rotate for horizontal or vertical > deployment. It did well in the recent double-whammy power outage we > had here, keeping me on teh Intarwebs in spite of the darkness. > > Cheers, HTH, > -Kit > > On Aug 31, 2009, at 7:32 PM, Jonathan wrote: > > >> Does anyone have recommendations for a good UPS for home use? I'm >> looking for something that can handle at least 800 watts. I've come >> to >> the realization that unfortunately I'm not going to get much runtime >> at >> that level of power draw but I'm alright with that. >> >> Thanks, >> Jonathan >> _______________________________________________ >> talk mailing list >> talk at lists.nycbug.org >> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From matt at atopia.net Tue Sep 1 14:35:28 2009 From: matt at atopia.net (Matt Juszczak) Date: Tue, 1 Sep 2009 14:35:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Considering BSD-based desktop Message-ID: Hi all, I used to run with FreeBSD 4.x with xfce. It worked quite well, but I ended up switching to Ubuntu 7.x, which is now end of life. I'm considering the upgrade to Ubuntu 9.x, but would really really like that FreeBSD based system back. What I didn't like that made me switch was: - Lack of ability to easily get flash running - Lack of tethering support with Verizon (I have a blackberry I use to tether, and got it working in Ubuntu) - Lack of ease to play DVD's. Like FreeBSD for servers, Ubuntu sort of just "works" as a desktop machine. But I do miss the ports collection and all the fun FreeBSDisms that make me love the OS. Can anyone recommend a setup they've used that works well and could potentially allow me to especially get #2 working? (Tethering with Verizon Blackberry). Thanks! -Matt From cwolsen at ubixos.com Tue Sep 1 15:35:43 2009 From: cwolsen at ubixos.com (Christopher Olsen) Date: Tue, 1 Sep 2009 15:35:43 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Considering BSD-based desktop In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <005c01ca2b3b$65df7a90$319e6fb0$@com> I use gnome on my network with FreeBSD 8-BETA3 (FBSD 7.2-STABLE will probably work as well) I can use linux firefox and linux flash there is no native flash support and Xine will play your dvds as far as tethering goes you will have to google about that :) I hope this helps... -Christopher -----Original Message----- From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Matt Juszczak Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 2:35 PM To: talk at lists.nycbug.org Subject: [nycbug-talk] Considering BSD-based desktop Hi all, I used to run with FreeBSD 4.x with xfce. It worked quite well, but I ended up switching to Ubuntu 7.x, which is now end of life. I'm considering the upgrade to Ubuntu 9.x, but would really really like that FreeBSD based system back. What I didn't like that made me switch was: - Lack of ability to easily get flash running - Lack of tethering support with Verizon (I have a blackberry I use to tether, and got it working in Ubuntu) - Lack of ease to play DVD's. Like FreeBSD for servers, Ubuntu sort of just "works" as a desktop machine. But I do miss the ports collection and all the fun FreeBSDisms that make me love the OS. Can anyone recommend a setup they've used that works well and could potentially allow me to especially get #2 working? (Tethering with Verizon Blackberry). Thanks! -Matt _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From marco at metm.org Wed Sep 2 08:30:08 2009 From: marco at metm.org (Marco Scoffier) Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 08:30:08 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] wed meeting In-Reply-To: <4A9BD677.4010508@metm.org> References: <4A9AA1F9.60900@ceetonetechnology.com> <5029D3A8-84C6-4CEE-97C0-CAA11DE469E5@fetissov.org> <4A9BD677.4010508@metm.org> Message-ID: <4A9E6550.8020702@metm.org> So. Yet again a meeting has been moved. I can't make tonight's meeting. If someone else has an audio recorder that would be great. Marco Marco Scoffier wrote: > I am definitely going to try to make this one. > I will bring my audio recorder. > > Marco > > Nikolai Fetissov wrote: > >> Folks, >> >> Unfortunatly I can't make it to this meeting. >> I'd really really appreciate if somebody could take over the audio >> recording. >> >> Cheers, >> -- >> Nikolai >> >> On Aug 30, 2009, at 11:59 AM, George Rosamond > > wrote: >> >> >> >>> good meeting this week. . . >>> >>> Wednesday, September 02, 2009 >>> >>> Jeffrey Hsu on How to Get Started with Kernel Programming >>> >>> 6:45 PM, Suspenders Restaurant >>> >>> http://www.suspendersbar.com/location.php >>> >>> This talk is intended to introduce kernel programming for the absolute >>> novice. We will cover: >>> >>> # basic setup >>> # building and booting test kernels >>> # how to write your first system call >>> # a quick overview of the major subsystems including >>> # kernel locking and synchronization primitives >>> # device drivers >>> # VFS layer >>> # memory allocation >>> # networking >>> >>> Bio >>> >>> Jeffrey M. Hsu became a member the FreeBSD project in 1994 as one of >>> its >>> first 10 committers. He has contributed to many sections of the >>> operating system in areas such as the networking stack, Java, and a >>> large number of the early ports in the language category. He has >>> worked >>> professionally on FreeBSD and NetBSD was offered commit bits to both >>> the >>> OpenBSD and DragonFlyBSD projects when they were first being formed >>> and >>> is active in the DragonFlyBSD project today. He holds a degree from >>> U.C. >>> Berkeley in computer science. >>> >>> In the past, he has consulted for leading companies such as the >>> Western >>> Software Laboratory division of Digital Equipment Corporation, Cygnus, >>> Encanto, Netscape, ClickArray, Palm, Wasabi, and Cisco Systems. >>> Jeffrey >>> enjoys giving talks and meeting BSD enthusiasts all over the world. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> announce mailing list >>> announce at lists.nycbug.org >>> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/announce >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> talk mailing list >>> talk at lists.nycbug.org >>> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> talk mailing list >> talk at lists.nycbug.org >> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From lists at kithalsted.com Wed Sep 2 14:52:06 2009 From: lists at kithalsted.com (Kit Halsted) Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2009 13:52:06 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] UPS / battery backups In-Reply-To: <4A9D0629.9010902@metm.org> References: <4A9C6B9D.8040604@kc8onw.net> <328101B2-DB7A-4B96-91F0-40A10996A726@kithalsted.com> <4A9D0629.9010902@metm.org> Message-ID: Hi Marco, I am most definitely comparing old to new, but: I still find it completely unacceptable that the APC units can *cause* a power loss. Again, they stopped supplying power to the things plugged into them while they were still getting power from the wall. The least expensive batteries I could find for the 1kVA APC were about $55 apiece before shipping, or about $130 shipped for the pair. It was worth $20 to go from beige to black. Cheers, -Kit On Sep 1, 2009, at 6:31 AM, Marco Scoffier wrote: > Hi Kit, > > I think you may be comparing old backup unit to new backup unit. > You have to replace the batteries every 2 years on any backup unit. > Most people don't, but if you want to guarantee the uptime you > must. The APC units even the smaller ones make replacement > relatively easy, and you can easily find reduced prices on batteries > for the APC. Not so sure about the two models you mention. > > I found a bunch of APC's in the trash and have been replacing the > batteries for years. > > Marco > > Kit Halsted wrote: >> After the 3rd time my old APC took down my entire rack, I replaced >> it with either a CyberPower or a Tripp LIte. I'm a little foggy >> now, as a month earlier my other ancient APC had started taking >> down my home entertainment stuff, so I replaced that with the >> other brand. Either one is *way* better bang for the buck than APC. >> >> I will never use another APC unit after seeing them fail this way. >> (I.e. wall power still working fine, but UPS stops supplying >> power.) Kinda defeats the purpose of buying one in the first >> place, no? >> >> Okay, I looked. I bought a 485VA CyberPower on sale at Staples to >> use with my AV gear and a Tripp Lite Smart 1000 LCD 1KVA unit from >> New Egg for my rack. The big one was right around $150 shipped. >> It's not rackable, but the LED does rotate for horizontal or >> vertical deployment. It did well in the recent double-whammy power >> outage we had here, keeping me on teh Intarwebs in spite of the >> darkness. >> >> Cheers, HTH, >> -Kit >> >> On Aug 31, 2009, at 7:32 PM, Jonathan wrote: >> >> >>> Does anyone have recommendations for a good UPS for home use? I'm >>> looking for something that can handle at least 800 watts. I've >>> come to >>> the realization that unfortunately I'm not going to get much >>> runtime at >>> that level of power draw but I'm alright with that. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Jonathan >>> _______________________________________________ >>> talk mailing list >>> talk at lists.nycbug.org >>> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> talk mailing list >> talk at lists.nycbug.org >> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >> > > From yds at CoolRat.org Thu Sep 3 16:51:55 2009 From: yds at CoolRat.org (Yarema) Date: Thu, 03 Sep 2009 16:51:55 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] fave BSD tips/tricks? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4AA02C6B.5010209@CoolRat.org> Dru Lavigne wrote: > > I'm finishing up an article for BSD mag on BSD tips and tricks. Anyone > have a favourite tip or trick they'd like to see in this article? Too late for the article, I know.. But one of my favorite "tricks" for configuring network interfaces on FreeBSD is to rename the interfaces. Something like this (taken from my home server): ifconfig_sk0_name="wan0" ifconfig_re0_name="lan0" ifconfig_wan0="DHCP polling" ifconfig_lan0="polling" ipv4_addrs_lan0="192.168.1.1-2/24" dhcpd_ifaces="lan0" ... &c. &c. The upside is that I no longer have to worry that pf.conf will break because I no longer need to use the ext_if = "sk0" int_if = "re0" convention. I don't even define the (ex|in)t_if macros. Instead I just refer to the interfaces by their new names in all the rules. And if appropriate I can copy pf.conf from one machine to another and I know it'll work even if the drivers are different. This leaves only one place where the driver name is referenced, the rename variable. No more search & replace across multiple files if I swap interface cards or motherboards and the like. Before I started using this trick I'd invariably forget to change it somewhere and then I'd be wondering why dhcpd or somesuch is no longer working with my new hardware. :) Here's another example from one of my carped firewall boxen: cloned_interfaces="carp0 carp1 carp2" ifconfig_re0_name="wan0" ifconfig_re1_name="lan0" ifconfig_re2_name="lan1" ifconfig_vr0_name="sync0" ifconfig_wan0="polling" ifconfig_lan0="polling" ifconfig_lan1="polling" ifconfig_sync0="polling" pfsync_enable="YES" # Expose pf state to other hosts for syncing pfsync_syncdev="sync0" # Interface for pfsync to work through Makes the output of `ifconfig -a` much more sensible too.. -- Yarema From nikolai at fetissov.org Fri Sep 4 09:18:21 2009 From: nikolai at fetissov.org (nikolai) Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2009 09:18:21 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] wed meeting In-Reply-To: <4A9E6550.8020702@metm.org> References: <4A9AA1F9.60900@ceetonetechnology.com> <5029D3A8-84C6-4CEE-97C0-CAA11DE469E5@fetissov.org> <4A9BD677.4010508@metm.org> <4A9E6550.8020702@metm.org> Message-ID: Did anybody record the presentation? Thanks, -- Nikolai > So. Yet again a meeting has been moved. > I can't make tonight's meeting. > If someone else has an audio recorder that would be great. > > Marco > > Marco Scoffier wrote: >> I am definitely going to try to make this one. >> I will bring my audio recorder. >> >> Marco >> >> Nikolai Fetissov wrote: >> >>> Folks, >>> >>> Unfortunatly I can't make it to this meeting. >>> I'd really really appreciate if somebody could take over the audio >>> recording. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> -- >>> Nikolai >>> >>> On Aug 30, 2009, at 11:59 AM, George Rosamond >>> >> > wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> good meeting this week. . . >>>> >>>> Wednesday, September 02, 2009 >>>> >>>> Jeffrey Hsu on How to Get Started with Kernel Programming >>>> >>>> 6:45 PM, Suspenders Restaurant >>>> >>>> http://www.suspendersbar.com/location.php >>>> >>>> This talk is intended to introduce kernel programming for the absolute >>>> novice. We will cover: >>>> >>>> # basic setup >>>> # building and booting test kernels >>>> # how to write your first system call >>>> # a quick overview of the major subsystems including >>>> # kernel locking and synchronization primitives >>>> # device drivers >>>> # VFS layer >>>> # memory allocation >>>> # networking >>>> >>>> Bio >>>> >>>> Jeffrey M. Hsu became a member the FreeBSD project in 1994 as one of >>>> its >>>> first 10 committers. He has contributed to many sections of the >>>> operating system in areas such as the networking stack, Java, and a >>>> large number of the early ports in the language category. He has >>>> worked >>>> professionally on FreeBSD and NetBSD was offered commit bits to both >>>> the >>>> OpenBSD and DragonFlyBSD projects when they were first being formed >>>> and >>>> is active in the DragonFlyBSD project today. He holds a degree from >>>> U.C. >>>> Berkeley in computer science. >>>> >>>> In the past, he has consulted for leading companies such as the >>>> Western >>>> Software Laboratory division of Digital Equipment Corporation, Cygnus, >>>> Encanto, Netscape, ClickArray, Palm, Wasabi, and Cisco Systems. >>>> Jeffrey >>>> enjoys giving talks and meeting BSD enthusiasts all over the world. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> announce mailing list >>>> announce at lists.nycbug.org >>>> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/announce >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> talk mailing list >>>> talk at lists.nycbug.org >>>> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> talk mailing list >>> talk at lists.nycbug.org >>> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> talk mailing list >> talk at lists.nycbug.org >> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >> > > From george at ceetonetechnology.com Fri Sep 4 09:29:53 2009 From: george at ceetonetechnology.com (George Rosamond) Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2009 09:29:53 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] wed meeting In-Reply-To: References: <4A9AA1F9.60900@ceetonetechnology.com> <5029D3A8-84C6-4CEE-97C0-CAA11DE469E5@fetissov.org> <4A9BD677.4010508@metm.org> <4A9E6550.8020702@metm.org> Message-ID: <4AA11651.7050601@ceetonetechnology.com> nikolai wrote: > Did anybody record the presentation? > Thanks, Yes. . . Bill did, and he should be emailing the raw audio at some point. (Bill. . .I need to hit you offlist about something else, and don't know your email addr. . so email me) g From billtotman at billtotman.com Fri Sep 4 09:32:36 2009 From: billtotman at billtotman.com (billtotman at billtotman.com) Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2009 13:32:36 +0000 Subject: [nycbug-talk] wed meeting In-Reply-To: References: <4A9AA1F9.60900@ceetonetechnology.com><5029D3A8-84C6-4CEE-97C0-CAA11DE469E5@fetissov.org><4A9BD677.4010508@metm.org> <4A9E6550.8020702@metm.org> Message-ID: <1496636320-1252072037-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-442225165-@bda446.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Hi Nikolai, I have it. I haven't proofed it yet but I figured I would pass it to you for inspection and/or posting. Let me know how you prefer to retrieve it. Thanks, Bill Sent via BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "nikolai" Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2009 09:18:21 To: NYC*BUG Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] wed meeting Did anybody record the presentation? Thanks, -- Nikolai > So. Yet again a meeting has been moved. > I can't make tonight's meeting. > If someone else has an audio recorder that would be great. > > Marco > > Marco Scoffier wrote: >> I am definitely going to try to make this one. >> I will bring my audio recorder. >> >> Marco >> >> Nikolai Fetissov wrote: >> >>> Folks, >>> >>> Unfortunatly I can't make it to this meeting. >>> I'd really really appreciate if somebody could take over the audio >>> recording. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> -- >>> Nikolai >>> >>> On Aug 30, 2009, at 11:59 AM, George Rosamond >>> >> > wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> good meeting this week. . . >>>> >>>> Wednesday, September 02, 2009 >>>> >>>> Jeffrey Hsu on How to Get Started with Kernel Programming >>>> >>>> 6:45 PM, Suspenders Restaurant >>>> >>>> http://www.suspendersbar.com/location.php >>>> >>>> This talk is intended to introduce kernel programming for the absolute >>>> novice. We will cover: >>>> >>>> # basic setup >>>> # building and booting test kernels >>>> # how to write your first system call >>>> # a quick overview of the major subsystems including >>>> # kernel locking and synchronization primitives >>>> # device drivers >>>> # VFS layer >>>> # memory allocation >>>> # networking >>>> >>>> Bio >>>> >>>> Jeffrey M. Hsu became a member the FreeBSD project in 1994 as one of >>>> its >>>> first 10 committers. He has contributed to many sections of the >>>> operating system in areas such as the networking stack, Java, and a >>>> large number of the early ports in the language category. He has >>>> worked >>>> professionally on FreeBSD and NetBSD was offered commit bits to both >>>> the >>>> OpenBSD and DragonFlyBSD projects when they were first being formed >>>> and >>>> is active in the DragonFlyBSD project today. He holds a degree from >>>> U.C. >>>> Berkeley in computer science. >>>> >>>> In the past, he has consulted for leading companies such as the >>>> Western >>>> Software Laboratory division of Digital Equipment Corporation, Cygnus, >>>> Encanto, Netscape, ClickArray, Palm, Wasabi, and Cisco Systems. >>>> Jeffrey >>>> enjoys giving talks and meeting BSD enthusiasts all over the world. >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> announce mailing list >>>> announce at lists.nycbug.org >>>> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/announce >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> talk mailing list >>>> talk at lists.nycbug.org >>>> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> talk mailing list >>> talk at lists.nycbug.org >>> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> talk mailing list >> talk at lists.nycbug.org >> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >> > > _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From yds at CoolRat.org Fri Sep 4 13:10:08 2009 From: yds at CoolRat.org (Yarema) Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2009 13:10:08 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] The Failure of the GPL Message-ID: <4AA149F0.10001@CoolRat.org> At the last meeting I was chatting with Marc about languages or some such and it brought to mind this article.. http://TinyURL.com/FailureOfTheGPL Particularly relevant to FreeBSD since the project is actively working on dropping GCC and replacing it with LLVM-clang, which is BSD licensed and in many ways much better than GCC. IMHO.. -- Yarema From o_sleep at belovedarctos.com Fri Sep 4 13:36:13 2009 From: o_sleep at belovedarctos.com (Bjorn Nelson) Date: Fri, 04 Sep 2009 13:36:13 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] The Failure of the GPL In-Reply-To: <4AA149F0.10001@CoolRat.org> References: <4AA149F0.10001@CoolRat.org> Message-ID: <4AA1500D.2040903@belovedarctos.com> Yarema wrote: > At the last meeting I was chatting with Marc about languages or some > such and it brought to mind this article.. > http://TinyURL.com/FailureOfTheGPL Particularly relevant to FreeBSD > since the project is actively working on dropping GCC and replacing it > with LLVM-clang, which is BSD licensed and in many ways much better than > GCC. IMHO.. > Is there an easier way to refer to this compiler? Borland C Microsoft C Sun Studio C Gnu C then... C Language front end for the Low Level Virtual Machine. From mark.saad at ymail.com Fri Sep 4 18:37:15 2009 From: mark.saad at ymail.com (Mark Saad) Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2009 22:37:15 +0000 Subject: [nycbug-talk] The Failure of the GPL Message-ID: <218605636-1252103948-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1711706940-@bda268.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Yarema Has anyone ever compaired clang to pcc. If my memory serves me right openbsd imported pcc to hopefully replace gcc . it would be good to see what each can offer . ------Original Message------ From: Yarema Sender: talk-bounces+mark.saad=ymail.com at lists.nycbug.org To: George Rosamond To: Isaac Levy To: Marc Spitzer Cc: talk at lists.nycbug.org Sent: Sep 4, 2009 1:10 PM Subject: [nycbug-talk] The Failure of the GPL At the last meeting I was chatting with Marc about languages or some such and it brought to mind this article.. http://TinyURL.com/FailureOfTheGPL Particularly relevant to FreeBSD since the project is actively working on dropping GCC and replacing it with LLVM-clang, which is BSD licensed and in many ways much better than GCC. IMHO.. -- Yarema _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk Mark Saad | mark.saad at ymail.com From nikolai at fetissov.org Sat Sep 5 21:06:28 2009 From: nikolai at fetissov.org (nikolai) Date: Sat, 5 Sep 2009 21:06:28 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] September 2009 meeting audio Message-ID: Folks, Thanks to Bill Totman the audio of Jeffrey M. Hsu presentation is available online at http://www.fetissov.org/public/nycbug/nycbug-09-02-09.mp3 Cheers, -- Nikolai From george at ceetonetechnology.com Mon Sep 7 10:36:09 2009 From: george at ceetonetechnology.com (George Rosamond) Date: Mon, 07 Sep 2009 10:36:09 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] September 2009 meeting audio In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4AA51A59.8010201@ceetonetechnology.com> nikolai wrote: > Folks, > > Thanks to Bill Totman the audio of Jeffrey M. Hsu presentation is > available online at > http://www.fetissov.org/public/nycbug/nycbug-09-02-09.mp3 > > Cheers, And cheers to both Bill and Nikolai on this. Jeffrey's slides are also online now: http://www.nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Home;SUBM=10234 g From skreuzer at exit2shell.com Tue Sep 8 12:29:04 2009 From: skreuzer at exit2shell.com (Steven Kreuzer) Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2009 12:29:04 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD git repository Message-ID: <529A47F9-481A-492D-83E3-CE48D92F1D4A@exit2shell.com> There has been some interest in git and I know at least one person who converted the FreeBSD ports repo into git. Fabien Thomas has created a mirror of the FreeBSD repository on gitorious. Its updated every 15 minutes. Main page: http://www.gitorious.com/freebsd/freebsd Head: http://www.gitorious.com/freebsd/freebsd/commits/master -- Steven Kreuzer http://www.exit2shell.com/~skreuzer From mikel.king at olivent.com Wed Sep 9 15:57:47 2009 From: mikel.king at olivent.com (Mikel King) Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 15:57:47 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Beta testers needed Message-ID: <149446A8-0BD6-4A5E-B3CA-671EBBE77115@olivent.com> Anyone interested in helping out with a replacement to BSD News please contact me off list directly. Regards, Mikel From drulavigne at sympatico.ca Thu Sep 10 13:07:43 2009 From: drulavigne at sympatico.ca (Dru Lavigne) Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 17:07:43 +0000 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Calling all BSD SysAdmins Message-ID: Please circulate widely, especially to those shops running BSD: If you have 30 minutes between now and October 16th, you can help the BSD Certification Group determine which real-world tasks should be assessed by the upcoming BSDP exam. Read on for details on how you can help. http://it.toolbox.com/blogs/bsd-guru/calling-all-bsd-sysadmins-34051 Cheers, Dru -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From yds at CoolRat.org Thu Sep 10 17:08:31 2009 From: yds at CoolRat.org (Yarema) Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 17:08:31 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Vintage Computer Festival East 6.0 Message-ID: <4AA96ACF.1070905@CoolRat.org> http://www.vintage.org/2009/east/ http://ArsTechnica.com/science/news/2009/09/visiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-centervisiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-center.ars Any NYC*BUGgers going/interested in going? It's in Jersey at http://www.infoAge.org/ -- Yarema From spork at bway.net Fri Sep 11 00:38:26 2009 From: spork at bway.net (Charles Sprickman) Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 00:38:26 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Vintage Computer Festival East 6.0 In-Reply-To: <4AA96ACF.1070905@CoolRat.org> References: <4AA96ACF.1070905@CoolRat.org> Message-ID: Arse Technica has a short article on this as well: http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2009/09/visiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-centervisiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-center.ars C On Thu, 10 Sep 2009, Yarema wrote: > http://www.vintage.org/2009/east/ > http://ArsTechnica.com/science/news/2009/09/visiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-centervisiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-center.ars > > Any NYC*BUGgers going/interested in going? > It's in Jersey at http://www.infoAge.org/ > > -- > Yarema > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From spork at bway.net Fri Sep 11 01:07:57 2009 From: spork at bway.net (Charles Sprickman) Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 01:07:57 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Vintage Computer Festival East 6.0 In-Reply-To: References: <4AA96ACF.1070905@CoolRat.org> Message-ID: Good god, I'm blind. Sorry for the repeat. On Fri, 11 Sep 2009, Charles Sprickman wrote: > Arse Technica has a short article on this as well: > > http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2009/09/visiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-centervisiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-center.ars > > C > > On Thu, 10 Sep 2009, Yarema wrote: > >> http://www.vintage.org/2009/east/ >> http://ArsTechnica.com/science/news/2009/09/visiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-centervisiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-center.ars >> >> Any NYC*BUGgers going/interested in going? >> It's in Jersey at http://www.infoAge.org/ >> >> -- >> Yarema >> _______________________________________________ >> talk mailing list >> talk at lists.nycbug.org >> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >> > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From robin.polak at gmail.com Fri Sep 11 10:29:40 2009 From: robin.polak at gmail.com (Robin Polak) Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 10:29:40 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Vintage Computer Festival East 6.0 In-Reply-To: References: <4AA96ACF.1070905@CoolRat.org> Message-ID: <551868240909110729n67995a89wf1a9f9f6bf139195@mail.gmail.com> I'm certainly going to go. Sounds like fun. On Fri, Sep 11, 2009 at 01:07, Charles Sprickman wrote: > Good god, I'm blind. Sorry for the repeat. > > On Fri, 11 Sep 2009, Charles Sprickman wrote: > > > Arse Technica has a short article on this as well: > > > > > http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2009/09/visiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-centervisiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-center.ars > > > > C > > > > On Thu, 10 Sep 2009, Yarema wrote: > > > >> http://www.vintage.org/2009/east/ > >> > http://ArsTechnica.com/science/news/2009/09/visiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-centervisiting-vintage-computers-at-a-brand-new-science-center.ars > >> > >> Any NYC*BUGgers going/interested in going? > >> It's in Jersey at http://www.infoAge.org/ > >> > >> -- > >> Yarema > >> _______________________________________________ > >> talk mailing list > >> talk at lists.nycbug.org > >> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > >> > > _______________________________________________ > > talk mailing list > > talk at lists.nycbug.org > > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > -- Robin Polak E-Mail: robin.polak at gmail.com V. 917-494-2080 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mspitzer at gmail.com Fri Sep 11 13:10:48 2009 From: mspitzer at gmail.com (Marc Spitzer) Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2009 13:10:48 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sqlfreenyc.org mini conference. Message-ID: <8c50a3c30909111010s7b098780kd34cb54a151b5e3c@mail.gmail.com> if you are interested: SqlFreeNYC.org will be having a late-day conference 5 October 2009, 6:00-10:00 PM at 40 West 20th St, 6th floor. It's devoted to non-sql based storage technologies. In addition to 10gen (MongoDB), Cloudera (Hadoop), Cloudant (couchdb) our very own Sutart Sierra will be discussing Clojure/Hadoop and an AllegroGraph presentation by Franz. http://sqlfreenyc.org/ RSVP: http://anyvite.com/1aczrvxjp6 (privacy is respected) -- Freedom is nothing but a chance to be better. --Albert Camus The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money. --Margaret Thatcher From yds at CoolRat.org Sat Sep 12 20:42:50 2009 From: yds at CoolRat.org (Yarema) Date: Sat, 12 Sep 2009 20:42:50 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD 8 Getting New Routing Architecture Message-ID: <4AAC400A.5020603@CoolRat.org> FreeBSD 8 Getting New Routing Architecture http://www.InternetNews.com/dev-news/print.php/3835746 Pretty cool.. -- Yarema From spork at bway.net Thu Sep 17 00:40:35 2009 From: spork at bway.net (Charles Sprickman) Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 00:40:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] iPhone apps for unix-y people Message-ID: Any suggestions? For starters, I'm wondering if TouchTerm Pro is pretty much the definitive ssh client. Beyond that, with a bazillion apps in their store, can anyone recommend some favorites? Phone is not jailbroken (yet - waiting on 3.1 hack). Thanks, Charles ___ Charles Sprickman NetEng/SysAdmin Bway.net - New York's Best Internet - www.bway.net spork at bway.net - 212.655.9344 From compustretch at gmail.com Thu Sep 17 09:57:20 2009 From: compustretch at gmail.com (forest mars) Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 09:57:20 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] iPhone apps for unix-y people In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 12:40 AM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > Any suggestions? > > For starters, I'm wondering if TouchTerm Pro is pretty much the definitive > ssh client. Chip, I'm not sure there is a definitive ssh client for the iPhone, each seems to have a crucial missing feature or reported issues. TouchTerm would seem to be the most popular one (perhaps owing to there being a free & a pro version) but AFAIK doesn't work over a VNC tunnel or have native iPhone 3.0 c/p support (perhaps they have added this in the latest version, ymmv?) Have you looked at issh? hth, Forest Mars -- "In theory, theory and practice are exactly the same. In practice, they're completely different." ------------------------------------------------------------------ This email is: [ ] private: do not forward [ x ] o.k. to forward [ ] o.k. to blog [ ] ask first -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPsdk version 1.7.1 (C) 1997-1999 Network Associates, Inc. and its affiliated companies. (Diffie-Helman/DSS-only version) iQA/AwUBRkjTLDbz7LySoccvEQJDcQCguZZj4M4kOVOlOX4CtbgR0rppsdovAjra 3RRXIlkdzuYI0YJz4WyvKlTn =MLhk -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- ------------------------------------------------------------------ The New TLDs are Here! Switch to Name.Space: http://namespace.org/switch Support new domains & keep free media free! Register yours today! https://secure.name-space.com/registry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From spork at bway.net Thu Sep 17 19:47:07 2009 From: spork at bway.net (Charles Sprickman) Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2009 19:47:07 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] iPhone apps for unix-y people In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 17 Sep 2009, forest mars wrote: > On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 12:40 AM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > >> Any suggestions? >> >> For starters, I'm wondering if TouchTerm Pro is pretty much the definitive >> ssh client. > > I'm not sure there is a definitive ssh client for the iPhone, each seems to > have a crucial missing feature or reported issues. TouchTerm would seem to > be the most popular one (perhaps owing to there being a free & a pro > version) but AFAIK doesn't work over a VNC tunnel or have native iPhone 3.0 > c/p support (perhaps they have added this in the latest version, ymmv?) Have > you looked at issh? I ended up grabbing both TTPro and iSSH (for $5/each and not much feature overlap, it's worthwhile). iSSH has all the nifty tunneling stuff and a vnc client, but lacks many terminal features. It looks like TTPro has a huge learning curve, but has some shortcuts to make up for the issues with the lack of a real keyboard - gestures, on-screen macros, etc. If I can program in a number of shortcuts like "tail /var/log/blah", "/usr/local/etc/rc.d/blah", "conf t", "ip route", etc. it should be nice for emergencies. There are a multitude of small differences - for example both allow for quitting the app and resuming the session by managing screen sessions for you, but TTPro lets you specify the "screen" program so I can use my preferred "tmux" instead of "screen". The list goes on... Now to line up a good set of jumphosts. Or some kind of portknocking thing for direct access without having to jump through other hosts. Decisions, decisions... Thanks, Charles > hth, > > Forest Mars > -- > "In theory, theory and practice are exactly the same. > In practice, they're completely different." > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > This email is: > [ ] private: do not forward > [ x ] o.k. to forward > [ ] o.k. to blog > [ ] ask first > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: PGPsdk version 1.7.1 (C) 1997-1999 Network Associates, Inc. and its > affiliated companies. (Diffie-Helman/DSS-only version) > > iQA/AwUBRkjTLDbz7LySoccvEQJDcQCguZZj4M4kOVOlOX4CtbgR0rppsdovAjra > 3RRXIlkdzuYI0YJz4WyvKlTn > =MLhk > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > The New TLDs are Here! > Switch to Name.Space: http://namespace.org/switch > Support new domains & keep free media free! Register yours today! > https://secure.name-space.com/registry > From george at ceetonetechnology.com Fri Sep 18 12:14:46 2009 From: george at ceetonetechnology.com (George Rosamond) Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 12:14:46 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] lightsquid Message-ID: <4AB3B1F6.9050602@ceetonetechnology.com> Wondering if anyone out there is using lightsquid for getting web surfing info on a LAN. The context is no authentication/as transparent as possible, mapping of IP to hostname, a decent level of detail about web surfing activity. . . g From isaac at diversaform.com Wed Sep 23 12:47:12 2009 From: isaac at diversaform.com (Isaac Levy) Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 12:47:12 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management Message-ID: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> Hi All, Much like the 'Tips-And-Tricks' thread a few weeks back: At work, I'm charged with giving a talk to Developers and DBA's on the following topic: "UNIX Process, Memory, and Disk- Userland Monitoring Tools for Non- UNIX developers" My company is a Java shop, with plenty of Ruby, Python, and loads of shell scripts running around- in BSD and Linux systems- so this talk is all about trying to get everyone on the same page with 'the classic basics'. -- With that, I thought I'd hit list to see what folks would have any input? What am I missing? The high-level outline is below, any comments/criticism is welcome, I'm looking for stuff I've missed- Best, .ike -- Each section below is split into a 'read whatever is happening' part, and 'do something with whatever is happening' part- most devs' tasks at my company just need to have visibility into things like what part of their code is eating the system, basic issues. I am explicitly *not* looking for good 3rd party tools, (pstree, for example)- I am looking to cover the basics of what's just expected to be there on our typical stock UNIX systems- (FreeBSD and OpenBSD, and CentOS Linux here, to be precise). I'm also not really looking for DTrace type tools, that's a whole exploration on it's own- especially when it comes to apps which aren't written in C. ############################## - Userland/Kernel Structure Basics (2 minute spiel) - man(1) is your friend, so is dmesg(8) - Processes - stats/info facilities + using procfs(5) + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk(1) parsing) + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) - management tools + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) + nice(1), renice(8) - Memory - stats/info facilities + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) + swapinfo(8) - management tools - swapon(8), swapoff(8) - Disk - stats/info facilities + iostat(8) + df(1) and du(1) + lsof(8) (non-stock on many UNIX systems, but worth mention?) + top(1) disk i/o tricks - management tools + disk mount(8) basics + nfs, living with it basics - advanced but very useful for developers: + memory filesystems (creating, using) - disk-backed memory filesystems -- Bonus Networking section, perhaps, - Network - UNIX stats/info facilities + ifconfig(8) + netstat(1) + tcpdump(1) - UNIX management tools + ifconfig(8) + netstat(1) ############################## From nikolai at fetissov.org Wed Sep 23 13:13:42 2009 From: nikolai at fetissov.org (nikolai) Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 13:13:42 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> Message-ID: > Hi All, > > Much like the 'Tips-And-Tricks' thread a few weeks back: > At work, I'm charged with giving a talk to Developers and DBA's on the > following topic: > > "UNIX Process, Memory, and Disk- Userland Monitoring Tools for Non- > UNIX developers" > > My company is a Java shop, with plenty of Ruby, Python, and loads of > shell scripts running around- in BSD and Linux systems- so this talk > is all about trying to get everyone on the same page with 'the classic > basics'. > > -- > With that, I thought I'd hit list to see what folks would have any > input? What am I missing? > > The high-level outline is below, any comments/criticism is welcome, > I'm looking for stuff I've missed- > > Best, > .ike > > > > -- > Each section below is split into a 'read whatever is happening' part, > and 'do something with whatever is happening' part- most devs' tasks > at my company just need to have visibility into things like what part > of their code is eating the system, basic issues. > > I am explicitly *not* looking for good 3rd party tools, (pstree, for > example)- I am looking to cover the basics of what's just expected to > be there on our typical stock UNIX systems- (FreeBSD and OpenBSD, and > CentOS Linux here, to be precise). > > I'm also not really looking for DTrace type tools, that's a whole > exploration on it's own- especially when it comes to apps which aren't > written in C. > > > ############################## > - Userland/Kernel Structure Basics (2 minute spiel) > - man(1) is your friend, so is dmesg(8) > > - Processes > - stats/info facilities > + using procfs(5) > + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk(1) parsing) > + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > - management tools > + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) > + nice(1), renice(8) > > - Memory > - stats/info facilities > + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) > + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > + swapinfo(8) > - management tools > - swapon(8), swapoff(8) > > > - Disk > - stats/info facilities > + iostat(8) > + df(1) and du(1) > + lsof(8) (non-stock on many UNIX systems, but worth mention?) > + top(1) disk i/o tricks > - management tools > + disk mount(8) basics > + nfs, living with it basics > - advanced but very useful for developers: > + memory filesystems (creating, using) > - disk-backed memory filesystems > > -- > Bonus Networking section, perhaps, > > - Network > - UNIX stats/info facilities > + ifconfig(8) > + netstat(1) > + tcpdump(1) > - UNIX management tools > + ifconfig(8) > + netstat(1) > > ############################## > > > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > dtrace on FreeBSD/Solaris/MacOSX oprofile and probably valgrind on Linux My 2c, -- Nikolai From dave at donnerjack.com Wed Sep 23 13:21:27 2009 From: dave at donnerjack.com (David Lawson) Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 13:21:27 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> Message-ID: <7B5BE750-9387-4EF5-8293-9C7989F8BFCD@donnerjack.com> It's worth looking at what version of systat you've got installed and definitely worth thinking about upgrading to the latest (or later) ones, at least on linux 2.6 kernels you can get fun stuff like per process disk IO statistics and all kind of niftiness out of it. --Dave On Sep 23, 2009, at 12:47 PM, Isaac Levy wrote: > Hi All, > > Much like the 'Tips-And-Tricks' thread a few weeks back: > At work, I'm charged with giving a talk to Developers and DBA's on the > following topic: > > "UNIX Process, Memory, and Disk- Userland Monitoring Tools for Non- > UNIX developers" > > My company is a Java shop, with plenty of Ruby, Python, and loads of > shell scripts running around- in BSD and Linux systems- so this talk > is all about trying to get everyone on the same page with 'the classic > basics'. > > -- > With that, I thought I'd hit list to see what folks would have any > input? What am I missing? > > The high-level outline is below, any comments/criticism is welcome, > I'm looking for stuff I've missed- > > Best, > .ike > > > > -- > Each section below is split into a 'read whatever is happening' part, > and 'do something with whatever is happening' part- most devs' tasks > at my company just need to have visibility into things like what part > of their code is eating the system, basic issues. > > I am explicitly *not* looking for good 3rd party tools, (pstree, for > example)- I am looking to cover the basics of what's just expected to > be there on our typical stock UNIX systems- (FreeBSD and OpenBSD, and > CentOS Linux here, to be precise). > > I'm also not really looking for DTrace type tools, that's a whole > exploration on it's own- especially when it comes to apps which aren't > written in C. > > > ############################## > - Userland/Kernel Structure Basics (2 minute spiel) > - man(1) is your friend, so is dmesg(8) > > - Processes > - stats/info facilities > + using procfs(5) > + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk(1) parsing) > + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > - management tools > + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) > + nice(1), renice(8) > > - Memory > - stats/info facilities > + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) > + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > + swapinfo(8) > - management tools > - swapon(8), swapoff(8) > > > - Disk > - stats/info facilities > + iostat(8) > + df(1) and du(1) > + lsof(8) (non-stock on many UNIX systems, but worth mention?) > + top(1) disk i/o tricks > - management tools > + disk mount(8) basics > + nfs, living with it basics > - advanced but very useful for developers: > + memory filesystems (creating, using) > - disk-backed memory filesystems > > -- > Bonus Networking section, perhaps, > > - Network > - UNIX stats/info facilities > + ifconfig(8) > + netstat(1) > + tcpdump(1) > - UNIX management tools > + ifconfig(8) > + netstat(1) > > ############################## > > > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From isaac at diversaform.com Wed Sep 23 13:39:28 2009 From: isaac at diversaform.com (Isaac Levy) Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 13:39:28 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <7B5BE750-9387-4EF5-8293-9C7989F8BFCD@donnerjack.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> <7B5BE750-9387-4EF5-8293-9C7989F8BFCD@donnerjack.com> Message-ID: <257FC4E8-92F8-4B62-82EF-1E423E2D0BCB@diversaform.com> Updated Outline Per Nikolai and David's input so far (thanks!): + Added a bonus section for 'advanced profiling tools', (dtrace, oprofile, etc...), because of their immense usefulness- but they may not be appropriate tools for this talk- they deserve a talk of their own. + Added sysstat, but perhaps not in the right place- since it profiles so many different things? - (noteworthy: no systat on fully loaded CentOS ... :( need to install it via yum package) What else? Best, .ike ############################## - Userland/Kernel Structure Basics (2 minute spiel) - man(1) is your friend, so is dmesg(8) - Processes - stats/info facilities + using procfs(5) + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk(1) parsing) + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) + systat(1) - management tools + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) + nice(1), renice(8) - Memory - stats/info facilities + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) + swapinfo(8) - management tools - swapon(8), swapoff(8) - Disk - stats/info facilities + iostat(8) + df(1) and du(1) + lsof(8) (non-stock on many UNIX systems, but worth mention?) + top(1) disk i/o tricks - management tools + disk mount(8) basics + nfs, living with it basics - advanced but very useful for developers: + memory filesystems (creating, using) - disk-backed memory filesystems -- Bonus Networking section, perhaps, - Network - UNIX stats/info facilities + ifconfig(8) + netstat(1) + tcpdump(1) - UNIX management tools + ifconfig(8) + netstat(1) - Kernel Based Advanced Profiling Tools - dtrace(1m), (FreeBSD, Solaris, MacOSX) - oprofile(1), valgrind(1) (Linux, not part of stock CentOS/Ubuntu Install!) ############################## From marco at metm.org Wed Sep 23 13:44:09 2009 From: marco at metm.org (Marco Scoffier) Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 13:44:09 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> Message-ID: <4ABA5E69.2020106@metm.org> Isaac Levy wrote: > I am explicitly *not* looking for good 3rd party tools, (pstree, for > example)- I am looking to cover the basics of what's just expected to > be there on our typical stock UNIX systems- (FreeBSD and OpenBSD, and > CentOS Linux here, to be precise). Hey Ike, I think you've pretty much covered the basics. I wonder if you want to add a section at the end for getting info on remote machines ? At least in the environment where I work, multiple people with multiple nodes, often the problem is finding which node is available for running a job. You can ssh ; top ( then repeat until you find a free machine ) You can ssh 'ps' etc. and put all this in a hacky script. Or despite your disclaimer ... ganglia daemon + server is becoming pretty common for monitoring resources on multiple machines Marco From dave at donnerjack.com Wed Sep 23 13:44:29 2009 From: dave at donnerjack.com (David Lawson) Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 13:44:29 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <257FC4E8-92F8-4B62-82EF-1E423E2D0BCB@diversaform.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> <7B5BE750-9387-4EF5-8293-9C7989F8BFCD@donnerjack.com> <257FC4E8-92F8-4B62-82EF-1E423E2D0BCB@diversaform.com> Message-ID: > > + Added sysstat, but perhaps not in the right place- since it > profiles so many different things? > - (noteworthy: no systat on fully loaded CentOS ... :( need to > install it via yum package) That's weird, I could have sworn our stock CentOS installs had sar crons enabled, but we may be doing that in the kickstart rather than it being something CentOS does, I wrote them a long time ago. sar is probably worth touching on as well, since you can get all kinds of useful trending and post-mortem analysis out of it and most developers don't know it's there, I've found. > What else? > > Best, > .ike > > > ############################## > - Userland/Kernel Structure Basics (2 minute spiel) > - man(1) is your friend, so is dmesg(8) > > - Processes > - stats/info facilities > + using procfs(5) > + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk(1) parsing) > + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > + systat(1) > - management tools > + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) > + nice(1), renice(8) > > - Memory > - stats/info facilities > + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) > + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > + swapinfo(8) > - management tools > - swapon(8), swapoff(8) > > > - Disk > - stats/info facilities > + iostat(8) > + df(1) and du(1) > + lsof(8) (non-stock on many UNIX systems, but worth mention?) > + top(1) disk i/o tricks > - management tools > + disk mount(8) basics > + nfs, living with it basics > - advanced but very useful for developers: > + memory filesystems (creating, using) > - disk-backed memory filesystems > > -- > Bonus Networking section, perhaps, > > - Network > - UNIX stats/info facilities > + ifconfig(8) > + netstat(1) > + tcpdump(1) > - UNIX management tools > + ifconfig(8) > + netstat(1) > > - Kernel Based Advanced Profiling Tools > - dtrace(1m), (FreeBSD, Solaris, MacOSX) > - oprofile(1), valgrind(1) (Linux, not part of stock CentOS/Ubuntu > Install!) > > ############################## > From scottro at nyc.rr.com Wed Sep 23 15:16:07 2009 From: scottro at nyc.rr.com (Scott Robbins) Date: Wed, 23 Sep 2009 15:16:07 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> <7B5BE750-9387-4EF5-8293-9C7989F8BFCD@donnerjack.com> <257FC4E8-92F8-4B62-82EF-1E423E2D0BCB@diversaform.com> Message-ID: <20090923191607.GA99941@mail.scottro.net> On Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 01:44:29PM -0400, David Lawson wrote: > > > > + Added sysstat, but perhaps not in the right place- since it > > profiles so many different things? > > - (noteworthy: no systat on fully loaded CentOS ... :( need to > > install it via yum package) > > That's weird, I could have sworn our stock CentOS installs had sar > crons enabled, but we may be doing that in the kickstart rather than > it being something CentOS does, I wrote them a long time ago. sar is > probably worth touching on as well, since you can get all kinds of > useful trending and post-mortem analysis out of it and most developers > don't know it's there, I've found. Nope, seems to not be in the default installation. (Just checked on a few boxes here.) -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Oz: Looks dead, smells dead, yet it's moving around. That's interesting. From mspitzer at gmail.com Thu Sep 24 01:15:49 2009 From: mspitzer at gmail.com (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 01:15:49 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> Message-ID: <8c50a3c30909232215wd9397b3x58a0ee5b6c52ace5@mail.gmail.com> Ike, I would also add the differences between standard tools, if you did not plan on it already. ps for example: 1: on centos it is system 5/posix flags and output, ie ps -ef 2: on the bsd's its well bsd output, ps wwauxx Different calling conventions, output format and information available but the same command Also I would add truss/strace and friends, developer centered goodness. tcpdump should be limited to two cases: 1: very simple usage of bpf, ie capture stiff from ip address 1.2.3.4 2: as a means of getting things to wire shark and at the end give them a short version of your jails talk ;) marc On Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 12:47 PM, Isaac Levy wrote: > Hi All, > > Much like the 'Tips-And-Tricks' thread a few weeks back: > At work, I'm charged with giving a talk to Developers and DBA's on the > following topic: > > ? "UNIX Process, Memory, and Disk- Userland Monitoring Tools for Non- > UNIX developers" > > My company is a Java shop, with plenty of Ruby, Python, and loads of > shell scripts running around- in BSD and Linux systems- so this talk > is all about trying to get everyone on the same page with 'the classic > basics'. > > -- > With that, I thought I'd hit list to see what folks would have any > input? ?What am I missing? > > The high-level outline is below, any comments/criticism is welcome, > I'm looking for stuff I've missed- > > Best, > .ike > > > > -- > Each section below is split into a 'read whatever is happening' part, > and 'do something with whatever is happening' part- most devs' tasks > at my company just need to have visibility into things like what part > of their code is eating the system, basic issues. > > I am explicitly *not* looking for good 3rd party tools, (pstree, for > example)- I am looking to cover the basics of what's just expected to > be there on our typical stock UNIX systems- (FreeBSD and OpenBSD, and > CentOS Linux here, to be precise). > > I'm also not really looking for DTrace type tools, that's a whole > exploration on it's own- especially when it comes to apps which aren't > written in C. > > > ############################## > - Userland/Kernel Structure Basics (2 minute spiel) > - man(1) is your friend, so is dmesg(8) > > - Processes > ? - stats/info facilities > ? ? + using procfs(5) > ? ? + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk(1) parsing) > ? ? + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > ? - management tools > ? ? + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) > ? ? + nice(1), renice(8) > > - Memory > ? - stats/info facilities > ? ? + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) > ? ? + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > ? ? + swapinfo(8) > ? - management tools > ? ? - swapon(8), swapoff(8) > > > - Disk > ? - stats/info facilities > ? ? + iostat(8) > ? ? + df(1) and du(1) > ? ? + lsof(8) (non-stock on many UNIX systems, but worth mention?) > ? ? + top(1) disk i/o tricks > ? - management tools > ? ? + disk mount(8) basics > ? ? + nfs, living with it basics > ? - advanced but very useful for developers: > ? ? + memory filesystems (creating, using) > ? ? ? - disk-backed memory filesystems > > -- > Bonus Networking section, perhaps, > > - Network > ? - UNIX stats/info facilities > ? ? + ifconfig(8) > ? ? + netstat(1) > ? ? + tcpdump(1) > ? - UNIX management tools > ? ? + ifconfig(8) > ? ? + netstat(1) > > ############################## > > > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > -- Freedom is nothing but a chance to be better. --Albert Camus The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money. --Margaret Thatcher From o_sleep at belovedarctos.com Thu Sep 24 08:03:19 2009 From: o_sleep at belovedarctos.com (Bjorn Nelson) Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 08:03:19 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> Message-ID: <4ABB6007.6070807@belovedarctos.com> Isaac Levy wrote: > + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > parallel to sar post event investigation, just dump top at 1 minute intervals to a file and copy it to nfs. Very useful/worth that minimal perf impact. > - management tools > + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) > stop using kill -9 first > - Memory > - stats/info facilities > + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) > + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > + swapinfo(8) > - management tools > - swapon(8), swapoff(8) > linux just trust free + buffers + cache. Get the devs started early on understanding linux never reclaims cache. vmstat for overall perfs and gdb for core debugging (maybe they are already familiar with gdb). -Bjorn From lists at stringsutils.com Thu Sep 24 13:00:18 2009 From: lists at stringsutils.com (Francisco Reyes) Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 13:00:18 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> <7B5BE750-9387-4EF5-8293-9C7989F8BFCD@donnerjack.com> <257FC4E8-92F8-4B62-82EF-1E423E2D0BCB@diversaform.com> Message-ID: Isaac Levy writes: > - (noteworthy: no systat on fully loaded CentOS ... :( need to > install it via yum package) How about mpstat? From badiane_ka at yahoo.com Fri Sep 25 12:25:16 2009 From: badiane_ka at yahoo.com (Badiane Ka) Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 09:25:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <610970.43660.qm@web52709.mail.re2.yahoo.com> mpstat is contained in the sysstat package. Message: 1 Date: Thu, 24 Sep 2009 13:00:18 -0400 From: Francisco Reyes Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management To: Isaac Levy Cc: NYCBUG List Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="US-ASCII" Isaac Levy writes: >? ? - (noteworthy: no systat on fully loaded CentOS ... :( need to? > install it via yum package) How about mpstat? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From isaac at diversaform.com Mon Sep 28 15:48:04 2009 From: isaac at diversaform.com (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 15:48:04 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <4ABA5E69.2020106@metm.org> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> <4ABA5E69.2020106@metm.org> Message-ID: Hi Marco, On Sep 23, 2009, at 1:44 PM, Marco Scoffier wrote: > Isaac Levy wrote: >> I am explicitly *not* looking for good 3rd party tools, (pstree, >> for example)- I am looking to cover the basics of what's just >> expected to be there on our typical stock UNIX systems- (FreeBSD >> and OpenBSD, and CentOS Linux here, to be precise). > Hey Ike, > > I think you've pretty much covered the basics. I wonder if you want > to add a section at the end for getting info on remote machines ? At > least in the environment where I work, multiple people with multiple > nodes, often the problem is finding which node is available for > running a job. > > You can ssh ; top ( then repeat until you find a free > machine ) > You can ssh 'ps' etc. and put all this in a hacky script. > > Or despite your disclaimer ... > > ganglia daemon + server is becoming pretty common for monitoring > resources on multiple machines > > Marco Good thought- but not sure if I want to add this, everyone does a lot of ssh rpc here already. It's the more classic cross-platform UNIX stuff we're trying to focus on. Best, .ike From isaac at diversaform.com Mon Sep 28 16:03:57 2009 From: isaac at diversaform.com (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:03:57 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c30909232215wd9397b3x58a0ee5b6c52ace5@mail.gmail.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> <8c50a3c30909232215wd9397b3x58a0ee5b6c52ace5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6A0CA189-EA1E-45D7-8F9B-54324307DB12@diversaform.com> Hi Marc, On Sep 24, 2009, at 1:15 AM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > Ike, > > I would also add the differences between standard tools, if you did > not plan on it already. > ps for example: > 1: on centos it is system 5/posix flags and output, ie ps -ef > 2: on the bsd's its well bsd output, ps wwauxx > Different calling conventions, output format and information available > but the same command Yep- good point, I planned to cover the basic differences, (and perhaps post some simple bash snippets so developers can use it in their one-off scripts easier? Not sure if that's too much of a tangent for one talk). > > Also I would add truss/strace and friends, developer centered > goodness. Indeed, except: truss is available on the FreeBSD boxes. Strace is an additional yum package on our stock CentOS machines, (which we may choose to add to our stock company-default installs). However, being primarily a Java shop, I'm not sure of the developer interest in these tools. Regardless, I'm adding them to the outline below. > > tcpdump should be limited to two cases: > 1: very simple usage of bpf, ie capture stiff from ip address 1.2.3.4 > 2: as a means of getting things to wire shark Indeed- just the basics of using tcpdump is very handy. > > and at the end give them a short version of your jails talk ;) :P Rocket- .ike > > marc > ############################## - Userland/Kernel Structure Basics (2 minute spiel) - man(1) is your friend, so is dmesg(8) - Processes - stats/info facilities + using procfs(5) + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk(1) parsing) + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) + systat(1) - management tools + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) + nice(1), renice(8) - Memory - stats/info facilities + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) + swapinfo(8) - management tools - swapon(8), swapoff(8) - Disk - stats/info facilities + iostat(8) + df(1) and du(1) + lsof(8) (non-stock on many UNIX systems, but worth mention?) + top(1) disk i/o tricks - management tools + disk mount(8) basics + nfs, living with it basics - advanced but very useful for developers: + memory filesystems (creating, using) - disk-backed memory filesystems -- Bonus Networking section, perhaps, - Network - UNIX stats/info facilities + ifconfig(8) + netstat(1) + tcpdump(1) - UNIX management tools + ifconfig(8) + netstat(1) - Kernel Based Advanced Profiling Tools - dtrace(1m), (FreeBSD, Solaris, MacOSX) - oprofile(1), valgrind(1) (Linux, not part of stock CentOS/Ubuntu Install!) - truss(1)/strace(1) and friends ############################## From isaac at diversaform.com Mon Sep 28 16:19:41 2009 From: isaac at diversaform.com (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:19:41 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <4ABB6007.6070807@belovedarctos.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> <4ABB6007.6070807@belovedarctos.com> Message-ID: Word, On Sep 24, 2009, at 8:03 AM, Bjorn Nelson wrote: > Isaac Levy wrote: >> + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) >> > parallel to sar post event investigation, just dump top at 1 minute > intervals to a file and copy it to nfs. Very useful/worth that > minimal perf impact. >> - management tools >> + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) >> > stop using kill -9 first Flags :) Yeah- just showing folks that kill has a 7 fabby signals may change all sorts of behavior around here. >> - Memory >> - stats/info facilities >> + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) >> + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) >> + swapinfo(8) >> - management tools >> - swapon(8), swapoff(8) >> > linux just trust free + buffers + cache. Get the devs started early > on understanding linux never reclaims cache. Well, if we were writing C apps, yes- requisite- but this may not be so necessary in our java-heavy shop- unless you could enlighten me? I could be missing a big point, from my vantage point in userland... > > vmstat for overall perfs and gdb for core debugging (maybe they are > already familiar with gdb). Yeah, again, may not be so helpful in this java-centric shop, but I'll put it in the advanced section. Thanks Bjorn- Best, .ike ############################## - Userland/Kernel Structure Basics (2 minute spiel) - man(1) is your friend, so is dmesg(8) - Processes - stats/info facilities + using procfs(5) + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk(1) parsing) + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) + systat(1) - management tools + kill(1), killall(1) (flags!) + nice(1), renice(8) - Memory - stats/info facilities + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) + swapinfo(8) - management tools - swapon(8), swapoff(8) - Disk - stats/info facilities + iostat(8) + df(1) and du(1) + lsof(8) (non-stock on many UNIX systems, but worth mention?) + top(1) disk i/o tricks - management tools + disk mount(8) basics + nfs, living with it basics - advanced but very useful for developers: + memory filesystems (creating, using) - disk-backed memory filesystems -- Bonus Networking section, perhaps, - Network - UNIX stats/info facilities + ifconfig(8) + netstat(1) + tcpdump(1) - UNIX management tools + ifconfig(8) + netstat(1) - Kernel Based Advanced Profiling Tools + dtrace(1m), (FreeBSD, Solaris, MacOSX) + oprofile(1), valgrind(1) (Linux, not part of stock CentOS/Ubuntu Install!) + truss(1)/strace(1) and friends - Debuggers + GDB ############################## From okan at demirmen.com Mon Sep 28 16:32:20 2009 From: okan at demirmen.com (Okan Demirmen) Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:32:20 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: <6A0CA189-EA1E-45D7-8F9B-54324307DB12@diversaform.com> References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> <8c50a3c30909232215wd9397b3x58a0ee5b6c52ace5@mail.gmail.com> <6A0CA189-EA1E-45D7-8F9B-54324307DB12@diversaform.com> Message-ID: <20090928203220.GV25@clam.khaoz.org> On Mon 2009.09.28 at 16:03 -0400, Isaac Levy wrote: > Hi Marc, > > On Sep 24, 2009, at 1:15 AM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > > Ike, > > > > I would also add the differences between standard tools, if you did > > not plan on it already. > > ps for example: > > 1: on centos it is system 5/posix flags and output, ie ps -ef > > 2: on the bsd's its well bsd output, ps wwauxx > > Different calling conventions, output format and information available > > but the same command > > Yep- good point, I planned to cover the basic differences, (and > perhaps post some simple bash snippets so developers can use it in > their one-off scripts easier? Not sure if that's too much of a > tangent for one talk). please, and i think you'll agree, never use the word "bash" if you want sane and portable scripts. From okan at demirmen.com Mon Sep 28 16:37:39 2009 From: okan at demirmen.com (Okan Demirmen) Date: Mon, 28 Sep 2009 16:37:39 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Advanced UNIX Basics Management In-Reply-To: References: <833E2B08-67A4-4DA3-8452-358B039EE0E3@diversaform.com> <4ABB6007.6070807@belovedarctos.com> Message-ID: <20090928203739.GW25@clam.khaoz.org> On Mon 2009.09.28 at 16:19 -0400, Isaac Levy wrote: > >> - Memory > >> - stats/info facilities > >> + ps(1) (flags and some handy awk parsing) > >> + top(1) (briefly, everyone knows top...) > >> + swapinfo(8) > >> - management tools > >> - swapon(8), swapoff(8) > >> > > linux just trust free + buffers + cache. Get the devs started early > > on understanding linux never reclaims cache. > > Well, if we were writing C apps, yes- requisite- but this may not be > so necessary in our java-heavy shop- unless you could enlighten me? I > could be missing a big point, from my vantage point in userland... being a java-centric shop, they need to really understand the java virtual machine (especially the one they are using), which means understanding a bit of real internals - it has surprised me how many "mini-tutorials" are required to explain such concepts; and know what the effects of certain options behave on all the OS's the vm's are supposed to run. From matt at atopia.net Tue Sep 29 13:07:40 2009 From: matt at atopia.net (Matt Juszczak) Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 13:07:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Cron management Message-ID: Hi All, I have a setup that is using puppet for system management/configuration, including crons. It works well, except that many of the devs have requested access to add/edit/delete crons (95% of our crons are unfortunately for site-related code and DB related tasks). There are two options I have: - Give every dev access to our puppet server and access to change puppet configuration (not really something I want to do). - Setup a single cron inside puppet that runs every minute, and then somehow setup a "task management system" that can execute multiple tasks using that single cron. Are there such systems as the last one I mentioned, perhaps web and mysql/php based, where the dev's could create new "tasks" to run, and a single cron running every minute would execute those tasks when needed? Thanks! -Matt From josh at rivels.org Tue Sep 29 13:43:08 2009 From: josh at rivels.org (Josh Rivel) Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 13:43:08 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Cron management In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Matt, On Tue, Sep 29, 2009 at 1:07 PM, Matt Juszczak wrote: > Hi All, > > I have a setup that is using puppet for system management/configuration, > including crons. ?It works well, except that many of the devs have > requested access to add/edit/delete crons (95% of our crons are > unfortunately for site-related code and DB related tasks). > > There are two options I have: > > - Give every dev access to our puppet server and access to change puppet > configuration (not really something I want to do). [snip] You might be able to via creative sudo access only grant them access to the folders where you store the cronjobs for the specific machines that they need access to. Just a thought. Josh From njt at ayvali.org Tue Sep 29 14:07:48 2009 From: njt at ayvali.org (N.J. Thomas) Date: Tue, 29 Sep 2009 14:07:48 -0400 Subject: [nycbug-talk] cron management In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090929180748.GP41655@zaph.org> * Matt Juszczak [2009-09-29 13:07:40-0400]: > - Give every dev access to our puppet server and access to change > puppet configuration (not really something I want to do). We do this with our configuration management system (although not with cron, but it's the same idea). We created a separate branch in our source repository, and have the devs check in there. About once a day, we have someone merge into the main trunk. That then gets pushed into our configuration management tool. It works well because the devs really only need to do this about once a day at most. If your dev team needs to do lots of frequent little changes, then the context switching for the person on your team who is responsible for merging and pushing out their code may be too high. Thomas