[talk] mid-town connectivity

[George Neville-Neil]

Mar 18, 2014 19:51、Mark Saad <mark.saad at ymail.com> のメッセージ:

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>> On Mar 14, 2014, at 7:00 PM, George Rosamond <george at ceetonetechnology.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Mark Saad:
>>> 
>>> 
>>>>> On Mar 14, 2014, at 3:56 PM, Charles Sprickman <spork at bway.net> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Mar 14, 2014, at 2:08 PM, Pete Wright wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> also i remember back in the day con edison pretty much had every
>>>>> building outfitted with dark fiber, but i think they got out of the
>>>>> comms business a while ago.
>>>> 
>>>> The network still exists, and other than a major issue with a
>>>> spanning tree meltdown a few months back, it's been rock-solid -
>>>> we're a layer 2 customer and we sell tail circuits through them.
>>>> Detailed and well in advance notices of service-impacting and
>>>> non-service-impacting maintenance, a very responsive NOC, and in
>>>> most places a point of entry to the building that's on the opposite
>>>> end of the telco stuff which is nice since backhoes avoid power
>>>> lines better than telco lines.  Sandy had no impact except for one
>>>> unique location where we had a VZ tail circuit and something got wet
>>>> that shouldn't have.
>>>> 
>>>> Sidera was really big into the financial firms, and had some very
>>>> high-priced offerings where they'd shave a few milliseconds or
>>>> microseconds off the route.  We obviously don't bother with those
>>>> services, but we do share in the benefits when they're making
>>>> hardware decisions.  I see no evidence they grossly oversell any of
>>>> the layer 2 services we buy.
>>>> 
>>>> If I remember correctly, the chain of ownership goes like this:
>>>> 
>>>> ConEd -> RCN -> Sidera -> Lightower (merger?)
>>> Coned CEC merged with RCN , RCN metro networks split from RCN and merged with another transit provider and became Sidera . Sidera merged with Lightower .  I work in a lightower facility , as a customer .  
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> I can't speak about their IP transit services, we don't use them.
>>>> We are legacy Level3 and Hurricane, with Level3 being preferred.  We
>>>> also get IPv6 transit from both upstreams.  We are Cogent-free (with
>>>> good reason).
>>>> 
>>>> Charles
>>>> 
>>>>> -pete
>>> 
>>> At $WORK we use two sets of mux'd ds3 and t1 links . The sets are from cogent and Verizon iirc it's  20 t1 mux'd to one 100m ethernet handoff and for the ds3's it's 4 mux'd into a gig ethernet handoff .  Verizon took a while To get it up and running . Cogent was faster but had to use verizon for in building handoffs . We also have a private point to point fiber set from lightower and they have been good at making things happen , however we do not use them for ip services . 
>>> 
>>> So what's it like : It's good enough that the c levels down to everyone but network operations  likes the speed and reliability . I have no idea what the cost is but we have fairly deep pockets .
>> 
>> Thanks for all the replies.  Good stuff.  I browsed through them as they
>> came in, but will work through more thoroughly tonight.
>> 
>> It just kills me that if we were in SK, JP and a bunch of other places,
>> such a post would be pointless.  I'd have ipv6 with 30m synchronous for
>> $19.95 a month myself.  It's just a reminder of how infrastructure is
>> sooo broken in this city.  I could have made the same post ten or 15
>> years ago.
>> 
>> Very appreciated for the input though...
>> 
>> g
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> 
> So I don't like the comparison of Asia to North America .  Japan and South Korea ( a/k/a the republic of samsung ) have been in a tech arms race for so long it's not even interesting any more . They can do things there we will probably not see for various reasons . *  What I mean is their offerings are market , and infrastructure driven . We have monopolies who control vast parts of the infrastructure and fight to keep it with in their bounds for various reasons .  ConEd Laid down so much fiber it's unreal and they are a public utility  . Verizon owns so much of the remaining infrastructure most "providers" have to piggy back on verizon gear or use Verizon's right aways to get you service . What it boils down to is if you want to provide network services in NYC you have to do it with out invading the market space of the providers you have to use to get customers service . 

NTT is a monopoly. In the 80s they laid fiber all over Japan. Why? Because the Japanese believe in infrastructure. They are now reaping the benefits of that investment. I can get more bandwidth, cheaper, up a mountain in Japan than I can in much of the US including NYC. 

Americans do not believe in sharing in this way. Note cars vs trains for example. 

The ways in which Verizon and the like have twisted the market scum but they can do it because Americans don't travel and so don't know anything better and they do not believe in infrastructure as they once did. 

Sorry, I just came back from Japan and there are plenty of criticisms I can make of the Japanese ( xenophobia, racism, sexism and homophobia to start) but a belief in sharing for the common good of the Japanese and a belief in building your way to the future are common cultural traits and that's why my apartment building had a 1g fiber (mentioned in the ad BTW) in 2006. 
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> * slight rant but keep this in mind . 4k tv / video is the new big deal . Popular is Asia and Europe the requirements to deliver 4k content is almost unbelievable .  Scott long made reference to this at the con; i can't remember if he said it was an order of magnitude greater the 1080p or not but it was huge none the less . In any case Scott stated , most people in North America can't see netflix's 4k content , not due to lacy of tech but due to network providers infighting on costs of delivery ; and the subtext is also do to the lack of customer complaints .  So while we complain that we can't get fast network service in NYC the reality is our market doesn't need or want it yet . No provider really wants to take on Verizon's fios or comcast / Time Warner , not until enough customers complain that they can't get 4k tv at home . Then they will upgrade their networks .
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> Also do you really need to see that much detail , with 1080p I can tell the fox 5 news guy has nasty razor bumps ,so at 4k can I see into his soul ? 
> 

If he had one....

I don't have or watch TV but I want 4K TV because I want to live in the future and in the future we get more stuff faster. 

End of my rant :-)

Best
George