From dan Wed Dec 1 23:45:26 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2004 23:45:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] BSDCan 2005 - call for papers Message-ID: <41AE5796.6977.8C01E7F4@localhost> BSDCan 2004 was an enormously successful grass-roots style conference. It brought together a great mix of *BSD developers and users for a nice blend of both developer-centric and user-centric presentations, food, and activities. Based upon that accomplishment, planning for the next event began shortly thereafter. BSDCan 2005 will be held May 13-14, 2005, in Ottawa. We are now requesting proposals for papers. The papers should be written with a very strong technical content bias. Papers and proposals of a business development or marketing nature are not appropriate for this venue. The schedule is: 19 Dec 2003 Proposals acceptance begins 19 Jan 2003 Proposals acceptance ends 19 Feb 2003 Confirmation of accepted proposals 19 Mar 2004 Abstracts due 19 Apr 2004 Formatted final papers must arrive no later than this date Please submit all proposals to papers at bsdcan.org NOTE: This is the schedule for formal papers. We are also accepting submissions for for talks and presentations. If you have a proposal, please contact us on papers at bsdcan.org. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ BSDCan - The Technical BSD Conference - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From jesse Thu Dec 2 00:55:02 2004 From: jesse (Jesse Callaway) Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 00:55:02 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] hack fest Message-ID: Hey Pete, you said something about a hack fest when you come back to visit. What did you have in mind... something like a prize for the most throughput between two interfaces? most virtual machines per MB ram? or should we kind of jam on a project? I always think it would be fun, albeit inefficient, to build a frankenstein farm. I have visions of robot arms and toasters. I think it would be fun to make a robot arm device file which you could write to. More essential would be a coffee machine (played out? never) integrated with a small unit running BSD. From pete Thu Dec 2 03:02:46 2004 From: pete (pete wright) Date: Thu, 02 Dec 2004 00:02:46 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: hack fest In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41AECC26.2060906@nomadlogic.org> Jesse Callaway wrote: > Hey Pete, you said something about a hack fest when you come back to > visit. What did you have in mind... something like a prize for the > most throughput between two interfaces? most virtual machines per MB > ram? or should we kind of jam on a project? I always think it would be > fun, albeit inefficient, to build a frankenstein farm. I have visions > of robot arms and toasters. I think it would be fun to make a robot > arm device file which you could write to. More essential would be a > coffee machine (played out? never) integrated with a small unit > running BSD. > i had alot of fun during ike's jail party...maybe something along those lines. it'd even be fun to do an install fest, we may even get lucky if college kids are in town for the holiday's and have a big turn out. -pete From pete Thu Dec 2 14:09:00 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 02 Dec 2004 11:09:00 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NetAPP OS? Message-ID: <41AF684C.3060704@nomadlogic.org> Hi All, I've been doing some research on NetAPP recently. Does anyone know what OS ONTAP is based upon. I was under the assumption that is was a derivitive of GNU/Linux (esp. due to the well know devs. they have working for them). Yet according to this article it is a BSD derivitive: http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/bsd/2004/07/01/freesbie.html (Quote) ". Personally, I like the NetApp NFS server from Network Appliance. It runs BSD, supports the NFS protocol, and works very well. I'll call it as nfs01." Maybe I am confused and the author is refering to the NetAPP hardware? Cheers, Pete -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From alex Thu Dec 2 14:08:21 2004 From: alex (alex at pilosoft.com) Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 14:08:21 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] NetAPP OS? In-Reply-To: <41AF684C.3060704@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 2 Dec 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > I've been doing some research on NetAPP recently. Does anyone know > what OS ONTAP is based upon. I was under the assumption that is was a > derivitive of GNU/Linux (esp. due to the well know devs. they have > working for them). Yet according to this article it is a BSD > derivitive: It is derivative of ole sunos4 (which was bsd-based) -alex From pete Thu Dec 2 14:15:26 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 02 Dec 2004 11:15:26 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NetAPP OS? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <41AF69CE.2010603@nomadlogic.org> alex at pilosoft.com wrote: >On Thu, 2 Dec 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > > > >> I've been doing some research on NetAPP recently. Does anyone know >>what OS ONTAP is based upon. I was under the assumption that is was a >>derivitive of GNU/Linux (esp. due to the well know devs. they have >>working for them). Yet according to this article it is a BSD >>derivitive: >> >> >It is derivative of ole sunos4 (which was bsd-based) > > > ah execellent. thanks alex! -pete >-alex > >_______________________________________________ >% NYC*BUG talk mailing list >http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >%Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists >%We meet the first Wednesday of the month > > -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From dlavigne6 Fri Dec 3 11:37:11 2004 From: dlavigne6 (Dru) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 11:37:11 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] latest blog Message-ID: <20041203113644.L556@dru.domain.org> http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/5895 Better late than never :-) Dru From unixenigma Fri Dec 3 11:35:33 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 08:35:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] |OBSD Problem| - DHCP (network card) 'no DHCPOFFERS received' Message-ID: <20041203163533.59079.qmail@web53905.mail.yahoo.com> Hey guys. Funny, but I got my DHCP problem again. Remember no DHCPOFFERS and stuff. So my card work fine in OBSD for some time until I setup GAG to boot to windows (for some of my devices) I used OBSD for awhile,then I had to boot to windows, all was ok. As soon as I boot back to OBSD my NIC started doing this weird stuff again. I saved dmesg (same one as I provided before) I tried playing with bios - changing IRQs - no luck. I tried setting windows IP to static, thinking maybe the gate remembers somehow my mac/ip/os info - of course no luck (stupid idea) I took out the card off and in 2 secs put it back into the slot(same one), it started working again (DHCP gives me a lease) As soon as I boot back to windows and then back to OBSD - NIC gives me after few lines 'no DHCPOFFERS' I saved dmesg which when compared was the same as when the ard was working, except this line: "arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo" Anyway, I tried and I searched forums - no relevant information to help me. I changed this 'Davicom DM9102' NIC to '3Com 3c905C 100Base-TX' NIC I did not do anything else - my problem disappeared. Now I can boot into different systems without taking NIC out and back in for network for OBSD to work. Just wanted to follow up on the problem for future reference. So, if you have something to add - please do, otherwise I assume that the problem was in the NIC itself or BIOS. Here is the dmesg (when card was working ok dmesg is the same except it did not have "arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo" line.) Thanks a lot. Sincerely, GT ------------------------------------------------------ OpenBSD 3.6 (GENERIC) #59: Fri Sep 17 12:32:57 MDT 2004 deraadt at i386.openbsd.org:/usr/src/sys/arch/i386/compile/GENERIC cpu0: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.40GHz ("GenuineIntel" 686-class) 2.39 GHz cpu0: FPU,V86,DE,PSE,TSC,MSR,PAE,MCE,CX8,APIC,SEP,MTRR,PGE,MCA,CMOV,PAT,PSE36,CFLUSH,ACPI,MMX,FXSR,SSE,SSE2,SS,HTT,TM real mem = 1072766976 (1047624K) avail mem = 972263424 (949476K) using 4278 buffers containing 53739520 bytes (52480K) of memory mainbus0 (root) bios0 at mainbus0: AT/286+(00) BIOS, date 09/13/02, BIOS32 rev. 0 @ 0xffe90 apm0 at bios0: Power Management spec V1.2 apm0: AC on, battery charge unknown pcibios0 at bios0: rev 2.1 @ 0xf0000/0x10000 pcibios0: PCI IRQ Routing Table rev 1.0 @ 0xfba60/176 (9 entries) pcibios0: PCI Interrupt Router at 000:31:0 ("Intel 82801BA LPC" rev 0x00) pcibios0: PCI bus #2 is the last bus bios0: ROM list: 0xc0000/0xf000 0xcf000/0x1000 cpu0 at mainbus0 pci0 at mainbus0 bus 0: configuration mode 1 (no bios) pchb0 at pci0 dev 0 function 0 "Intel 82850 Host" rev 0x04: rng active, 7Kb/sec ppb0 at pci0 dev 1 function 0 "Intel 82850/82860 AGP" rev 0x04 pci1 at ppb0 bus 1 vga1 at pci1 dev 0 function 0 "Nvidia GeForce4 Ti 4200" rev 0xa3 wsdisplay0 at vga1: console (80x25, vt100 emulation) wsdisplay0: screen 1-5 added (80x25, vt100 emulation) ppb1 at pci0 dev 30 function 0 "Intel 82801BA AGP" rev 0x04 pci2 at ppb1 bus 2 "AT&T/Lucent FW322 1394" rev 0x04 at pci2 dev 7 function 0 not configured ohci0 at pci2 dev 8 function 0 "NEC USB" rev 0x41: irq 10, version 1.0 usb0 at ohci0: USB revision 1.0 uhub0 at usb0 uhub0: NEC OHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1 uhub0: 3 ports with 3 removable, self powered ohci1 at pci2 dev 8 function 1 "NEC USB" rev 0x41: irq 11, version 1.0 usb1 at ohci1: USB revision 1.0 uhub1 at usb1 uhub1: NEC OHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1 uhub1: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered ehci0 at pci2 dev 8 function 2 "NEC USB 2.0" rev 0x02: irq 11 ehci0: EHCI version 0.95 ehci0: companion controllers, 3 ports each: ohci0 ohci1 usb2 at ehci0: USB revision 2.0 uhub2 at usb2 uhub2: NEC EHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 2.00/1.00, addr 1 uhub2: 5 ports with 5 removable, self powered emu0 at pci2 dev 9 function 0 "Creative Labs SoundBlaster Live" rev 0x0a: irq 11 ac97: codec id 0x54524123 (TriTech Microelectronics TR28602) audio0 at emu0 "Creative Labs PCI Gameport Joystick" rev 0x0a at pci2 dev 9 function 1 not configured dc0 at pci2 dev 10 function 0 "Davicom DM9102" rev 0x31: irq 11, address 00:08:a1:24:48:77 amphy0 at dc0 phy 1: Am79C873 10/100 media interface, rev. 0 ichpcib0 at pci0 dev 31 function 0 "Intel 82801BA LPC" rev 0x04 pciide0 at pci0 dev 31 function 1 "Intel 82801BA IDE" rev 0x04: DMA, channel 0 wired to compatibility, channel 1 wired to compatibility wd0 at pciide0 channel 0 drive 0: wd0: 16-sector PIO, LBA, 114440MB, 234375000 sectors atapiscsi0 at pciide0 channel 0 drive 1 scsibus0 at atapiscsi0: 2 targets sd0 at scsibus0 targ 0 lun 0: SCSI0 0/direct removable sd0: drive offline wd0(pciide0:0:0): using PIO mode 4, Ultra-DMA mode 5 sd0(pciide0:0:1): using PIO mode 3, Ultra-DMA mode 2 atapiscsi1 at pciide0 channel 1 drive 0 scsibus1 at atapiscsi1: 2 targets cd0 at scsibus1 targ 0 lun 0: SCSI0 5/cdrom removable atapiscsi2 at pciide0 channel 1 drive 1 scsibus2 at atapiscsi2: 2 targets cd1 at scsibus2 targ 0 lun 0: SCSI0 5/cdrom removable cd0(pciide0:1:0): using PIO mode 4, Ultra-DMA mode 2 cd1(pciide0:1:1): using PIO mode 4, Ultra-DMA mode 2 uhci0 at pci0 dev 31 function 2 "Intel 82801BA USB" rev 0x04: irq 11 usb3 at uhci0: USB revision 1.0 uhub3 at usb3 uhub3: Intel UHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1 uhub3: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered "Intel 82801BA SMBus" rev 0x04 at pci0 dev 31 function 3 not configured uhci1 at pci0 dev 31 function 4 "Intel 82801BA USB2" rev 0x04: irq 9 usb4 at uhci1: USB revision 1.0 uhub4 at usb4 uhub4: Intel UHCI root hub, class 9/0, rev 1.00/1.00, addr 1 uhub4: 2 ports with 2 removable, self powered isa0 at ichpcib0 isadma0 at isa0 pckbc0 at isa0 port 0x60/5 pckbd0 at pckbc0 (kbd slot) pckbc0: using irq 1 for kbd slot wskbd0 at pckbd0: console keyboard, using wsdisplay0 pcppi0 at isa0 port 0x61 midi0 at pcppi0: sysbeep0 at pcppi0 lpt0 at isa0 port 0x378/4 irq 7 npx0 at isa0 port 0xf0/16: using exception 16 pccom0 at isa0 port 0x3f8/8 irq 4: ns16550a, 16 byte fifo fdc0 at isa0 port 0x3f0/6 irq 6 drq 2 fd0 at fdc0 drive 0: 1.44MB 80 cyl, 2 head, 18 sec biomask ff6d netmask ff6d ttymask ffef pctr: user-level cycle counter enabled dkcsum: wd0 matched BIOS disk 80 sd0(atapiscsi0:0:0): Check Condition (error 0x70) on opcode 0x0 SENSE KEY: Not Ready ASC/ASCQ: Medium Not Present sd0(atapiscsi0:0:0): Check Condition (error 0x70) on opcode 0x1b SENSE KEY: Not Ready ASC/ASCQ: Medium Not Present root on wd0a rootdev=0x0 rrootdev=0x300 rawdev=0x302 uhidev0 at uhub3 port 1 configuration 1 interface 0 uhidev0: Logitech USB Receiver, rev 1.10/9.10, addr 2, iclass 3/1 ums0 at uhidev0: 5 buttons and Z dir. wsmouse0 at ums0 mux 0 ugen0 at uhub1 port 2 ugen0: Hewlett-Packard HP Scanjet 5400C Series, rev 1.10/0.00, addr 2 arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo arpresolve: can't allocate llinfo ------------------------------------------------------ __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ike Fri Dec 3 13:48:16 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 13:48:16 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] latest blog In-Reply-To: <20041203113644.L556@dru.domain.org> References: <20041203113644.L556@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: On Dec 3, 2004, at 11:37 AM, Dru wrote: > > http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/5895 > > Better late than never :-) > > Dru Rockin'- thoughtfully, (and pleasantly non-inflamitoraly) put. Rocket- .ike From lists Fri Dec 3 16:44:01 2004 From: lists (lists at genoverly.net) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 22:44:01 +0100 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Why BSD? Message-ID: <0MKz1m-1CaLFa28Vs-0002uX@mrelay.perfora.net> Dru's essay draws attention to the lingering question we probably all need to answer OUT LOUD. I asked the question of the fledgeling NYCBUG list a year ago: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/2003-December/000047.html So, in that spirit we are going to build a page on the NYCBUG site that will hopefully help to answer "Why BSD?" as stated by NYCBUG members. Share with the world why you use BSD! Go to the Submission page on NYCBUG (http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Submission) and tell us all about it. Please put "Why BSD" in the title. We'll compile them and put them up on the web. Michael From pete Fri Dec 3 18:53:52 2004 From: pete (pete at nomadlogic.org) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 15:53:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Why BSD? In-Reply-To: <0MKz1m-1CaLFa28Vs-0002uX@mrelay.perfora.net> References: <0MKz1m-1CaLFa28Vs-0002uX@mrelay.perfora.net> Message-ID: <61730.160.33.20.11.1102118032.squirrel@www.nomadlogic.org> > > Dru's essay draws attention to the lingering question we probably all > need to answer OUT LOUD. I asked the question of the fledgeling NYCBUG > list a year ago: > > http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/2003-December/000047.html > > So, in that spirit we are going to build a page on the NYCBUG site that > will hopefully help to answer "Why BSD?" as stated by NYCBUG members. > > Share with the world why you use BSD! Go to the Submission page on > NYCBUG (http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Submission) and tell us all > about it. Please put "Why BSD" in the title. We'll compile them and > put them up on the web. well i wrote a very eloquent treastie on why I prefer the BSD way...but I promptly ignored the 2000 char limit. when i saw the end get cut off after previewing it, i paniced and hit the back button which erased my entire submission. sigh, in retrospect maybe my endorsement is not a good thing if i can't clearly read instructions ;) -pete ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From dlavigne6 Fri Dec 3 19:18:07 2004 From: dlavigne6 (Dru) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 19:18:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Why BSD? In-Reply-To: <61730.160.33.20.11.1102118032.squirrel@www.nomadlogic.org> References: <0MKz1m-1CaLFa28Vs-0002uX@mrelay.perfora.net> <61730.160.33.20.11.1102118032.squirrel@www.nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20041203191634.R556@dru.domain.org> On Fri, 3 Dec 2004 pete at nomadlogic.org wrote: > >> >> Dru's essay draws attention to the lingering question we probably all >> need to answer OUT LOUD. I asked the question of the fledgeling NYCBUG >> list a year ago: >> >> http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/2003-December/000047.html >> >> So, in that spirit we are going to build a page on the NYCBUG site that >> will hopefully help to answer "Why BSD?" as stated by NYCBUG members. >> >> Share with the world why you use BSD! Go to the Submission page on >> NYCBUG (http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Submission) and tell us all >> about it. Please put "Why BSD" in the title. We'll compile them and >> put them up on the web. > > well i wrote a very eloquent treastie on why I prefer the BSD way...but I > promptly ignored the 2000 char limit. when i saw the end get cut off > after previewing it, i paniced and hit the back button which erased my > entire submission. sigh, in retrospect maybe my endorsement is not a good > thing if i can't clearly read instructions ;) Aaaaww... I don't think O'Reilly has a limit when you post a comment if you feel like trying to recapture some of that eloquence :-) Dru From pete Fri Dec 3 19:18:14 2004 From: pete (pete at nomadlogic.org) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 16:18:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Why BSD? In-Reply-To: <20041203191634.R556@dru.domain.org> References: <0MKz1m-1CaLFa28Vs-0002uX@mrelay.perfora.net> <61730.160.33.20.11.1102118032.squirrel@www.nomadlogic.org> <20041203191634.R556@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: <23510.160.33.20.11.1102119494.squirrel@www.nomadlogic.org> > > > On Fri, 3 Dec 2004 pete at nomadlogic.org wrote: > >> >>> >>> Dru's essay draws attention to the lingering question we probably all >>> need to answer OUT LOUD. I asked the question of the fledgeling NYCBUG >>> list a year ago: >>> >>> http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/2003-December/000047.html >>> >>> So, in that spirit we are going to build a page on the NYCBUG site that >>> will hopefully help to answer "Why BSD?" as stated by NYCBUG members. >>> >>> Share with the world why you use BSD! Go to the Submission page on >>> NYCBUG (http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Submission) and tell us all >>> about it. Please put "Why BSD" in the title. We'll compile them and >>> put them up on the web. >> >> well i wrote a very eloquent treastie on why I prefer the BSD way...but >> I >> promptly ignored the 2000 char limit. when i saw the end get cut off >> after previewing it, i paniced and hit the back button which erased my >> entire submission. sigh, in retrospect maybe my endorsement is not a >> good >> thing if i can't clearly read instructions ;) > > > Aaaaww... I don't think O'Reilly has a limit when you post a comment if > you feel like trying to recapture some of that eloquence :-) > > Dru cool. when i get the egg off my face i'll make another go at it. i also have to wait until more people go home from work, don't wanna look like a total slacker ;) -p > ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From pete Fri Dec 3 19:49:30 2004 From: pete (pete at nomadlogic.org) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 16:49:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Why BSD? In-Reply-To: <0MKz1m-1CaLFa28Vs-0002uX@mrelay.perfora.net> References: <0MKz1m-1CaLFa28Vs-0002uX@mrelay.perfora.net> Message-ID: <57724.160.33.20.11.1102121370.squirrel@www.nomadlogic.org> > > Dru's essay draws attention to the lingering question we probably all > need to answer OUT LOUD. I asked the question of the fledgeling NYCBUG > list a year ago: > > http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/2003-December/000047.html > > So, in that spirit we are going to build a page on the NYCBUG site that > will hopefully help to answer "Why BSD?" as stated by NYCBUG members. > > Share with the world why you use BSD! Go to the Submission page on > NYCBUG (http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Submission) and tell us all > about it. Please put "Why BSD" in the title. We'll compile them and > put them up on the web. > this is a big reason why I run BSD: http://news.netcraft.com/archives/2004/12/02/most_reliable_hosting_providers_during_november.html not bad that 5 of the top 10 most reliable hosting providors are running BSD. -p > Michael > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From spork Fri Dec 3 19:56:25 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 19:56:25 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] latest blog In-Reply-To: <20041203113644.L556@dru.domain.org> References: <20041203113644.L556@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 3 Dec 2004, Dru wrote: > > http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/5895 I got sidetracked by PHK's article. Sadly he derides my t-shirt-winning "FreeBSD: The Power to Serve" tagline. :) Charles > Better late than never :-) > > Dru > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From scottro Fri Dec 3 21:52:21 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 21:52:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Westchester Library System's website (CROSSPOSTED nylug, nycbug) Message-ID: <20041204025221.GA49693@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Well, I can't get my father to leave MS, but at least I got him using Mozilla more than IE. In general, he prefers it and seems to get a great deal less spyware. He called me tonight--he was searching for something on the Westchester Library System's website. It uses java, however, despite the fact that he's using Mozilla in WinXP, the site wouldn't work. (His Mozilla does have the java plugin installed). Afterwards, I tried it with FreeBSD's firefox and linux-opera (both of which work with java on every other page I've visited) as well as on my wife's Mac with safari. However, it seems that the only browser that will work with this site is Internet Explorer. (He likes to experiment, and also has Netscape on his machine, but that didn't work either) I will probably attempt to write them about this, but of course, the more complaints they hear about it, the better, at least from an advocacy standpoint. Is it unreasonable to expect a site to work with other browsers than IE? The site in question is at http://www.westchesterlibraries.org/ns.html In the upper right, there's a link to reserve or renew books online. They do offer a telnet option, but it still seems worth mentioning it to them. Thanks for listening. - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Angel: Buffy, careful with this gift. Lots of things that seem strong and good and powerful, they can be painful. Buffy: Like, say, immortality? Angel: Exactly. I'm dying to get rid of that. Buffy: Funny. Angel: I'm a funny guy. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFBsSZl+lTVdes0Z9YRAk4fAJ9dVphROZZcy3U9BElL+5X/tc9lxQCdH+K8 Bf4CRJs44QVDWZm7BjofkTk= =bevE -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From scottro Fri Dec 3 21:57:20 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 21:57:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Follow up on my Westchester Library website post Message-ID: <20041204025720.GA49850@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Heh, small world. I just went to the contact page. http://www.westchesterlibraries.org/wls/#CT I see that an old friend (one of my formal martial arts teachers) is the Network Mgr. Although there's a different name for the webs, I think I'll start there. (There's also a tech support link for email only, but I'll probably start by calling my friend.) - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Spike: So when do we destroy the world, already? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFBsSeQ+lTVdes0Z9YRAp29AJ0YM3VzTrZt784Aehh7x6QGtHqj6QCfeYB/ mh+B4mzniTNN5Fgegu6Yjdo= =YE3H -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From scottro Fri Dec 3 22:33:08 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 22:33:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] follow up on the follow up Message-ID: <20041204033308.GA50103@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Ah Pook very kindly sent me another link http://www.westchesterlibraries.org/catalog/ with a link to "Catalog and More" that doesn't use java. My dad is happy, as he can now browse the Westchester library catalog without IE, but I still think it merits a complaint. I did send a note of complaint to my friend (ironically enough, we haven't seen each other for several years--at that time, I was defending MS and he was just getting into Unix), but as he IS a martial arts teacher, it was a very polite complaint. :) - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Xander: Yep, vampires are real. A lot of 'em live in Sunnydale. Willow'll fill you in. Willow: I know it's hard to accept at first. Oz: Actually, it explains a lot. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFBsS/0+lTVdes0Z9YRAiFfAJsHZYOi+BiPApLGLj6Xlz/7FwMmOQCdHv6f 8d/WZ0KR4DZ5ad9ZB9MBkTU= =a2nk -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From george Mon Dec 6 09:46:19 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 09:46:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification Message-ID: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> This Register.com article leads me to some interesting conclusions: http://www.theregister.com/2004/12/06/linux_economic_realities/ There have been a number of Linux-related certs, most importantly the RedHat one. But we're fortunate that a single BSD cert is more easily created, as we don't have huge multinationals backing one project versus another. If a BSD cert was created, it could be done in the interests of the technology in general, without spawning competition from other entities. One of the benefits of not having competing corporate entities or distros in the mix. We would obviously want to be as inclusive as possible, particularly in the beginning, for all the projects. . . from Free, Net, Open and DragonFly. I am thinking about starting up a mailman list for the topic. Dru, Ike, myself and many others have been involved in discussions on this matter haphazardly. . . it may be time to jump start the project in January. We should probably implement an accompanying Wiki for it, as it is a cumulative-type project. Next stage is to pull in others outside of NYC*BUG, particularly critical individuals at each project and at Yahoo, Pair, etc. Thoughts? We should probably have a volunteer to oversee the tech end of things for the wiki, list, documentation. g From tillman Mon Dec 6 15:49:20 2004 From: tillman (Tillman Hodgson) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 14:49:20 -0600 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041206204920.GL569@seekingfire.com> On Mon, Dec 06, 2004 at 09:46:19AM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > This Register.com article leads me to some interesting conclusions: > > http://www.theregister.com/2004/12/06/linux_economic_realities/ > > There have been a number of Linux-related certs, most importantly the > RedHat one. The LPI one is an interesting one because of it's claim to be vender-neutral. Disclaimer: I'm LPI certified and participated in their beta process. > But we're fortunate that a single BSD cert is more easily created, as > we don't have huge multinationals backing one project versus another. That's true. Hmmm. I hadn't looked at it that way before. > I am thinking about starting up a mailman list for the topic. Dru, > Ike, myself and many others have been involved in discussions on this > matter haphazardly. . . it may be time to jump start the project in > January. I'm interested in getting involved. -T -- "I don't believe in art. I believe in artists." -- Marcel Duchamp From george Mon Dec 6 15:50:12 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 15:50:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Site & mail Message-ID: <6C4DB15C-47C8-11D9-91B3-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Things are back up. We are going to avoid this happening again. . . g From lists Sun Dec 5 09:00:01 2004 From: lists (lists at genoverly.net) Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2004 15:00:01 +0100 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD admin Message-ID: <0MKyxe-1Cawxd2gWo-0000fA@mrelay.perfora.net> http://www.taosecurity.com/keeping_freebsd_up-to-date.html "My advice on administering this reference platform is based on deploying FreeBSD on servers, workstations, and laptops since 2000. The article represents mix of my interpretations of official FreeBSD documentation, inputs from mentors, and the result of my own experimentation and deployment strategies. This guide cannot be anywhere near a complete reference on keeping FreeBSD up-to-date or maintaining a secure system. I strongly recommend reading the excellent FreeBSD Handbook as well as the multiple helpful published books on FreeBSD." From JBrown Mon Dec 6 16:56:15 2004 From: JBrown (Brown, James Jim) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 16:56:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: I'm also interested in getting involved. Jim B. Note: The information contained in this message may be privileged and confidential and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer. Thank you. ThruPoint, Inc. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041206/531bc343/attachment.html From tux Mon Dec 6 09:56:56 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 09:56:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Websites Down? Message-ID: <001401c4dba3$d6a8b7b0$0500a8c0@apollo> Is it just my browser, or are the websites for NYCBUG and the upcoming party down? Kevin From spork Sat Dec 4 14:32:04 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 14:32:04 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Follow up on my Westchester Library website post In-Reply-To: <20041204025720.GA49850@scottro11.homeunix.net> References: <20041204025720.GA49850@scottro11.homeunix.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 3 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Heh, small world. I just went to the contact page. > > http://www.westchesterlibraries.org/wls/#CT Small world indeed. Or a world of bad webmasters. :) This site has never rendered properly in Safari: http://www.montlib.com/ And the webmaster has never responded to (polite) suggestions to clean it up or accept help in making it accessible to those not using IE. There should be some requirement that publically-funded operations like this follow web standards... Charles > I see that an old friend (one of my formal martial arts teachers) > is the Network Mgr. Although there's a different name for the webs, I > think I'll start there. (There's also a tech support link for email > only, but I'll probably start by calling my friend.) > > > - -- > > Scott Robbins > > PGP keyID EB3467D6 > ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) > gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 > > Spike: So when do we destroy the world, already? > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) > > iD8DBQFBsSeQ+lTVdes0Z9YRAp29AJ0YM3VzTrZt784Aehh7x6QGtHqj6QCfeYB/ > mh+B4mzniTNN5Fgegu6Yjdo= > =YE3H > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From george Mon Dec 6 20:29:05 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 20:29:05 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] looking for post cvs perms and rsync wrapper programs Message-ID: <20041207012905.GD13722@sta> Hey, what is that program that restores uid/gid and permissions to files after they have been checked out from cvs? Also, there is wrapper for rsync so it can be used to efficiently make full backups every day -- it uses hard links on files that haven't changed, so you can pick your day and get the full backup -- all at the expense of changed files and lots of inodes. Only, I don't remember the name of the program... // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From unixenigma Tue Dec 7 11:17:27 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 08:17:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041207161727.48384.qmail@web53903.mail.yahoo.com> Great idea. Please, let me know if I can be of any service to this project - count me in. GT --- "G. Rosamond" wrote: > This Register.com article leads me to some > interesting conclusions: > > http://www.theregister.com/2004/12/06/linux_economic_realities/ > > There have been a number of Linux-related certs, > most importantly the > RedHat one. > > But we're fortunate that a single BSD cert is more > easily created, as > we don't have huge multinationals backing one > project versus another. > If a BSD cert was created, it could be done in the > interests of the > technology in general, without spawning competition > from other > entities. One of the benefits of not having > competing corporate > entities or distros in the mix. > > We would obviously want to be as inclusive as > possible, particularly in > the beginning, for all the projects. . . from Free, > Net, Open and > DragonFly. > > I am thinking about starting up a mailman list for > the topic. Dru, > Ike, myself and many others have been involved in > discussions on this > matter haphazardly. . . it may be time to jump start > the project in > January. > > We should probably implement an accompanying Wiki > for it, as it is a > cumulative-type project. Next stage is to pull in > others outside of > NYC*BUG, particularly critical individuals at each > project and at > Yahoo, Pair, etc. > > Thoughts? We should probably have a volunteer to > oversee the tech end > of things for the wiki, list, documentation. > > g > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce > lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dlavigne6 Tue Dec 7 11:38:11 2004 From: dlavigne6 (Dru) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 11:38:11 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] latest blog Message-ID: <20041207113803.D545@dru.domain.org> For those who haven't upgraded to FreeBSD 5.3 yet... http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/6033 Dru From fungus Tue Dec 7 12:51:50 2004 From: fungus (Lonnie Olson) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 10:51:50 -0700 Subject: [nycbug-talk] looking for post cvs perms and rsync wrapper programs In-Reply-To: <20041207012905.GD13722@sta> References: <20041207012905.GD13722@sta> Message-ID: On Dec 6, 2004, at 6:29 PM, George Georgalis wrote: > Also, there is wrapper for rsync so it can be used to efficiently > make full backups every day -- it uses hard links on files that > haven't changed, so you can pick your day and get the full backup > -- all at the expense of changed files and lots of inodes. Only, > I don't remember the name of the program... http://www.freshports.org/sysutils/rsnapshot/ --lonnie -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 2482 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041207/ee5780e5/attachment.bin From scottro Tue Dec 7 17:40:51 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 17:40:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] latest blog In-Reply-To: <20041207113803.D545@dru.domain.org> References: <20041207113803.D545@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: <20041207224051.GB32411@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 11:38:11AM -0500, Dru wrote: > > For those who haven't upgraded to FreeBSD 5.3 yet... > > http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/6033 Heh Dru, you should have read my page, I cover about three of your issues there. :) Another very nice thing about 5.3 (not yet mentioned in UPDATING as of a few days ago) is rather than cd'ing to /usr/obj and cleaning up that way, there's a new make cleanworld target, done from /usr/src. This eliminates things like the following chflags -R noschg * (Thinking, hrrm, this is taking a long time today) rm -rf * (Hrrm, this is really taking awhile.) cd /usr/src /usr/src no such directory (HUH??????) pwd /usr Oops. :) Yes, it really did happen once--fortunately, a test box, so I could laugh. - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Angel: So, you're back. Cordelia: Very good, Mister I-can't-tail-the-suspect-during-the-day- because-I'll-burst-into-flames Private Eye. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFBtjFz+lTVdes0Z9YRAmRQAKC8T+NwB42Np3Hko6A+Rk927nzviQCeMolr T+YIcK2LYgmmjzbJ+Cfw7uA= =a6mi -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From nycbug Tue Dec 7 18:02:14 2004 From: nycbug (a nice bug) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 18:02:14 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: latest blog In-Reply-To: <20041207224051.GB32411@scottro11.homeunix.net> References: <20041207113803.D545@dru.domain.org> <20041207224051.GB32411@scottro11.homeunix.net> Message-ID: <20041207230214.GA28584@florian.hastek.net> Scott Robbins: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > way, there's a new make cleanworld target, done from /usr/src. This > eliminates things like the following > > chflags -R noschg * > > (Thinking, hrrm, this is taking a long time today) > > rm -rf * > > (Hrrm, this is really taking awhile.) > > cd /usr/src > > /usr/src no such directory > > > (HUH??????) > > pwd /usr > > Oops. :) ROTF!!! Haven't laughed this hard in weeks! > From pete Tue Dec 7 19:31:07 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 19:31:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Security Implications for cvsupd Message-ID: <20041208003107.GA18006@nomadlogic.org> Hi all, For various reasons I've contemplated setting up a cvsup mirror. While I plan to use it mostly for personal use at first, I've kicked around the idea of making it semi-public. Are there any non-obvious security implications one should think about when doing this. I am most likely going to run it in a jail, but there maybe there are other things to worry about. Secondly, is there any interest/need for yet another cvs mirror for FreeBSD in the NycBug community? -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From dlavigne6 Tue Dec 7 21:32:55 2004 From: dlavigne6 (Dru) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 21:32:55 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] latest blog In-Reply-To: <20041207224051.GB32411@scottro11.homeunix.net> References: <20041207113803.D545@dru.domain.org> <20041207224051.GB32411@scottro11.homeunix.net> Message-ID: <20041207213155.C545@dru.domain.org> On Tue, 7 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 11:38:11AM -0500, Dru wrote: >> >> For those who haven't upgraded to FreeBSD 5.3 yet... >> >> http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/6033 > > > Heh Dru, you should have read my page, I cover about three of your > issues there. :) > > Another very nice thing about 5.3 (not yet mentioned in UPDATING as of a > few days ago) is rather than cd'ing to /usr/obj and cleaning up that > way, there's a new make cleanworld target, done from /usr/src. This > eliminates things like the following > > chflags -R noschg * > > (Thinking, hrrm, this is taking a long time today) > > rm -rf * > > (Hrrm, this is really taking awhile.) > > cd /usr/src > > /usr/src no such directory > > > (HUH??????) > > pwd /usr > > Oops. :) > > Yes, it really did happen once--fortunately, a test box, so I could > laugh. > Ouch! BTW, do you have an URL for your notes? If you want, post the URL as a comment to the blog so others can see read through it as well :-) Dru From scottro Tue Dec 7 22:02:43 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 22:02:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] latest blog In-Reply-To: <20041207213155.C545@dru.domain.org> References: <20041207113803.D545@dru.domain.org> <20041207224051.GB32411@scottro11.homeunix.net> <20041207213155.C545@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: <20041208030243.GA17789@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 09:32:55PM -0500, Dru wrote: > > > On Tue, 7 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > > >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > >Hash: SHA1 > > > >On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 11:38:11AM -0500, Dru wrote: > >> > >>For those who haven't upgraded to FreeBSD 5.3 yet... > >> > >>http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/6033 > > > > > >Heh Dru, you should have read my page, I cover about three of your > >issues there. :) > > > > > Ouch! BTW, do you have an URL for your notes? If you want, post the > URL as a comment to the blog so others can see read through it as well > :-) Yes'm, I went ahead and did so. I thought I'd wound up posting it twice, but it only showed once. :) - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Buffy: Ahh, it's okay. Gave Cord and I chance to spend some quality death time. Cordelia: And we got these free corsages. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFBtm7T+lTVdes0Z9YRAqStAKCpqyehp0HCAdlyuYvZMAI4hbrepwCgi6AS 25uQdCFR8mZH5j3i2rANV2M= =GrgS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From okan Tue Dec 7 23:19:42 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 23:19:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Security Implications for cvsupd In-Reply-To: <20041208003107.GA18006@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041208003107.GA18006@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20041208041942.GB42546@yinaska.pair.com> On Tue 2004.12.07 at 19:31 -0500, Pete Wright wrote: > Hi all, > For various reasons I've contemplated setting up a cvsup mirror. > While I plan to use it mostly for personal use at first, I've > kicked around the idea of making it semi-public. Are there any > non-obvious security implications one should think about when > doing this. I am most likely going to run it in a jail, but > there maybe there are other things to worry about. Secondly, > is there any interest/need for yet another cvs mirror for > FreeBSD in the NycBug community? an nycbug mirror in california - that's a novel idea! i say do it ;) as far as security is concerned, do anoncvs over ssh - no pserver. since i imagine you are running pf somewhere on or in front of it, limit the bandwidth and connections. i've run an unofficial openbsd mirror for quite a while for a couple of dozen people and projects without concern - not really publicly advertised, but publicly available. - just for kicks. okan > -p > > -- > ~~oO00Oo~~ > Peter Wright > pete at nomadlogic.org > www.nomadlogic.org/~pete > 917.415.9866 > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From pete Tue Dec 7 23:33:14 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 23:33:14 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Security Implications for cvsupd In-Reply-To: <20041208041942.GB42546@yinaska.pair.com> References: <20041208003107.GA18006@nomadlogic.org> <20041208041942.GB42546@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: <20041208043314.GC18006@nomadlogic.org> On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 11:19:42PM -0500, Okan Demirmen wrote: > On Tue 2004.12.07 at 19:31 -0500, Pete Wright wrote: > > Hi all, > > For various reasons I've contemplated setting up a cvsup mirror. > > While I plan to use it mostly for personal use at first, I've > > kicked around the idea of making it semi-public. Are there any > > non-obvious security implications one should think about when > > doing this. I am most likely going to run it in a jail, but > > there maybe there are other things to worry about. Secondly, > > is there any interest/need for yet another cvs mirror for > > FreeBSD in the NycBug community? > > an nycbug mirror in california - that's a novel idea! i say do it ;) well it'd be admin'd from ca, but it's colo'd in rockland co ny. that's the only way george would allow me to keep my nycbug mebership card ;p > > as far as security is concerned, do anoncvs over ssh - no pserver. > since i imagine you are running pf somewhere on or in front of it, > limit the bandwidth and connections. cool, would this still apply for cvsup? I just noticed that i incorrectly refered to it as a cvs mirror in my original email. i meant cvsup. > > i've run an unofficial openbsd mirror for quite a while for a couple > of dozen people and projects without concern - not really publicly > advertised, but publicly available. - just for kicks. > cool...that's pretty much what i'm shooting for. know i know who to call when all h*ll breaks loose ;) -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From spork Tue Dec 7 23:41:36 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 23:41:36 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Security Implications for cvsupd In-Reply-To: <20041208043314.GC18006@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041208003107.GA18006@nomadlogic.org> <20041208041942.GB42546@yinaska.pair.com> <20041208043314.GC18006@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 7 Dec 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > cool, would this still apply for cvsup? I just noticed that i > incorrectly refered to it as a cvs mirror in my original email. i meant > cvsup. Cvsup is easier. You could jail it if you want and that would do it. Check out the cvsup-mirror port. It makes setting this up almost too easy (I set it up for intenal use @bway). The hard part is finding a good mirror to sync with; when I set mine up I had a rough time finding one that was available in the wee morning hours. Charles >> >> i've run an unofficial openbsd mirror for quite a while for a couple >> of dozen people and projects without concern - not really publicly >> advertised, but publicly available. - just for kicks. >> > cool...that's pretty much what i'm shooting for. know i know who to > call when all h*ll breaks loose ;) > > -p > > > -- > ~~oO00Oo~~ > Peter Wright > pete at nomadlogic.org > www.nomadlogic.org/~pete > 917.415.9866 > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From pete Tue Dec 7 23:43:43 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 23:43:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Security Implications for cvsupd In-Reply-To: References: <20041208003107.GA18006@nomadlogic.org> <20041208041942.GB42546@yinaska.pair.com> <20041208043314.GC18006@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20041208044343.GD18006@nomadlogic.org> On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 11:41:36PM -0500, Charles Sprickman wrote: > On Tue, 7 Dec 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > > >cool, would this still apply for cvsup? I just noticed that i > >incorrectly refered to it as a cvs mirror in my original email. i meant > >cvsup. > > Cvsup is easier. You could jail it if you want and that would do it. > > Check out the cvsup-mirror port. It makes setting this up almost too easy > (I set it up for intenal use @bway). The hard part is finding a good > mirror to sync with; when I set mine up I had a rough time finding one > that was available in the wee morning hours. > > Charles execellent! i saw that port mentioned in dan lagine's freebsddiary.com site. allright now i'm getting excited! -pete > > >> > >>i've run an unofficial openbsd mirror for quite a while for a couple > >>of dozen people and projects without concern - not really publicly > >>advertised, but publicly available. - just for kicks. > >> > >cool...that's pretty much what i'm shooting for. know i know who to > >call when all h*ll breaks loose ;) > > > >-p > > > > > >-- > >~~oO00Oo~~ > >Peter Wright > >pete at nomadlogic.org > >www.nomadlogic.org/~pete > >917.415.9866 > >_______________________________________________ > >% NYC*BUG talk mailing list > >http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > >%Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > >%We meet the first Wednesday of the month > > -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From pete Tue Dec 7 23:47:23 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 23:47:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Security Implications for cvsupd In-Reply-To: <20041208044343.GD18006@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041208003107.GA18006@nomadlogic.org> <20041208041942.GB42546@yinaska.pair.com> <20041208043314.GC18006@nomadlogic.org> <20041208044343.GD18006@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20041208044723.GE18006@nomadlogic.org> On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 11:43:43PM -0500, Pete Wright wrote: > > execellent! i saw that port mentioned in dan lagine's freebsddiary.com > site. allright now i'm getting excited! sorry!! that should be Dan Langille, i hope you don't hold this against me dan ;) -pete -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From george Tue Dec 7 23:49:55 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 23:49:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Security Implications for cvsupd In-Reply-To: <20041208044343.GD18006@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041208003107.GA18006@nomadlogic.org> <20041208041942.GB42546@yinaska.pair.com> <20041208043314.GC18006@nomadlogic.org> <20041208044343.GD18006@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <9B4A2D9C-48D4-11D9-932B-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 7, 2004, at 11:43 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 11:41:36PM -0500, Charles Sprickman wrote: >> On Tue, 7 Dec 2004, Pete Wright wrote: >> >>> cool, would this still apply for cvsup? I just noticed that i >>> incorrectly refered to it as a cvs mirror in my original email. i >>> meant >>> cvsup. >> >> Cvsup is easier. You could jail it if you want and that would do it. >> >> Check out the cvsup-mirror port. It makes setting this up almost too >> easy >> (I set it up for intenal use @bway). The hard part is finding a good >> mirror to sync with; when I set mine up I had a rough time finding one >> that was available in the wee morning hours. >> >> Charles > > execellent! i saw that port mentioned in dan lagine's freebsddiary.com > site. allright now i'm getting excited! > Pete. . . it's an awesome thing. . . and yes, with it, you can keep your NYC*BUG membership even though you temporarily find yourself in Cali. . . I think it would be nice to list cvsup servers provided by NYC*BUG people. . . Okan, don't keep it a secret. . . MW: maybe setup an area for cvsup servers provided. . . No one has elaborated which or all BSDs they are providing cvsup servers for. I think it's all if possible. And PF the bandwidth if necessary. . . g From pete Tue Dec 7 23:53:56 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 23:53:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Security Implications for cvsupd In-Reply-To: <9B4A2D9C-48D4-11D9-932B-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <20041208003107.GA18006@nomadlogic.org> <20041208041942.GB42546@yinaska.pair.com> <20041208043314.GC18006@nomadlogic.org> <20041208044343.GD18006@nomadlogic.org> <9B4A2D9C-48D4-11D9-932B-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041208045356.GG18006@nomadlogic.org> On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 11:49:55PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > On Dec 7, 2004, at 11:43 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > > >On Tue, Dec 07, 2004 at 11:41:36PM -0500, Charles Sprickman wrote: > >>On Tue, 7 Dec 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > >> > >>>cool, would this still apply for cvsup? I just noticed that i > >>>incorrectly refered to it as a cvs mirror in my original email. i > >>>meant > >>>cvsup. > >> > >>Cvsup is easier. You could jail it if you want and that would do it. > >> > >>Check out the cvsup-mirror port. It makes setting this up almost too > >>easy > >>(I set it up for intenal use @bway). The hard part is finding a good > >>mirror to sync with; when I set mine up I had a rough time finding one > >>that was available in the wee morning hours. > >> > >>Charles > > > >execellent! i saw that port mentioned in dan lagine's freebsddiary.com > >site. allright now i'm getting excited! > > > > Pete. . . it's an awesome thing. . . and yes, with it, you can keep > your NYC*BUG membership even though you temporarily find yourself in > Cali. . . > > I think it would be nice to list cvsup servers provided by NYC*BUG > people. . . Okan, don't keep it a secret. . . > > MW: maybe setup an area for cvsup servers provided. . . > > No one has elaborated which or all BSDs they are providing cvsup > servers for. > > I think it's all if possible. And PF the bandwidth if necessary. . . > cool, i'm building the jail now. hopefully i'll have something usable up by the end of the week. so i'll post the url to the list when i feel it's ok to start hammering the server. for now i'll just be mirroring the 5.x brach of FreeBSD, but if it works out as easy as it sounds i'll probably be able to dedicate more disk space to this in the future. -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From george Wed Dec 8 00:06:31 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 00:06:31 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Holiday Party Message-ID: Hope everyone RSVP'd who needed to. If you didn't, please contact me off list. Also, there are still some slots available for small businesses. It's a great way to grow your small hosting/consulting/services firm amid an impressive audience. The RSVP list is stunning, to say the least. Name the big firm in NYC and there are technology people from it. From AT&T, IBM, AIG, Goldman, and so on. It looks like we're getting the 'best and the brightest' at the event. Again, contact me off list with any queries on this topic. We, of course, need more volunteers to help out with various tasks throughout the evening. Thanks to those who have volunteered so far, including the one who I bumped into tonight wearing the RedHat hat. g From sunny-ml Wed Dec 8 09:10:10 2004 From: sunny-ml (Sunny Dubey) Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 09:10:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Holiday Party In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200412080910.10371.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> On Wednesday 08 December 2004 00:06, G. Rosamond wrote: > The RSVP list is stunning, to say the least. > Name the big firm in NYC and there are technology people from it. From > AT&T, IBM, AIG, Goldman, and so on. It looks like we're getting the > 'best and the brightest' at the event. *cough* Since when did people from big firms become intelligent ? I can think of lots of hopelessly stupid-beyond-belief people working at big companies/firms/etc. And with the same token I can think of lots of very intelligent people working at small firms/SMB's/etc. Most of the folks of NYCBUG aren't from big firms, yet I could easily hold them to a higher light than some mindless sysadmin from a Wall St. corp. Its not a question of being anti-large corporations. Rather its about setting the right tone for this party, keeping things in perspective, and not engaging in meaningless amounts of professionalism. Sunny Dubey (a very small fish, and proud of it) From sunny-ml Wed Dec 8 09:12:25 2004 From: sunny-ml (Sunny Dubey) Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 09:12:25 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsd advocacy: "Selling" NetBSD to the IT Department Message-ID: <200412080912.25633.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> hey guys This thread just started today on the netbsd-users list: http://mail-index.netbsd.org/netbsd-users/2004/12/08/0000.html it might just be worth keeping track of. cool Sunny Dubey From tux Wed Dec 8 10:13:52 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 10:13:52 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Holiday Party References: <200412080910.10371.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> Message-ID: <000d01c4dd38$87036430$6400a8c0@olympus> : Since when did people from big firms become intelligent ? I can think of lots : of hopelessly stupid-beyond-belief people working at big companies/firms/etc. : And with the same token I can think of lots of very intelligent people : working at small firms/SMB's/etc. : : Most of the folks of NYCBUG aren't from big firms, yet I could easily hold : them to a higher light than some mindless sysadmin from a Wall St. corp. : : Its not a question of being anti-large corporations. Rather its about setting : the right tone for this party, keeping things in perspective, and not : engaging in meaningless amounts of professionalism. : : Sunny Dubey : (a very small fish, and proud of it) Well said. (an even smaller fish, and damn proud of it) From pete Wed Dec 8 14:10:41 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 14:10:41 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Holiday Party In-Reply-To: <200412080910.10371.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> References: <200412080910.10371.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> Message-ID: <20041208191041.GC10518@nomadlogic.org> On Wed, Dec 08, 2004 at 09:10:10AM -0500, Sunny Dubey wrote: > On Wednesday 08 December 2004 00:06, G. Rosamond wrote: > > > The RSVP list is stunning, to say the least. > > Name the big firm in NYC and there are technology people from it. From > > AT&T, IBM, AIG, Goldman, and so on. It looks like we're getting the > > 'best and the brightest' at the event. > > *cough* > > Since when did people from big firms become intelligent ? I can think of lots > of hopelessly stupid-beyond-belief people working at big companies/firms/etc. > And with the same token I can think of lots of very intelligent people > working at small firms/SMB's/etc. I agree with you here sunny, altho there is something to be said for meeting and opening up communications with people that work at large firms. they do bring something different to the table. i've also got to say that i've seen my fair share of boneheaded SMB admins/programmers in my day as well. so as the saying goes...size doesn't always matter ;p > > Most of the folks of NYCBUG aren't from big firms, yet I could easily hold > them to a higher light than some mindless sysadmin from a Wall St. corp. that's actually an interesting point, altho i wounder if it's true or not? i can think of a couple posters on talk@ that are definatly not from what i'd consider SMB's. > > Its not a question of being anti-large corporations. Rather its about setting > the right tone for this party, keeping things in perspective, and not > engaging in meaningless amounts of professionalism. > here here, altho i'm going to miss it.... -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From george Wed Dec 8 14:30:19 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 14:30:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Holiday Party In-Reply-To: <20041208191041.GC10518@nomadlogic.org> References: <200412080910.10371.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> <20041208191041.GC10518@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <98C6D390-494F-11D9-96EA-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 8, 2004, at 2:10 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > On Wed, Dec 08, 2004 at 09:10:10AM -0500, Sunny Dubey wrote: >> On Wednesday 08 December 2004 00:06, G. Rosamond wrote: >> >>> The RSVP list is stunning, to say the least. >>> Name the big firm in NYC and there are technology people from it. >>> From >>> AT&T, IBM, AIG, Goldman, and so on. It looks like we're getting the >>> 'best and the brightest' at the event. >> >> *cough* >> >> Since when did people from big firms become intelligent ? I can >> think of lots >> of hopelessly stupid-beyond-belief people working at big >> companies/firms/etc. >> And with the same token I can think of lots of very intelligent people >> working at small firms/SMB's/etc. > > I agree with you here sunny, altho there is something to be said for > meeting and opening up communications with people that work at large > firms. they do bring something different to the table. i've also got > to say that i've seen my fair share of boneheaded SMB > admins/programmers > in my day as well. so as the saying goes...size doesn't always matter > ;p There are boneheads everywhere. There's no question about that. But for the sponsors, they are certainly interested in the big name firms, as they are contacted to larger budgets. That was the point Sunny. Not skill levels implied. >> >> Most of the folks of NYCBUG aren't from big firms, yet I could easily >> hold >> them to a higher light than some mindless sysadmin from a Wall St. >> corp. > > that's actually an interesting point, altho i wounder if it's true or > not? i can think of a couple posters on talk@ that are definatly not > from what i'd consider SMB's. Who knows. Mindless speculation, IMO. > >> >> Its not a question of being anti-large corporations. Rather its >> about setting >> the right tone for this party, keeping things in perspective, and not >> engaging in meaningless amounts of professionalism. >> > here here, altho i'm going to miss it.... > That's undeniable. But when you move back to NYC. . . g From lists Wed Dec 8 15:42:28 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 15:42:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Fw: Newsletter from O'Reilly Message-ID: <20041208154228.56568c94@delinux.abwatley.com> Begin forwarded message: ================================================================ O'Reilly News for User Group Members December 8, 2004 ================================================================ ---------------------------------------------------------------- Book News ---------------------------------------------------------------- -PC Hardware Annoyances -Mac Annoyances -Windows XP Personal Trainer -Excel 2003 Personal Trainer -PowerPoint 2003 Personal Trainer -Managing Projects with GNU make, 3rd Edition -Mind Hacks: Tips & Tools for Using Your Brain -A Theory of Fun for Game Design -Flash Out of the Box -Oracle SQL*Plus Pocket Reference, 3rd Edition ---------------------------------------------------------------- Upcoming Events ---------------------------------------------------------------- -Gordon Meyer ("Smart Home Hacks"), DigitalGuru, Sunnyvale, CA-- December 15 -Kyle Rankin, ("Knoppix Hacks"), at LUGOD, Davis, CA--January 4 -Cary Millsap ("Optimizing Oracle Performance"), COUG, Calgary, Alberta--January 5 -O'Reilly (Booth #2225) at Macworld Conference & Expo, San Francisco--January 10-14 -Free Exhibit Hall Pass for Macworld ---------------------------------------------------------------- Conference News ---------------------------------------------------------------- -Registration is Open for O'Reilly Emerging Technology Conference, San Diego, CA--March 14-17, 2005 ---------------------------------------------------------------- News ---------------------------------------------------------------- -David Pogue's "CBS News Sunday Morning" Wins an Emmy -Paying Attention (or Not) to the Flickr Daily Zeitgeist -New Titles on Safari -Lawrence Lessig on Blogs and the Law -Author IMterview: "Smart Home Hacks" -True Stories of Knoppix Rescues -Choosing a Language for Interactive Fiction -Inside EuroBSDCon 2004 -Gifts, Gadgets, and Software for Mac Geeks -Reclaiming Hacks -Five Favorite Annoyances -How To Start Hacking Your PC -Using the SQL Server 2000 Reporting Services -Automate Windows Installations -Learning Lab: .NET Certificate $200 Instant Rebate -Simple Object Persistence with the db4o Object Database -Juggle Your Java with JDistro -Reeking Havok with the Experience Music Project -Greg Kessler: Rock and Roll Shooter ================================================ Book News ================================================ Did you know you can request a free book to review for your group? 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In the category of "Outstanding Interpretation and/or Analysis of a Business News Story--Regularly Scheduled Newscast," David Pogue's "CBS News Sunday Morning" won the Emmy: "David Pogue takes complex technological applications such as Google or Spam and makes them comprehensible to the ordinary, non-technophile viewer." David is the creator of the Missing Manuals Series. You can read the press release here: http://www.emmyonline.org/emmy/2ndBizEmmyWinners.html ***Paying Attention (or Not) to the Flickr Daily Zeitgeist Perhaps the most complex operating system in the world is the human brain. In "Mind Hacks," authors Matt Webb and Tom Stafford use cognitive neuroscience to present experiments, tricks, and tips related to vision, motor skills, attention, cognition, and subliminal perception. In this article, they explore how elements of web pages attract attention and influence reading. They then apply some of the ideas from their book in the examination of one such element, an animated photo-sharing widget, the Flickr Daily Zeitgeist. http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/network/2004/12/06/mndhcks_1.html ***New Titles on Safari Search, annotate, read, and download chapters from your favorite technical books through Safari Bookshelf. New titles from O'Reilly include: "Java Network Programming, 3rd Edition;" "Securing Windows Server 2003;" "Unit Test Frameworks;" "Word Hacks;" "Managing Projects with GNU make, 3rd Edition;" "High Performance Linux Clusters;" "Oracle SQL*Plus: The Definitive Guide;" and "Windows XP Power Hound." If you haven't gone on Safari yet, get a free trial. http://www.oreilly.com/go/safari-ug ***Lawrence Lessig on Blogs and the Law In this IT Conversations interview, Lawrence Lessig talks about the growth of law-related blogs and their impact on the practice of law, and some of the problems with current copyright law. http://www.itconversations.com/shows/detail285.html Lessig will be speaking at O'Reilly's Emerging Technology Conference. http://conferences.oreillynet.com/etech/ ***Author IMterview: "Smart Home Hacks" Gizmodo editor Joel Johnson talks to author Gordon Meyer about home automation and some of the reasons X10 is still a good choice for home hackers. After the IMterview, you'll find a hack on how to forward your phone calls without using the phone company's services, excerpted from Gordon's new book "Smart Home Hacks." http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/wireless/x10/index.php#smart-home-hacks-imterview-and-book-excerpt-025870 --------------------- Open Source --------------------- ***True Stories of Knoppix Rescues A battle-hardened sysadmin shares his near-death tales of Knoppix rescue. Kyle Rankin is a true Knoppix veteran with endless stories of broken systems and machines in distress. In this article, he shares a few of his favorites, complete with outcomes and weapons of choice. Not for the faint of heart. Kyle is the author of "Knoppix Hacks." http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2004/12/02/knpxhks_1.html ***Choosing a Language for Interactive Fiction Retro gaming is hot, and what could be more retro than interactive fiction? If you pine for the days of white mailboxes, twisty little passages, and Babelfish all in your mind, perhaps you long to create your own interactive fiction world. Liza Daly starts down that path by explaining how to choose the right IF language. http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/onlamp/2004/11/24/interactive_fiction.html ***Inside EuroBSDCon 2004 European BSD fans recently had the opportunity to meet and talk during EuroBSDCon 2004. Federico Biancuzzi was there. Here are his thoughts from the conference and ideas on how to improve conferences for the rest of the European BSD community. http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/bsd/2004/11/24/eurobsdcon2004.html --------------------- Mac --------------------- ***Gifts, Gadgets, and Software for Mac Geeks This year's gift guide shows you the coolest gadgets and often includes clever software to accompany them. Suggestions start as cheap as $15 and most are less than $80. And the best part--everything works beautifully with Mac OS X. http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2004/11/23/gifts.html ***Reclaiming Hacks The O'Reilly Hacks series has stirred a controversy that usually extends no further than the front cover of a book. The hacking spirit, not the promotion of illegal activities, is being reclaimed through each one of these books. The curious nature of the hacker ethic, whether prompted by a sheer spark of genius or the urge of an annoyance, celebrates rolling up the sleeves and taking action. Hadley Stern, author of "iPod and iTunes Hacks," takes a stab at clarification and discusses the issues he faced while writing his book. http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2004/12/03/hadley_hks.html ***Five Favorite Annoyances As much as we love our Macs, we've got to admit that sometimes they annoy the patience out of us. John Rizzo, author of "Mac Annoyances," picks five of his favorite Mac annoyances to share. Better yet, he offers a fix for every problem. Don't get mad, get clever. http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2004/11/30/macannoy_1.html --------------------- Windows/.NET --------------------- ***How To Start Hacking Your PC Want to get under the hood of your PC and start hacking? Jim Aspinwall, author of "PC Hacks," literally wrote the book on it. In this first part of a two-part article, he teaches you everything you need to know to get started. http://www.windowsdevcenter.com/pub/a/windows/2004/11/24/PC_Hacking_Part1.html ***Using the SQL Server 2000 Reporting Services Microsoft has finally added reporting capabilities to its flagship database server, SQL Server 2000. In this article, Wei-Meng Lee walks you through the basics of creating a simple report using the SQL Server 2000 Reporting Services. http://www.ondotnet.com/pub/a/dotnet/2004/11/29/sqlreporting.html ***Automate Windows Installations Answer files can automate Windows installations, saving time and simplifying deployment. Mitch Tulloch, author of "Windows Server Hacks," offers tips and tricks for making better use of them. http://www.windowsdevcenter.com/pub/a/windows/2004/11/30/answer_files.html ***Learning Lab: .NET Certificate $200 Instant Rebate Learn .NET programming skills and earn a .NET Programming Certificate from the University of Illinois. The .NET Certificate Series from the O'Reilly Learning Lab is comprised of three courses that give you the foundation you need to do .NET programming well: Learn XML; Learn Object-Oriented Programming Using Java; and Learn C#. Only in December, receive a $200 instant rebate when you enroll in all three courses. http://www.oreilly.com/redirector.csp?link=UADot&type=news --------------------- Java --------------------- ***Simple Object Persistence with the db4o Object Database Mapping Java objects to relational databases is a difficult task, fraught with perils and gotchas. db4o dodges the issue entirely by providing an object-oriented persistence mechanism that is small, lightweight, and efficient. Jim Paterson shows how it works. http://www.onjava.com/pub/a/onjava/2004/12/01/db4o.html ***Juggle Your Java with JDistro Typically, one Java application will live in its own virtual machine, but this is neither required nor necessarily desirable. JDistro, a multitasking Java application, makes it possible to run applications, applets, and more, all inside of one process. Howard Wen interviewed creators Guillaume Desnoix and Gerard Collin to find out how it works. a.com/pub/a/onjava/2004/11/24/jdistro.html --------------------- Digital Media --------------------- ***Reeking Havok with the Experience Music Project High-tech drummer Reek Havok develops interactive music technology for Seattle???s Experience Music Project museum. In this interview, he takes you behind the scenes and shares his software groove secrets. http://digitalmedia.oreilly.com/2004/12/01/reek_1204.html ***Greg Kessler: Rock and Roll Shooter Greg Kessler has photographed plenty of well known artists in the music industry, including the likes of Phish, Bela Fleck and the Flecktones, String Cheese Incident, and Of A Revolution (O.A.R.). In this portfolio, he not only presents the captivating images, Greg also includes anecdotes about the subjects themselves. http://digitalmedia.oreilly.com/2004/12/01/featured.html ================================================ >From Your Peers =============================================== Don't forget to check out the O'Reilly UG wiki to see what user groups across the globe are up to: http://wiki.oreillynet.com/usergroups/index.cgi -- --- From dlavigne6 Wed Dec 8 17:50:03 2004 From: dlavigne6 (Dru) Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 17:50:03 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] update to hacks 80 and 89 Message-ID: <20041208174902.H540@dru.domain.org> http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/wlg/6041 Dru From lists Thu Dec 9 00:46:40 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 00:46:40 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? Message-ID: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> One of the ISPs I use has been down for 2 days. My clients are less than happy about not getting their email. Although I may not want to handle a mail server long term.. at least for now I need to bring up an IMAP/POP3 mail server from my home machine with DSL till I get another ISP or this one fixes the problem. Any recommendations? From pete Thu Dec 9 00:56:01 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 00:56:01 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? In-Reply-To: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <20041209055601.GB11836@nomadlogic.org> On Thu, Dec 09, 2004 at 12:46:40AM -0500, Francisco Reyes wrote: > One of the ISPs I use has been down for 2 days. > My clients are less than happy about not getting their email. > > Although I may not want to handle a mail server long term.. at least for > now I need to bring up an IMAP/POP3 mail server from my home machine with > DSL till I get another ISP or this one fixes the problem. > > Any recommendations? I run postfix+courier IMAP (with ssl support)+squirrelMail+freebsd. it run great, is well documented and very stable. it is also pretty trivial to add support for ClamAV and SpamAssassin. here are some links to get you started, altho google.com/bsd is very helpfull as well: http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a/bsd/2003/08/21/postfix.html http://www.freebsddiary.org/postfix-virtual-domains.php http://www.csua.berkeley.edu/~ranga/notes/freebsd_postfix.html http://www.courier-mta.org/ http://www.postfix.org/ HTH -pete > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From alex Thu Dec 9 00:54:49 2004 From: alex (alex at pilosoft.com) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 00:54:49 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? In-Reply-To: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: > One of the ISPs I use has been down for 2 days. My clients are less than > happy about not getting their email. > > Although I may not want to handle a mail server long term.. at least for > now I need to bring up an IMAP/POP3 mail server from my home machine > with DSL till I get another ISP or this one fixes the problem. > > Any recommendations? Courier-imap has been rumored to be easy to install and use. I use cyrus but it is certainly not for the faint of the heart. -alex From spork Thu Dec 9 01:21:16 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 01:21:16 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? In-Reply-To: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: > One of the ISPs I use has been down for 2 days. > My clients are less than happy about not getting their email. > > Although I may not want to handle a mail server long term.. at least for now > I need to bring up an IMAP/POP3 mail server from my home machine with DSL > till I get another ISP or this one fixes the problem. Two things: I second the postfix/courier (or binc-imap, very similar) solution; I'd do that if I had it to do all over again. Also the vpopmail/qmail route is fairly easy if you are at all familiar with qmail. Second thing: Bway prides itself on handling tough situations like this. If you say the word, we can set you up right quick with some self-administered domain accounts. We're pretty reasonably priced. Call and ask for Joe, tell him I sent you. Thanks, Charles > Any recommendations? > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From lists Thu Dec 9 09:52:21 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 09:52:21 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? In-Reply-To: References: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <20041209095053.V72350@zoraida.natserv.net> On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Charles Sprickman wrote: > Second thing: Bway prides itself on handling tough situations like this. Do you over virtual machines? Basically with my current provider there is a space/bandwith limit and I can host as many domains as I want. I only have a handfull of clients and their space/bandwith needs are small so it works great. From lists Thu Dec 9 09:59:55 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 09:59:55 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? In-Reply-To: <20041209055601.GB11836@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> <20041209055601.GB11836@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20041209095840.W72350@zoraida.natserv.net> On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > I run postfix+courier IMAP (with ssl support)+squirrelMail+freebsd. it > run great, is well documented and very stable. Thanks. What advantage if any does Cyrux has over Courier? >From reading last night it seems Cyrux you don't have to create a user for each mail account. Is Courier the same? Thanks for the links. Will get to read them. From alex Thu Dec 9 10:52:09 2004 From: alex (alex at pilosoft.com) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 10:52:09 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? In-Reply-To: <20041209095840.W72350@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > > > I run postfix+courier IMAP (with ssl support)+squirrelMail+freebsd. it > > run great, is well documented and very stable. > > Thanks. > What advantage if any does Cyrux has over Courier? Cyrus is more scalable - Large universities run Cyrus with tens of thousands of accounts. > >From reading last night it seems Cyrux you don't have to create a user for > each mail account. Is Courier the same? That's same for both. -alex From okan Thu Dec 9 11:34:00 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 11:34:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] soekris orders Message-ID: <20041209163400.GA86175@yinaska.pair.com> hi - anyone want in on soekris orders? i need 2 4801/case/power combos. if we get a total of at least 5, we can get a better discount ($244 for the combo). i need to place the order within the next 7 days to make sure i get my boxes before end of year. if that's too soon for anybody else, oh well, i'm sure i'll need more again someother time. thanks, okan -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From pete Thu Dec 9 12:53:40 2004 From: pete (pete wright) Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 09:53:40 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? In-Reply-To: <20041209095840.W72350@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> <20041209055601.GB11836@nomadlogic.org> <20041209095840.W72350@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <41B89124.10107@nomadlogic.org> Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > >> I run postfix+courier IMAP (with ssl support)+squirrelMail+freebsd. it >> run great, is well documented and very stable. > > > Thanks. > What advantage if any does Cyrux has over Courier? > From reading last night it seems Cyrux you don't have to create a user > for each mail account. Is Courier the same? according to this link: http://www.courier-mta.org/ you can use a SQL backend (as well as LDAP) for authentication for courier, which i assume is also possible for cyrux. here is a howto i found as well that should give you the general idea of it's capabilities: http://www.high5.net/howto/ -p From george Thu Dec 9 15:49:20 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 15:49:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] isp check Message-ID: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> has anyone used or heard good/bad things about: Cavalier Business Communications http://www.cavtel.com/ Also is there a learn everything you need to know (and nothing more) website to get BGP working? // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From mspitzer Thu Dec 9 16:06:31 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 16:06:31 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] isp check In-Reply-To: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> References: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> Message-ID: <8c50a3c30412091306cd478dc@mail.gmail.com> http://www.openbgp.org might be a good place to start marc On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 15:49:20 -0500, George Georgalis wrote: > has anyone used or heard good/bad things about: > > Cavalier Business Communications > http://www.cavtel.com/ > > Also is there a learn everything you need to know (and nothing more) > website to get BGP working? > > // George > > -- > George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE > http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From spork Thu Dec 9 16:27:57 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 16:27:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? In-Reply-To: <20041209095053.V72350@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041209004426.R65959@zoraida.natserv.net> <20041209095053.V72350@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Charles Sprickman wrote: > >> Second thing: Bway prides itself on handling tough situations like this. > > Do you over virtual machines? Not yet, still trying to make a business case for that one... If there was a way to limit per jail resources, we'd probably be all over that. > Basically with my current provider there is a space/bandwith limit and I can > host as many domains as I want. I only have a handfull of clients and their > space/bandwith needs are small so it works great. I was just speaking of our normal hosted email service. We either set everything up for you or hand you a user/pass and url where you can create/modify your accounts yourself... Charles From jbaltz Thu Dec 9 16:40:32 2004 From: jbaltz (Jerry B. Altzman) Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 16:40:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] isp check In-Reply-To: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> References: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> Message-ID: <41B8C650.40208@omnipod.com> On 12/9/2004 3:49 PM, George Georgalis wrote: > Also is there a learn everything you need to know (and nothing more) > website to get BGP working? Don't know much about the ISP, but the O'Reilly book by Iljitsch van Beijnum (http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/bgp/) is _de rigeur_ reading. Of course, BGP is hairy on a good day -- ask your ISPs' engineers for help in configuring your setup. I remember a quote from Radia Perlman's book, roughly paraphrased: "If you think you understand BGP and aren't scared, you don't understand BGP." > // George //jbaltz -- jerry b. altzman jbaltz at omnipod.com +1 646 230 8750 Thank you for contributing to the heat death of the universe. From spork Thu Dec 9 16:43:15 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 16:43:15 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] isp check In-Reply-To: <41B8C650.40208@omnipod.com> References: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> <41B8C650.40208@omnipod.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, Jerry B. Altzman wrote: > On 12/9/2004 3:49 PM, George Georgalis wrote: > >> Also is there a learn everything you need to know (and nothing more) >> website to get BGP working? > > Don't know much about the ISP, but the O'Reilly book by Iljitsch van Beijnum > (http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/bgp/) is _de rigeur_ reading. How is that? Halabi's "Internet Routing Architectures" is really good, but not really the best intro to the topic. :) It's also completely Cisco-centric (being a Cisco Press book and all). Does the O'Reilly book cover Juniper or any open source BGP implementations? Is it fairly example-heavy? How does it compare to Halabi's book? Thanks, Charles > Of course, BGP is hairy on a good day -- ask your ISPs' engineers for help in > configuring your setup. > I remember a quote from Radia Perlman's book, roughly paraphrased: "If you > think you understand BGP and aren't scared, you don't understand BGP." > >> // George > > //jbaltz > -- > jerry b. altzman jbaltz at omnipod.com +1 646 230 8750 > Thank you for contributing to the heat death of the universe. > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From george Thu Dec 9 16:44:22 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 16:44:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] holiday party Message-ID: <7D169D4A-4A2B-11D9-A073-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Well, we're coming to the home stretch for the holiday party this coming Wednesday night. We will begin setup at noon on Wednesday. We definitely need some volunteers that early on Wednesday for setup, but the volunteers for during the event should all arrive at 5 pm if at all possible. I have a good list of volunteers, but we will need more of course. Please email me offlist to add your efforts. Remember, we are co-sponsors for this event, and it's our responsibility to make it happen right. g From jbaltz Thu Dec 9 17:03:48 2004 From: jbaltz (Jerry B. Altzman) Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 17:03:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] isp check In-Reply-To: References: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> <41B8C650.40208@omnipod.com> Message-ID: <41B8CBC4.5050400@omnipod.com> On 12/9/2004 4:43 PM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > How is that? Halabi's "Internet Routing Architectures" is really good, > but not really the best intro to the topic. :) It's also completely > Cisco-centric (being a Cisco Press book and all). Does the O'Reilly > book cover Juniper or any open source BGP implementations? Is it > fairly example-heavy? How does it compare to Halabi's book? IvB's book is a lot lower-level than the Halabi book, but is stil pretty Cisco-centric. I don't remember if he covers zebra (pretty much like IOS 11 anyway) or openbgp. It's a good read, though. > Charles //jbaltz -- jerry b. altzman jbaltz at omnipod.com +1 646 230 8750 Thank you for contributing to the heat death of the universe. From pete Thu Dec 9 22:53:34 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 22:53:34 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NetBSD 2.0 Released Message-ID: <20041210035334.GB14399@nomadlogic.org> from the "like you needed to know dept" NetBSD 2.0 has been released: http://www.netbsd.org/Changes/#netbsd-2.0 http://www.netbsd.org/Releases/formal-2.0/NetBSD-2.0.html have fun! -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From george Fri Dec 10 00:13:21 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 00:13:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYC*BUG profile Message-ID: <35FBD6D8-4A6A-11D9-A073-000D9328615E@sddi.net> I have an idea and I am looking for a volunteer. . . It would be great to have a monthly piece in Daemon News (bsdnews.com) EZine about NYC*BUG happenings. . . some basic coverage of our monthly events, whether our meeting or the holiday party. We have a serious presence in the BSD community and beyond, and this would only highlight our activities, and possibly assist us in other ways in the long run. Anyone interested in playing journalist and making the commitment for monthly pieces. . . nothing too complex or long is necessary. At least a few paragraphs on the meeting. . . Please contact me off list about it. . . g From sunny-ml Fri Dec 10 07:37:09 2004 From: sunny-ml (Sunny Dubey) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 07:37:09 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] holiday party In-Reply-To: <7D169D4A-4A2B-11D9-A073-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <7D169D4A-4A2B-11D9-A073-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <200412100737.10363.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> On Thursday 09 December 2004 16:44, G. Rosamond wrote: > Well, we're coming to the home stretch for the holiday party this > coming Wednesday night. is there a posted agenda for this party ? cool Sunny Dubey From dan Fri Dec 10 09:31:15 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 09:31:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RAID anyone? Message-ID: <41B96CE3.24052.B74D1EFE@localhost> This came out yesterday. It's how I got my development box (the on that houses the beta sites for FreshPorts, FreeBSDDiary, FreshSource, etc): http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a//bsd/2004/12/09/raid.html :) -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ BSDCan - The Technical BSD Conference - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From ike Fri Dec 10 10:43:04 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 10:43:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RAID anyone? In-Reply-To: <41B96CE3.24052.B74D1EFE@localhost> References: <41B96CE3.24052.B74D1EFE@localhost> Message-ID: <2E53A67F-4AC2-11D9-82A6-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Wordup Dan, All, On Dec 10, 2004, at 9:31 AM, Dan Langille wrote: > This came out yesterday. It's how I got my development box (the on > that houses the beta sites for FreshPorts, FreeBSDDiary, FreshSource, > etc): > > http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a//bsd/2004/12/09/raid.html > > :) Solid article Dan! I recently went through similar fun with an Adaptec 2410SA- which I believe is a similar card to the one you used in the article, except it's Serial ATA. I'm eager to see Part 2 of the article, "In my next article, I'll show you how I created a NetSaint plugin to monitor and report upon my RAID array." - I had no idea NetSaint had RAID monitoring facilities- will be very exited to read this when it's out... -- Wanted to give a quick shout out re. Monitoring tools- The box I'm running the 2410SA on is a web-server, extremely minimal FreeBSD software base, so we're using aaccli to monitor/manage the RAID: http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/sysutils/aaccli/pkg-descr It's a nice stand-alone package, but the actual app is fairly crude. The app is a bit clunky to get using, but you can feed it scripts (using some fairly clunky syntax), but we found it really easy to stuff aaccli script text into a few shell scripts, which was all we wanted for the kind of notification/reporting we needed- minimal fuss, standalone app. This app is reported to work with a lot of raid cards, btw. -- I also tried out the asr-utils package with the card, which seem to work great, http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/sysutils/asr-utils/pkg-descr And I gotta say, all that X11 just wasn't Kosher on the server- so we wiped it all before putting the box online. I'd think that the asr-utils would be peachy to manage raid volumes on a machine whose primary life is lived with a monitor plugged into it... a workstation or server with a head. -- Anyhow, also, a shout out to Matador for recommending the 2410SA months ago on thisere' list, http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/2004-September/002612.html My client chose to snag one of these cards based on this glowing review, and a bit of homework... Rocket- .ike From sunny-ml Fri Dec 10 10:54:43 2004 From: sunny-ml (Sunny Dubey) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 10:54:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RAID anyone? In-Reply-To: <41B96CE3.24052.B74D1EFE@localhost> References: <41B96CE3.24052.B74D1EFE@localhost> Message-ID: <200412101054.43185.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> On Friday 10 December 2004 09:31, Dan Langille wrote: > This came out yesterday. It's how I got my development box (the on > that houses the beta sites for FreshPorts, FreeBSDDiary, FreshSource, > etc): > > http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a//bsd/2004/12/09/raid.html > > :) It should be noted that the 7000-series cards require the 3dmd monitoring/management software. Yes, the card is a hardware RAID card, but the 7000-series has no way of physically telling the user that something has failed. Instead it sends out emails warning folks about a failure. IIRC this software is not released for BSD. Instead, BSD prints messages to dmesg when a failure as occured. So I'm sure you could write a parser and stuff. These cards are very much bang-for-your buck, and they are 3ware cards. Just keep the above in mind. Sunny Dubey From sunny-ml Fri Dec 10 10:56:09 2004 From: sunny-ml (Sunny Dubey) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 10:56:09 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RAID anyone? In-Reply-To: <200412101054.43185.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> References: <41B96CE3.24052.B74D1EFE@localhost> <200412101054.43185.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> Message-ID: <200412101056.09127.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> On Friday 10 December 2004 10:54, Sunny Dubey wrote: > On Friday 10 December 2004 09:31, Dan Langille wrote: > > This came out yesterday. It's how I got my development box (the on > > that houses the beta sites for FreshPorts, FreeBSDDiary, FreshSource, > > etc): > > > > http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a//bsd/2004/12/09/raid.html > > > > :) ah, I totally missed the fact that you are the author *slaps self*, can you confirm the info in my previous email ? cool Sunny Dubey From dan Fri Dec 10 11:20:03 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 11:20:03 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RAID anyone? In-Reply-To: <200412101054.43185.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> References: <41B96CE3.24052.B74D1EFE@localhost> Message-ID: <41B98663.26427.B7B0BD02@localhost> On 10 Dec 2004 at 10:54, Sunny Dubey wrote: > On Friday 10 December 2004 09:31, Dan Langille wrote: > > This came out yesterday. It's how I got my development box (the on > > that houses the beta sites for FreshPorts, FreeBSDDiary, FreshSource, > > etc): > > > > http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a//bsd/2004/12/09/raid.html > > > > :) > > It should be noted that the 7000-series cards require the 3dmd > monitoring/management software. > > Yes, the card is a hardware RAID card, but the 7000-series has no way of > physically telling the user that something has failed. Instead it sends out > emails warning folks about a failure. It should also be noted that the article is not about the 7000- series. It's about the Adaptec 2400A. > IIRC this software is not released for BSD. Instead, BSD prints messages to > dmesg when a failure as occured. So I'm sure you could write a parser and > stuff. The follow up article, out next month, is how to write a plug-in monitor for the RAID card. > These cards are very much bang-for-your buck, and they are 3ware cards. Just > keep the above in mind. Noted. Thanks. I use the 3-ware cards on a Windows box and another FreeBSD box. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ BSDCan - The Technical BSD Conference - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From steve Fri Dec 10 11:58:26 2004 From: steve (Steve Rieger) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 11:58:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] mysql issues Message-ID: Hi all I just rebooted my server and now mysql is acting funny. All the databases are still there along with all the data, but when I browse mysql I only see two databases rt3 and the test (which is empty. About a week ago I installed rt3 from ports. With the exception of that nobody touched the mysql stuff. Right now even the mysql database oitself is not loading. Any advice on how I can get mysql to pick up all the other databases Thanx -- Steve Rieger Direct 212-804-1131 Cell 646-335-8915 From lists Fri Dec 10 12:17:08 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 12:17:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] encrypt home space Message-ID: <20041210121708.720d336e@delinux.abwatley.com> Talk, I wanted to create an encrypted home and swap space on my laptop. In case it is ever lifted... you know. I have FreeBSD on my laptop. I started by revisiting Roland Dowdeswell: NetBSD crypto disk. http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Home&SUBM=20 I found cfs in ports: http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/security/cfs/pkg-descr then checked Dan's diary and found an article from many years ago: http://www.freebsddiary.org/encrypted-fs.php There is also an article for little usb thumb drives: http://bsdnews.org/03/cryptusb.php The Handbook has a chapter on gbde: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/disks-encrypting.html "Unlike cumbersome encryption methods that encrypt only individual files, gbde transparently encrypts entire file systems. No cleartext ever touches the hard drive's platter." I really liked Roland's talk. I may be wrong but, cgd seems NetBSD specific. Because of that, I'm leaning toward gbde. Has anyone tried something similar to what I'm talking about? Michael -- --- From unixenigma Fri Dec 10 13:03:33 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 10:03:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] encrypt home space In-Reply-To: <20041210121708.720d336e@delinux.abwatley.com> Message-ID: <20041210180333.98267.qmail@web53905.mail.yahoo.com> I could be wrong but I did try 2 different approaches one was cfs, second was vnode. I found that CFS supports DES which is insecure because the key is to short, 3DES which can be considered secure but is painfully slow. DES is 56bit and 3DES is slow but 168bit however it is effectively providing security only of 112 Bit encryption. You can implement Blowfish I think - never tried it though but read that it does have problems. Vnode is very fast and I think is reliable - however it is more work and there is a problem during systems crashes, fdisk cant check the drive for errors or something I forgot, but there is plenty information on the topic. Hope I wasn't completely off the topic :) Thanks Sincerely, GT --- michael wrote: > Talk, > > I wanted to create an encrypted home and swap space > on my laptop. In > case it is ever lifted... you know. I have FreeBSD > on my laptop. > > I started by revisiting Roland Dowdeswell: NetBSD > crypto disk. > http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Home&SUBM=20 > > I found cfs in ports: > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/security/cfs/pkg-descr > > then checked Dan's diary and found an article from > many years ago: > http://www.freebsddiary.org/encrypted-fs.php > > There is also an article for little usb thumb > drives: > http://bsdnews.org/03/cryptusb.php > > The Handbook has a chapter on gbde: > http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/disks-encrypting.html > "Unlike cumbersome encryption methods that encrypt > only individual > files, gbde transparently encrypts entire file > systems. No cleartext > ever touches the hard drive's platter." > > I really liked Roland's talk. I may be wrong but, > cgd seems NetBSD > specific. Because of that, I'm leaning toward gbde. > Has anyone tried > something similar to what I'm talking about? > > Michael > > -- > --- > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce > lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From unixenigma Fri Dec 10 13:07:36 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 10:07:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] encrypt home space In-Reply-To: <20041210121708.720d336e@delinux.abwatley.com> Message-ID: <20041210180736.249.qmail@web53905.mail.yahoo.com> One more thing I forgot to mention. In OpenBSD I did the following to encrypt swap fs from console you can write: # sysctl -w vm.swapencrypt.enable=1 Or edit your /etc/sysctl.conf to enable this feature permanently. Thanks GT --- michael wrote: > Talk, > > I wanted to create an encrypted home and swap space > on my laptop. In > case it is ever lifted... you know. I have FreeBSD > on my laptop. > > I started by revisiting Roland Dowdeswell: NetBSD > crypto disk. > http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Home&SUBM=20 > > I found cfs in ports: > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/url.cgi?ports/security/cfs/pkg-descr > > then checked Dan's diary and found an article from > many years ago: > http://www.freebsddiary.org/encrypted-fs.php > > There is also an article for little usb thumb > drives: > http://bsdnews.org/03/cryptusb.php > > The Handbook has a chapter on gbde: > http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/disks-encrypting.html > "Unlike cumbersome encryption methods that encrypt > only individual > files, gbde transparently encrypts entire file > systems. No cleartext > ever touches the hard drive's platter." > > I really liked Roland's talk. I may be wrong but, > cgd seems NetBSD > specific. Because of that, I'm leaning toward gbde. > Has anyone tried > something similar to what I'm talking about? > > Michael > > -- > --- > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce > lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From spork Fri Dec 10 13:53:03 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 13:53:03 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] RAID anyone? In-Reply-To: <41B96CE3.24052.B74D1EFE@localhost> References: <41B96CE3.24052.B74D1EFE@localhost> Message-ID: On Fri, 10 Dec 2004, Dan Langille wrote: > This came out yesterday. It's how I got my development box (the on > that houses the beta sites for FreshPorts, FreeBSDDiary, FreshSource, > etc): > > http://www.onlamp.com/pub/a//bsd/2004/12/09/raid.html For the record I just built a box with a 3Ware 8506-4LP. So far so good. There are a few cosmetic issues with the driver, but performance has been great, and the price point is decent: -$300 - 4 port SATA RAID controller -$200 - 2xSeagate 160GB SATA drives ("real" SATA, not a bridge chip) I'm putting together another soon with the same controller and 4 drives. I'm staying away from RAID 5 since it's kind of slow, and drives are dirt cheap. $700 for a third of a terabyte of relatively fast, mirrored storage is a great deal. Charles > :) > -- > Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ > BSDCan - The Technical BSD Conference - http://www.bsdcan.org/ > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From unixenigma Sat Dec 11 19:13:41 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 16:13:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] CELL/Telemarketers - Warning?! Message-ID: <20041212001341.41215.qmail@web53902.mail.yahoo.com> This is just a thought to consider... or a warning. This is what I got from a friend of mine. I read about it in few articles in newspapers prior his e-mail: "Starting Jan 1, 2005, all cell phone numbers will be made public to telemarketing firms. So this means as of Jan 1, your cell phone may start ringing off the hook with telemarketers, but unlike your home phone, most plans pay for your incoming calls. These telemarketers will eat up your free minutes and end up costing money. According to the National Do Not Call List, you have until Dec 15, 2004 to get on the national "Do Not Call List" for cell phones. You can either call 1-888-382-1222 from the cell phone that you wish to have put on the "do not call list" or you can do it online at www.donotcall.gov . Registering only takes a minute, but is in effect for 5 years. Register before Dec 15." I did add all my numbers long time ago in april - cause got tired of these calls. Even put cell numbers (never got any telemarketers calls though anyway), but my home numbers stopped ringing with annoying telemarketers. :) Anyway I called Verizon (my cell company), they assured me that nothing will be done like that due to some laws of cell privacy or something. That is great, but at the same time this is what I found as well: " Soon, however, some of the privacy that cell phones provide may be eroded. Six national wireless companies (AllTel, AT&T Wireless, Cingular, Nextel, Sprint PCS, and T-Mobile) have banded together and hired Qsent, Inc. to produce a Wireless 411 service. Their goal is to pool their listings to create a comprehensive directory of cell phone customer names and phone numbers that would be made available to directory assistance providers. (In most places, telephone users can call directory assistance at 411 [for local numbers] or by dialing an area code plus 555-1212 [for out-of-area numbers] and, by providing enough information to identify an individual phone customer [usually a full name and city of residence], obtain that customer's phone number. " Customers do disagree with all of this crap, but who listen to them, right... Anyway, just wanted you to be ready, and check with your cell providers. Thanks for checking it out. Sincerely, GT --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041211/c8b5bb2b/attachment.html From dqtran1 Sat Dec 11 21:31:23 2004 From: dqtran1 (dqtran1 at earthlink.net) Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 18:31:23 -0800 (GMT-08:00) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Gentoo Linux, just curious Message-ID: <18868583.1102818683468.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Does anyone have suggestions on how to track an email that a user swears they sent and it is confirmed as leaving our mail server but never gets there? No, error messages, no undeliverable messages - it just disappears into neverland. The recipient never gets it. Other email transmissions work with no problems for the same user and other users. The only common denominator seems to be certain recipients, and their IT people seem to be too busy to help or don't want to help. Thanks Don From scottro Sat Dec 11 21:48:44 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 21:48:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Gentoo Linux, just curious In-Reply-To: <18868583.1102818683468.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <18868583.1102818683468.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20041212024844.GA87284@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Sat, Dec 11, 2004 at 06:31:23PM -0800, dqtran1 at earthlink.net wrote: > Does anyone have suggestions on how to track an email that a user swears they sent > and > it is confirmed as leaving our mail server but never gets there? I've found that my users (who are, sad to say using MS) often manage to put people on their blocked senders list or junkmail list (depending upon whether it's OE or Outlook). Another possibility is the other company's spam filter. We put SpamAssassin on our mailserver. For two or three weeks, mails that were considered spam were delivered, but they had [SPAM] or whatever it is in the headers. We sent several emails around telling users they MUST let us know if suppliers, or other important emails were being marked spam. We warned them that we were going to kill them at the server. So, of course, after we put that into effect, several calls about mails that users weren't getting. Did you read the emails we sent? Yes, but I was too busy. You were too busy to hit forward and send it to me? Well, I meant to. I never did? Sigh. > The only common denominator seems to be certain recipients, and their IT people > seem to be too busy to help or don't want to help. Heh. If it's a scenario similar to the one I just described, one can hardly blame them. :) (That's a joke of course--I really do feel that we are more or less in the position of having the users as our customers and if they knew all these things, we wouldn't have jobs--still it gets frustrating, So, seriously, I guess you will have to contact the recepient, and walk them through checking their blocked senders list, and then possibly talk to the IT people and see what their spam filters are. - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Willow: I knew it! I knew it! Well, not in the sense of having the slightest idea, but I knew there was something I didn't know. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFBu7GM+lTVdes0Z9YRAgfIAKCOTXRJfilFgIW56ZjgUdA37cEB9QCfSqGK eDPR6Ajlm4Riqhq2qbP9jPM= =3fTe -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From gstewart Sun Dec 12 06:33:33 2004 From: gstewart (Godwin Stewart) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 12:33:33 +0100 Subject: [WOT] Re: [nycbug-talk] CELL/Telemarketers - Warning?! In-Reply-To: <20041212001341.41215.qmail@web53902.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041212001341.41215.qmail@web53902.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20041212123333.6046b68a.gstewart@spamcop.net> On Sat, 11 Dec 2004 16:13:41 -0800 (PST), G T wrote: > This is just a thought to consider... or a warning. I just love it when people forward well-known urban legends to mailing lists :o) http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/cell411.asp "[Signing up with the National Do Not Call Registry] will not keep wireless customer listings out of the proposed Wireless 411 database - it will only add their phone numbers to a list of numbers off-limits to most telemarketers, a step which is premature (because the Wireless 411 directory has not yet been implemented) and largely unnecessary (because the Wireless 411 directory information is not supposed to be supplied to telemarketers, and because FCC regulations already in place block the bulk of telemarketing calls to cell phones)." -- G. Stewart - gstewart at spamcop.net BOFH excuse #417: Computer room being moved. Our systems are down for the weekend. From lists Sun Dec 12 11:22:01 2004 From: lists (lists at genoverly.net) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 17:22:01 +0100 Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_[nycbug-talk]_soekris_orders?= Message-ID: <0MKz1m-1CdWVu0l2m-0004TI@mrelay.perfora.net> On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 11:34:00 -0500 Okan Demirmen wrote: > > anyone want in on soekris orders? Here are some links I found that I haven't seen on this list yet. The first one shows how fun and easy these boxes really are. Michael 1) Step-by-step soekris guide -- with photos. http://www.davidcourtney.org/soekris.html "First I would like to explain a little about this document. It is written with two target audiences in mind. * First Audience: People who already own a Soekris product (specifically the net4801-50) and are seeking help setting it up. * Second Audience: People who may be considering the purchase of a Soekris product and are trying to get as much information about it as possible before they make their purchase." 2) Running non-BSD OS.. http://soentoo.sourceforge.net/index.php "Soentoo is a lightweight distribution based on Gentoo which is to be run on a Soekris net4801 (or similar) embedded system." -- From unixenigma Sun Dec 12 12:20:57 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 09:20:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: [WOT] Re: [nycbug-talk] CELL/Telemarketers - Warning?! In-Reply-To: <20041212123333.6046b68a.gstewart@spamcop.net> Message-ID: <20041212172057.50613.qmail@web53909.mail.yahoo.com> I knew the legend Stewart :( just wanted to clear 411 thingy Still think that 411 is crap idea. And the deadline for donotcall is due to their update of registry is every 3 months (probably next update is 15th - that's all) but thanks for time/energy spent Godwin Stewart wrote: On Sat, 11 Dec 2004 16:13:41 -0800 (PST), G T wrote: > This is just a thought to consider... or a warning. I just love it when people forward well-known urban legends to mailing lists :o) http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/cell411.asp "[Signing up with the National Do Not Call Registry] will not keep wireless customer listings out of the proposed Wireless 411 database - it will only add their phone numbers to a list of numbers off-limits to most telemarketers, a step which is premature (because the Wireless 411 directory has not yet been implemented) and largely unnecessary (because the Wireless 411 directory information is not supposed to be supplied to telemarketers, and because FCC regulations already in place block the bulk of telemarketing calls to cell phones)." -- G. Stewart - gstewart at spamcop.net BOFH excuse #417: Computer room being moved. Our systems are down for the weekend. _______________________________________________ % NYC*BUG talk mailing list http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists %We meet the first Wednesday of the month --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Meet the all-new My Yahoo! ? Try it today! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041212/10faf1e8/attachment.html From marco Sun Dec 12 12:26:18 2004 From: marco (marco at metm.org) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 12:26:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] OpenBSD VPN roadwarrior setup Message-ID: <20041212172617.GA395@metm.org> Hello, Does anyone have a good experience setting up a VPN tunnel termination point for secure "road warrior" XP laptop connections to an windows LAN ? I've been struggling with a flaky badly documented linux product, (which I did not choose). Basically all my experiences setting up VPNs with linux have been horrible. I started playing with the VPN configuration on an OpenBSD server I have here (not on the client site) and it seems (as one would expect) much saner. I would like to suggest going with OpenBSD, but as I have not gone this route before, I would like some feedback. Thanks, -- Marco From jschauma Sun Dec 12 13:32:04 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 13:32:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Gentoo Linux, just curious In-Reply-To: <18868583.1102818683468.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> References: <18868583.1102818683468.JavaMail.root@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20041212183204.GB907@netmeister.org> dqtran1 at earthlink.net wrote: > Does anyone have suggestions on how to track an email that a user swears they sent > and > it is confirmed as leaving our mail server but never gets there? What does that have to do with the subject (``Gentoo Linux, just curious'') ? Anyway, you say it is confirmed to leave your mail server -- so you have the spooling ID when the remote site accepted the mail? Contact the remote admin and ask them about the message... -Jan -- A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041212/2ab8fbea/attachment.bin From george Sun Dec 12 17:37:21 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 17:37:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] choosing an amd box Message-ID: <20041212223721.GC19934@run> I was looking to put together an amd 64 box and realized they have several models, I thought there was one AMD64 (Opteron), but it looks like 4: ATHLON 64 CPU SOCKET 754 ATHLON 64 FX CPU OPTERON CPU ATHLON 64 CPU SOCKET 939 The box (Shuttle) I want to put it in only seems to support socket 754 So, with Opteron and FX out http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/TechnicalResources/0,,30_182_869,00.html I'm now deciding to go with Athlon 64 or Athlon XP. http://us.shuttle.com/specs_access.asp?pro_id=476 http://us.shuttle.com/specs_access.asp?pro_id=489 comparing Mhz to $$$ Athlon 64 is a better value. http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductList.jsp?ThirdCategoryCode=010423 http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductList.jsp?ThirdCategoryCode=010413 (it's a moving target but that seems the best vendor at the moment) and it looks like: AMD Athlon 64 3400+ Processor Socket 754, 512KB @ $220.00 on the Shuttle SK83G. Does this look like a good choice? Have I missed something? // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From lists Sun Dec 12 18:32:01 2004 From: lists (lists at genoverly.net) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 00:32:01 +0100 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Netcraft dogfood Message-ID: <0MKz1m-1CddE22ajB-0003qV@mrelay.perfora.net> WWW.GEORGEWBUSH.COM switches to self-hosted FreeBSD server Netcraft - UK From george Sun Dec 12 18:52:12 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 18:52:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] soekris orders In-Reply-To: <0MKz1m-1CdWVu0l2m-0004TI@mrelay.perfora.net> References: <0MKz1m-1CdWVu0l2m-0004TI@mrelay.perfora.net> Message-ID: <20041212235212.GA20107@run> On Sun, Dec 12, 2004 at 05:22:01PM +0100, lists at genoverly.net wrote: > >On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 11:34:00 -0500 >Okan Demirmen wrote: > >> >> anyone want in on soekris orders? > > >Here are some links I found that I haven't seen on this list yet. >The first one shows how fun and easy these boxes really are. >Michael Thanks for the great links... I'm gona give one of these a shot, but, unfortunately, Okan, with my clients saying "sometime in the future" I can't before the end of the year.... // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From okan Sun Dec 12 21:25:46 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 21:25:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] soekris orders In-Reply-To: <20041212235212.GA20107@run> References: <0MKz1m-1CdWVu0l2m-0004TI@mrelay.perfora.net> <20041212235212.GA20107@run> Message-ID: <20041213022546.GB23744@yinaska.pair.com> On Sun 2004.12.12 at 18:52 -0500, George Georgalis wrote: > On Sun, Dec 12, 2004 at 05:22:01PM +0100, lists at genoverly.net wrote: > > > >On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 11:34:00 -0500 > >Okan Demirmen wrote: > > > >> > >> anyone want in on soekris orders? > > > > > >Here are some links I found that I haven't seen on this list yet. > >The first one shows how fun and easy these boxes really are. > >Michael > > > Thanks for the great links... I'm gona give one of these a shot, > but, unfortunately, Okan, with my clients saying "sometime > in the future" I can't before the end of the year.... Yes, thanks Michael for the links. ...and I'm sure I'll be ordering more "some other time" so maybe next time ;) Okan > // George > > > -- > George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE > http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From lists Sun Dec 12 21:32:17 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 21:32:17 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Easy to learn/use IMAP? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041212213059.V54635@zoraida.natserv.net> On Thu, 9 Dec 2004 alex at pilosoft.com wrote: > Cyrus is more scalable - Large universities run Cyrus with tens of > thousands of accounts. Took me 2 days, but got Cyrus working. I think I will write something up. Found lots of general info even some older versions of FreeBSD, but there were several differences. From george Sun Dec 12 22:04:25 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:04:25 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients Message-ID: Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. Also. . . all ftp clients I have tried so far hang after passwd is entered. Have tried CuteFTP, ftp95Pro. From a command prompt on Win32, no problems. . . FBSD server gets an error in /var/log/auth.log of "Did not receive identification string from x.x.x.x" Anyone? g From fifi Sun Dec 12 22:09:10 2004 From: fifi (Mike Sawicki) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:09:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041213030910.GJ614@HAX.ORG> On Sun, Dec 12, 2004 at 10:04:25PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. > > Also. . . all ftp clients I have tried so far hang after passwd is > entered. Have tried CuteFTP, ftp95Pro. From a command prompt on > Win32, no problems. . . > > FBSD server gets an error in /var/log/auth.log of "Did not receive > identification string from x.x.x.x" > > Anyone? > WinSCP is great. I'm still amazed that it's free.. Does scp and sftp. http://winscp.sourceforge.net Mike Sawicki (fifi at HAX.ORG) From okan Sun Dec 12 22:10:23 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:10:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041213031023.GA38854@yinaska.pair.com> On Sun 2004.12.12 at 22:04 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. i have core ftp lite installed on my girlfriend's pc for access to my openbsd's sftp/scp subsystem - she has yet to complain - in fact, i've moved her from ftp to sftp/scp without her noticing ;) okan > Also. . . all ftp clients I have tried so far hang after passwd is > entered. Have tried CuteFTP, ftp95Pro. From a command prompt on > Win32, no problems. . . > > FBSD server gets an error in /var/log/auth.log of "Did not receive > identification string from x.x.x.x" > > Anyone? > > g > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From george Sun Dec 12 22:12:29 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:12:29 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients In-Reply-To: <20041213030910.GJ614@HAX.ORG> References: <20041213030910.GJ614@HAX.ORG> Message-ID: On Dec 12, 2004, at 10:09 PM, Mike Sawicki wrote: > On Sun, Dec 12, 2004 at 10:04:25PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: >> Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. >> >> Also. . . all ftp clients I have tried so far hang after passwd is >> entered. Have tried CuteFTP, ftp95Pro. From a command prompt on >> Win32, no problems. . . >> >> FBSD server gets an error in /var/log/auth.log of "Did not receive >> identification string from x.x.x.x" >> >> Anyone? >> > > WinSCP is great. I'm still amazed that it's free.. > > Does scp and sftp. > > http://winscp.sourceforge.net > Yeah. . . just tried WinSCP and didn't get the error. . . so forget about the second part of the question. thanks g From okan Sun Dec 12 22:15:35 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:15:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients In-Reply-To: <20041213030910.GJ614@HAX.ORG> References: <20041213030910.GJ614@HAX.ORG> Message-ID: <20041213031535.GA40952@yinaska.pair.com> On Sun 2004.12.12 at 22:09 -0500, Mike Sawicki wrote: > On Sun, Dec 12, 2004 at 10:04:25PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. > > > > Also. . . all ftp clients I have tried so far hang after passwd is > > entered. Have tried CuteFTP, ftp95Pro. From a command prompt on > > Win32, no problems. . . > > > > FBSD server gets an error in /var/log/auth.log of "Did not receive > > identification string from x.x.x.x" > > > > Anyone? > > > > WinSCP is great. I'm still amazed that it's free.. yes, i agree winscp is much better than my suggestion...(i just remember that for i have a different objective to start off with ;) okan > Does scp and sftp. > > http://winscp.sourceforge.net > > Mike Sawicki (fifi at HAX.ORG) > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From scottro Sun Dec 12 22:16:35 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:16:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041213031635.GA88201@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Sun, Dec 12, 2004 at 10:04:25PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. > > Also. . . all ftp clients I have tried so far hang after passwd is > entered. Have tried CuteFTP, ftp95Pro. From a command prompt on > Win32, no problems. . . Would scp by any chance, work for you? If so, there's winscp which I use on our company's VPN to transfer files to and from FreeBSD servers there. Don't know if that's of any use to you, though. - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Gunn: Fair Cordelia. You still savin' my life? Cordelia: Every minute. Gunn: How's that workin' out? Cordelia: You're alive aren't you? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFBvQmT+lTVdes0Z9YRAv5gAJ9nUuwblua5Mhwts5jv//cdpPk/hwCcCEE4 fIBisMDlGUWELdiPDQRLDOY= =fzLt -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From tux Sun Dec 12 22:59:04 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:59:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients References: Message-ID: <001901c4e0c8$17e6f6f0$0500a8c0@apollo> : Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. FileZilla r0x :) ...even does multiple simultaneous downloads/uploads. http://filezilla.sourceforge.net/ From unixenigma Mon Dec 13 00:32:33 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 21:32:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20041213053233.10603.qmail@web53901.mail.yahoo.com> I used to like SSH Secure Shell (free non-commercial version only though) http://www.ssh.com/ Nice gui for win32 --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041212/e814791c/attachment.html From lists Mon Dec 13 07:08:05 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 07:08:05 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients In-Reply-To: <001901c4e0c8$17e6f6f0$0500a8c0@apollo> References: <001901c4e0c8$17e6f6f0$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <20041213070805.4ae3e67c@delinux.abwatley.com> On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 22:59:04 -0500 "Kevin Reiter" wrote: > : Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. > > FileZilla r0x :) > > ...even does multiple simultaneous downloads/uploads. > > http://filezilla.sourceforge.net/ > +1 FileZilla I got the customer service team moved over to it and they love it. Explorer-like environment, full drag&drop, SFTP support, and it must be fun to say the name.. because I keep hearing it. It works really well and did not require much training. FileZilla has a handy stay-alive feature, so, I had to keep drilling them that it is polite to disconnect when finished. Michael -- --- From hans Mon Dec 13 07:24:24 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 04:24:24 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8706A1E137@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > : Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. > > > > FileZilla r0x :) > > > > ...even does multiple simultaneous downloads/uploads. > > > > http://filezilla.sourceforge.net/ > > > > +1 FileZilla > > I got the customer service team moved over to it and they love it. > Explorer-like environment, full drag&drop, SFTP support, and it must > be fun to say the name.. because I keep hearing it. It works really > well and did not require much training. FileZilla has a handy > stay-alive feature, so, I had to keep drilling them that it is polite to > disconnect when finished. Ditto - filezilla is very good stuff H From mspitzer Mon Dec 13 12:49:23 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 12:49:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sftp clients In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8706A1E137@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8706A1E137@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <8c50a3c304121309496620d193@mail.gmail.com> filezillla is good stuff, sftp, ftp, ftp-ssl. Also remember that ftp and sftp are different protocols so great ftp clients may not support it, just stating the obvious here. marc On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 04:24:24 -0800, Hans Zaunere wrote: > > > > > > : Any recommendations on Win32 gui clients for sftp. > > > > > > FileZilla r0x :) > > > > > > ...even does multiple simultaneous downloads/uploads. > > > > > > http://filezilla.sourceforge.net/ > > > > > > > +1 FileZilla > > > > I got the customer service team moved over to it and they love it. > > Explorer-like environment, full drag&drop, SFTP support, and it must > > be fun to say the name.. because I keep hearing it. It works really > > well and did not require much training. FileZilla has a handy > > stay-alive feature, so, I had to keep drilling them that it is polite > to > > disconnect when finished. > > Ditto - filezilla is very good stuff > > > > H > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From george Mon Dec 13 12:54:17 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 12:54:17 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYTCHP last call for volunteers Message-ID: <0265979E-4D30-11D9-B336-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Last call for volunteers. If you didn't get an email from me earlier, then I missed you on my list. Email me offlist . . . Things are looking good. . . it's the last lap so it's a bit nuts. George From ike Mon Dec 13 12:57:55 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 12:57:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD Message-ID: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Hi all, from the cool, cheap, and expendable hardware dept., A vendor just built me a box with a SATA RAID card which is new to me- and I have a fairly strange question for everyone, as I don't know where to go from here. I need to find out how one goes about getting a hardware driver into the FreeBSD source- and having never been involved with that before, I don't know who/where to turn to. This is the course of action I think is appropriate, after thinking through the everything detailed below. The nutshell version, the HighPoint has FreeBSD drivers for their 1640 SATA RAID card on their website, it's just the installing disk drivers on boot volumes that bites. These things are cheap, solid, SATA RAID- who doesn't want that? (regardless if I want it, I've now got one :) If anyone can point me to the right person, or URL, I'd seriously appreciate it- this situation is right on the cusp of being VERY cool, IMHO. Details below- Rocket- .ike Details: -- ((SPECS)) The Raid card is the 'HighPoint RocketRaid 1640' http://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA/rr1640.htm It's a 4 channel SATA card, and they're fairly inexpensive. With that, HighPoint actually states FreeBSD support on their website, PROVIDES DRIVERS, and both 'CLI' and 'GUI' management tools- all fine and dandy (they can't be any clunkier than aaccli eh?). Right now the card hovers around $100- very accessible, very replaceable. (( DRIVERS EXIST!! )) http://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA/bios_rr1640.htm#FreeBSD There is online access to the card's drivers from the manufacturer, and they have actually gone to considerable effort to support FreeBSD through 4.x and 5.x (as well as Linux), though I have not yet seen any clear license concerning driver redistribution etc... (excepting a general copyright header in the manual), so I'd assume that with a little prodding even, HighPoint could be convinced to slap an MIT or BSD style license in there, so we can have the open inclusion of the driver or source in *BSD/*NIX source. Someone within FreeBSD may have tried this already and failed, but I haven't been able to find anything about this online. (( HOW INSTALLING DISK DRIVERS ON BOOT MEDIA BITES )) Installing the drivers, ESPECIALLY during a system install, is a real manual pain in the tail. The instructions provided by HighPoint call for a sequence involving: + booting from FreeBSD install CD - pausing before the kernel loads - loading the driver off a floppy + One then proceeds with a standard FreeBSD install - and at the end, one has to instal the HighPoint drivers on the fresh system - Then one manually has to add the driver to boot.load on the fresh system, so it bloody loads at boot time. The install sequence is documented in a PDF, in the tarball of stuff that comes with the driver images: http://www.highpoint-tech.com/BIOS%20+%20Driver/rr1640/FreeBSD/rr154x- bsd-v112s.tgz (( WHY DRIVER INSTALL BITES )) Driver install takes a inordinate amount of time, (hardware RAID being something I use, for one, because it SAVES me time). In addition, I have no floppy on this system- and don't plan to install one, so getting this to work involved a 3rd disk, then copying the install, and driver, etc... to the RAID once it was working. Now, thinking foreword to a time when there is some sort of critical problem with the system, I shudder to think what kind of boot-ballet I'll have to deal with, should I need to boot from emergency repair media- seeing as whenever that kind of thing happens, it's always under time pressure, anything that can go wrong will go wrong. I could create my own install/repair CD's based on the minidist releases, but this is a loosing proposition as well- seeing as I currently will be supporting 1 of these buggers, and what the heck happens when there is some Zero-day system exploit, where I'll need to do some major upgrades within hours. (( WHY DRIVERS INCLUSION FOR SOURCE/INSTALLER MEDIA SOLVES EVERYTHING )) It's simple- All of the above install issues for boot volumes disappear for this card. IMHO, this enables all of us to use fast and inexpensive RAID in places that would otherwise be cost-prohibitive (slap RAID in that little dev box in your closet). I'd personally start using the cards all over in clusters of redundant servers, where fast/cheap replacements are key for me... For advocacy purposes, this is the kind of situation that I think creates bad perceptions about Open Source- and BSD- HighPoint folks really are putting effort into supporting FreeBSD, but I'd hate to be a newbie who just bought a HighPoint card for my first FreeBSD install!!! From mspitzer Mon Dec 13 13:48:28 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 13:48:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <8c50a3c3041213104834af7d99@mail.gmail.com> ok I suck with names, but what about the guy who gave the talk about the freebsd book? you were there and are better with names then I am. marc On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 12:57:55 -0500, Isaac Levy wrote: > Hi all, from the cool, cheap, and expendable hardware dept., > > A vendor just built me a box with a SATA RAID card which is new to me- > and I have a fairly strange question for everyone, as I don't know > where to go from here. > > I need to find out how one goes about getting a hardware driver into > the FreeBSD source- and having never been involved with that before, I > don't know who/where to turn to. This is the course of action I think > is appropriate, after thinking through the everything detailed below. From pete Mon Dec 13 13:58:22 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 13:58:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c3041213104834af7d99@mail.gmail.com> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <8c50a3c3041213104834af7d99@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041213185822.GA24133@nomadlogic.org> On Mon, Dec 13, 2004 at 01:48:28PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > ok I suck with names, but what about the guy who gave the talk about > the freebsd book? you were there and are better with names then I am. are you refering to Marshall Kirk McKusick? > > On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 12:57:55 -0500, Isaac Levy wrote: > > Hi all, from the cool, cheap, and expendable hardware dept., > > > > A vendor just built me a box with a SATA RAID card which is new to me- > > and I have a fairly strange question for everyone, as I don't know > > where to go from here. > > > > I need to find out how one goes about getting a hardware driver into > > the FreeBSD source- and having never been involved with that before, I > > don't know who/where to turn to. This is the course of action I think > > is appropriate, after thinking through the everything detailed below. hey ike, so you want to take the third party driver and intergreate it into your source tree so when you do a make world it get's included as well? that sounds pretty awesome. i wounder if folks on freebsd-hardware@ might be of help? altho i bet you may be able to get it built as a module by putting the source in /usr/src/sys/modules then editing the Makefile in there. don't know if this is helpfull but it may be worth hacking on until you get a definitive response from a commiter of something... -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From mspitzer Mon Dec 13 14:14:56 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 14:14:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <20041213185822.GA24133@nomadlogic.org> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <8c50a3c3041213104834af7d99@mail.gmail.com> <20041213185822.GA24133@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <8c50a3c304121311144cbdfe37@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 13:58:22 -0500, Pete Wright wrote: > On Mon, Dec 13, 2004 at 01:48:28PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > ok I suck with names, but what about the guy who gave the talk about > > the freebsd book? you were there and are better with names then I am. > > are you refering to Marshall Kirk McKusick? Thats the name. marc > > > > > > > On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 12:57:55 -0500, Isaac Levy wrote: > > > Hi all, from the cool, cheap, and expendable hardware dept., > > > > > > A vendor just built me a box with a SATA RAID card which is new to me- > > > and I have a fairly strange question for everyone, as I don't know > > > where to go from here. > > > > > > I need to find out how one goes about getting a hardware driver into > > > the FreeBSD source- and having never been involved with that before, I > > > don't know who/where to turn to. This is the course of action I think > > > is appropriate, after thinking through the everything detailed below. > > hey ike, so you want to take the third party driver and intergreate it > into your source tree so when you do a make world it get's included as > well? that sounds pretty awesome. i wounder if folks on > freebsd-hardware@ might be of help? altho i bet you may be able to get > it built as a module by putting the source in /usr/src/sys/modules then > editing the Makefile in there. don't know if this is helpfull but it > may be worth hacking on until you get a definitive response from a > commiter of something... > > -p > > -- > ~~oO00Oo~~ > Peter Wright > pete at nomadlogic.org > www.nomadlogic.org/~pete > 917.415.9866 > From ike Mon Dec 13 14:22:43 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 14:22:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c304121311144cbdfe37@mail.gmail.com> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <8c50a3c3041213104834af7d99@mail.gmail.com> <20041213185822.GA24133@nomadlogic.org> <8c50a3c304121311144cbdfe37@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <5CB71804-4D3C-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Word- On Dec 13, 2004, at 2:14 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: >> >> are you refering to Marshall Kirk McKusick? > > Thats the name. Yep- From ike Mon Dec 13 14:25:24 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 14:25:24 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <20041213185822.GA24133@nomadlogic.org> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <8c50a3c3041213104834af7d99@mail.gmail.com> <20041213185822.GA24133@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: Wordup Pete, All, On Dec 13, 2004, at 1:58 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > > hey ike, so you want to take the third party driver and intergreate it > into your source tree so when you do a make world it get's included as > well? that sounds pretty awesome. Yep- that's the ticket. I'd really also like to see the driver in the Stable release, so that install/repair ISO's have the driver loaded and ready to go. > i wounder if folks on > freebsd-hardware@ might be of help? Just now subscribed, perfect- thanks. > altho i bet you may be able to get > it built as a module by putting the source in /usr/src/sys/modules then > editing the Makefile in there. Gotcha. Thanks for this one- I'm going to try this out right now. > don't know if this is helpfull but it > may be worth hacking on until you get a definitive response from a > commiter of something... Dig- thank you. Rocket- .ike From pete Mon Dec 13 14:27:39 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 14:27:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <8c50a3c3041213104834af7d99@mail.gmail.com> <20041213185822.GA24133@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20041213192739.GD24133@nomadlogic.org> On Mon, Dec 13, 2004 at 02:25:24PM -0500, Isaac Levy wrote: > Wordup Pete, All, > > On Dec 13, 2004, at 1:58 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > > > > >hey ike, so you want to take the third party driver and intergreate it > >into your source tree so when you do a make world it get's included as > >well? that sounds pretty awesome. > > Yep- that's the ticket. I'd really also like to see the driver in the > Stable release, so that install/repair ISO's have the driver loaded and > ready to go. > > >i wounder if folks on > >freebsd-hardware@ might be of help? > > Just now subscribed, perfect- thanks. > > >altho i bet you may be able to get > >it built as a module by putting the source in /usr/src/sys/modules then > >editing the Makefile in there. > > Gotcha. Thanks for this one- I'm going to try this out right now. > cool, lemme know how it works out. it was checking out the Makefile in /usr/src/sys/modules and saw this which looked promising: SUBDIR= ${_3dfx} \ ${_aac} \ accf_data \ accf_http \ ... so hopefully this is where one defines which directories get built. > >don't know if this is helpfull but it > >may be worth hacking on until you get a definitive response from a > >commiter of something... > > Dig- thank you. np -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From spork Mon Dec 13 14:39:56 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 14:39:56 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: On Mon, 13 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: > The nutshell version, the HighPoint has FreeBSD drivers for their 1640 SATA > RAID card on their website, it's just the installing disk drivers on boot > volumes that bites. These things are cheap, solid, SATA RAID- who doesn't > want that? (regardless if I want it, I've now got one :) > > If anyone can point me to the right person, or URL, I'd seriously appreciate > it- this situation is right on the cusp of being VERY cool, IMHO. Can you tell us more about the driver? Is it tacked-on to the existing ATA stuff, or is it more like the 3Ware (which presents itself more like a scsi device to the OS)? If the latter, a quick shout on -hackers should find you the right person. A few people that may or may not work on this stuff but are quite smart and easy to work with are: -Mike Smith (really really great guy - if he's got the time and the commit bit, he'd probably help) -Scott Long (mostly adaptec stuff, but who knows...) And while I appreciate Soren's work, he's not the most cooperative or helpful person in the group, so I'd steer clear. Again, if this is a more scsi-like driver, asking on -scsi is good - most anyone who works on any RAID cards is going to be there. Charles > Details below- Rocket- > .ike > > > > > Details: > -- > ((SPECS)) > The Raid card is the 'HighPoint RocketRaid 1640' > http://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA/rr1640.htm > > It's a 4 channel SATA card, and they're fairly inexpensive. With that, > HighPoint actually states FreeBSD support on their website, PROVIDES DRIVERS, > and both 'CLI' and 'GUI' management tools- all fine and dandy (they can't be > any clunkier than aaccli eh?). Right now the card hovers around $100- very > accessible, very replaceable. > > > (( DRIVERS EXIST!! )) > http://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA/bios_rr1640.htm#FreeBSD > There is online access to the card's drivers from the manufacturer, and they > have actually gone to considerable effort to support FreeBSD through 4.x and > 5.x (as well as Linux), though I have not yet seen any clear license > concerning driver redistribution etc... (excepting a general copyright header > in the manual), so I'd assume that with a little prodding even, HighPoint > could be convinced to slap an MIT or BSD style license in there, so we can > have the open inclusion of the driver or source in *BSD/*NIX source. Someone > within FreeBSD may have tried this already and failed, but I haven't been > able to find anything about this online. > > > (( HOW INSTALLING DISK DRIVERS ON BOOT MEDIA BITES )) > Installing the drivers, ESPECIALLY during a system install, is a real manual > pain in the tail. The instructions provided by HighPoint call for a sequence > involving: > + booting from FreeBSD install CD > - pausing before the kernel loads > - loading the driver off a floppy > + One then proceeds with a standard FreeBSD install > - and at the end, one has to instal the HighPoint drivers on the fresh system > - Then one manually has to add the driver to boot.load on the fresh system, > so it bloody loads at boot time. > > The install sequence is documented in a PDF, in the tarball of stuff that > comes with the driver images: > http://www.highpoint-tech.com/BIOS%20+%20Driver/rr1640/FreeBSD/rr154x- > bsd-v112s.tgz > > (( WHY DRIVER INSTALL BITES )) > Driver install takes a inordinate amount of time, (hardware RAID being > something I use, for one, because it SAVES me time). In addition, I have no > floppy on this system- and don't plan to install one, so getting this to work > involved a 3rd disk, then copying the install, and driver, etc... to the RAID > once it was working. Now, thinking foreword to a time when there is some > sort of critical problem with the system, I shudder to think what kind of > boot-ballet I'll have to deal with, should I need to boot from emergency > repair media- seeing as whenever that kind of thing happens, it's always > under time pressure, anything that can go wrong will go wrong. > I could create my own install/repair CD's based on the minidist releases, but > this is a loosing proposition as well- seeing as I currently will be > supporting 1 of these buggers, and what the heck happens when there is some > Zero-day system exploit, where I'll need to do some major upgrades within > hours. > > > (( WHY DRIVERS INCLUSION FOR SOURCE/INSTALLER MEDIA SOLVES EVERYTHING )) > It's simple- All of the above install issues for boot volumes disappear for > this card. > IMHO, this enables all of us to use fast and inexpensive RAID in places that > would otherwise be cost-prohibitive (slap RAID in that little dev box in your > closet). I'd personally start using the cards all over in clusters of > redundant servers, where fast/cheap replacements are key for me... > > For advocacy purposes, this is the kind of situation that I think creates bad > perceptions about Open Source- and BSD- HighPoint folks really are putting > effort into supporting FreeBSD, but I'd hate to be a newbie who just bought a > HighPoint card for my first FreeBSD install!!! > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From ike Mon Dec 13 15:20:35 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 15:20:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <726FFEB7-4D44-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Hi Charles, On Dec 13, 2004, at 2:39 PM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > On Mon, 13 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: > >> The nutshell version, the HighPoint has FreeBSD drivers for their >> 1640 SATA RAID card on their website, it's just the installing disk >> drivers on boot volumes that bites. These things are cheap, solid, >> SATA RAID- who doesn't want that? (regardless if I want it, I've now >> got one :) >> >> If anyone can point me to the right person, or URL, I'd seriously >> appreciate it- this situation is right on the cusp of being VERY >> cool, IMHO. > > Can you tell us more about the driver? I'll try here- I've not gotten it successfully installed here today- I'm working around the problem that I don't have a floppy drive on the machine, and the drivers are distributed as floppy images... Taking forever to shuffle disks around here. > Is it tacked-on to the existing ATA stuff, or is it more like the > 3Ware (which presents itself more like a scsi device to the OS)? I'm not really familiar with the internals of the 3Ware drivers, but I *think* it's similar- the docs say it presents itself as /dev/da0 to the filesystem. Additionally, after install, the sysctl interface to the RAID is done like: # sysctl hpt374.status -and- # sysctl ?w hpt374.status=?hpt rebuild a,b,0? -etc- So I'm not sure if that answers your question or not here- but perhaps it provides some more clues? > If the latter, a quick shout on -hackers should find you the right > person. A few people that may or may not work on this stuff but are > quite smart and easy to work with are: > > -Mike Smith (really really great guy - if he's got the time and the > commit bit, he'd probably help) > -Scott Long (mostly adaptec stuff, but who knows...) Excellent- thank you! > > And while I appreciate Soren's work, he's not the most cooperative or > helpful person in the group, so I'd steer clear. > > Again, if this is a more scsi-like driver, asking on -scsi is good - > most anyone who works on any RAID cards is going to be there. > > Charles Cool- much thanks Charles. Rocket- .ike From spork Mon Dec 13 15:46:59 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 15:46:59 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <726FFEB7-4D44-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <726FFEB7-4D44-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: On Mon, 13 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: > I'm not really familiar with the internals of the 3Ware drivers, but I > *think* it's similar- the docs say it presents itself as /dev/da0 to the > filesystem. Additionally, after install, the sysctl interface to the RAID is > done like: > # sysctl hpt374.status > -and- > # sysctl ?w hpt374.status=?hpt rebuild a,b,0? > -etc- > > So I'm not sure if that answers your question or not here- but perhaps it > provides some more clues? Hmmm, that's interesting. Talk to freebsd-scsi. That's a nice low-traffic list and those people are extremely helpful. Thanks, Charles > Rocket- > .ike > > From ike Mon Dec 13 15:48:30 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 15:48:30 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <58D1597C-4D48-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Hi Charles, All, On Dec 13, 2004, at 2:39 PM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > Can you tell us more about the driver? Is it tacked-on to the > existing ATA stuff, or is it more like the 3Ware (which presents > itself more like a scsi device to the OS)? If the latter, a quick > shout on -hackers should find you the right person. While installing a fresh OS, confirmed this in the manual: "If the module has been loaded successfully you should see the RR154x/1640 banner and a display screen of the attached drives. You can now access the drives as a SCSI device (if you have no other SCSI device, the first device is /dev/da0, then /dev/da1, etc.)." So I guess I'll dive into this issue with -scsi and see if anyone responds... Thanks! Rocket- .ike From george Mon Dec 13 20:55:23 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 20:55:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] holiday party In-Reply-To: <200412100737.10363.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> References: <7D169D4A-4A2B-11D9-A073-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <200412100737.10363.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> Message-ID: <37992444-4D73-11D9-BF04-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 10, 2004, at 7:37 AM, Sunny Dubey wrote: > On Thursday 09 December 2004 16:44, G. Rosamond wrote: >> Well, we're coming to the home stretch for the holiday party this >> coming Wednesday night. > > is there a posted agenda for this party ? > > Nothing in stone. What are you looking for exactly? g From george Mon Dec 13 21:51:51 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 21:51:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c304121311144cbdfe37@mail.gmail.com> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <8c50a3c3041213104834af7d99@mail.gmail.com> <20041213185822.GA24133@nomadlogic.org> <8c50a3c304121311144cbdfe37@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1B0165F8-4D7B-11D9-BF04-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 13, 2004, at 2:14 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 13:58:22 -0500, Pete Wright > wrote: >> On Mon, Dec 13, 2004 at 01:48:28PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: >>> ok I suck with names, but what about the guy who gave the talk about >>> the freebsd book? you were there and are better with names then I >>> am. >> >> are you refering to Marshall Kirk McKusick? > > Thats the name. > > marc > It's a great feeling when Marc forgets the obvious. . . he is the unofficial encyclopedia of NYC*BUG, if anyone wasn't aware. He's been banned from competing in trivia. . . Not remembering Kirk is like a Linux/GNU user not remembering Linus' name. Rain man? g From lists Tue Dec 14 08:15:36 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 08:15:36 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? Message-ID: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> On an announcement email from the 8th it said the address would be sent monday. I did not get an email with address (at least not that I can find). From ike Tue Dec 14 08:21:15 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 08:21:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> On Dec 14, 2004, at 8:15 AM, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On an announcement email from the 8th it said the address would be > sent monday. I did not get an email with address (at least not that I > can find). Francisco- you are not alone... Where's the party at!?! Rocket- .ike From ike Tue Dec 14 08:24:52 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 08:24:52 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <00a701c4e157$5a303690$0301a8c0@thomas> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00a701c4e157$5a303690$0301a8c0@thomas> Message-ID: <894ADB96-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Hi All, I just wanted to shout out re. the HighPoint RocketRaid 1640 driver fun from yesterday- two things: 1) I've started the ball rolling on FreeBSD-scsi list, and will continue to try to get some words about the possibility/sanity of getting these drivers into the release sources. We'll see what happens... 2) I just dug into the FreeBSD LiveCD project, and I'M FREAKING OUT IT'S SO COOL. The project distributes scripts so one can make their own bootable CD- containing whatever one wants it to have. For my own 'micro-datacenter' purposes, I'm diving in this morning to create/test my own Live bootable CD for system installs and repair uses, of course primarily to ensure the HighPoint drivers are on board, and can be installed over and over with the OS... (as well as providing a fixit disk that properly deals with the RAID boot volume). Problem solved for me in a clean and immediate manner, and I'm happy. Giddy even. With that, I'll switch off my -v flag on this list thread, I just thought this LiveCD project is such a cool solution, worth blabbing about here... Rocket- .ike From ike Tue Dec 14 08:27:37 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 08:27:37 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <894ADB96-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00a701c4e157$5a303690$0301a8c0@thomas> <894ADB96-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: On Dec 14, 2004, at 8:24 AM, Isaac Levy wrote: > 2) I just dug into the FreeBSD LiveCD project, and I'M FREAKING OUT > IT'S SO COOL. Freaking out so much I forgot the URL, for the record,: http://livecd.sourceforge.net/ Rocket- .ike From tux Tue Dec 14 08:46:29 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 08:46:29 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> : Francisco- you are not alone... : : Where's the party at!?! If you are a sponsor, and update was sent by Hans yesterday (Monday). I don't know if the information sent was meant only for the sponsors or not, but for $50 I'll tell ya before it goes out en masse ;) (...please include credit card info when responding to ensure you don't get sent to Spanish Harlem or Yankee Stadium .. =) From ike Tue Dec 14 08:50:13 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 08:50:13 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Wait- On Dec 14, 2004, at 8:46 AM, Kevin Reiter wrote: > Spanish Harlem or Yankee Stadium I thought it was being held at Coney Island- in the small plaza next to the rollercoaster? /me very very confused this morning Rocket- .ike From tux Tue Dec 14 09:05:10 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:05:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> : I thought it was being held at Coney Island- in the small plaza next to : the rollercoaster? : : /me very very confused this morning Dude - drink more coffee :) From ike Tue Dec 14 09:12:44 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:12:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> On Dec 14, 2004, at 9:05 AM, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : I thought it was being held at Coney Island- in the small plaza next > to > : the rollercoaster? > : > : /me very very confused this morning > > Dude - drink more coffee :) What? It's on the beach or something now? From tux Tue Dec 14 09:14:47 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:14:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> : What? It's on the beach or something now? You obviously didn't get the memo. This will reflect on your performance rating I'm afraid... From ike Tue Dec 14 09:47:22 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:47:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> On Dec 14, 2004, at 9:14 AM, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : What? It's on the beach or something now? > > You obviously didn't get the memo. This will reflect on your > performance rating > I'm afraid... /me hunches over my keyboard and cries so much the tears extinguish my morning cigarette... :) From mspitzer Tue Dec 14 09:48:07 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:48:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] highpoint RAID drivers on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <1B0165F8-4D7B-11D9-BF04-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <8471ABBE-4D30-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <8c50a3c3041213104834af7d99@mail.gmail.com> <20041213185822.GA24133@nomadlogic.org> <8c50a3c304121311144cbdfe37@mail.gmail.com> <1B0165F8-4D7B-11D9-BF04-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <8c50a3c3041214064876738400@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 21:51:51 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > On Dec 13, 2004, at 2:14 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > > On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 13:58:22 -0500, Pete Wright > > wrote: > >> On Mon, Dec 13, 2004 at 01:48:28PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > >>> ok I suck with names, but what about the guy who gave the talk about > >>> the freebsd book? you were there and are better with names then I > >>> am. > >> > >> are you refering to Marshall Kirk McKusick? > > > > Thats the name. > > > > marc > > > > It's a great feeling when Marc forgets the obvious. . . he is the > unofficial encyclopedia of NYC*BUG, if anyone wasn't aware. He's been > banned from competing in trivia. . . > > Not remembering Kirk is like a Linux/GNU user not remembering Linus' > name. > > Rain man? Look names that are attached to people are a people skill, nuff said. And I did not forget him, tall guy brown hair, mustach, works on filesystem stuff, I just stink with names. marc > > g > > From mspitzer Tue Dec 14 09:50:41 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:50:41 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <8c50a3c304121406505d81e7d4@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:14:47 -0500, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : What? It's on the beach or something now? > > You obviously didn't get the memo. This will reflect on your performance rating > I'm afraid... Dare I say TPS report, dont forget the cover sheet. marc From ike Tue Dec 14 10:12:58 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:12:58 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c304121406505d81e7d4@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <8c50a3c304121406505d81e7d4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Kevin, Marc, On Dec 14, 2004, at 9:50 AM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:14:47 -0500, Kevin Reiter > wrote: >> : What? It's on the beach or something now? >> >> You obviously didn't get the memo. This will reflect on your >> performance rating >> I'm afraid... > > Dare I say TPS report, dont forget the cover sheet. > > marc Feel free to swing by my Brooklyn office for the report: http://diversaform.com/temp/ReportThis.gif Rocket- http://diversaform.com/temp/ike_emoticon.gif From mspitzer Tue Dec 14 10:15:39 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:15:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <8c50a3c304121406505d81e7d4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8c50a3c304121407154b49cfbe@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:12:58 -0500, Isaac Levy wrote: > Kevin, Marc, > > On Dec 14, 2004, at 9:50 AM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > > On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:14:47 -0500, Kevin Reiter > > wrote: > >> : What? It's on the beach or something now? > >> > >> You obviously didn't get the memo. This will reflect on your > >> performance rating > >> I'm afraid... > > > > Dare I say TPS report, dont forget the cover sheet. > > > > marc > > Feel free to swing by my Brooklyn office for the report: > > http://diversaform.com/temp/ReportThis.gif Where is the cover sheet, dont you read your memos??!?!?!?! marc > > Rocket- > http://diversaform.com/temp/ike_emoticon.gif > > From tux Tue Dec 14 10:05:50 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:05:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> : /me hunches over my keyboard and cries so much the tears extinguish my : morning cigarette... I'll sell you another one for $5 =) (Hey, it's EOY and I have to think of new and exciting ways to close out the month ;) From ike Tue Dec 14 10:21:32 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:21:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: On Dec 14, 2004, at 10:15 AM, Marc Spitzer wrote: >> Feel free to swing by my Brooklyn office for the report: >> >> http://diversaform.com/temp/ReportThis.gif > > Where is the cover sheet, dont you read your memos??!?!?!?! > > marc On Dec 14, 2004, at 10:05 AM, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : /me hunches over my keyboard and cries so much the tears extinguish > my > : morning cigarette... > > I'll sell you another one for $5 =) > > (Hey, it's EOY and I have to think of new and exciting ways to close > out the month > ;) /me tries to figure out how to fit the hammer into my jacket for tomorrow evening. Beind an extra-wide 70's tie perhaps... Rocket- .ike From george Tue Dec 14 10:22:23 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:22:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: On Dec 14, 2004, at 10:05 AM, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : /me hunches over my keyboard and cries so much the tears extinguish > my > : morning cigarette... > > I'll sell you another one for $5 =) > > (Hey, it's EOY and I have to think of new and exciting ways to close > out the month > ;) > You guys should stick to coffee rather than quaaludes for Tuesdays. Address is coming out soon. We've been a bit swamped. but please continue the thread, it's gotten pretty funny. g From ike Tue Dec 14 10:25:43 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:25:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <6BA5E04E-4DE4-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> On Dec 14, 2004, at 10:22 AM, G. Rosamond wrote: > You guys should stick to coffee rather than quaaludes for Tuesdays. Awwww. But we all need a treat after Mondays man. > > Address is coming out soon. We've been a bit swamped. ! > > but please continue the thread, it's gotten pretty funny. NOW you've killed the thread, all we'll do now is consciously TRY to be funny. Hrm. > > g /me heads for Gman's brooklyn office, hammer in hand... Rocket- .ike From tux Tue Dec 14 10:37:42 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:37:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo> : /me tries to figure out how to fit the hammer into my jacket for : tomorrow evening. : Beind an extra-wide 70's tie perhaps... /me goes to the costume rental place and hopes they have something available for tomorrow night... ...minus the extra-wide 70's tie... From tux Tue Dec 14 10:40:47 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:40:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <010e01c4e1f3$4a508530$0500a8c0@apollo> : You guys should stick to coffee rather than quaaludes for Tuesdays. All I know is, there had BETTER be some coffee tomorrow night or I'll be borrowing Isaac's hammer =) From tux Tue Dec 14 10:43:45 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:43:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <6BA5E04E-4DE4-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <011401c4e1f3$b3f2e8c0$0500a8c0@apollo> : NOW you've killed the thread, all we'll do now is consciously TRY to be : funny. Hrm. Let's just ignore him until this thread is done =) (Didja ever try to do telephone tech support while reading/participating in a funny thread and try to think of reasons to tell the client why you're laughing so damn hard? I'm running outta 'scuses...) From okan Tue Dec 14 10:45:14 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:45:14 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c304121406505d81e7d4@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <8c50a3c304121406505d81e7d4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041214154513.GA95718@yinaska.pair.com> On Tue 2004.12.14 at 09:50 -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 09:14:47 -0500, Kevin Reiter wrote: > > : What? It's on the beach or something now? > > > > You obviously didn't get the memo. This will reflect on your performance rating > > I'm afraid... > > Dare I say TPS report, dont forget the cover sheet. hah...and the funny thing is that at one of my old jobs, we actually got to call our reports, TPS...yes, that's right, our little group was riddled with snipets from office space, whilst our manager had NO CLUE as to what we were saying, asking for, or doing. so we got him to follow along ;) ah, the memories.... okan > marc > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From ike Tue Dec 14 10:45:43 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 10:45:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <36B29BDE-4DE7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> On Dec 14, 2004, at 10:37 AM, Kevin Reiter wrote: > /me goes to the costume rental place and hopes they have something > available for > tomorrow night... ...minus the extra-wide 70's tie... It's a costume party now? /me totally confused again here. I thought it was going to be more of a Vegas-themed thing- showtunes, etc... From tux Tue Dec 14 11:16:46 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 11:16:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo> <36B29BDE-4DE7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <014d01c4e1f8$561062f0$0500a8c0@apollo> : It's a costume party now? /me totally confused again here. I thought : it was going to be more of a Vegas-themed thing- showtunes, etc... That's the *other* party. Grab yer coffee mug (that's the round thingy with the handle), stand up, walk over to the coffee machine, grab the HANDLE of the coffee pot with the hand that's not holding the coffee mug, pour coffee into the mug that you're still holding in your other hand, put the coffee pot back where you found it, then, while still holding the mug, walk back to your desk. Sit down, and start drinking =) From ike Tue Dec 14 11:49:43 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 11:49:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <014d01c4e1f8$561062f0$0500a8c0@apollo> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo> <36B29BDE-4DE7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <014d01c4e1f8$561062f0$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <275D73C6-4DF0-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> On Dec 14, 2004, at 11:16 AM, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : It's a costume party now? /me totally confused again here. I > thought > : it was going to be more of a Vegas-themed thing- showtunes, etc... > > That's the *other* party. > > Grab yer coffee mug (that's the round thingy with the handle), stand > up, walk over > to the coffee machine, grab the HANDLE of the coffee pot with the hand > that's not > holding the coffee mug, pour coffee into the mug that you're still > holding in your > other hand, put the coffee pot back where you found it, then, while > still holding > the mug, walk back to your desk. Sit down, and start drinking =) Done- but now I can't focus my eyes very well for more than a few seconds... http://diversaform.com/temp/intern.jpg Rocket- .ike From spork Tue Dec 14 11:52:11 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 11:52:11 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <36B29BDE-4DE7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo> <36B29BDE-4DE7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 14 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: > On Dec 14, 2004, at 10:37 AM, Kevin Reiter wrote: > >> /me goes to the costume rental place and hopes they have something >> available for >> tomorrow night... ...minus the extra-wide 70's tie... > > It's a costume party now? /me totally confused again here. I thought it was > going to be more of a Vegas-themed thing- showtunes, etc... Don't leak the address or you'll have party-crashers like me coming in and picking fights with all the NT-geeks that took my spot. Not that I have any "business casual" attire left anymore. Burp. I am certainly looking forward to meeting you nutjobs at the next monthly meeting though. I think everyone should bring a hammer to that. Charles > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From tux Tue Dec 14 11:55:07 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 11:55:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo> <36B29BDE-4DE7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <014d01c4e1f8$561062f0$0500a8c0@apollo> <275D73C6-4DF0-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <018b01c4e1fd$ac288a50$0500a8c0@apollo> : Done- but now I can't focus my eyes very well for more than a few : seconds... Minor side effect. Ignore it and it might go away. Then again, it might now. If it doesn't, go grab that hammer, stand in front of a mirror (so you can see the target), raise the hammer about 16 inches from the top of your head, and in a very quick motion, lower the head of the hammer so it comes to rest on the top center of your skull. (OK, it'll probably bounce, but don't worry about that part for now.) Repeat as needed, unless you drink more coffee (follow previous instructions.) From jbaltz Tue Dec 14 11:56:56 2004 From: jbaltz (Jerry B. Altzman) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 11:56:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo> <36B29BDE-4DE7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <41BF1B58.6000107@omnipod.com> On 12/14/2004 11:52 AM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > I am certainly looking forward to meeting you nutjobs at the next > monthly meeting though. I think everyone should bring a hammer to that. Someone commented to me while we were in my data center cage the other day: "Why do you have that big-a$$ claw hammer there in your toolbox?" Now, ask yourself, why *wouldn't* you need a big claw hammer in your data center? Percussive maintenance, maaaaybe? > Charles //jbaltz -- jerry b. altzman jbaltz at omnipod.com +1 646 230 8750 Thank you for contributing to the heat death of the universe. From george Tue Dec 14 12:00:21 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 12:00:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo> <14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo> <399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo> <0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo> <36B29BDE-4DE7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: On Dec 14, 2004, at 11:52 AM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > On Tue, 14 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: > >> On Dec 14, 2004, at 10:37 AM, Kevin Reiter wrote: >> >>> /me goes to the costume rental place and hopes they have something >>> available for >>> tomorrow night... ...minus the extra-wide 70's tie... >> >> It's a costume party now? /me totally confused again here. I >> thought it was going to be more of a Vegas-themed thing- showtunes, >> etc... > > Don't leak the address or you'll have party-crashers like me coming in > and picking fights with all the NT-geeks that took my spot. Not that > I have any "business casual" attire left anymore. Burp. I think you *are* on the list Charles. . . oops, you're not. It's okay, there are hired bouncers with a list. I only sent 55 messages to talk advising people to RSVP. . . > > I am certainly looking forward to meeting you nutjobs at the next > monthly meeting though. I think everyone should bring a hammer to > that. > ditto on the hammers. The meetings are generally good (and your buddy Manos is next up in Jan), but the bar is always the best. g From tux Tue Dec 14 12:04:15 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 12:04:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net><085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org><003501c4e1e3$53dffaf0$0500a8c0@apollo><14476BB1-4DD7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org><004401c4e1e5$ee94dc30$0500a8c0@apollo><399E14F4-4DDA-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org><005e01c4e1e7$520b6530$0500a8c0@apollo><0FAFBC58-4DDF-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org><00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo><00ec01c4e1f2$db71f3b0$0500a8c0@apollo><36B29BDE-4DE7-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org><014d01c4e1f8$561062f0$0500a8c0@apollo><275D73C6-4DF0-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> <018b01c4e1fd$ac288a50$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <01c701c4e1fe$f432f6e0$0500a8c0@apollo> might now = might *not* (I was laughing too hard and forgot to do a spellcheck =) From louis Tue Dec 14 12:12:46 2004 From: louis (Louis Zhang) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 12:12:46 -0500 Subject: FW: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? Message-ID: <110304437002@mercury.hosting4u.net> >Done- but now I can't focus my eyes very well for more than a few seconds... There are millions of "web sites" that will fix that problem right up. Private msg me for details. :) Louis _______________________________________________ % NYC*BUG talk mailing list http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists %We meet the first Wednesday of the month From john Tue Dec 14 13:19:37 2004 From: john (John Bacall) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 13:19:37 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> Message-ID: <200412141320.03308.john@unixen.org> On Tuesday 14 December 2004 10:21 am, Isaac Levy wrote: > On Dec 14, 2004, at 10:15 AM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > (Hey, it's EOY and I have to think of new and exciting ways to > > close out the month > > ;) > > /me tries to figure out how to fit the hammer into my jacket for > tomorrow evening. Ahhhshieeet! Mr. .SpRocket- 3 fbi agents just perked up- who'll administer the colonic on yer @$$ tomorrow? (-: <- I'm a contrarian. John From john Tue Dec 14 13:39:34 2004 From: john (John Bacall) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 13:39:34 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <085E6F83-4DD3-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <200412141339.34196.john@unixen.org> I dig your acolyte's singlepoint intensity. Miao's fierce. John From ike Tue Dec 14 13:56:44 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 13:56:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <110304437002@mercury.hosting4u.net> References: <110304437002@mercury.hosting4u.net> Message-ID: On Dec 14, 2004, at 12:12 PM, Louis Zhang wrote: > There are millions of "web sites" that will fix that problem right up. > Private msg me for details. :) Louis, you have a killer product for EVERYTHING man. I don't know how you do it. Will call you about this one. http://diversaform.com/temp/ike_emoticon.gif Rocket- .ike From ike Tue Dec 14 13:58:20 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 13:58:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <200412141320.03308.john@unixen.org> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <200412141320.03308.john@unixen.org> Message-ID: <1F02BF0B-4E02-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> On Dec 14, 2004, at 1:19 PM, John Bacall wrote: > Ahhhshieeet! Mr. .SpRocket- 3 fbi agents just perked up- who'll > administer the colonic on yer @$$ tomorrow? (-: <- I'm a contrarian. > > John On Dec 14, 2004, at 1:39 PM, John Bacall wrote: > I dig your acolyte's singlepoint intensity. Miao's fierce. > > John I'm bringing my intern tomorrow for protection yo'. He is indeed tough. (not all that ambitious, but tough). Rocket- .ike From george Tue Dec 14 14:08:30 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 14:08:30 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier for NYTCHP Message-ID: <8AC45C8A-4E03-11D9-B5E1-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Can we get some commitments for making double sided copies of this flier: http://metm.org/export/nycbug_jan_meeting.pdf We need about 400. Email me offlist to bring some copies. . . and they should be there as early as possible. g From bschonhorst Tue Dec 14 14:38:39 2004 From: bschonhorst (Brad Schonhorst) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 14:38:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: <1F02BF0B-4E02-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <200412141320.03308.john@unixen.org> <1F02BF0B-4E02-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: > I'm bringing my intern tomorrow for protection yo'. He is indeed > tough. (not all that ambitious, but tough). You're intern is kinda cute, is she available? From george Tue Dec 14 14:41:20 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 14:41:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Address to party? In-Reply-To: References: <20041214081435.J82748@zoraida.natserv.net> <00bf01c4e1f0$0228b780$0500a8c0@apollo> <200412141320.03308.john@unixen.org> <1F02BF0B-4E02-11D9-A787-000D9368D406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <20F41AA0-4E08-11D9-B5E1-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 14, 2004, at 2:38 PM, Brad Schonhorst wrote: > >> I'm bringing my intern tomorrow for protection yo'. He is indeed >> tough. (not all that ambitious, but tough). > > You're intern is kinda cute, is she available? > I don't think you want her/him around beer. Ike, are the art exhibit pictures around still? I have them on my iBook. . . g From george Tue Dec 14 15:46:35 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 15:46:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] another flier link Message-ID: <3E96112F-4E11-11D9-B5E1-000D9328615E@sddi.net> this is the public link for the flier for the swag bag for the NYTCHP for tomorrow. http://nycbug.org/uploads/nycbug_jan_meeting.pdf Who else can make copies? g From steve.rieger Wed Dec 15 17:09:11 2004 From: steve.rieger (steve rieger) Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 17:09:11 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ldap and mysql question Message-ID: <41C0B607.6080203@tbwachiat.com> does anybody on this list use rt3 or tutos and authenticates only to an ldap server. rt3 is running but am having issues authenticating via ldap, tutos seems that it will not authenticate via ldap but rather imports users from ldap into its mysql db, (whichh is cool with me) so on that note do any of you have a dirxml to export from ldap into mysql, i can modufy for my own needs but a start would be appreciated, thanx -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: steve.rieger.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 830 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041215/c73d553d/attachment.vcf From pete Thu Dec 16 00:42:19 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 00:42:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] While you all were partying... Message-ID: <20041216054219.GA31174@nomadlogic.org> ....i was reading this link from the latest crypto gram: http://www.timhunkin.com/94_illegal_engineering.htm hope the NYTCHP went well all! -pete -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From unixenigma Thu Dec 16 02:07:09 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2004 23:07:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] party Message-ID: <20041216070709.46082.qmail@web53907.mail.yahoo.com> Thank you! Well organized and great crowd. I enjoyed it :) Sincerely, GT --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Send holiday email and support a worthy cause. Do good. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041215/2c78b2c3/attachment.html From george Thu Dec 16 05:24:55 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 05:24:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] lost coat(s) In-Reply-To: <20041216070709.46082.qmail@web53907.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041216070709.46082.qmail@web53907.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20041216102455.GA4551@sta> At the closing of the after party, we found one coat, with keys and a book. Another coat was missing. And a third coat belonging to someone else at the bar was inadvertently taken. I have the phone of the owner of the third coat, who would *really* like it back. All the coats where black. Oh and Hanz has Ike's scarf. great party, thanks all! // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From bschonhorst Thu Dec 16 09:43:27 2004 From: bschonhorst (Brad Schonhorst) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 09:43:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] party In-Reply-To: <20041216070709.46082.qmail@web53907.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041216070709.46082.qmail@web53907.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > Thank you! > ? > Well organized and great crowd. > I enjoyed it :) > I second that! Great party! From steve.rieger Thu Dec 16 10:43:17 2004 From: steve.rieger (steve rieger) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 10:43:17 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] rt3 and tutos questions Message-ID: <41C1AD15.7050708@tbwachiat.com> hope y'all had a great party, the only thing i would have liked, a little louder music, so that we can dance. and now for the tech questions does anybody on this list use rt3 or tutos and authenticates only to an ldap server. rt3 is running but am having issues authenticating via ldap, tutos seems that it will not authenticate via ldap but rather imports users from ldap into its mysql db, (whichh is cool with me) so on that note do any of you have a dirxml to export from ldap into mysql, i can modufy for my own needs but a start would be appreciated, thanx -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: steve.rieger.vcf Type: text/x-vcard Size: 830 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041216/678879cd/attachment.vcf From george Thu Dec 16 12:09:13 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 12:09:13 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] The Party Message-ID: <35F32892-4F85-11D9-A6D4-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Phew what a blast. There are a number of people who went above and beyond to make sure it was a success. GT showed up *before* I did at noon yesterday. Miwa (of the Marco and Miwa show) was awesome. Marc. Bruno. Nikolai. Zoran. Ike. Megan. Dan. So many others. There's been great feedback on the event. I can barely talk today. g From marco Thu Dec 16 12:21:57 2004 From: marco (marco at metm.org) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 12:21:57 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] The Party In-Reply-To: <35F32892-4F85-11D9-A6D4-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <35F32892-4F85-11D9-A6D4-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041216172156.GC2054@metm.org> On Thu, Dec 16, 2004 at 12:09:13PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: >Phew what a blast. > >There are a number of people who went above and beyond to make sure it >was a success. Congratulations to you George, on an incredible amount of work well done. -- Marco From pete Thu Dec 16 12:45:45 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 12:45:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] mozilla ad Message-ID: <20041216174545.GA5422@nomadlogic.org> hey all the mozilla ad is running today, i am not sure it made it to the west coast edition. if possible could one of you all snag me a copy and i'll pay you the $.50 when i get into town. http://www.mozilla.org/images/nyt_ad_large_2004.png -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From mjdewitt Thu Dec 16 13:58:04 2004 From: mjdewitt (DeWitt, Michael) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 13:58:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Call for pictures of the holiday party Message-ID: It was great seeing so many of you at the party last night. I noticed that quite a few people had cameras. I would like to gather everyone's pictures and hang them in the NYPHP gallery (which is open to all to view at http://nyphp.org/content/gallery/). If you have some that you would like to share, would you please compress and email them to me at mailto:mjdewitt at alexcommgrp.com Thanks Mike NYPHP From george Thu Dec 16 14:21:59 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 14:21:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] mozilla ad In-Reply-To: <20041216174545.GA5422@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041216174545.GA5422@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: On Dec 16, 2004, at 12:45 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > hey all the mozilla ad is running today, i am not sure it made it to > the > west coast edition. if possible could one of you all snag me a copy > and > i'll pay you the $.50 when i get into town. > > http://www.mozilla.org/images/nyt_ad_large_2004.png > > $.50 for the NY Times? What is this, 1985? I'll pick up a copy today for you Pete. Sorry you missed last night. Turned out great. I knew we could pull something off without you being here. g From george Thu Dec 16 14:39:56 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 14:39:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] lost coat(s) In-Reply-To: <20041216102455.GA4551@sta> References: <20041216070709.46082.qmail@web53907.mail.yahoo.com> <20041216102455.GA4551@sta> Message-ID: <43D61DA1-4F9A-11D9-A39B-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 16, 2004, at 5:24 AM, George Georgalis wrote: > At the closing of the after party, we found one coat, with keys and a > book. Another coat was missing. And a third coat belonging to someone > else at the bar was inadvertently taken. > > I have the phone of the owner of the third coat, who would *really* > like > it back. All the coats where black. Oh and Hanz has Ike's scarf. > > great party, thanks all! > I'm at the location right now. Please call me on my cell. 917-968-1900 g From george Thu Dec 16 14:48:35 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 14:48:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Call for pictures of the holiday party In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <790E8C91-4F9B-11D9-A39B-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 16, 2004, at 1:58 PM, DeWitt, Michael wrote: > It was great seeing so many of you at the party last night. > > I noticed that quite a few people had cameras. I would like to gather > everyone's pictures and hang them in the NYPHP gallery (which is open > to all > to view at http://nyphp.org/content/gallery/). If you have some that > you > would like to share, would you please compress and email them to me at > mailto:mjdewitt at alexcommgrp.com > > Thanks > > Mike > NYPHP I have a good number of pictures. . . mostly taken by Grant from ORA. . . Will send to you later today. We should repl on the NYC*BUG www also. g From zperkov Thu Dec 16 15:04:48 2004 From: zperkov (Zoran Perkov) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 15:04:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] The Party In-Reply-To: <20041216172156.GC2054@metm.org> References: <35F32892-4F85-11D9-A6D4-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041216172156.GC2054@metm.org> Message-ID: <8a851180041216120468131e3e@mail.gmail.com> good stuff. -/z On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 12:21:57 -0500, marco at metm.org wrote: > On Thu, Dec 16, 2004 at 12:09:13PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > >Phew what a blast. > > > >There are a number of people who went above and beyond to make sure it > >was a success. > > Congratulations to you George, > > on an incredible amount of work well done. > > -- > Marco > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From unixenigma Thu Dec 16 16:27:45 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 13:27:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Call for pictures of the holiday party In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20041216212745.54837.qmail@web53902.mail.yahoo.com> I got some. Few of them are made before the party, during the preparation. GT --- "DeWitt, Michael" wrote: > It was great seeing so many of you at the party last > night. > > I noticed that quite a few people had cameras. I > would like to gather > everyone's pictures and hang them in the NYPHP > gallery (which is open to all > to view at http://nyphp.org/content/gallery/). If > you have some that you > would like to share, would you please compress and > email them to me at > mailto:mjdewitt at alexcommgrp.com > > Thanks > > Mike > NYPHP > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce > lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo From george Thu Dec 16 17:36:18 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 17:36:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] mozilla ad In-Reply-To: <20041216174545.GA5422@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041216174545.GA5422@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: On Dec 16, 2004, at 12:45 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > hey all the mozilla ad is running today, i am not sure it made it to > the > west coast edition. if possible could one of you all snag me a copy > and > i'll pay you the $.50 when i get into town. > > http://www.mozilla.org/images/nyt_ad_large_2004.png > I got you the late edition for $.50. The two page ad is very nice. . . I'll keep it around until you're back in town. We should all get together when Pete's here. Let's pick a date. . . It should go without saying, I'm not into doing any party organizing right now. g From jfranks214 Thu Dec 16 18:59:46 2004 From: jfranks214 (Jonathan Franks) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 18:59:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here Message-ID: Hey folks- I was just wondering if anyone knows of a BSD users group in the Albany (NY) area.... It's just a little tough to make meetings in the city from up here. (Although I had planned I coming to the party... I just couldn't get away mid week.) Anyhow I just thought I'd ask... Jonathan From george Thu Dec 16 19:02:42 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 19:02:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Dec 16, 2004, at 6:59 PM, Jonathan Franks wrote: > Hey folks- > > I was just wondering if anyone knows of a BSD users group in the > Albany (NY) > area.... It's just a little tough to make meetings in the city from up > here. (Although I had planned I coming to the party... I just couldn't > get > away mid week.) > > Anyhow I just thought I'd ask... > Sorry you missed the party. It was pretty boring anyway. The first place to check is BSDUserGroups.org, hosted by BC Hosting and maintained by Daemon News (specifically me). There's nothing. First step, IMO, is to start up a mailing list, which we could do on our box, and advertise. You would be surprised. Give us the okay, and we'll setup a Albany BUG list for you. g From george Thu Dec 16 19:03:24 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 19:03:24 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <123A848F-4FBF-11D9-8A97-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 16, 2004, at 6:59 PM, Jonathan Franks wrote: > Hey folks- > > I was just wondering if anyone knows of a BSD users group in the > Albany (NY) > area.... It's just a little tough to make meetings in the city from up > here. (Although I had planned I coming to the party... I just couldn't > get > away mid week.) > Oh, and at some point, start meeting at the Palais Royale, one of my favorite bars in the world. g From jfranks214 Thu Dec 16 19:19:08 2004 From: jfranks214 (Jonathan Franks) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 19:19:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Absolutely. What do I need to do? I had thought about trying to start one up, but decided "Oh, I just don't know where to begin..." -----Original Message----- From: G. Rosamond [mailto:george at sddi.net] Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2004 7:03 PM To: Jonathan Franks Cc: NYC-BUG talk Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here On Dec 16, 2004, at 6:59 PM, Jonathan Franks wrote: > Hey folks- > > I was just wondering if anyone knows of a BSD users group in the > Albany (NY) > area.... It's just a little tough to make meetings in the city from up > here. (Although I had planned I coming to the party... I just couldn't > get > away mid week.) > > Anyhow I just thought I'd ask... > Sorry you missed the party. It was pretty boring anyway. The first place to check is BSDUserGroups.org, hosted by BC Hosting and maintained by Daemon News (specifically me). There's nothing. First step, IMO, is to start up a mailing list, which we could do on our box, and advertise. You would be surprised. Give us the okay, and we'll setup a Albany BUG list for you. g From jfranks214 Thu Dec 16 19:20:30 2004 From: jfranks214 (Jonathan Franks) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 19:20:30 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here In-Reply-To: <123A848F-4FBF-11D9-8A97-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: Can't say as I've ever been there, but a good bar is always welcome. :-) -----Original Message----- From: G. Rosamond [mailto:george at sddi.net] Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2004 7:03 PM To: Jonathan Franks Cc: NYC-BUG talk Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here On Dec 16, 2004, at 6:59 PM, Jonathan Franks wrote: > Hey folks- > > I was just wondering if anyone knows of a BSD users group in the > Albany (NY) > area.... It's just a little tough to make meetings in the city from up > here. (Although I had planned I coming to the party... I just couldn't > get > away mid week.) > Oh, and at some point, start meeting at the Palais Royale, one of my favorite bars in the world. g From mspitzer Thu Dec 16 19:43:56 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 19:43:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8c50a3c30412161643478788b4@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 19:19:08 -0500, Jonathan Franks wrote: > Absolutely. What do I need to do? > > I had thought about trying to start one up, but decided "Oh, I just don't > know where to begin..." >From my experience helping to get lispnyc started, do the following: on bsd/unix/linux newsgroups/mailing lists send out a message that there will be a meeting of the albany BSD users group on (date here) and (time here) at (place here) put some more stuff here about what is going to happen, we are drinking or PF/CARP talk and then we are drinking. ... be prepaired to do this annouincement/setup meeting stuff for at least 3 months. By then you might have some help. and get the word out locally, does albany have craigslist? you just might be supprised at the turn out. And as stated below a mailing list is most important. marc > > > -----Original Message----- > From: G. Rosamond [mailto:george at sddi.net] > Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2004 7:03 PM > To: Jonathan Franks > Cc: NYC-BUG talk > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here > > On Dec 16, 2004, at 6:59 PM, Jonathan Franks wrote: > > > Hey folks- > > > > I was just wondering if anyone knows of a BSD users group in the > > Albany (NY) > > area.... It's just a little tough to make meetings in the city from up > > here. (Although I had planned I coming to the party... I just couldn't > > get > > away mid week.) > > > > Anyhow I just thought I'd ask... > > > > Sorry you missed the party. It was pretty boring anyway. > > The first place to check is BSDUserGroups.org, hosted by BC Hosting and > maintained by Daemon News (specifically me). > > There's nothing. > > First step, IMO, is to start up a mailing list, which we could do ond > our box, and advertise. You would be surprised. > > Give us the okay, and we'll setup a Albany BUG list for you. > > g > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From jfranks214 Thu Dec 16 20:16:09 2004 From: jfranks214 (Jonathan Franks) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 20:16:09 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c30412161643478788b4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hey thanks for the advice. It appears that Albany does indeed have craigslist... and it's new. Imagine the luck. See now, I asked a simple question and now look what I've gotten myself into! :-) Frankly, I never expected to become an "organizer" but what the heck? I'm already thinking of where on earth we could meet. It also seems like "Capital District *BSD Users Group" (CDBUG ? ) might be more inclusive, as we have three cities (Albany, Schenectady, Troy) right in the vicinity, and rural areas abound... I think that this needs to happen, though, so why not. G - I'll take you up on the mailing list. -----Original Message----- From: Marc Spitzer [mailto:mspitzer at gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2004 7:44 PM To: Jonathan Franks Cc: NYC-BUG talk Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 19:19:08 -0500, Jonathan Franks wrote: > Absolutely. What do I need to do? > > I had thought about trying to start one up, but decided "Oh, I just don't > know where to begin..." >From my experience helping to get lispnyc started, do the following: on bsd/unix/linux newsgroups/mailing lists send out a message that there will be a meeting of the albany BSD users group on (date here) and (time here) at (place here) put some more stuff here about what is going to happen, we are drinking or PF/CARP talk and then we are drinking. ... be prepaired to do this annouincement/setup meeting stuff for at least 3 months. By then you might have some help. and get the word out locally, does albany have craigslist? you just might be supprised at the turn out. And as stated below a mailing list is most important. marc > > > -----Original Message----- > From: G. Rosamond [mailto:george at sddi.net] > Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2004 7:03 PM > To: Jonathan Franks > Cc: NYC-BUG talk > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here > > On Dec 16, 2004, at 6:59 PM, Jonathan Franks wrote: > > > Hey folks- > > > > I was just wondering if anyone knows of a BSD users group in the > > Albany (NY) > > area.... It's just a little tough to make meetings in the city from up > > here. (Although I had planned I coming to the party... I just couldn't > > get > > away mid week.) > > > > Anyhow I just thought I'd ask... > > > > Sorry you missed the party. It was pretty boring anyway. > > The first place to check is BSDUserGroups.org, hosted by BC Hosting and > maintained by Daemon News (specifically me). > > There's nothing. > > First step, IMO, is to start up a mailing list, which we could do ond > our box, and advertise. You would be surprised. > > Give us the okay, and we'll setup a Albany BUG list for you. > > g > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From george Thu Dec 16 21:42:58 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 21:42:58 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5C8BCABA-4FD5-11D9-8A97-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 16, 2004, at 7:19 PM, Jonathan Franks wrote: > Absolutely. What do I need to do? > > I had thought about trying to start one up, but decided "Oh, I just > don't > know where to begin..." > I'll setup the list later on. . . and maybe one for LABUG. . . right Pete? g From marco Thu Dec 16 22:25:33 2004 From: marco (marco at metm.org) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 22:25:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] (no subject) Message-ID: <20041217032532.GD5913@metm.org> Bcc: Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here Reply-To: In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c30412161643478788b4 at mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Dec 16, 2004 at 07:43:56PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: >be prepaired to do this annouincement/setup meeting stuff for at least ^ ^ You can spot a vi user a mile away... -- Marco From pete Thu Dec 16 22:27:19 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 22:27:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here In-Reply-To: <5C8BCABA-4FD5-11D9-8A97-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <5C8BCABA-4FD5-11D9-8A97-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041217032719.GB6280@nomadlogic.org> On Thu, Dec 16, 2004 at 09:42:58PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > On Dec 16, 2004, at 7:19 PM, Jonathan Franks wrote: > > >Absolutely. What do I need to do? > > > >I had thought about trying to start one up, but decided "Oh, I just > >don't > >know where to begin..." > > > > I'll setup the list later on. . . and maybe one for LABUG. . . right > Pete? heh yea, i've actually been slacking on that. maybe i'll take this on after the holiday's. -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From rick Thu Dec 16 23:08:22 2004 From: rick (Rick Aliwalas) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 23:08:22 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] isp check In-Reply-To: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> References: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> Message-ID: On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, George Georgalis wrote: > Also is there a learn everything you need to know (and nothing more) > website to get BGP working? Henning Brauer's talk on BGP at OpenCon 2004 is up now : http://bulabula.org/papers/opencon04/bgpd/ Have you ever used MagicPoint? It's awesome. vi-able Powerpoint. -rick From george Thu Dec 16 23:09:37 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 23:09:37 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <77B2E100-4FE1-11D9-8A97-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 16, 2004, at 8:16 PM, Jonathan Franks wrote: > Hey thanks for the advice. It appears that Albany does indeed have > craigslist... and it's new. Imagine the luck. > > See now, I asked a simple question and now look what I've gotten myself > into! :-) This is something I wrote up a while back on DN about starting NYC*BUG. . . http://ezine.daemonnews.org/200403/nycbug.html > > Frankly, I never expected to become an "organizer" but what the heck? > I'm > already thinking of where on earth we could meet. It also seems like > "Capital District *BSD Users Group" (CDBUG ? ) might be more > inclusive, as > we have three cities (Albany, Schenectady, Troy) right in the > vicinity, and > rural areas abound... > > > I think that this needs to happen, though, so why not. > > G - I'll take you up on the mailing list. > I'll send you the info offlist later. . g From george Thu Dec 16 23:30:39 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2004 23:30:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] CD*BUG-talk. . . Message-ID: <67D97D28-4FE4-11D9-8A97-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Just created a mailing list for the upstate New York Capitol District region, CDBUG-talk http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo Jonathan Franks is administering the list. Anyone is obviously invited to join, but it should obviously be aimed at those in the Albany/Schenectady/Troy area. I'd recommend that JF posts some spiel about launching the list on Daemon News (bsdnews.com), Undeadly.org, etc. Good luck Jonathan. George From mspitzer Fri Dec 17 00:05:38 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 00:05:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <20041217032532.GD5913@metm.org> References: <20041217032532.GD5913@metm.org> Message-ID: <8c50a3c304121621051497eaf2@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 22:25:33 -0500, marco at metm.org wrote: > Bcc: > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] It's lonely up here > Reply-To: > In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c30412161643478788b4 at mail.gmail.com> > > On Thu, Dec 16, 2004 at 07:43:56PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > >be prepaired to do this annouincement/setup meeting stuff for at least > ^ ^ > You can spot a vi user a mile away... Well I wrote it in gmail's editor, and generally I prefer xemacs. marc who still thinks viper mode is way cool > > -- > Marco > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From george Fri Dec 17 00:10:04 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 00:10:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYTCHP Message-ID: Just posted to Daemon News: This past Wednesday, the New York City *BSD User Group and New York PHP hosted a holiday party with hundreds of attendees. The event, entitled the New York Technical Community Holiday Party was held in an exclusive space in Manhattan's Soho, where the attendees networked, spoke with the sponsors and of course drank enormous quantities of beer and wine. The event was free, and was sponsored by Tech Web/CMP Publishing, New York Internet, O'Reilly and Associates, Source Labs, Wiley, Usenix, Zend, Pilosoft, Cyber X Designs, Penguin Netwerx, LoftMail/Biz Integrators, TechVenue.com and NYC Wireless, and of course BSD Mall/Daemon News. The Soho Apple Store donated a 20 gig iPod and General Computer and Services donated a killer video card for a raffle. A collection was also taken for the OpenBSD Hackathon to be held in May 2005. Attendees represented firms from IBM, AT&T, Goldman Sachs to small consulting operations. The event officially ended until 10:30 pm, but the last of the party-goers staggered home from the after-after-party at 4 am or so. Some pictures of the event are posted on the NYC*BUG site in the Gallery section under NYTCHP. From george Fri Dec 17 02:45:08 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 02:45:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] DN posting on NYTCHP Message-ID: <92F27EC4-4FFF-11D9-B18B-000D9328615E@sddi.net> A great opportunity to comment on the event. . . NYTCHP a Smashing Success * New York Technical Community Holiday Party 16 December 2004 Submitted By : George This past Wednesday, the New York City *BSD User Group and New York PHP hosted a holiday party with hundreds of attendees. The event, entitled the New York Technical Community Holiday Party was held in an exclusive space in Manhattan's Soho, where the attendees networked, spoke with the sponsors and of course drank enormous quantities of beer and wine. The event was free, and was sponsored by Tech Web/CMP Publishing, New York Internet, O'Reilly and Associates, Source Labs, Wiley, Usenix, Zend, Pilosoft, Cyber X Designs, Penguin Netwerx, LoftMail/Biz Integrators, TechVenue.com and NYC Wireless, and of course BSD Mall/Daemon News. The Soho Apple Store donated a 20 gig iPod and General Computer and Services donated a killer video card for a raffle. A collection was also taken for the OpenBSD Hackathon to be held in May 2005. Attendees represented firms from IBM, AT&T, Goldman Sachs to small consulting operations. The event officially ended until 10:30 pm, but the last of the party-goers staggered home from the after-after-party at 4 am or so. Some pictures of the event are posted on the NYC*BUG site in the Gallery section under NYTCHP. No URL Read 0 Comments From george Fri Dec 17 09:13:39 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:13:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] isp check In-Reply-To: References: <20041209204920.GB2972@run> Message-ID: <20041217141339.GB16622@sta> On Thu, Dec 16, 2004 at 11:08:22PM -0500, Rick Aliwalas wrote: >On Thu, 9 Dec 2004, George Georgalis wrote: > >>Also is there a learn everything you need to know (and nothing more) >>website to get BGP working? > >Henning Brauer's talk on BGP at OpenCon 2004 is up now : > > http://bulabula.org/papers/opencon04/bgpd/ Looks like some excellent info. Thanks! > >Have you ever used MagicPoint? It's awesome. vi-able Powerpoint. http://member.wide.ad.jp/wg/mgp/ heh, I had links to templates, Toolbox, and an old home page for magicpoint in my bookmarks, but I've never tried it and those have all expired too. :-) it was _the_ ipv6 presentation that reminded me I had seen it before. // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From o_sleep Fri Dec 17 10:19:50 2004 From: o_sleep (Bjorn Nelson) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:19:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Call for pictures of the holiday party In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <18344756-503F-11D9-AD16-003065B84EC8@belovedarctos.com> All, I remember we were taking a poll on what local NY isp's people liked, and I recommended acedsl. I am running into a problem but it's not actually with them but others trying to access my site at home (using acedsl). I am only having problems from people on verizon dsl and earthlink dsl. It seems that pages only load partially or not at all. He is on PPPoE and I read that problems like this happen when you use the default Windows setting of 1500 MTU. We set it down to 1438, which was a point it stopped fragmenting at but it didn't seem to help. Anyone else have this same problem or can guess what this would be happening? Anyone a verizon user that would like to help me verify this? I have a world of warcraft guild webpage that I have been using as a benchmark, I am curious too see if anyone else can't load the page completely either. My friend loads the page but is unable to load the image: http://www.proteanorder.org Specs: 384kup 13ms average seek harddrive (laptop) Thanks, Bjorn From alex Fri Dec 17 10:15:33 2004 From: alex (alex at pilosoft.com) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:15:33 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Call for pictures of the holiday party In-Reply-To: <18344756-503F-11D9-AD16-003065B84EC8@belovedarctos.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 17 Dec 2004, Bjorn Nelson wrote: > I remember we were taking a poll on what local NY isp's people liked, > and I recommended acedsl. I am running into a problem but it's not > actually with them but others trying to access my site at home (using > acedsl). I am only having problems from people on verizon dsl and > earthlink dsl. It seems that pages only load partially or not at all. > He is on PPPoE and I read that problems like this happen when you use > the default Windows setting of 1500 MTU. We set it down to 1438, which > was a point it stopped fragmenting at but it didn't seem to help. > Anyone else have this same problem or can guess what this would be > happening? Anyone a verizon user that would like to help me verify > this? Yes, please turn off iptables on your end, you have something that filters ICMP and is breaking his PMTU discovery (google for "PMTU discovery"). > I have a world of warcraft guild webpage that I have been using as a > benchmark, I am curious too see if anyone else can't load the page > completely either. My friend loads the page but is unable to load the > image: http://www.proteanorder.org -alex From okan Fri Dec 17 10:25:13 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:25:13 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] soekris orders In-Reply-To: <20041209163400.GA86175@yinaska.pair.com> References: <20041209163400.GA86175@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: <20041217152512.GB50143@yinaska.pair.com> last call on soekris 4801+case+power (and a few vpn1411) orders for today...i'm placing an order this afternoon. cheers, okan On Thu 2004.12.09 at 11:34 -0500, Okan Demirmen wrote: > hi - > > anyone want in on soekris orders? i need 2 4801/case/power combos. > if we get a total of at least 5, we can get a better discount ($244 > for the combo). i need to place the order within the next 7 days > to make sure i get my boxes before end of year. if that's too soon > for anybody else, oh well, i'm sure i'll need more again someother > time. > > thanks, > okan > > -- > Okan Demirmen > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From okan Fri Dec 17 10:41:44 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:41:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> On Mon 2004.12.06 at 09:46 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > This Register.com article leads me to some interesting conclusions: > > http://www.theregister.com/2004/12/06/linux_economic_realities/ > > There have been a number of Linux-related certs, most importantly the > RedHat one. > > But we're fortunate that a single BSD cert is more easily created, as > we don't have huge multinationals backing one project versus another. > If a BSD cert was created, it could be done in the interests of the > technology in general, without spawning competition from other > entities. One of the benefits of not having competing corporate > entities or distros in the mix. > > We would obviously want to be as inclusive as possible, particularly in > the beginning, for all the projects. . . from Free, Net, Open and > DragonFly. > > I am thinking about starting up a mailman list for the topic. Dru, > Ike, myself and many others have been involved in discussions on this > matter haphazardly. . . it may be time to jump start the project in > January. > > We should probably implement an accompanying Wiki for it, as it is a > cumulative-type project. Next stage is to pull in others outside of > NYC*BUG, particularly critical individuals at each project and at > Yahoo, Pair, etc. > > Thoughts? We should probably have a volunteer to oversee the tech end > of things for the wiki, list, documentation. George, et all, I think this is a good idea. I realize that it will take a long long time before any BSD cert is taken seriously by employers, however it has to start sometime/somewhere. In a world where *BSD is used in the majority of network appliances, giving those organizations some more HR tools would be smart. Speaking of which, I am now seeing those companies, who shall remain nameless for now, feel as if they have come in, defending their *BSD choice. Not that anyone should care (we don't), for they are sold as "black boxes" with management interfaces. As far as full BSD systems (Open, Net, Free, Dragon), it would be interesting what consulting firms could/would do with *BSD certs. (Yes, we live in an ugly corporate world.) Getting off point, my point is that slipping *BSD certs into the industry may be one factor in reassuring the industry that *BSD is still here, strong and ever evolving. What can we do to help? Okan > g > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From zperkov Fri Dec 17 10:49:35 2004 From: zperkov (Zoran Perkov) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:49:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] soekris orders In-Reply-To: <20041217152512.GB50143@yinaska.pair.com> References: <20041209163400.GA86175@yinaska.pair.com> <20041217152512.GB50143@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: <8a851180041217074995ef340@mail.gmail.com> hey okan, we met briefly the other night...i'll let you know before 12. -/z On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:25:13 -0500, Okan Demirmen wrote: > last call on soekris 4801+case+power (and a few vpn1411) orders for > today...i'm placing an order this afternoon. > > cheers, > okan > > On Thu 2004.12.09 at 11:34 -0500, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > hi - > > > > anyone want in on soekris orders? i need 2 4801/case/power combos. > > if we get a total of at least 5, we can get a better discount ($244 > > for the combo). i need to place the order within the next 7 days > > to make sure i get my boxes before end of year. if that's too soon > > for anybody else, oh well, i'm sure i'll need more again someother > > time. > > > > thanks, > > okan > > > > -- > > Okan Demirmen > > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > > _______________________________________________ > > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > > -- > Okan Demirmen > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From okan Fri Dec 17 10:53:03 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:53:03 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] soekris orders In-Reply-To: <8a851180041217074995ef340@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041209163400.GA86175@yinaska.pair.com> <20041217152512.GB50143@yinaska.pair.com> <8a851180041217074995ef340@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041217155303.GD50143@yinaska.pair.com> On Fri 2004.12.17 at 10:49 -0500, Zoran Perkov wrote: > hey okan, > we met briefly the other night...i'll let you know before 12. ah yes...i'll wait until early afternoon. okan > -/z > > > On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:25:13 -0500, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > last call on soekris 4801+case+power (and a few vpn1411) orders for > > today...i'm placing an order this afternoon. > > > > cheers, > > okan > > > > On Thu 2004.12.09 at 11:34 -0500, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > > hi - > > > > > > anyone want in on soekris orders? i need 2 4801/case/power combos. > > > if we get a total of at least 5, we can get a better discount ($244 > > > for the combo). i need to place the order within the next 7 days > > > to make sure i get my boxes before end of year. if that's too soon > > > for anybody else, oh well, i'm sure i'll need more again someother > > > time. > > > > > > thanks, > > > okan > > > > > > -- > > > Okan Demirmen > > > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > > > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > > > _______________________________________________ > > > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > > > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > > > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > > > > -- > > Okan Demirmen > > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > > _______________________________________________ > > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From george Fri Dec 17 10:52:56 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 10:52:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: On Dec 17, 2004, at 10:41 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > On Mon 2004.12.06 at 09:46 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: >> This Register.com article leads me to some interesting conclusions: >> >> http://www.theregister.com/2004/12/06/linux_economic_realities/ >> >> There have been a number of Linux-related certs, most importantly the >> RedHat one. >> >> But we're fortunate that a single BSD cert is more easily created, as >> we don't have huge multinationals backing one project versus another. >> If a BSD cert was created, it could be done in the interests of the >> technology in general, without spawning competition from other >> entities. One of the benefits of not having competing corporate >> entities or distros in the mix. >> >> We would obviously want to be as inclusive as possible, particularly >> in >> the beginning, for all the projects. . . from Free, Net, Open and >> DragonFly. >> >> I am thinking about starting up a mailman list for the topic. Dru, >> Ike, myself and many others have been involved in discussions on this >> matter haphazardly. . . it may be time to jump start the project in >> January. >> >> We should probably implement an accompanying Wiki for it, as it is a >> cumulative-type project. Next stage is to pull in others outside of >> NYC*BUG, particularly critical individuals at each project and at >> Yahoo, Pair, etc. >> >> Thoughts? We should probably have a volunteer to oversee the tech end >> of things for the wiki, list, documentation. > > George, et all, > > I think this is a good idea. I realize that it will take a long > long time before any BSD cert is taken seriously by employers, > however it has to start sometime/somewhere. That's exactly the point. A cert would approach the issue of the lack of commercial support for the BSDs. > > In a world where *BSD is used in the majority of network appliances, > giving those organizations some more HR tools would be smart. > Speaking of which, I am now seeing those companies, who shall remain > nameless for now, feel as if they have come in, defending their > *BSD choice. Not that anyone should care (we don't), for they are > sold as "black boxes" with management interfaces. As far as full > BSD systems (Open, Net, Free, Dragon), it would be interesting what > consulting firms could/would do with *BSD certs. (Yes, we live in > an ugly corporate world.) > Majority of network appliances? Woah. I can name a lot (Borderware fw, CheckPoint Nokia, some Snap servers), but majority? That would be significant. > Getting off point, my point is that slipping *BSD certs into the > industry may be one factor in reassuring the industry that *BSD is > still here, strong and ever evolving. > > What can we do to help? > Well, I setup two new lists on our mailman last night, one for LABUG (Los Angeles' Pete) and one for CDBUG (Albany area for Jonathan F). . . I think it's time for a BSDCert list. A number of us have spoken about it for a while, and Dru seems at the helm. Since she's also an instructor with years of experience, I think she has the best of sense of the big picture. We have one contact from NetBSD, plus a good number of others. We'll start with a list, with a wiki, as there's lots of data accumulation and organization to take care of. We need to look at backers for the cert, starting with each of the BSD projects, then moving onto entities like BSD Mall/DN, etc. Maybe some educational institutes. We need to work out a curriculum, covering both general Unix stuff then BSD specifics. There should probably be sections of each of the BSDs, plus specials sections on OpenSSH, pkgsrc, pf, ports, etc. I'll setup a list later, but I think it would be a good idea to get the wiki up somewhere first. .. with passwd protection for editing rights. g From okan Fri Dec 17 11:00:00 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:00:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] party + Message-ID: <20041217160000.GE50143@yinaska.pair.com> First off, thanks for a great party! Second, I was talking to a few people about a few things that made people look at me like I was nuts (maybe I am/was). Unfortunately, I don't remember their names, so I thought I'd drop a link to one of the topics that got me odd looks - CLI (not command line interface), but common language infrastructure. To take it further (yes I said this), you can also see what Microsoft is going with their rendition, CLR. I'll spare the details for this list, but drop at least a link in: http://www.ecma-international.org/publications/standards/Ecma-335.htm Then you can take this a step further into virtual environments and see where this may lead us one day. (Hello EMC?) Cheers, Okan -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From okan Fri Dec 17 11:04:18 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:04:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: <20041217160418.GF50143@yinaska.pair.com> On Fri 2004.12.17 at 10:52 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > On Dec 17, 2004, at 10:41 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > >On Mon 2004.12.06 at 09:46 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > >>This Register.com article leads me to some interesting conclusions: > >> > >>http://www.theregister.com/2004/12/06/linux_economic_realities/ > >> > >>There have been a number of Linux-related certs, most importantly the > >>RedHat one. > >> > >>But we're fortunate that a single BSD cert is more easily created, as > >>we don't have huge multinationals backing one project versus another. > >>If a BSD cert was created, it could be done in the interests of the > >>technology in general, without spawning competition from other > >>entities. One of the benefits of not having competing corporate > >>entities or distros in the mix. > >> > >>We would obviously want to be as inclusive as possible, particularly > >>in > >>the beginning, for all the projects. . . from Free, Net, Open and > >>DragonFly. > >> > >>I am thinking about starting up a mailman list for the topic. Dru, > >>Ike, myself and many others have been involved in discussions on this > >>matter haphazardly. . . it may be time to jump start the project in > >>January. > >> > >>We should probably implement an accompanying Wiki for it, as it is a > >>cumulative-type project. Next stage is to pull in others outside of > >>NYC*BUG, particularly critical individuals at each project and at > >>Yahoo, Pair, etc. > >> > >>Thoughts? We should probably have a volunteer to oversee the tech end > >>of things for the wiki, list, documentation. > > > >George, et all, > > > >I think this is a good idea. I realize that it will take a long > >long time before any BSD cert is taken seriously by employers, > >however it has to start sometime/somewhere. > > That's exactly the point. A cert would approach the issue of the lack > of commercial support for the BSDs. > > > > >In a world where *BSD is used in the majority of network appliances, > >giving those organizations some more HR tools would be smart. > >Speaking of which, I am now seeing those companies, who shall remain > >nameless for now, feel as if they have come in, defending their > >*BSD choice. Not that anyone should care (we don't), for they are > >sold as "black boxes" with management interfaces. As far as full > >BSD systems (Open, Net, Free, Dragon), it would be interesting what > >consulting firms could/would do with *BSD certs. (Yes, we live in > >an ugly corporate world.) > > > > Majority of network appliances? Woah. I can name a lot (Borderware > fw, CheckPoint Nokia, some Snap servers), but majority? That would be > significant. I didn't want to miss an important vendor and piss them off ;) But absolutely! > >Getting off point, my point is that slipping *BSD certs into the > >industry may be one factor in reassuring the industry that *BSD is > >still here, strong and ever evolving. > > > >What can we do to help? > > > > Well, I setup two new lists on our mailman last night, one for LABUG > (Los Angeles' Pete) and one for CDBUG (Albany area for Jonathan F). . . > I think it's time for a BSDCert list. I may ask for a new one too soon, depending on where I end up next month ;) > A number of us have spoken about it for a while, and Dru seems at the > helm. Since she's also an instructor with years of experience, I think > she has the best of sense of the big picture. > > We have one contact from NetBSD, plus a good number of others. > > We'll start with a list, with a wiki, as there's lots of data > accumulation and organization to take care of. > > We need to look at backers for the cert, starting with each of the BSD > projects, then moving onto entities like BSD Mall/DN, etc. Maybe some > educational institutes. > > We need to work out a curriculum, covering both general Unix stuff then > BSD specifics. There should probably be sections of each of the BSDs, > plus specials sections on OpenSSH, pkgsrc, pf, ports, etc. > > I'll setup a list later, but I think it would be a good idea to get the > wiki up somewhere first. .. with passwd protection for editing rights. let the wiki begin ;) thanks george. cheers, okan > g > -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From bob Fri Dec 17 11:12:09 2004 From: bob (Bob Ippolito) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:12:09 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] party + In-Reply-To: <20041217160000.GE50143@yinaska.pair.com> References: <20041217160000.GE50143@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: <674B72F2-5046-11D9-9543-000A9567635C@redivi.com> On Dec 17, 2004, at 11:00 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > Second, I was talking to a few people about a few things that made > people look at me like I was nuts (maybe I am/was). Unfortunately, > I don't remember their names, so I thought I'd drop a link to one > of the topics that got me odd looks - CLI (not command line interface), > but common language infrastructure. To take it further (yes I said > this), you can also see what Microsoft is going with their rendition, > CLR. I'll spare the details for this list, but drop at least a > link in: > > http://www.ecma-international.org/publications/standards/Ecma-335.htm > > Then you can take this a step further into virtual environments and > see where this may lead us one day. (Hello EMC?) The CLI isn't a very big step beyond where the JVM already is... It's been proven several times over that the JVM is at least nearly as capable of providing a runtime for alternative languages (Jython, Groovy, etc.). The CLI and JVM both have sandboxing features, but they're not really the same sort of thing that is provided by the kernel. -bob From okan Fri Dec 17 11:21:10 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:21:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] party + In-Reply-To: <674B72F2-5046-11D9-9543-000A9567635C@redivi.com> References: <20041217160000.GE50143@yinaska.pair.com> <674B72F2-5046-11D9-9543-000A9567635C@redivi.com> Message-ID: <20041217162110.GG50143@yinaska.pair.com> On Fri 2004.12.17 at 11:12 -0500, Bob Ippolito wrote: > > On Dec 17, 2004, at 11:00 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > >Second, I was talking to a few people about a few things that made > >people look at me like I was nuts (maybe I am/was). Unfortunately, > >I don't remember their names, so I thought I'd drop a link to one > >of the topics that got me odd looks - CLI (not command line interface), > >but common language infrastructure. To take it further (yes I said > >this), you can also see what Microsoft is going with their rendition, > >CLR. I'll spare the details for this list, but drop at least a > >link in: > > > >http://www.ecma-international.org/publications/standards/Ecma-335.htm > > > >Then you can take this a step further into virtual environments and > >see where this may lead us one day. (Hello EMC?) > > The CLI isn't a very big step beyond where the JVM already is... It's > been proven several times over that the JVM is at least nearly as > capable of providing a runtime for alternative languages (Jython, > Groovy, etc.). > > The CLI and JVM both have sandboxing features, but they're not really > the same sort of thing that is provided by the kernel. I agree with you. I was simply talking about CLI, and I kept getting command line interface back. I should have chosen my words more carefully, especially when I may have been sluring. Okan > -bob > -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From george Fri Dec 17 11:21:11 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:21:11 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <20041217160418.GF50143@yinaska.pair.com> References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> <20041217160418.GF50143@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: On Dec 17, 2004, at 11:04 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > >> Majority of network appliances? Woah. I can name a lot (Borderware >> fw, CheckPoint Nokia, some Snap servers), but majority? That would be >> significant. > > I didn't want to miss an important vendor and piss them off ;) But > absolutely! > But it's a good idea to start looking at them . . . Let's deal with the 'little' fish, then think about getting backing from them if possible. Apple is obviously the real big fish. >>> Getting off point, my point is that slipping *BSD certs into the >>> industry may be one factor in reassuring the industry that *BSD is >>> still here, strong and ever evolving. >>> >>> What can we do to help? >>> >> >> Well, I setup two new lists on our mailman last night, one for LABUG >> (Los Angeles' Pete) and one for CDBUG (Albany area for Jonathan F). . >> . >> I think it's time for a BSDCert list. > > I may ask for a new one too soon, depending on where I end up next > month ;) Uh oh. . . . the NYC*BUG diaspora begins. . . Don't we get to vote on this? > >> A number of us have spoken about it for a while, and Dru seems at the >> helm. Since she's also an instructor with years of experience, I >> think >> she has the best of sense of the big picture. >> >> We have one contact from NetBSD, plus a good number of others. >> >> We'll start with a list, with a wiki, as there's lots of data >> accumulation and organization to take care of. >> >> We need to look at backers for the cert, starting with each of the BSD >> projects, then moving onto entities like BSD Mall/DN, etc. Maybe some >> educational institutes. >> >> We need to work out a curriculum, covering both general Unix stuff >> then >> BSD specifics. There should probably be sections of each of the BSDs, >> plus specials sections on OpenSSH, pkgsrc, pf, ports, etc. >> >> I'll setup a list later, but I think it would be a good idea to get >> the >> wiki up somewhere first. .. with passwd protection for editing rights. > > let the wiki begin ;) > > thanks george. > > cheers, > okan > >> g >> > > -- > Okan Demirmen > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > From george Fri Dec 17 11:57:26 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:57:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] So it begins. . . . CD*BUG Message-ID: http://bsdnews.com/view_story.php3?story_id=4817 Good luck JF. Isn't the Albany area known at the Capitol district, not Capital? Ooops. . . Just checked www.timesunion.com and you're right. Doh. g From o_sleep Fri Dec 17 12:47:47 2004 From: o_sleep (Bjorn Nelson) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 12:47:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Fwd: weird verizon problem Message-ID: All, I remember we had a discussion about what local isp's people could recommend and I suggested acedsl. I am having a problem now, although it's not with them. It's with anyone on verizon dsl or earthlink dsl's network connecting to my webserver at home which is on acedsl. The weird thing is, it works through a proxy (using any of the ones that work at multiproxy.org). It also works fine from other places. The other weird thing is sometimes it loads a partial page and sometimes it doesn't. We tried lowering the default MTU setting on the person that was trying to connect from verizon to a setting that wouldn't fragment, but no go. The benchmark I have been using is my World of Warcraft guild page but the image isn't able to load for him: http://www.proteanorder.org I am curious to see if this problem is limited to verizon and earthlink. I am using 384k up dsl and 13ms average seek time harddrive. The image is about 200k. If anyone has any ideas I would appreciate it, Bjorn The following is the communication I have had with my ISP... Begin forwarded message: > From: support at acedsl.com > Date: December 16, 2004 3:56:34 PM EST > To: Bjorn Nelson > Subject: Re: weird verizon problem > > the trace stops in Verizon's network, your friend should address it > with them. > > > traceroute to 70.18.222.117 (70.18.222.117), 30 hops max, 40 byte > packets > 1 r2-ge2 (66.114.76.226) 0.998 ms 0.502 ms 1.644 ms > 2 206.g2-0.er1a.lga1.us.above.net (64.124.176.50) 1.143 ms 1.171 > ms 0.92 ms > 3 so-4-0-0.cr1.lga1.us.above.net (64.125.28.189) 2.306 ms 0.9 ms > 1.025 ms > 4 64.125.27.141.available.above.net (64.125.27.141) 1.309 ms 1.479 > ms > 0.937 ms > 5 so-1-0-0.mpr1.iad1.us.above.net (64.125.28.61) 5.119 ms 5.24 ms > 6.018 ms > 6 so-3-0-0.mpr2.iad2.us.above.net (64.125.28.214) 6.123 ms 5.167 > ms 5.487 > ms > 7 so-3-0-0.mpr2.iad10.us.above.net (64.125.30.121) 6.741 ms 18.961 > ms > 11.584 ms > 8 so-2-1-3-0.PEER-RTR1.ASH.verizon-gni.net (130.81.15.41) 9.115 ms > 5.617 > ms 5.492 ms > 9 so-7-0-0-0.BB-RTR1.RES.verizon-gni.net (130.81.10.89) 6.222 ms > 5.748 ms > 5.847 ms > 10 so-5-0-0-0.BB-RTR1.NY325.verizon-gni.net (130.81.8.254) 12.44 ms > 12.693 > ms 14.193 ms > 11 so-0-1-0-0.CORE-RTR1.NY325.verizon-gni.net (130.81.8.26) 12.383 > ms 16.016 > ms 13.292 ms > 12 A3-0-0-1730.DSL-RTR11.NY325.verizon-gni.net (130.81.11.166) > 12.503 ms > 13.039 ms 12.935 ms > 13 * * * > > > Quoting Bjorn Nelson : > >> Acedsl, >> >> Here is the traceroute from someone that is on verizon at ip: >> 70.18.222.117 >> >> We tried lowering the mtu to size to 1438 on his computer which was a >> size that is stopped fragmenting at but the site still doesn't load. >> Sometimes it loads a partial webpage and sometimes it to doesn't load >> at all. My webserver isn't showing much usage at this time and this >> works fine from other locations using different isp's but it seems to >> happen with verizon and earthlink. >> >> -Bjorn >> >> Begin forwarded message: >> >>> From: My friend >>> Date: December 16, 2004 3:40:43 PM EST >>> To: Bjorn Nelson >>> Subject: >>> >>> Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600] >>> (C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp. >>> >>> C:\Documents and Settings\Owner>tracert >>> www.proteanorder.org >>> >>> Tracing route to www.proteanorder.org [66.114.86.142] >>> over a maximum of 30 hops: >>> >>> 1 22 ms 20 ms 15 ms 10.32.41.1 >>> 2 31 ms 30 ms 31 ms >>> at-3-1-0-1730.CORE-RTR1.NY325.verizon-gni.net [1 >>> 30.81.11.165] >>> 3 31 ms 30 ms 31 ms >>> so-4-0-0-0.BB-RTR1.NY325.verizon-gni.net [130.81 >>> .8.25] >>> 4 31 ms 30 ms 30 ms >>> so-5-0-0-0.BB-RTR1.RES.verizon-gni.net [130.81.8 >>> .253] >>> 5 31 ms 24 ms 30 ms >>> so-6-0-0-0.PEER-RTR1.ASH.verizon-gni.net [130.81 >>> .10.90] >>> 6 31 ms 30 ms 30 ms 130.81.15.42 >>> 7 31 ms 30 ms 30 ms >>> so-4-0-0.mpr2.iad2.us.above.net [64.125.30.122] >>> >>> 8 31 ms 30 ms 31 ms >>> so-4-0-0.mpr1.iad1.us.above.net [64.125.28.213] >>> >>> 9 46 ms 46 ms 46 ms >>> so-2-0-0.cr1.lga1.us.above.net [64.125.28.62] >>> 10 46 ms 30 ms 46 ms >>> 64.125.27.142.available.above.net [64.125.27.142 >>> ] >>> 11 31 ms 30 ms 30 ms >>> pos0-0.er1a.lga1.us.above.net [64.125.28.190] >>> 12 31 ms 30 ms 30 ms >>> 64.125.180.78.acecape.com [64.125.180.78] >>> 13 * * * Request timed out. >>> 14 * * * Request timed out. >>> 15 * * * Request timed out. >>> 16 * * * Request timed out. >>> 17 * * * Request timed out. >>> 18 * * * Request timed out. >>> 19 * * * Request timed out. >>> 20 * * * Request timed out. >>> 21 * * * Request timed out. >>> 22 * ^C >>> C:\Documents and Settings\Owner> >>> From tux Fri Dec 17 12:50:44 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 12:50:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Call for pictures of the holiday party References: <18344756-503F-11D9-AD16-003065B84EC8@belovedarctos.com> Message-ID: <00ba01c4e460$ef0b8740$6400a8c0@olympus> : I have a world of warcraft guild webpage that I have been using as a : benchmark, I am curious too see if anyone else can't load the page : completely either. My friend loads the page but is unable to load the : image: : http://www.proteanorder.org Loads fine on my end ... From scottro Fri Dec 17 13:01:02 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 13:01:02 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Call for pictures of the holiday party In-Reply-To: <00ba01c4e460$ef0b8740$6400a8c0@olympus> References: <18344756-503F-11D9-AD16-003065B84EC8@belovedarctos.com> <00ba01c4e460$ef0b8740$6400a8c0@olympus> Message-ID: <20041217180102.GC36705@nyserve1.starlofashions.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Fri, Dec 17, 2004 at 12:50:44PM -0500, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : I have a world of warcraft guild webpage that I have been using as a > : benchmark, I am curious too see if anyone else can't load the page > : completely either. My friend loads the page but is unable to load the > : image: > : http://www.proteanorder.org > > Loads fine on my end ... Loads fine here too (from work, our upstream provider is AT&T). - -- Scott GPG KeyID EB3467D6 ( 1B848 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 D575 EB34 67D6) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Faith: Isn't it crazy how slayin' just always makes you hungry and horny? Buffy: Well... sometimes I crave a nonfat yogurt afterwards. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFBwx7e+lTVdes0Z9YRAla/AKCDphpg55kTIbiuXVGs/34LJMcZDgCfdfo4 SYBRrYkSWP6tb69VVXtc7pk= =jpfn -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From bschonhorst Fri Dec 17 14:18:03 2004 From: bschonhorst (Brad Schonhorst) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 14:18:03 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] OT: PHP Vulnerability Message-ID: <5F550083-5060-11D9-9C0F-000A277AE326@vcsnyc.org> From http://www.hardened-php.net During the development of Hardened-PHP several serious vulnerabilties were discovered and fixed. The following advisory has been released. The advisory: http://www.hardened-php.net/advisories/012004.txt Apparently PHP 4 and 5 is effected which includes the versions running on Mac OS X Server (PHP v 4.3.2) From mspitzer Fri Dec 17 14:18:46 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 14:18:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] party + In-Reply-To: <20041217162110.GG50143@yinaska.pair.com> References: <20041217160000.GE50143@yinaska.pair.com> <674B72F2-5046-11D9-9543-000A9567635C@redivi.com> <20041217162110.GG50143@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: <8c50a3c304121711187baf9e91@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 11:21:10 -0500, Okan Demirmen wrote: > On Fri 2004.12.17 at 11:12 -0500, Bob Ippolito wrote: > > > > On Dec 17, 2004, at 11:00 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > > > >Second, I was talking to a few people about a few things that made > > >people look at me like I was nuts (maybe I am/was). Unfortunately, > > >I don't remember their names, so I thought I'd drop a link to one > > >of the topics that got me odd looks - CLI (not command line interface), > > >but common language infrastructure. To take it further (yes I said > > >this), you can also see what Microsoft is going with their rendition, > > >CLR. I'll spare the details for this list, but drop at least a > > >link in: > > > > > >http://www.ecma-international.org/publications/standards/Ecma-335.htm > > > > > >Then you can take this a step further into virtual environments and > > >see where this may lead us one day. (Hello EMC?) > > > > The CLI isn't a very big step beyond where the JVM already is... It's > > been proven several times over that the JVM is at least nearly as > > capable of providing a runtime for alternative languages (Jython, > > Groovy, etc.). > > > > The CLI and JVM both have sandboxing features, but they're not really > > the same sort of thing that is provided by the kernel. > > I agree with you. I was simply talking about CLI, and I kept getting > command line interface back. I should have chosen my words more > carefully, especially when I may have been sluring. > > Okan as keeper of things wierd and nifty: ucd pascal pcode and the poplog project both have done this for a long time befor java was designated as the toaster programming language, remember befor the web. marc ps ucd-pcode is a lot older than poplog From george Fri Dec 17 14:50:25 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 14:50:25 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Fwd: weird verizon problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041217195025.GC22883@sta> On Fri, Dec 17, 2004 at 12:47:47PM -0500, Bjorn Nelson wrote: >All, > >I remember we had a discussion about what local isp's people could >recommend and I suggested acedsl. I am having a problem now, although >it's not with them. It's with anyone on verizon dsl or earthlink dsl's >network connecting to my webserver at home which is on acedsl. The >weird thing is, it works through a proxy (using any of the ones that >work at multiproxy.org). It also works fine from other places. The >other weird thing is sometimes it loads a partial page and sometimes it >doesn't. We tried lowering the default MTU setting on the person that >was trying to connect from verizon to a setting that wouldn't fragment, >but no go. > >The benchmark I have been using is my World of Warcraft guild page but >the image isn't able to load for him: > http://www.proteanorder.org > >I am curious to see if this problem is limited to verizon and >earthlink. I am using 384k up dsl and 13ms average seek time >harddrive. The image is about 200k. no problems from pilosoft network, you can probably save a lot of bandwidth on that picture, but for testing there shouldn't be a problem that I know of. $ curl -I http://www.proteanorder.org/img/death.png HTTP/1.1 200 OK Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 19:19:12 GMT Server: Apache/2.0.50 (FreeBSD) mod_perl/1.99_14 Perl/v5.8.4 DAV/2 PHP/4.3.9 Last-Modified: Fri, 03 Dec 2004 23:16:27 GMT ETag: "5c897-314ab-53fc48c0" Accept-Ranges: bytes Content-Length: 201899 MS-Author-Via: DAV Content-Type: image/png have you tried serving from a another lightweight server like boa (me not sure if it builds on BSD) don't know what you can do about M$ clients, but use mtr vs traceroute whenever possible it's ported to bsd. http://www.bitwizard.nl/mtr/ some hops will just drop direct icmp packets, but route them and everything else fine, traceroute cannot get over that. mtr will show you the rest of the route. (disregard these Sent numbers that's a local config) Packets Pings Host Loss% Snt Last Avg Best Wrst StDev 1. ??? 2. 216.66.12.241 0.0% 15 9.8 10.8 8.7 23.3 3.6 3. 66.250.55.54 0.0% 14 9.8 10.4 9.8 13.4 0.9 4. 66.230.128.230 0.0% 13 10.0 11.7 9.0 32.9 6.4 5. so-5-2-0.cr1.lga1.us.above.net 0.0% 12 11.3 14.4 10.2 30.3 7.4 6. pos0-0.er1a.lga1.us.above.net 9.1% 11 10.3 10.3 9.5 11.0 0.5 7. 64.125.180.78.acecape.com 0.0% 9 10.9 10.8 9.6 11.4 0.6 8. r1-ge1.acecape.com 0.0% 7 16.8 12.2 10.8 16.8 2.1 9. mail.belovedarctos.com There is something funny going on at hop 8 and 9 from dsl.net... Packets Pings Host Loss% Snt Last Avg Best Wrst StDev 1. gw.cyberhenge.net 0.0% 59 1.2 1.2 1.1 1.9 0.1 2. dslam.cyberhenge.net 0.0% 59 4.1 14.5 4.0 232.0 39.1 3. ar02-chi02-h4-0.dsl.net 0.0% 59 69.6 69.8 69.3 71.8 0.4 4. 172.16.4.42 0.0% 59 70.2 70.3 69.4 72.0 0.4 5. cr01-nyc02-g0-2-0-100.dsl.net 0.0% 59 69.9 70.1 69.5 71.6 0.5 6. ge-5-1-121.ipcolo1.NewYork1.Level3.net 0.0% 58 70.0 70.0 69.4 71.9 0.5 7. ae-1-54.bbr2.NewYork1.Level3.net 0.0% 58 69.8 70.8 69.7 98.5 3.9 8. ge-0-3-0.bbr2.Washington1.Level3.net 1.7% 58 75.0 76.6 74.6 147.9 9.8 as-1-0.bbr2.Washington1.Level3.net 9. so-6-0-0.edge2.Washington1.Level3.net 0.0% 58 113.0 77.3 75.0 132.7 8.9 so-7-0-0.edge2.Washington1.Level3.net 10. abovenet-level3-oc48.Washington1.Level3.net 0.0% 58 75.4 76.8 75.1 101.7 4.3 11. so-4-0-0.mpr2.iad2.us.above.net 0.0% 58 81.2 77.5 76.6 81.3 1.2 12. so-4-0-0.mpr1.iad1.us.above.net 0.0% 58 77.5 79.0 76.6 125.1 7.1 13. so-2-0-0.cr1.lga1.us.above.net 0.0% 58 80.8 82.3 80.8 94.3 2.9 14. 64.125.27.142.available.above.net 0.0% 58 81.6 82.9 80.8 131.3 6.9 15. pos0-0.er1a.lga1.us.above.net 0.0% 58 80.3 80.5 79.6 82.8 0.7 16. 64.125.180.78.acecape.com 0.0% 58 80.4 80.8 80.1 91.4 1.5 17. r1-ge1.acecape.com 0.0% 58 81.4 85.2 80.4 212.3 17.5 18. mail.belovedarctos.com 0.0% 58 107.1 107.1 105.5 111.0 1.1 ...who knows. // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From mjdewitt Fri Dec 17 15:54:23 2004 From: mjdewitt (DeWitt, Michael) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 15:54:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] 35% off from Addison-Wesley/Prentice Hall to group members Message-ID: If you are looking for some reading material over the holidays, here you go: For discount off Prentice Hall PTR books: http://www.phptr.com/promotion/1945 For discount off Addison-Wesley books: http://www.awprofessional.com/promotion/1942 Mike From george Fri Dec 17 17:56:35 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 17:56:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYC*BUG theme song. . . Message-ID: As recommended by Ike, this is being proposed as the official theme song of NYC*BUG. Screaming Jay Hawkins, "Little Daemon". . . http://www.rockabilly.nl/lyrics2/l0091.htm g From tux Fri Dec 17 20:23:58 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 20:23:58 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Snort 2.x on FreeBSD Message-ID: <009701c4e4a0$3fa7fa50$6400a8c0@olympus> Is there anyone on the list who is pretty good with Snort 2.x on FreeBSD? I'm looking to get Snort, Acid, MySQL, and Perl all playing nicely on a test box, and I don't know jack about Snort other than how to get it installed. If anyone can point me in the right direction for the configuration stuff, I'd highly appreciate it. -Kev From zperkov Fri Dec 17 20:53:03 2004 From: zperkov (Zoran Perkov) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 20:53:03 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Snort 2.x on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <009701c4e4a0$3fa7fa50$6400a8c0@olympus> References: <009701c4e4a0$3fa7fa50$6400a8c0@olympus> Message-ID: <8a85118004121717534398620f@mail.gmail.com> i have installed snort on a few FreeBSD 5.2.1 boxes but i didnt use acid...used mysql with sguil instead.. what kind of config help do you need. -/z On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 20:23:58 -0500, Kevin Reiter wrote: > Is there anyone on the list who is pretty good with Snort 2.x on FreeBSD? I'm > looking to get Snort, Acid, MySQL, and Perl all playing nicely on a test box, and > I don't know jack about Snort other than how to get it installed. If anyone can > point me in the right direction for the configuration stuff, I'd highly appreciate > it. > > -Kev > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From mspitzer Fri Dec 17 21:12:51 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 21:12:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Snort 2.x on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <009701c4e4a0$3fa7fa50$6400a8c0@olympus> References: <009701c4e4a0$3fa7fa50$6400a8c0@olympus> Message-ID: <8c50a3c3041217181237d07114@mail.gmail.com> On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 20:23:58 -0500, Kevin Reiter wrote: > Is there anyone on the list who is pretty good with Snort 2.x on FreeBSD? I'm > looking to get Snort, Acid, MySQL, and Perl all playing nicely on a test box, and > I don't know jack about Snort other than how to get it installed. If anyone can > point me in the right direction for the configuration stuff, I'd highly appreciate > it. for sguil this is a good start: http://sguil.sourceforge.net/index.php?page=documentation for acid freebsd has a port security/acid, it should be a good place to start marc > > -Kev > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From o_sleep Fri Dec 17 22:18:01 2004 From: o_sleep (O_Sleep) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 22:18:01 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Fwd: weird verizon problem In-Reply-To: <20041217195025.GC22883@sta> References: <20041217195025.GC22883@sta> Message-ID: <6C5D61B9-50A3-11D9-86EE-003065A248EA@belovedarctos.com> On Dec 17, 2004, at 2:50 PM, George Georgalis wrote: > no problems from pilosoft network, you can probably save a lot of > bandwidth on that picture, but for testing there shouldn't be a problem > that I know of. > > $ curl -I http://www.proteanorder.org/img/death.png > HTTP/1.1 200 OK > Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2004 19:19:12 GMT > Server: Apache/2.0.50 (FreeBSD) mod_perl/1.99_14 Perl/v5.8.4 DAV/2 > PHP/4.3.9 > Last-Modified: Fri, 03 Dec 2004 23:16:27 GMT > ETag: "5c897-314ab-53fc48c0" > Accept-Ranges: bytes > Content-Length: 201899 > MS-Author-Via: DAV > Content-Type: image/png > > have you tried serving from a another lightweight server like boa > (me not sure if it builds on BSD) > > don't know what you can do about M$ clients, but use mtr vs traceroute > whenever possible it's ported to bsd. http://www.bitwizard.nl/mtr/ > > some hops will just drop direct icmp packets, but route them and > everything else fine, traceroute cannot get over that. mtr will show > you > the rest of the route. > > (disregard these Sent numbers that's a local config) > Packets > Pings > Host Loss% Snt Last > Avg Best Wrst StDev > 1. ??? > 2. 216.66.12.241 0.0% 15 9.8 > 10.8 8.7 23.3 3.6 > 3. 66.250.55.54 0.0% 14 9.8 > 10.4 9.8 13.4 0.9 > 4. 66.230.128.230 0.0% 13 10.0 > 11.7 9.0 32.9 6.4 > 5. so-5-2-0.cr1.lga1.us.above.net 0.0% 12 11.3 > 14.4 10.2 30.3 7.4 > 6. pos0-0.er1a.lga1.us.above.net 9.1% 11 10.3 > 10.3 9.5 11.0 0.5 > 7. 64.125.180.78.acecape.com 0.0% 9 10.9 > 10.8 9.6 11.4 0.6 > 8. r1-ge1.acecape.com 0.0% 7 16.8 > 12.2 10.8 16.8 2.1 > 9. mail.belovedarctos.com > > > There is something funny going on at hop 8 and 9 from dsl.net... > Packets > Pings > Host Loss% Snt Last > Avg Best Wrst StDev > 1. gw.cyberhenge.net 0.0% 59 1.2 > 1.2 1.1 1.9 0.1 > 2. dslam.cyberhenge.net 0.0% 59 4.1 > 14.5 4.0 232.0 39.1 > 3. ar02-chi02-h4-0.dsl.net 0.0% 59 69.6 > 69.8 69.3 71.8 0.4 > 4. 172.16.4.42 0.0% 59 70.2 > 70.3 69.4 72.0 0.4 > 5. cr01-nyc02-g0-2-0-100.dsl.net 0.0% 59 69.9 > 70.1 69.5 71.6 0.5 > 6. ge-5-1-121.ipcolo1.NewYork1.Level3.net 0.0% 58 70.0 > 70.0 69.4 71.9 0.5 > 7. ae-1-54.bbr2.NewYork1.Level3.net 0.0% 58 69.8 > 70.8 69.7 98.5 3.9 > 8. ge-0-3-0.bbr2.Washington1.Level3.net 1.7% 58 75.0 > 76.6 74.6 147.9 9.8 > as-1-0.bbr2.Washington1.Level3.net > 9. so-6-0-0.edge2.Washington1.Level3.net 0.0% 58 113.0 > 77.3 75.0 132.7 8.9 > so-7-0-0.edge2.Washington1.Level3.net > 10. abovenet-level3-oc48.Washington1.Level3.net 0.0% 58 75.4 > 76.8 75.1 101.7 4.3 > 11. so-4-0-0.mpr2.iad2.us.above.net 0.0% 58 81.2 > 77.5 76.6 81.3 1.2 > 12. so-4-0-0.mpr1.iad1.us.above.net 0.0% 58 77.5 > 79.0 76.6 125.1 7.1 > 13. so-2-0-0.cr1.lga1.us.above.net 0.0% 58 80.8 > 82.3 80.8 94.3 2.9 > 14. 64.125.27.142.available.above.net 0.0% 58 81.6 > 82.9 80.8 131.3 6.9 > 15. pos0-0.er1a.lga1.us.above.net 0.0% 58 80.3 > 80.5 79.6 82.8 0.7 > 16. 64.125.180.78.acecape.com 0.0% 58 80.4 > 80.8 80.1 91.4 1.5 > 17. r1-ge1.acecape.com 0.0% 58 81.4 > 85.2 80.4 212.3 17.5 > 18. mail.belovedarctos.com 0.0% 58 107.1 > 107.1 105.5 111.0 1.1 > > ...who knows. > > // George Thanks for the info on mtr and for the debugging of my connection. I appreciate it. I am not sure how much I am going to get out of having my verizon dsl friend talk to their isp. They are notorious for not being much help. It's weird there is packet loss at: > pos0-0.er1a.lga1.us.above.net as well as: > 8. ge-0-3-0.bbr2.Washington1.Level3.net This will help me send them a convincing case. -Bjorn From megan.restuccia Sat Dec 18 00:26:58 2004 From: megan.restuccia (Megan Restuccia) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 0:26:58 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools Message-ID: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> Does anyone have a link to a good program for Mac OSX that will allow me to test max data throughput disk I/O read, writes, network and RAID caching performance (on varied size files - I have the inputs). I've been using pathrate, pathload, (dbench/tiobench - don't remember if these compiled on Mac) and various built-in tools and wanted to know what others used and good/bad points. Thanks! Megan From pete Sat Dec 18 00:50:33 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 00:50:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools In-Reply-To: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> Message-ID: <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> On Sat, Dec 18, 2004 at 12:26:58AM -0500, Megan Restuccia wrote: > Does anyone have a link to a good program for Mac OSX that will allow me to test max data throughput disk I/O read, writes, network and RAID caching performance (on varied size files - I have the inputs). I've been using pathrate, pathload, (dbench/tiobench - don't remember if these compiled on Mac) and various built-in tools and wanted to know what others used and good/bad points. > I don't know of any single app or utility that I would suggest to test/monitor Disk I/O. The one utility that I do use frequently to monitor disk I/O and other activity is iostat (8). I believe this is available on Darwin, on Gnu/Linux i believe it's called sysstat. As far as RAID caching perf. I have found that this varies from hardware vendor to hardware vendor. If you are using the Apple XRaid's I believe there are options in it's management package to check this out. I have used similar, vendor specific, software to monitor IBM JBOD's and RAID's as well as SGI RAID's. HTH -pete -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From o_sleep Sat Dec 18 01:09:19 2004 From: o_sleep (O_Sleep) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 01:09:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools In-Reply-To: <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <5ADEF06C-50BB-11D9-86EE-003065A248EA@belovedarctos.com> iozone is a throughput benchmark tool that does a pretty thorough job. http://www.iozone.org/ -Bjorn On Dec 18, 2004, at 12:50 AM, Pete Wright wrote: > On Sat, Dec 18, 2004 at 12:26:58AM -0500, Megan Restuccia wrote: >> Does anyone have a link to a good program for Mac OSX that will allow >> me to test max data throughput disk I/O read, writes, network and >> RAID caching performance (on varied size files - I have the inputs). >> I've been using pathrate, pathload, (dbench/tiobench - don't remember >> if these compiled on Mac) and various built-in tools and wanted to >> know what others used and good/bad points. >> > I don't know of any single app or utility that I would suggest to > test/monitor Disk I/O. The one utility that I do use frequently to > monitor disk I/O and other activity is iostat (8). I believe this is > available on Darwin, on Gnu/Linux i believe it's called sysstat. As > far > as RAID caching perf. I have found that this varies from hardware > vendor > to hardware vendor. If you are using the Apple XRaid's I believe there > are options in it's management package to check this out. I have used > similar, vendor specific, software to monitor IBM JBOD's and RAID's as > well as SGI RAID's. > > HTH > -pete > > > > -- > ~~oO00Oo~~ > Peter Wright > pete at nomadlogic.org > www.nomadlogic.org/~pete > 917.415.9866 > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month From dlavigne6 Sat Dec 18 09:04:19 2004 From: dlavigne6 (Dru) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 09:04:19 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: <20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> On Fri, 17 Dec 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > Majority of network appliances? Woah. I can name a lot (Borderware fw, > CheckPoint Nokia, some Snap servers), but majority? That would be > significant. Just as a point of interest, Checkpoint Nokia is transitioning their appliances from an ancient version of FreeBSD to RedHat. Guess what two of the reasons cited for the switch were? RedHat provides both support and an educational certification. > I'll setup a list later, but I think it would be a good idea to get the wiki > up somewhere first. .. with passwd protection for editing rights. Does anyone have any experience with twiki (twiki.org)? From the description it sounds pretty good... Dru From george Sat Dec 18 11:45:38 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 11:45:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools In-Reply-To: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> Message-ID: <3F5FC7CC-5114-11D9-BACF-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 18, 2004, at 12:26 AM, Megan Restuccia wrote: > Does anyone have a link to a good program for Mac OSX that will allow > me to test max data throughput disk I/O read, writes, network and RAID > caching performance (on varied size files - I have the inputs). I've > been using pathrate, pathload, (dbench/tiobench - don't remember if > these compiled on Mac) and various built-in tools and wanted to know > what others used and good/bad points. > Megan: Definitely post to the LESMUUG list. . . apparently this is BER's arena of expertise. http://lesmuug.org/mailman/listinfo/macosx-unix/ George From george Sat Dec 18 11:53:18 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 11:53:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> <20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: <5153D839-5115-11D9-BACF-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 18, 2004, at 9:04 AM, Dru wrote: > > > On Fri, 17 Dec 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > > > >> Majority of network appliances? Woah. I can name a lot (Borderware >> fw, CheckPoint Nokia, some Snap servers), but majority? That would >> be significant. > > > Just as a point of interest, Checkpoint Nokia is transitioning their > appliances from an ancient version of FreeBSD to RedHat. Guess what > two of the reasons cited for the switch were? RedHat provides both > support and an educational certification. My first point was I don't think they are the majority of appliances are a BSD. Checkpoint moving to RedHat. It actually makes sense. Support and development are strong. Despite the ire they receive from sections of the open source movement. > > > > >> I'll setup a list later, but I think it would be a good idea to get >> the wiki up somewhere first. .. with passwd protection for editing >> rights. > > > Does anyone have any experience with twiki (twiki.org)? From the > description it sounds pretty good... > It's the way. . . we need a box for it at this point. . . g From tux Sat Dec 18 12:01:47 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 12:01:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Snort 2.x on FreeBSD References: <009701c4e4a0$3fa7fa50$6400a8c0@olympus> Message-ID: <011601c4e523$4259e460$6400a8c0@olympus> Thanks for the replies sofar. What I'm asking for is help configuring snort - everything is installed, but I've never configured snort, and I'm not sure what rules to load, how to make acid hook into the MySQL database, etc. If there's a URL or four anyone knows about (my Google search wasn't very productive) that would save me some time. From okan Sat Dec 18 12:24:20 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 12:24:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <5153D839-5115-11D9-BACF-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> <20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> <5153D839-5115-11D9-BACF-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041218172420.GA47841@yinaska.pair.com> On Sat 2004.12.18 at 11:53 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > On Dec 18, 2004, at 9:04 AM, Dru wrote: > > > > > > >On Fri, 17 Dec 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > > > > > > > >>Majority of network appliances? Woah. I can name a lot (Borderware > >>fw, CheckPoint Nokia, some Snap servers), but majority? That would > >>be significant. > > > > > >Just as a point of interest, Checkpoint Nokia is transitioning their > >appliances from an ancient version of FreeBSD to RedHat. Guess what > >two of the reasons cited for the switch were? RedHat provides both > >support and an educational certification. > > My first point was I don't think they are the majority of appliances > are a BSD. > > Checkpoint moving to RedHat. It actually makes sense. Support and > development are strong. Despite the ire they receive from sections of > the open source movement. I believe Checkpoint is pushing Nokia them off BSD to linux. Checkpoint has been hurt recently by Nokia's lack of parrallel direction, when it comes to supporting Checkpoint. It's odd that Nokia's direction doesn't match Checkpoint's, but who knows why. Checkpoint is so desparate that they are starting to build their own boxes (funny that we may actually see a 48-way xeon box in our lab soon from Checkpoint;) but this is way off topic now. okan > > > > > > > > > > >>I'll setup a list later, but I think it would be a good idea to get > >>the wiki up somewhere first. .. with passwd protection for editing > >>rights. > > > > > >Does anyone have any experience with twiki (twiki.org)? From the > >description it sounds pretty good... > > > > It's the way. . . we need a box for it at this point. . . > > g > -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From tux Sat Dec 18 12:34:09 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 12:34:09 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net><20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com><20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> <5153D839-5115-11D9-BACF-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <012a01c4e527$c8605c20$6400a8c0@olympus> : It's the way. . . we need a box for it at this point. . . I'll be able to help out with that very shortly - a public IP with SSH access to a dedicated box for anything yous guys want (hey, I'm in Jersey :). I can work it out with George as far as access control, users, etc. if that's something the list would benefit from or even want. From george Sat Dec 18 12:40:53 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 12:40:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <012a01c4e527$c8605c20$6400a8c0@olympus> References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net><20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com><20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> <5153D839-5115-11D9-BACF-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <012a01c4e527$c8605c20$6400a8c0@olympus> Message-ID: On Dec 18, 2004, at 12:34 PM, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : It's the way. . . we need a box for it at this point. . . > > I'll be able to help out with that very shortly - a public IP with SSH > access to a > dedicated box for anything yous guys want (hey, I'm in Jersey :). I > can work it > out with George as far as access control, users, etc. if that's > something the list > would benefit from or even want. > We are currently using a jail on the NY PHP box. . . and their MTA for mail aliases on another. But we should have a dedicated box for other functions. . . wiki, etc. Believe me, it's been on my list. . . g From tux Sat Dec 18 12:50:06 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 12:50:06 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net><20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com><20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> <5153D839-5115-11D9-BACF-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <012a01c4e527$c8605c20$6400a8c0@olympus> Message-ID: <014a01c4e52a$02a4d300$6400a8c0@olympus> : But we should have a dedicated box for other functions. . . wiki, etc. : : Believe me, it's been on my list. . . That's what I'm offering :) Contact me off-list so we can discuss it further.. From zperkov Sat Dec 18 13:16:26 2004 From: zperkov (Zoran Perkov) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:16:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Snort 2.x on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <011601c4e523$4259e460$6400a8c0@olympus> References: <009701c4e4a0$3fa7fa50$6400a8c0@olympus> <011601c4e523$4259e460$6400a8c0@olympus> Message-ID: <8a85118004121810165cf15076@mail.gmail.com> never have used acid so im not much help there. all your rule needs can be found at www.bleedingsnort.com. there are few docs there about how to set it up. As far as what rules to use...this is wholey dependent on your needs. -/z On Sat, 18 Dec 2004 12:01:47 -0500, Kevin Reiter wrote: > Thanks for the replies sofar. > > What I'm asking for is help configuring snort - everything is installed, but I've > never configured snort, and I'm not sure what rules to load, how to make acid hook > into the MySQL database, etc. If there's a URL or four anyone knows about (my > Google search wasn't very productive) that would save me some time. > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From george Sat Dec 18 13:16:51 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:16:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] A new list on BSD Certification Message-ID: We've created a new list, the third for the week, for BSD Certifications. There's been ongoing discussion on this list and off list about the topic of BSD Certification. We have a number of people beyond NYC*BUG talk who are interested, and hopefully it can become the central repository for the topic. Dru has been the lead on this, and besides her usual impressive credentials, she's also a technology instructor. We will setup a wiki at some point to accompany the list, as it truly is an endeavor that requires the accumulation of lists, contacts, curriculm, possible sponsors, etc. For those interested: http://lists.nycbug.org to subscribe. George From tux Sat Dec 18 13:28:27 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:28:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Snort 2.x on FreeBSD References: <009701c4e4a0$3fa7fa50$6400a8c0@olympus> <011601c4e523$4259e460$6400a8c0@olympus> <8a85118004121810165cf15076@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <019801c4e52f$5e38a250$6400a8c0@olympus> : never have used acid so im not much help there. : all your rule needs can be found at www.bleedingsnort.com. : there are few docs there about how to set it up. As far as what : rules to use...this is wholey dependent on your needs. That's a big help - thanks! From spork Sat Dec 18 13:29:56 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:29:56 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: <20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> <20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 18 Dec 2004, Dru wrote: >> I'll setup a list later, but I think it would be a good idea to get the >> wiki up somewhere first. .. with passwd protection for editing rights. > > Does anyone have any experience with twiki (twiki.org)? From the description > it sounds pretty good... After looking at a number of wikis, I settled on phpwiki. Somewhat speedy, and a real screamer if you run php_accellerator or the Zend engine (I'm using php accel, it's free). Charles > Dru > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From ike Sat Dec 18 13:36:23 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:36:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools In-Reply-To: <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: Wordup Pete, Megan, Crew, On Dec 18, 2004, at 12:50 AM, Pete Wright wrote: > On Sat, Dec 18, 2004 at 12:26:58AM -0500, Megan Restuccia wrote: >> Does anyone have a link to a good program for Mac OSX that will allow >> me to test max data throughput disk I/O read, writes, network and >> RAID caching performance (on varied size files - I have the inputs). >> I've been using pathrate, pathload, (dbench/tiobench - don't remember >> if these compiled on Mac) and various built-in tools and wanted to >> know what others used and good/bad points. >> > I don't know of any single app or utility that I would suggest to > test/monitor Disk I/O. The one utility that I do use frequently to > monitor disk I/O and other activity is iostat (8). iostat(8) is in Darwin/OSX, but after just popping it up here, it seems to be barfing a bit: ikebook:/Users/ike ike$ iostat iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory iostat: disabling TTY statistics disk0 cpu KB/t tps MB/s us sy id 9.76 1 0.01 13 6 81 -- Could be me- will investigate eventually... On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:09 AM, O_Sleep wrote > iozone is a throughput benchmark tool that does a pretty thorough job. > > http://www.iozone.org/ > > -Bjorn WOAH- Cool. I want to try this thing... On Dec 18, 2004, at 11:45 AM, G. Rosamond wrote: > Megan: > > Definitely post to the LESMUUG list. . . apparently this is BER's > arena of expertise. > > http://lesmuug.org/mailman/listinfo/macosx-unix/ > > George Agreed- hit the list- (it's very low traffic). Rocket- .ike From spork Sat Dec 18 13:40:43 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:40:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools In-Reply-To: References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 18 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: > ikebook:/Users/ike ike$ iostat > iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory > iostat: disabling TTY statistics > disk0 cpu > KB/t tps MB/s us sy id > 9.76 1 0.01 13 6 81 > > -- > Could be me- will investigate eventually... Not just you: [oof:~/Desktop] spork$ iostat iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory iostat: disabling TTY statistics disk0 disk1 cpu KB/t tps MB/s KB/t tps MB/s us sy id 26.10 1 0.02 4.67 0 0.00 8 3 89 [oof:~/Desktop] spork$ uname -a Darwin oof.local 7.6.0 Darwin Kernel Version 7.6.0: Sun Oct 10 12:05:27 PDT 2004; root:xnu/xnu-517.9.4.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power Macintosh powerpc I'll have to give it a try in Tiger next time I boot to it. BTW, anyone know if Mac On Linux is progressing with their OS-X port? I'd love to boot Tiger in a virtual machine inside 10.3... Charles > > > On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:09 AM, O_Sleep wrote >> iozone is a throughput benchmark tool that does a pretty thorough job. >> >> http://www.iozone.org/ >> >> -Bjorn > > WOAH- Cool. I want to try this thing... > > > On Dec 18, 2004, at 11:45 AM, G. Rosamond wrote: >> Megan: >> >> Definitely post to the LESMUUG list. . . apparently this is BER's arena of >> expertise. >> >> http://lesmuug.org/mailman/listinfo/macosx-unix/ >> >> George > > Agreed- hit the list- (it's very low traffic). > > Rocket- > .ike > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From george Sat Dec 18 13:43:19 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:43:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools In-Reply-To: References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:40 PM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > On Sat, 18 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: > >> ikebook:/Users/ike ike$ iostat >> iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory >> iostat: disabling TTY statistics >> disk0 cpu >> KB/t tps MB/s us sy id >> 9.76 1 0.01 13 6 81 >> >> -- >> Could be me- will investigate eventually... > > Not just you: > > [oof:~/Desktop] spork$ iostat > iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory > iostat: disabling TTY statistics > disk0 disk1 cpu > KB/t tps MB/s KB/t tps MB/s us sy id > 26.10 1 0.02 4.67 0 0.00 8 3 89 > [oof:~/Desktop] spork$ uname -a > Darwin oof.local 7.6.0 Darwin Kernel Version 7.6.0: Sun Oct 10 > 12:05:27 PDT 2004; root:xnu/xnu-517.9.4.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power > Macintosh powerpc > > I'll have to give it a try in Tiger next time I boot to it. > > BTW, anyone know if Mac On Linux is progressing with their OS-X port? > I'd love to boot Tiger in a virtual machine inside 10.3... > > Charles [gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ iostat iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory iostat: disabling TTY statistics disk0 cpu KB/t tps MB/s us sy id 15.17 8 0.11 16 6 78 [gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ uname -a Darwin GMans-Computer.local 7.7.0 Darwin Kernel Version 7.7.0: Sun Nov 7 16:06:51 PST 2004; root:xnu/xnu-517.9.5.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power Macintosh powerpc [gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ >> >> >> On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:09 AM, O_Sleep wrote >>> iozone is a throughput benchmark tool that does a pretty thorough >>> job. >>> http://www.iozone.org/ >>> -Bjorn >> >> WOAH- Cool. I want to try this thing... >> >> >> On Dec 18, 2004, at 11:45 AM, G. Rosamond wrote: >>> Megan: >>> Definitely post to the LESMUUG list. . . apparently this is BER's >>> arena of expertise. >>> http://lesmuug.org/mailman/listinfo/macosx-unix/ >>> George >> >> Agreed- hit the list- (it's very low traffic). >> >> Rocket- >> .ike From bob Sat Dec 18 13:47:42 2004 From: bob (Bob Ippolito) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:47:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac On Linux (was: Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools) In-Reply-To: References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <4CD37488-5125-11D9-8A32-000A9567635C@redivi.com> On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:40 PM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > BTW, anyone know if Mac On Linux is progressing with their OS-X port? > I'd love to boot Tiger in a virtual machine inside 10.3... Yeah, I wish. Those guys haven't made any progress in quite some time. I was considering helping out with the port, but the current version doesn't even work well on Linux! I tried using it to boot OS X 10.2, OS X 10.3, and (a much older seed of) OS X 10.4 several months ago, and it was crashtastic for all of them. I wanted to use it to test my products without a reboot, but MOL did more rebooting on its own than I would've done otherwise :) MOL was originally designed to run the 'ol school Mac OS, and that seems to be all it does well (at least, I hope it does *something* well, I had no reason to try it). -bob From bob Sat Dec 18 13:53:02 2004 From: bob (Bob Ippolito) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:53:02 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools In-Reply-To: References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <0B46FE5D-5126-11D9-8A32-000A9567635C@redivi.com> On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:43 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:40 PM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > >> On Sat, 18 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: >> >>> ikebook:/Users/ike ike$ iostat >>> iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory >>> iostat: disabling TTY statistics >>> disk0 cpu >>> KB/t tps MB/s us sy id >>> 9.76 1 0.01 13 6 81 >>> >>> -- >>> Could be me- will investigate eventually... >> >> Not just you: >> >> [oof:~/Desktop] spork$ iostat >> iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory >> iostat: disabling TTY statistics >> disk0 disk1 cpu >> KB/t tps MB/s KB/t tps MB/s us sy id >> 26.10 1 0.02 4.67 0 0.00 8 3 89 >> [oof:~/Desktop] spork$ uname -a >> Darwin oof.local 7.6.0 Darwin Kernel Version 7.6.0: Sun Oct 10 >> 12:05:27 PDT 2004; root:xnu/xnu-517.9.4.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power >> Macintosh powerpc >> >> I'll have to give it a try in Tiger next time I boot to it. > > [gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ iostat > iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory > iostat: disabling TTY statistics > disk0 cpu > KB/t tps MB/s us sy id > 15.17 8 0.11 16 6 78 > [gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ uname -a > Darwin GMans-Computer.local 7.7.0 Darwin Kernel Version 7.7.0: Sun Nov > 7 16:06:51 PST 2004; root:xnu/xnu-517.9.5.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power > Macintosh powerpc > [gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ The man page says that iostat gives you some metric of system statistics averaged over your uptime. It doesn't really say much about the performance of your machine, it's really more of a "how much stuff did you compile today?" kind of statistic :) If you pass it a wait argument, *and* you are putting some serious I/O load on your machine, then you might see something useful.. but it sure seems like this is the wrong tool for this job. -bob From zperkov Sat Dec 18 14:30:17 2004 From: zperkov (Zoran Perkov) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 14:30:17 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Snort 2.x on FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <019801c4e52f$5e38a250$6400a8c0@olympus> References: <009701c4e4a0$3fa7fa50$6400a8c0@olympus> <011601c4e523$4259e460$6400a8c0@olympus> <8a85118004121810165cf15076@mail.gmail.com> <019801c4e52f$5e38a250$6400a8c0@olympus> Message-ID: <8a8511800412181130775a7879@mail.gmail.com> no problem ask away.... im sure you have reasons behind using acid...but sguil is a better solution in my opinion.it does requires a bit more work but Its a really efficient real-time monitoring solution and avoids opening more holes (aka web server) on your snort box. -/z On Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:28:27 -0500, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : never have used acid so im not much help there. > : all your rule needs can be found at www.bleedingsnort.com. > : there are few docs there about how to set it up. As far as what > : rules to use...this is wholey dependent on your needs. > > That's a big help - thanks! > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From louis Sat Dec 18 17:09:50 2004 From: louis (Louis Bertrand) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 17:09:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Asus 2500H BIOS setup hot key? Message-ID: Does anyone know how to enter the setup of an ASUS notebook 2500H? I have a friend whose trying to install Linux. Yes, I'm trying to talk him out of it, but I figure one less Windows machine is a step in the right direction :) Ciao --Louis From pete Sat Dec 18 20:31:25 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 20:31:25 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the case for a BSD Certification In-Reply-To: References: <971E00F0-4795-11D9-88C7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041217154144.GC50143@yinaska.pair.com> <20041218085913.D583@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: <20041219013125.GA13540@nomadlogic.org> On Sat, Dec 18, 2004 at 01:29:56PM -0500, Charles Sprickman wrote: > On Sat, 18 Dec 2004, Dru wrote: > > >>I'll setup a list later, but I think it would be a good idea to get the > >>wiki up somewhere first. .. with passwd protection for editing rights. > > > >Does anyone have any experience with twiki (twiki.org)? From the > >description it sounds pretty good... > > After looking at a number of wikis, I settled on phpwiki. Somewhat > speedy, and a real screamer if you run php_accellerator or the Zend > engine (I'm using php accel, it's free). yea phpwiki looks nice, we use twiki at Imageworks. It seems good enough, we have a rather large knowlegebase on it and performance is great. http://twiki.org/ I have not admin'd it tho, so I can't comment on it from that end tho... -pete -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From pete Sat Dec 18 20:37:20 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 20:37:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools In-Reply-To: <0B46FE5D-5126-11D9-8A32-000A9567635C@redivi.com> References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> <0B46FE5D-5126-11D9-8A32-000A9567635C@redivi.com> Message-ID: <20041219013720.GB13540@nomadlogic.org> On Sat, Dec 18, 2004 at 01:53:02PM -0500, Bob Ippolito wrote: > > On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:43 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > > >On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:40 PM, Charles Sprickman wrote: > > > >>On Sat, 18 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: > >> > >>>ikebook:/Users/ike ike$ iostat > >>>iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory > >>>iostat: disabling TTY statistics > >>> disk0 cpu > >>> KB/t tps MB/s us sy id > >>> 9.76 1 0.01 13 6 81 > >>> > >>>-- > >>>Could be me- will investigate eventually... > >> > >>Not just you: > >> > >>[oof:~/Desktop] spork$ iostat > >>iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory > >>iostat: disabling TTY statistics > >> disk0 disk1 cpu > >> KB/t tps MB/s KB/t tps MB/s us sy id > >> 26.10 1 0.02 4.67 0 0.00 8 3 89 > >>[oof:~/Desktop] spork$ uname -a > >>Darwin oof.local 7.6.0 Darwin Kernel Version 7.6.0: Sun Oct 10 > >>12:05:27 PDT 2004; root:xnu/xnu-517.9.4.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power > >>Macintosh powerpc > >> > >>I'll have to give it a try in Tiger next time I boot to it. > > > >[gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ iostat > >iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory > >iostat: disabling TTY statistics > > disk0 cpu > > KB/t tps MB/s us sy id > > 15.17 8 0.11 16 6 78 > >[gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ uname -a > >Darwin GMans-Computer.local 7.7.0 Darwin Kernel Version 7.7.0: Sun Nov > > 7 16:06:51 PST 2004; root:xnu/xnu-517.9.5.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power > >Macintosh powerpc > >[gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ > > The man page says that iostat gives you some metric of system > statistics averaged over your uptime. It doesn't really say much about > the performance of your machine, it's really more of a "how much stuff > did you compile today?" kind of statistic :) > errrr...sorta. if you iostat over time you can gain a metric of transactions per sec. and kb. per trans. etc... From those metrics it's quite easy to deduce where potential bottlenecks may be etc. -pete > If you pass it a wait argument, *and* you are putting some serious I/O > load on your machine, then you might see something useful.. but it sure > seems like this is the wrong tool for this job. have you used iostat? While I don't think it's by any means a "one stop" utility, but I don't think one would want to use one utility/metric for this type work. -pete -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From bob Sat Dec 18 21:30:38 2004 From: bob (Bob Ippolito) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 21:30:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mac OSX Troubleshooting tools In-Reply-To: <20041219013720.GB13540@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041218052658.ZCFT4717.out011.verizon.net@outgoing.verizon.net> <20041218055033.GB10059@nomadlogic.org> <0B46FE5D-5126-11D9-8A32-000A9567635C@redivi.com> <20041219013720.GB13540@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: On Dec 18, 2004, at 8:37 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > On Sat, Dec 18, 2004 at 01:53:02PM -0500, Bob Ippolito wrote: >> >> On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:43 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: >> >>> On Dec 18, 2004, at 1:40 PM, Charles Sprickman wrote: >>> >>>> On Sat, 18 Dec 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: >>>> >>>>> ikebook:/Users/ike ike$ iostat >>>>> iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory >>>>> iostat: disabling TTY statistics >>>>> disk0 cpu >>>>> KB/t tps MB/s us sy id >>>>> 9.76 1 0.01 13 6 81 >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Could be me- will investigate eventually... >>>> >>>> Not just you: >>>> >>>> [oof:~/Desktop] spork$ iostat >>>> iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory >>>> iostat: disabling TTY statistics >>>> disk0 disk1 cpu >>>> KB/t tps MB/s KB/t tps MB/s us sy id >>>> 26.10 1 0.02 4.67 0 0.00 8 3 89 >>>> [oof:~/Desktop] spork$ uname -a >>>> Darwin oof.local 7.6.0 Darwin Kernel Version 7.6.0: Sun Oct 10 >>>> 12:05:27 PDT 2004; root:xnu/xnu-517.9.4.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power >>>> Macintosh powerpc >>>> >>>> I'll have to give it a try in Tiger next time I boot to it. >>> >>> [gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ iostat >>> iostat: sysctl(kern.tty_nin) failed: No such file or directory >>> iostat: disabling TTY statistics >>> disk0 cpu >>> KB/t tps MB/s us sy id >>> 15.17 8 0.11 16 6 78 >>> [gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ uname -a >>> Darwin GMans-Computer.local 7.7.0 Darwin Kernel Version 7.7.0: Sun >>> Nov >>> 7 16:06:51 PST 2004; root:xnu/xnu-517.9.5.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power >>> Macintosh powerpc >>> [gman at GMans-Computer gman]$ >> >> The man page says that iostat gives you some metric of system >> statistics averaged over your uptime. It doesn't really say much >> about >> the performance of your machine, it's really more of a "how much stuff >> did you compile today?" kind of statistic :) >> > > errrr...sorta. if you iostat over time you can gain a metric of > transactions per sec. and kb. per trans. etc... From those metrics > it's > quite easy to deduce where potential bottlenecks may be etc. I don't really agree. From a little tinkering, I don't see how you could use iostat to find bottlenecks unless you're running at max load and looking at incremental statistics (but even then... I wouldn't really trust it). For example, looking at the I/O while I'm playing iTunes isn't going to tell me where any bottleneck is, it's just going to tell me that my disk is getting hit once or twice for about 70k every two or three seconds when playing an mp3. I have no idea if that's coming from cache (kernel, disk, raid, or otherwise), or even if it's iTunes making those transactions (probably a lot of them are actually from Mail, not iTunes). It would say more or less the same thing on a powerbook with a 4800 RPM harddrive as it would on a dual G5 with an Xserve RAID SAN full of 15krpm harddrives. Then again, maybe I'm missing something, but it doesn't seem like it's capable of really answering the original question about the max disk throughput and and the performance of the RAID cache given various data sets. iostat will tell you the average disk throughput of the applications you're running over some time interval, which is of course going to be somewhere between zero and the max throughput, but probably closer to zero :) >> If you pass it a wait argument, *and* you are putting some serious I/O >> load on your machine, then you might see something useful.. but it >> sure >> seems like this is the wrong tool for this job. > > have you used iostat? While I don't think it's by any means a "one > stop" utility, but I don't think one would want to use one > utility/metric for this type work. No, I haven't ever tried to make it do anything useful. I use other tools, especially Shark, but that's primarily useful for software developers not system architects. -bob From george Sat Dec 18 21:44:56 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 21:44:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] BUGs Message-ID: http://taosecurity.blogspot.com/ Talked to Richard earlier. . . from a spark to a prairie fire. . . g From unixenigma Sat Dec 18 21:57:52 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 18:57:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Asus 2500H BIOS setup hot key? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20041219025752.19430.qmail@web53904.mail.yahoo.com> Hey Here is some of the things you can try http://members.cox.net/joemurphy/setup.htm However, I found out that it has Award Bios there so it must enter bios with just 'del' The best way to find out is to check the boot screen and press 'esc' to get rid of logo and press 'pause' to freeze the screen to see the actual hotkey or bios version. Try some stuff, I hope you'll find something. Here are some hotkeys: ------------------------------------------------------ The Delete key is the most common. Press Delete during boot = AMI, Award BIOS Press Esc during boot = Toshiba Press F1 during boot = Toshiba; Phoenix; Late model PS/1 Value Point and 330s Press F10 when cursor jumps to top right-hand corner of screen = Compaq Press F10 when logo screen is displayed = Compaq Press F2 during boot = NEC Press Insert during boot = IBM PS/2 with reference partition Press Tab during boot = Emachine Press Reset button twice = some Dells Ctrl Alt + = Misc computers Ctrl Alt ? = Some PS/2s, such as 75 and 90 Ctrl Alt Enter = Dell Ctrl Alt Esc = AST Advantage, Award, Tandon Ctrl Alt Ins = Zenith, Phoenix Ctrl Alt S = Phoenix Ctrl Alt Shift + Num Pad Del = Olivetti PC Pro Ctrl Esc = Misc computers Ctrl Ins = some PS/2s when pointer at top right of screen For some Phoenix BIOS: To tell if your computer has a Phoenix BIOS, watch the screen carefully when you boot. One of the first lines to appear contains the word "Phoenix." 1.If you are in Windows, exit to DOS. 2 .Press Ctrl+Alt+Esc. The setup screen appears. If you have made certain changes to your system, or are having certain problems with your system, this may not work. If Pressing Ctrl+Alt+Esc doesn't open the setup program, follow these steps: 1.(Leave the computer switched on.) Use the key to lock the keyboard. 2.Press the Reset button on the front of the computer. A message appears asking you to unlock the keyboard 3.Unlock the keyboard and press F2 to run the CMOS setup. 4.Press Del. This brings up the CMOS setup program. If you have an EISA computer: 1.Press the Reset button on the front of the computer, then press Ctrl+Alt+Esc immediately when the memory count begins. If this conbination doesn't work, use Crtl+Alt+S. AST Many AST 486's require CTRL-ALT-ESC Compaq Generally Compaq Setup can be entered by hitting the 'F10' key when booting up. As soon as you see the cursor go to the upper right hand side of the screen, hit 'F10'. Compaq setup program resides on a small partition on the hard drive and if you have fdisked and reformatted or installed a new hard drive you will need to use the Compaq setup program from here: Compaq Setup Download http://www5.compaq.com/support/files/wsdsfr.html Dell Older Dells (486 models) require you to enter the sequence: CTRL-ALT-ENTER Hewlett Packard Pentium Systems: Hold down the F1 key upon startup/bootup IBM ThinkPad ThinkPad using IBM BIOS (Early Models): Press CTRL-ALT-INS when cursor is in upper-right corner of screen ThinkPad using IBM BIOS (Later Models): Press and hold F1 key while powering-up laptop ThinkPad using Phoenix BIOS: Press CTRL-ALT-F11 from DOS prompt Packard Bell Early models (386,486) require the sequence Ctrl-ALT-S at any time NEC Versa Notebooks Hold down the F1 key upon startup/bootup EC Versa Notebooks Hold down the F1 key upon startup/bootup Other Common BIOS Key Sequences CTRL-ALT-S CTRL-ALT-Enter CTRL-ALT-Insert CTRL-ALT-Esc F1 F10 Ctrl S = Phoenix Ctrl Shift Esc = Tandon 386 ------------------------------------------------------ Sincerely, GT Louis Bertrand wrote: Does anyone know how to enter the setup of an ASUS notebook 2500H? I have a friend whose trying to install Linux. Yes, I'm trying to talk him out of it, but I figure one less Windows machine is a step in the right direction :) Ciao --Louis _______________________________________________ % NYC*BUG talk mailing list http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists %We meet the first Wednesday of the month __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041218/2afff48c/attachment.html From tux Sat Dec 18 23:42:27 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 23:42:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] WarBSD Message-ID: <000901c4e585$24b7c190$6400a8c0@olympus> In case nobody has heard about it, I came across this whilst looking for something completely unrelated (go figure..) http://www.warbsd.com "WarBSD is a FreeBSD 5.0 based wireless "network auditing kit" (a.k.a war driving kit). It's inspiration was WarLinux and the desire to see if "it could be done on *BSD." " From george Sun Dec 19 13:30:16 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 13:30:16 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Firefox in NY Times today Message-ID: <07A188C0-51EC-11D9-B769-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Page 5 of the NY Times Business section today has a great, and somewhat abrasive, argument for using Firefox over IE. It's a load of laughs. . . It's entitled "The Fox Is in Microsoft's Henhouse (and Salivating)" Well worth the read. . . g From gstewart Sun Dec 19 14:06:04 2004 From: gstewart (Godwin Stewart) Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 20:06:04 +0100 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Firefox in NY Times today In-Reply-To: <07A188C0-51EC-11D9-B769-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <07A188C0-51EC-11D9-B769-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041219200604.294a8ef0.gstewart@spamcop.net> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 13:30:16 -0500, "G. Rosamond" wrote: > Well worth the read. . . I just *loved* the final comments and how the author used the M$ spokesman's own comments to hang him. Mr. Schare of Microsoft does have one suggestion for those who cannot use the latest patches in Service Pack 2: buy a new personal computer. By the same reasoning, the security problems created by a car's broken door lock could be solved by buying an entirely new automobile. The analogy comes straight from Mr. Schare. "It's like buying a car," he said. "If you want to get the latest safety features, you have to buy the latest model." In this case, the very latest model is not a 2001 Internet Explorer, but a 2004 Firefox. -- G. Stewart - gstewart at spamcop.net BOFH excuse #408: Computers under water due to SYN flooding From matt Sun Dec 19 14:28:17 2004 From: matt (Matt Juszczak) Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 14:28:17 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] mozilla ad In-Reply-To: References: <20041216174545.GA5422@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20041219142746.X15519@neptune.atopia.net> Does anyone have an extra copy of the ad? I was having surgery the day after the party and I've been stuck on the couch since. Any extra copies (or a photocopy!) would work. -Matt On Thu, 16 Dec 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > > On Dec 16, 2004, at 12:45 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > >> hey all the mozilla ad is running today, i am not sure it made it to the >> west coast edition. if possible could one of you all snag me a copy and >> i'll pay you the $.50 when i get into town. >> >> http://www.mozilla.org/images/nyt_ad_large_2004.png >> > > I got you the late edition for $.50. > > The two page ad is very nice. . . > > I'll keep it around until you're back in town. > > We should all get together when Pete's here. > > Let's pick a date. . . > > It should go without saying, I'm not into doing any party organizing right > now. > > g > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > > > !DSPAM:41c20def566199515911554! > From unixenigma Sun Dec 19 14:52:48 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 11:52:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] mozilla ad In-Reply-To: <20041219142746.X15519@neptune.atopia.net> Message-ID: <20041219195248.58285.qmail@web53907.mail.yahoo.com> I hope you are ok. I do have the original :) I kept it for myself, and thought maybe someone else has the name there and did not get the chance to buy the newspaper. U also can print out the pdf/png file provided. Anyway, get well soon and let me know. GT Matt Juszczak wrote: Does anyone have an extra copy of the ad? I was having surgery the day after the party and I've been stuck on the couch since. Any extra copies (or a photocopy!) would work. -Matt On Thu, 16 Dec 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > > On Dec 16, 2004, at 12:45 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > >> hey all the mozilla ad is running today, i am not sure it made it to the >> west coast edition. if possible could one of you all snag me a copy and >> i'll pay you the $.50 when i get into town. >> >> http://www.mozilla.org/images/nyt_ad_large_2004.png >> > > I got you the late edition for $.50. > > The two page ad is very nice. . . > > I'll keep it around until you're back in town. > > We should all get together when Pete's here. > > Let's pick a date. . . > > It should go without saying, I'm not into doing any party organizing right > now. > > g > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > > > !DSPAM:41c20def566199515911554! > _______________________________________________ % NYC*BUG talk mailing list http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists %We meet the first Wednesday of the month __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041219/89488f65/attachment.html From matt Sun Dec 19 15:37:55 2004 From: matt (Matt Juszczak) Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 15:37:55 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] [OT] bsdjobs Message-ID: <20041219153256.H16977@neptune.atopia.net> Hey all, As I mentioned at the party to some people, I'm currently working on a site (bsdjobs.net) that will be a 100% free, public, open, etc. bsdjobs site for posting and viewing. Who knows what will happen with it, but I'd still like to try it considering a lot of my fellow co workers have had people recently wanting BSD work and never know "where to go" (according to them). When I asked a guy at an ISP in Atlantic City, NJ about his interest in switching to BSD, he said he hasn't done it yet because its hard to find someone to support it. He says that if something goes down in the middle of the day, he would have no idea who to call to ask for help. So anyway, if anyone thinks its a ridiculous idea, let me know. I know other sites like it exist out there, but I figure its a good name, so why not try it. If anyone wants to help, let me know. I dont mind setting it up in some kind of CMS or giving out the user/pass for the sftp account to anyone who wants to assist. The web design is from OSWD, and I'm looking on getting an image made for the top part. Anyway, enough rambling for now. Sorry if I'm too OT. -Matt From lists Mon Dec 20 06:06:02 2004 From: lists (lists at genoverly.net) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 12:06:02 +0100 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYCBUG Message-ID: <0MKyxe-1CgLOV0WQT-0005QR@mrelay.perfora.net> OK ! The party opened the holiday season with a bang! Thanks again to the folks who went out of their way for us to have fun. But-hey, if you find yourself with a little down time this holiday season... which is what they call it after a couple of days cooped up with your family.. then we have a way to keep you sane. Well, holiday "cheer" helps, but this is just as good: Think about BSD! The holidays are a great time to write that book review you promised to do and never delivered. It is also the perfect time to reflect on WHY you use BSD at all. http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=Submission http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=WhyBSD We wish you a safe and happy holiday season. And take your laptop to your mama's house so you can record your every thought about BSD! Michael From greg Mon Dec 20 15:48:53 2004 From: greg (Greg Faber) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 15:48:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] just joined the list... Message-ID: <8F48F8D6-52C8-11D9-B179-0050E4D91728@click3x.com> Hi everyone, We're using FreeBSD at work here (courtesy no doubt of Pete Wright) and I have a question for the group. On Friday, I typed a few basic commands like: $>sudo rm -rf untitled\ folder after typing this I got no new prompt, nothing. I couldn't ctrl-c to cancel the command or anything. I couldn't type any new commands either. Not knowing what to do, I closed my terminal window and re-ssh'd into it, hoping that I could just kill whatever process might still be running. I did "ps" and sure enough the process was still there so I tried to kill it. That didn't work so I tried sudo kill -9 and that didn't work and actually added the process to the list of running processes. So now I have a bunch of processes that are still running and I don't know how to get rid of them. It's pissing me off... Here's the readout from ps: backupman at archiver ~ > ps PID TT STAT TIME COMMAND 54649 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo rm untitled folder/ 54662 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo rm -rf untitledfolder/ 54814 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo mv writers reel.ai writers_reel.ai 54838 p2- D 0:00.00 /bin/csh /backup/tools/backup_DLT /dev/nsa0 beckett.ba 54857 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo kill -9 54649 54921 p2- D 0:00.00 /bin/csh /backup/tools/backup_DLT beckett_tape1.backup 58543 p2 Ss 0:00.02 -tcsh (tcsh) 58581 p2 R+ 0:00.00 ps so if anyone has any ideas, I'm all ears. Thanks, Greg From jesse Mon Dec 20 16:04:20 2004 From: jesse (User Jesse) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 16:04:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] just joined the list... In-Reply-To: <8F48F8D6-52C8-11D9-B179-0050E4D91728@click3x.com> References: <8F48F8D6-52C8-11D9-B179-0050E4D91728@click3x.com> Message-ID: <20041220210420.GB94328@mail.theholymountain.com> Greg, what's up!!! This is the best email I ever got! I can stop messing around now... ahhh... It looks like a lot of file operations were going on. Were there many small files in the folder? I'm sure it's not pissing you off anymore, is it? Jesse On Mon, Dec 20, 2004 at 03:48:53PM -0500, Greg Faber wrote: > Hi everyone, > > We're using FreeBSD at work here (courtesy no doubt of Pete Wright) and > I have a question for the group. > > On Friday, I typed a few basic commands like: > > $>sudo rm -rf untitled\ folder > > after typing this I got no new prompt, nothing. I couldn't ctrl-c to > cancel the command or anything. I couldn't type any new commands > either. Not knowing what to do, I closed my terminal window and > re-ssh'd into it, hoping that I could just kill whatever process might > still be running. I did "ps" and sure enough the process was still > there so I tried to kill it. That didn't work so I tried sudo kill -9 > and that didn't work and actually added the process to the list of > running processes. So now I have a bunch of processes that are still > running and I don't know how to get rid of them. It's pissing me off... > Here's the readout from ps: > backupman at archiver ~ > ps > PID TT STAT TIME COMMAND > 54649 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo rm untitled folder/ > 54662 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo rm -rf untitledfolder/ > 54814 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo mv writers reel.ai writers_reel.ai > 54838 p2- D 0:00.00 /bin/csh /backup/tools/backup_DLT /dev/nsa0 > beckett.ba > 54857 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo kill -9 54649 > 54921 p2- D 0:00.00 /bin/csh /backup/tools/backup_DLT > beckett_tape1.backup > 58543 p2 Ss 0:00.02 -tcsh (tcsh) > 58581 p2 R+ 0:00.00 ps > > so if anyone has any ideas, I'm all ears. > > Thanks, > Greg > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month From pete Mon Dec 20 17:57:18 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2004 17:57:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] just joined the list... In-Reply-To: <8F48F8D6-52C8-11D9-B179-0050E4D91728@click3x.com> References: <8F48F8D6-52C8-11D9-B179-0050E4D91728@click3x.com> Message-ID: <20041220225718.GA19438@nomadlogic.org> On Mon, Dec 20, 2004 at 03:48:53PM -0500, Greg Faber wrote: > Hi everyone, > > We're using FreeBSD at work here (courtesy no doubt of Pete Wright) and > I have a question for the group. > hey greg, so you all are staying with the freebsd backup box eh? woo hoo! > On Friday, I typed a few basic commands like: > > $>sudo rm -rf untitled\ folder > > after typing this I got no new prompt, nothing. I couldn't ctrl-c to > cancel the command or anything. I couldn't type any new commands > either. Not knowing what to do, I closed my terminal window and > re-ssh'd into it, hoping that I could just kill whatever process might > still be running. I did "ps" and sure enough the process was still > there so I tried to kill it. That didn't work so I tried sudo kill -9 > and that didn't work and actually added the process to the list of > running processes. So now I have a bunch of processes that are still > running and I don't know how to get rid of them. It's pissing me off... > Here's the readout from ps: > backupman at archiver ~ > ps > PID TT STAT TIME COMMAND > 54649 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo rm untitled folder/ > 54662 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo rm -rf untitledfolder/ > 54814 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo mv writers reel.ai writers_reel.ai > 54838 p2- D 0:00.00 /bin/csh /backup/tools/backup_DLT /dev/nsa0 > beckett.ba > 54857 p2- D 0:00.01 sudo kill -9 54649 > 54921 p2- D 0:00.00 /bin/csh /backup/tools/backup_DLT > beckett_tape1.backup > 58543 p2 Ss 0:00.02 -tcsh (tcsh) > 58581 p2 R+ 0:00.00 ps > > so if anyone has any ideas, I'm all ears. > that's wierd, does the "untitled\ folder" still exist. I bet what's happening is that you did not escape the space between untitled and folder and something has gone screwy. it also looks like you are doing a tar to the sDLT machine, is the directory on the same volume as the media that is being backed up. there may be an issue there. hope click's going ok btw. -pete -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From george Tue Dec 21 12:07:40 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 12:07:40 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYTCHP pictures. . . Message-ID: NYPHP has all the photos sent in so far up: http://www.nyphp.org/content/gallery/view_album.php? set_albumName=nytchp04 The good, the bad and the ugly. More than any spaghetti western could ever cover. g From george Tue Dec 21 12:36:25 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 12:36:25 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD Message-ID: See the section under The FreeBSD Foundation's 501(c)3 Status at http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/press/20041221-newsletter.shtml We can help fix this, IMO. Let's open up some discussion on this. . . We are likely the largest regional BSD user group. We should come up with some ideas to alleviate this. . . losing or having to defend non-profit status is a big hassle. George From unixenigma Tue Dec 21 13:54:18 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 10:54:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20041221185419.34112.qmail@web53909.mail.yahoo.com> Would it be better to collect money through NYC*BUG and then donate to the FreeBSD Foundation? Or should it be just single member direct donation to the FreeBSD Foundation? I wonder how many users NYC*BUG has. Then multiply, let's say $100 each ;) (less or more $ - i don't know :) ) should be some nice number... GT "G. Rosamond" wrote: See the section under The FreeBSD Foundation's 501(c)3 Status at http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/press/20041221-newsletter.shtml We can help fix this, IMO. Let's open up some discussion on this. . . We are likely the largest regional BSD user group. We should come up with some ideas to alleviate this. . . losing or having to defend non-profit status is a big hassle. George _______________________________________________ % NYC*BUG talk mailing list http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists %We meet the first Wednesday of the month __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041221/008a23de/attachment.html From tillman Tue Dec 21 14:34:37 2004 From: tillman (Tillman Hodgson) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 13:34:37 -0600 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <20041221185419.34112.qmail@web53909.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041221185419.34112.qmail@web53909.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20041221193437.GA2641@seekingfire.com> On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 10:54:18AM -0800, G T wrote: > Would it be better to collect money through NYC*BUG and then donate to > the FreeBSD Foundation? Or should it be just single member direct donation > to the FreeBSD Foundation? If I understand their concern correctly (and I'm not sure that I do), they need a lot of small donations more than they need a single large donation. I sent them a donation this morning. If they had some kind of monthly or quarterly withdrawl plan that would be handy too. -T -- "The act of communication is the primary ethical act....life is meaningful only if the bounds of self can be transcended." -- Anatol Rapoport From bob Tue Dec 21 14:40:51 2004 From: bob (Bob Ippolito) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 14:40:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <20041221193437.GA2641@seekingfire.com> References: <20041221185419.34112.qmail@web53909.mail.yahoo.com> <20041221193437.GA2641@seekingfire.com> Message-ID: <388DE84E-5388-11D9-9505-000A9567635C@redivi.com> On Dec 21, 2004, at 2:34 PM, Tillman Hodgson wrote: > On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 10:54:18AM -0800, G T wrote: >> Would it be better to collect money through NYC*BUG and then donate to >> the FreeBSD Foundation? Or should it be just single member direct >> donation >> to the FreeBSD Foundation? > > If I understand their concern correctly (and I'm not sure that I do), > they need a lot of small donations more than they need a single large > donation. > > I sent them a donation this morning. If they had some kind of monthly > or > quarterly withdrawl plan that would be handy too. Well, the largest "small" donation is around $8,000 at this point, according to that newsletter. So, until we hit that number, it wouldn't matter either way. -bob From unixenigma Tue Dec 21 14:49:15 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 11:49:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <388DE84E-5388-11D9-9505-000A9567635C@redivi.com> Message-ID: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> Actually it is $30,400 in donations not affected by the 2% contribution limit. However, indeed 2% is $8000 for any single person. I may be wrong. GT Bob Ippolito wrote: On Dec 21, 2004, at 2:34 PM, Tillman Hodgson wrote: > On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 10:54:18AM -0800, G T wrote: >> Would it be better to collect money through NYC*BUG and then donate to >> the FreeBSD Foundation? Or should it be just single member direct >> donation >> to the FreeBSD Foundation? > > If I understand their concern correctly (and I'm not sure that I do), > they need a lot of small donations more than they need a single large > donation. > > I sent them a donation this morning. If they had some kind of monthly > or > quarterly withdrawl plan that would be handy too. Well, the largest "small" donation is around $8,000 at this point, according to that newsletter. So, until we hit that number, it wouldn't matter either way. -bob _______________________________________________ % NYC*BUG talk mailing list http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists %We meet the first Wednesday of the month --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - now with 250MB free storage. Learn more. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041221/bb9b0099/attachment.html From george Tue Dec 21 15:15:04 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 15:15:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Fwd: Stopping SSH dictionary attacks? Message-ID: <009AC896-538D-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Begin forwarded message: > From: "Juan J. Martinez" > Date: December 21, 2004 1:14:29 PM EST > To: misc at openbsd.org > Subject: Re: Stopping SSH dictionary attacks? > >> One solution I'm considering is writing a script that parses authlog >> every hour or so and adds any IPs with more than x failed login >> attempts to ipcop/etc/hosts_deny, am I on the right track with this >> (has someone already done it - I'm a big fan of not re-inventing the >> wheel)? > > Actually I've done this... however I think its usefulness is limited > (ie. scans from the same IP in different days are rare), but was fun > to code. > > You can check it at (the package is ssh_blocker): > http://blackshell.usebox.net/pub/shell/ > > Juanjo > > -- > Desarrollo y Sistemas: http://usebox.net/ > P?gina personal: http://usebox.net/jjm/ > > This may be relevant to some earlier discussions about openssh security and brute force/dictionary attacks. g From george Tue Dec 21 15:51:10 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 15:51:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Let's avoid top posting. . . it makes these conversations confusing. . . see below. On Dec 21, 2004, at 2:49 PM, G T wrote: > Actually it is $30,400 in donations not affected by the 2% > contribution limit. However, indeed 2% is $8000 for any single person. > I may be wrong. > GT > > > Bob Ippolito wrote: > > On Dec 21, 2004, at 2:34 PM, Tillman Hodgson wrote: > > > On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 10:54:18AM -0800, G T wrote: > >> Would it be better to collect money through NYC*BUG and then donate > to > >> the FreeBSD Foundation? Or should it be just single member direct > >> donation > >> to the FreeBSD Foundation? > > > > If I understand their concern correctly (and I'm not sure that I do), > > they need a lot of small donations more than they need a single large > > donation. > > > > I sent them a donation this morning. If they had some kind of monthly > > or > > quarterly withdrawl plan that would be handy too. > > Well, the largest "small" donation is around $8,000 at this point, > according to that newsletter. So, until we hit that number, it > wouldn't matter either way. > I think that's right Bob, at least from my understanding. Maybe we could have individual nycbug 'pledges' listed on our www site, maybe we can keep it standard at $15 each user x 200 on talk that's $3000 potentially. . . I'll them ask about a periodic contribution operation. George From zperkov Tue Dec 21 15:53:16 2004 From: zperkov (Zoran Perkov) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 15:53:16 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Fwd: Stopping SSH dictionary attacks? In-Reply-To: <009AC896-538D-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <009AC896-538D-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <8a851180041221125352e7c996@mail.gmail.com> i have been getting abused quite regularly.... of course this is just a home box with nothing relevant on it. but my ssh and ftp (purposely anonymous) have been getting abused the day after i opened the ports. i mostly use it to test snort sigs. -/z On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 15:15:04 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > > Begin forwarded message: > > > From: "Juan J. Martinez" > > Date: December 21, 2004 1:14:29 PM EST > > To: misc at openbsd.org > > Subject: Re: Stopping SSH dictionary attacks? > > > >> One solution I'm considering is writing a script that parses authlog > >> every hour or so and adds any IPs with more than x failed login > >> attempts to ipcop/etc/hosts_deny, am I on the right track with this > >> (has someone already done it - I'm a big fan of not re-inventing the > >> wheel)? > > > > Actually I've done this... however I think its usefulness is limited > > (ie. scans from the same IP in different days are rare), but was fun > > to code. > > > > You can check it at (the package is ssh_blocker): > > http://blackshell.usebox.net/pub/shell/ > > > > Juanjo > > > > -- > > Desarrollo y Sistemas: http://usebox.net/ > > P?gina personal: http://usebox.net/jjm/ > > > > > > This may be relevant to some earlier discussions about openssh security > and brute force/dictionary attacks. > > g > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From bob Tue Dec 21 16:02:11 2004 From: bob (Bob Ippolito) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 16:02:11 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Fwd: Stopping SSH dictionary attacks? In-Reply-To: <009AC896-538D-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <009AC896-538D-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <955C4A6A-5393-11D9-9505-000A9567635C@redivi.com> On Dec 21, 2004, at 3:15 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > Begin forwarded message: > >> From: "Juan J. Martinez" >> Date: December 21, 2004 1:14:29 PM EST >> To: misc at openbsd.org >> Subject: Re: Stopping SSH dictionary attacks? >> >>> One solution I'm considering is writing a script that parses authlog >>> every hour or so and adds any IPs with more than x failed login >>> attempts to ipcop/etc/hosts_deny, am I on the right track with this >>> (has someone already done it - I'm a big fan of not re-inventing the >>> wheel)? >> >> Actually I've done this... however I think its usefulness is limited >> (ie. scans from the same IP in different days are rare), but was fun >> to code. >> >> You can check it at (the package is ssh_blocker): >> http://blackshell.usebox.net/pub/shell/ > > This may be relevant to some earlier discussions about openssh > security and brute force/dictionary attacks. It's probably more secure to just turn off PasswordAuthentication. Then you don't have to worry about dictionary attacks, and brute force wouldn't be feasible. -bob From george Tue Dec 21 16:56:01 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 16:56:01 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041221215601.GE2341@sta> On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 03:51:10PM -0500, G Rosamond wrote: >Let's avoid top posting. . . it makes these conversations confusing. . >. see below. > >On Dec 21, 2004, at 2:49 PM, G T wrote: > >>Actually it is $30,400 in donations not affected by the 2% >>contribution limit. However, indeed 2% is $8000 for any single person. >>I may be wrong. >>GT >> >> >>Bob Ippolito wrote: >> >>On Dec 21, 2004, at 2:34 PM, Tillman Hodgson wrote: >> >>> On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 10:54:18AM -0800, G T wrote: >>>> Would it be better to collect money through NYC*BUG and then donate >>to >>>> the FreeBSD Foundation? Or should it be just single member direct >> >> donation >>>> to the FreeBSD Foundation? >>> >>> If I understand their concern correctly (and I'm not sure that I do), >>> they need a lot of small donations more than they need a single large >>> donation. >>> >>> I sent them a donation this morning. If they had some kind of monthly >> > or >>> quarterly withdrawl plan that would be handy too. >> >>Well, the largest "small" donation is around $8,000 at this point, >> according to that newsletter. So, until we hit that number, it >>wouldn't matter either way. >> > >I think that's right Bob, at least from my understanding. > >Maybe we could have individual nycbug 'pledges' listed on our www site, >maybe we can keep it standard at $15 each user x 200 on talk that's >$3000 potentially. . . I'll them ask about a periodic contribution >operation. And I was all excited about putting in my 2 cents! But indeed it seems all that matters is $30,000 is raised by entities none of which making more than an $8,000 donation. number of donors doesn't seem to matter which is probably a broken rule of the irs, the org status is in jeopardy because of a few big spenders.... I wonder how much pull 25,000 one dollar separate donations would make? I bet a lot if it made it to court, so I suggest we submit our receipts to nycbug for accounting props and send donations independently. // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From mspitzer Tue Dec 21 17:21:30 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 17:21:30 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <20041221215601.GE2341@sta> References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041221215601.GE2341@sta> Message-ID: <8c50a3c304122114217f02329d@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 16:56:01 -0500, George Georgalis wrote: > > And I was all excited about putting in my 2 cents! But indeed it > seems all that matters is $30,000 is raised by entities none of which > making more than an $8,000 donation. number of donors doesn't seem to > matter which is probably a broken rule of the irs, the org status is > in jeopardy because of a few big spenders.... I wonder how much pull > 25,000 one dollar separate donations would make? I bet a lot if it made > it to court, so I suggest we submit our receipts to nycbug for accounting > props and send donations independently. > > // George Why can't people give whatever they think is fair and be done with it? Why does this have to be turned into a telethon? We all have the links needed to donate so why not leave it at that. marc From bob Tue Dec 21 17:43:05 2004 From: bob (Bob Ippolito) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 17:43:05 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c304122114217f02329d@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041221215601.GE2341@sta> <8c50a3c304122114217f02329d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Dec 21, 2004, at 5:21 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 16:56:01 -0500, George Georgalis > wrote: > >> And I was all excited about putting in my 2 cents! But indeed it >> seems all that matters is $30,000 is raised by entities none of which >> making more than an $8,000 donation. number of donors doesn't seem to >> matter which is probably a broken rule of the irs, the org status is >> in jeopardy because of a few big spenders.... I wonder how much pull >> 25,000 one dollar separate donations would make? I bet a lot if it >> made >> it to court, so I suggest we submit our receipts to nycbug for >> accounting >> props and send donations independently. > > Why can't people give whatever they think is fair and be done with it? > Why does this have to be turned into a telethon? We all have the > links needed to donate so why not leave it at that. Well, they should've brought this up sooner, cause raising 30k in less than two weeks almost requires a sort of telethon to get the information out to the right number of people. Even if they don't make it, I'm sure they would win the appeal. The real problem is just that the appeal process is probably a pain in the ass and will incur a lot of lawyer fees. Given their financial statement, they can certainly afford this, but the money is better spent on FreeBSD. -bob From mspitzer Tue Dec 21 18:04:21 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 18:04:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041221215601.GE2341@sta> <8c50a3c304122114217f02329d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8c50a3c30412211504329f0e62@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 17:43:05 -0500, Bob Ippolito wrote: > On Dec 21, 2004, at 5:21 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > > On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 16:56:01 -0500, George Georgalis > > wrote: > > > >> And I was all excited about putting in my 2 cents! But indeed it > >> seems all that matters is $30,000 is raised by entities none of which > >> making more than an $8,000 donation. number of donors doesn't seem to > >> matter which is probably a broken rule of the irs, the org status is > >> in jeopardy because of a few big spenders.... I wonder how much pull > >> 25,000 one dollar separate donations would make? I bet a lot if it > >> made > >> it to court, so I suggest we submit our receipts to nycbug for > >> accounting > >> props and send donations independently. > > > > Why can't people give whatever they think is fair and be done with it? > > Why does this have to be turned into a telethon? We all have the > > links needed to donate so why not leave it at that. > > Well, they should've brought this up sooner, cause raising 30k in less > than two weeks almost requires a sort of telethon to get the > information out to the right number of people. > > Even if they don't make it, I'm sure they would win the appeal. The > real problem is just that the appeal process is probably a pain in the > ass and will incur a lot of lawyer fees. Given their financial > statement, they can certainly afford this, but the money is better > spent on FreeBSD. > > -bob I am not arguing about getting the word out, that has been done. But this focus on recognition instead of just do the right thing and move on seem, well for want of a better word, childish. From past experience people on this list have deep pockets and are not afraid to use them. If you think something is the right thing to do then do it and be done. marc From pete Tue Dec 21 18:08:05 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 18:08:05 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c30412211504329f0e62@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041221215601.GE2341@sta> <8c50a3c304122114217f02329d@mail.gmail.com> <8c50a3c30412211504329f0e62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041221230805.GA23140@nomadlogic.org> On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 06:04:21PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > > Why can't people give whatever they think is fair and be done with it? > > > Why does this have to be turned into a telethon? We all have the > > > links needed to donate so why not leave it at that. > > > > Well, they should've brought this up sooner, cause raising 30k in less > > than two weeks almost requires a sort of telethon to get the > > information out to the right number of people. > > > > Even if they don't make it, I'm sure they would win the appeal. The > > real problem is just that the appeal process is probably a pain in the > > ass and will incur a lot of lawyer fees. Given their financial > > statement, they can certainly afford this, but the money is better > > spent on FreeBSD. > > > > -bob > > I am not arguing about getting the word out, that has been done. But > this focus on recognition instead of just do the right thing and move > on seem, well for want of a better word, childish. From past > experience people on this list have deep pockets and are not afraid to > use them. If you think something is the right thing to do then do it > and be done. > here here! thank you mark! just do it, or don't do it. george thanks for bringing this topic up and getting the word out too! -p -- ~~oO00Oo~~ Peter Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete 917.415.9866 From george Tue Dec 21 18:16:18 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2004 18:16:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <20041221230805.GA23140@nomadlogic.org> References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041221215601.GE2341@sta> <8c50a3c304122114217f02329d@mail.gmail.com> <8c50a3c30412211504329f0e62@mail.gmail.com> <20041221230805.GA23140@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <519E8F10-53A6-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 21, 2004, at 6:08 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 06:04:21PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: >>>> Why can't people give whatever they think is fair and be done with >>>> it? >>>> Why does this have to be turned into a telethon? We all have the >>>> links needed to donate so why not leave it at that. >>> >>> Well, they should've brought this up sooner, cause raising 30k in >>> less >>> than two weeks almost requires a sort of telethon to get the >>> information out to the right number of people. >>> >>> Even if they don't make it, I'm sure they would win the appeal. The >>> real problem is just that the appeal process is probably a pain in >>> the >>> ass and will incur a lot of lawyer fees. Given their financial >>> statement, they can certainly afford this, but the money is better >>> spent on FreeBSD. >>> >>> -bob >> >> I am not arguing about getting the word out, that has been done. But >> this focus on recognition instead of just do the right thing and move >> on seem, well for want of a better word, childish. From past >> experience people on this list have deep pockets and are not afraid to >> use them. If you think something is the right thing to do then do it >> and be done. >> > > here here! thank you mark! just do it, or don't do it. > > > george thanks for bringing this topic up and getting the word out too! > -p > But you're *all* wrong. Please send your checks to: Bill Gates Microsoft Redmond, WA 66666 That should help us. And tell them it's from NYC*BUG. We have to show we're having an impact. g From george Wed Dec 22 00:57:07 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 00:57:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <519E8F10-53A6-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <20041221215601.GE2341@sta> <8c50a3c304122114217f02329d@mail.gmail.com> <8c50a3c30412211504329f0e62@mail.gmail.com> <20041221230805.GA23140@nomadlogic.org> <519E8F10-53A6-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <20041222055707.GB6434@sta> On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 06:16:18PM -0500, G Rosamond wrote: > >On Dec 21, 2004, at 6:08 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > >>On Tue, Dec 21, 2004 at 06:04:21PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: >>>>>Why can't people give whatever they think is fair and be done with >>>>>it? >>>>> Why does this have to be turned into a telethon? We all have the >>>>>links needed to donate so why not leave it at that. >>>> >>>>Well, they should've brought this up sooner, cause raising 30k in >>>>less >>>>than two weeks almost requires a sort of telethon to get the >>>>information out to the right number of people. >>>> >>>>Even if they don't make it, I'm sure they would win the appeal. The >>>>real problem is just that the appeal process is probably a pain in >>>>the >>>>ass and will incur a lot of lawyer fees. Given their financial >>>>statement, they can certainly afford this, but the money is better >>>>spent on FreeBSD. >>>> >>>>-bob >>> >>>I am not arguing about getting the word out, that has been done. But >>>this focus on recognition instead of just do the right thing and move >>>on seem, well for want of a better word, childish. From past >>>experience people on this list have deep pockets and are not afraid to >>>use them. If you think something is the right thing to do then do it >>>and be done. >>> >> >>here here! thank you mark! just do it, or don't do it. >> >> >>george thanks for bringing this topic up and getting the word out too! >>-p >> > >But you're *all* wrong. Please send your checks to: > >Bill Gates >Microsoft >Redmond, WA 66666 > >That should help us. And tell them it's from NYC*BUG. We have to show >we're having an impact. > Hell, $M did it, a conspiracy to blow fbsd's 503c status out of the water! I'm not a proponent of telethons. Just didn't want to pop G's bubble with regard to organizing a fund raiser. ;-) // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From george Wed Dec 22 01:40:30 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 01:40:30 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] money and bike sheds. . . Message-ID: <5F7C1835-53E4-11D9-88B2-000D9328615E@sddi.net> okay, okay. . . slashdot isn't appropriate on this list, but there's short thread on the FBSD Foundation quandary. . . http://bsd.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/12/22/0137209&from=rss It's interesting they rejected Richard Bejtlich's post but accepted another 12 hours later. Not that Slashdot is everyone's main source for tech news. . . To clear it up, it's not about weak funding from the *BSD community as much as it's about foolish standards for charities. They are doing fine financially, but they need to have the correct proportion of small to large donations. But we all knew that, right? George From mikel.king Wed Dec 22 11:32:32 2004 From: mikel.king (Mikel King) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 11:32:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD In-Reply-To: <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> <0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <41C9A1A0.3030500@ocsny.com> Sorry but from the phone it just unavoidable...would ne nice if people used SNIP a bit more around here...;-P G. Rosamond wrote: > Let's avoid top posting. . . it makes these conversations confusing. . > . see below. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041222/0ae7a8ba/attachment.html From tux Wed Dec 22 11:41:29 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 11:41:29 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Important about finances of FBSD References: <20041221194915.84199.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com><0B0FA200-5392-11D9-ADE7-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <41C9A1A0.3030500@ocsny.com> Message-ID: <00ef01c4e845$16edb0c0$6400a8c0@olympus> : Sorry but from the phone it just unavoidable...would ne nice if people : used SNIP a bit more around here...;-P ...as well as plain text messages... : G. Rosamond wrote: : : > Let's avoid top posting. . . it makes these conversations confusing. . : > . see below. From unixenigma Wed Dec 22 12:31:03 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 09:31:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] |Wireless AP| Top AP? Message-ID: <20041222173103.54966.qmail@web53910.mail.yahoo.com> Hey I just got Proxim AP-2000 with all kits and combocard gold 8480-wd. I was really disappointed. Range was (inside) like 30 feet. PC-card is claiming to run at 100mW - runs only at 30mW. My connection strength dropped to 'good' when I went to the next room (B range had to be 1750 feet open clear space). I called customer service and was transfered to India (no news). Guy had no clue! He even told to put my gold pc-card into AP to check range and power output. WHAT?!?! Security features are most of them useless without dedicated server. I could be wrong or got faulty AP, but I did check power outputs of kits and found out they are the same as Linksys (even less by 1dBm), D-Link and other ones. A at about 14 dBm and B/G at 15 or 16 dBm. B network or G sux at my building i have like 40% CRC packet errors, with A was ok. My conclusion - PROXIM sux! (plus customer service sux) Can someone advice me a nice tri-mode AP and pc-card (compatible with OBSD would be nice) I have my eyes on Linksys WAP55AG, however I hate their firewall router that I have (had to use third party firmware to make it going) I need nice range and reliable service. Thanks a million. p.s. I am returning AP to the seller (got it cheap - all setup for around $360 - got crap :( ) GT __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do? http://my.yahoo.com From george Wed Dec 22 15:59:04 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 15:59:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] pete back in town. . . Message-ID: <5045C295-545C-11D9-859D-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Pete Wright will be back in town next week. . . from far off LA. We are going to have a tech/social assemblage next week at my place in Brooklyn on Monday. Let's start at 7 pm, as some of us still have to work. . . Email me offlist for directions. . . George From dlavigne6 Wed Dec 22 21:02:54 2004 From: dlavigne6 (Dru) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 21:02:54 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] quagga Message-ID: <20041222210024.V575@dru.domain.org> Anyone here ever use /net/quagga (the new name for zebra)? The interface is basically a stripped down Cisco IOS, but I seem to be missing how to get the commands I enter while in vtysh to be saved to any of my config files... Alternately, if I edit the routing config files manually, "sh run" is still empty :-( Dru From dlavigne6 Wed Dec 22 21:09:22 2004 From: dlavigne6 (Dru) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 21:09:22 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Another Live CD (fwd) Message-ID: <20041222210845.L575@dru.domain.org> This just got posted to another list I'm on: http://www.livebsd.com/ Based on Freesbie, full KDE install. Dru From george Wed Dec 22 22:09:45 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 22:09:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Another Live CD (fwd) In-Reply-To: <20041222210845.L575@dru.domain.org> References: <20041222210845.L575@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: <18C653C0-5490-11D9-859D-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 22, 2004, at 9:09 PM, Dru wrote: > > This just got posted to another list I'm on: > > http://www.livebsd.com/ > > Based on Freesbie, full KDE install. > A la Knoppix. Cool. (if you like KDE ;-) I think projects like this are hugely beneficial. I know that m0n0wall really caught Mike's attention. IPCop, based on Linux is awesome, but it's truly the BSD firewalls that set the tone. May this proliferation of BSD CDs continue. I know I keep several in my bag, not to mention g4u. George From okan Thu Dec 23 10:14:13 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:14:13 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city Message-ID: <20041223151413.GA97781@yinaska.pair.com> Hi - Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. Thanks, Okan -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From george Thu Dec 23 10:16:46 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:16:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city In-Reply-To: <20041223151413.GA97781@yinaska.pair.com> References: <20041223151413.GA97781@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: On Dec 23, 2004, at 10:14 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > Hi - > > Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm > specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. > Woah . . . unlikely same day . . . I don't know anywhere with same day, but you might want to try some of those places are sell used stuff. Try: http://www.bizinetworks.com/index.html I sold them some old Cisco stuff way back. .. g From george Thu Dec 23 10:20:49 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:20:49 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city In-Reply-To: <20041223151413.GA97781@yinaska.pair.com> References: <20041223151413.GA97781@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: <3A20ADCC-54F6-11D9-98A8-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 23, 2004, at 10:14 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > Hi - > > Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm > specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. > > Or. . . maybe Manchester. . . they might be able to get you something today. Their www site is http://mecnet.com/, but talk to Rich Klein at 631-951-7360. They are in LI, so the sooner you call the better. . . George From alex Thu Dec 23 10:15:41 2004 From: alex (alex at pilosoft.com) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:15:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city In-Reply-To: <20041223151413.GA97781@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 23 Dec 2004, Okan Demirmen wrote: > Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm > specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. Come by our office (55 Broad St downtown), we have a boatload of SFPs and GBIC, all types. 100$ for LC SX SFP. (call 917 407 8664) Alex Pilosov | DSL, Colocation, Hosting Services President | alex at pilosoft.com Pilosoft, Inc. | http://www.pilosoft.com From dlavigne6 Thu Dec 23 10:46:22 2004 From: dlavigne6 (Dru) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:46:22 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] for those who love web/usermin Message-ID: <20041223104444.Y574@dru.domain.org> www.swelltech.com/virtualmin Looks like a sweet way to manage virtual domains. The FreeBSD port is in sysutils/virtualmin. Dru From tillman Thu Dec 23 11:08:47 2004 From: tillman (Tillman Hodgson) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:08:47 -0600 Subject: [nycbug-talk] quagga In-Reply-To: <20041222210024.V575@dru.domain.org> References: <20041222210024.V575@dru.domain.org> Message-ID: <20041223160847.GW2641@seekingfire.com> On Wed, Dec 22, 2004 at 09:02:54PM -0500, Dru wrote: > > Anyone here ever use /net/quagga (the new name for zebra)? Yup, we use it on a community meta-network (a network composed of tunnels across the Internet). We just added two more nodes this morning. > The interface is basically a stripped down Cisco IOS, but I seem to be > missing how to get the commands I enter while in vtysh to be saved to > any of my config files... Either "copy run start" or "write file" will do the trick. Note that Quagga writes the file from scratch, and thus it loses your comments in the process. This sucks. See below. > Alternately, if I edit the routing config files manually, "sh run" is > still empty :-( Restart the daemons after editing them. This is my preferred way to make changes so that I can actually comment my config files. Alternatively, for a small change, I'll edit the config file then make the same change in the "live" interface, skipping the "restart the daemon" step. -T -- Page 594: You will find that the Unix file system has a compelling beauty: everything makes sense. - Harley Hahn, _The Unix Companion_ From okan Thu Dec 23 11:40:34 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 11:40:34 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city In-Reply-To: <20041223151413.GA97781@yinaska.pair.com> References: <20041223151413.GA97781@yinaska.pair.com> Message-ID: <20041223164034.GA15403@yinaska.pair.com> Thanks for all your responses...I'm working on a few leads now... Cheers, Okan On Thu 2004.12.23 at 10:14 -0500, Okan Demirmen wrote: > Hi - > > Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm > specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. > > Thanks, > Okan > > -- > Okan Demirmen > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month -- Okan Demirmen PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 From swygue Thu Dec 23 12:35:33 2004 From: swygue (swygue) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 12:35:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Gmail Accounts Message-ID: Hi, I am new to nycbug list and I wanted to know if anyone wants a Gmail account I have some invitation and since I currently do not have any IT friends I would like to give them to users of my favorite OS. From swygue Thu Dec 23 12:50:36 2004 From: swygue (swygue) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 12:50:36 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Imaging software for FreeBSD Message-ID: Hi guys, Does anyone know of a fast imaging program for BSD. I want to setup FreeBSD for my two little brothers. The computers that I have are only p500mhz and installing KDE took me about 26 hours. Not wanting to sit through that long process I decided to try g4u (http://www.feyrer.de/g4u/) and now I am day four and this thing is still running. I want fast imaging program that works with FreeBSD like symantec ghost. Any suggestions ? Or can some one tell me how I can accomplish this task some other way. I would like to get one PC build just the way I want and copy it to the other PC. Thanks From tux Thu Dec 23 15:48:33 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 15:48:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Imaging software for FreeBSD References: Message-ID: <002701c4e930$c4df7f60$6400a8c0@olympus> : Does anyone know of a fast imaging program for BSD. I want to setup : FreeBSD for my two little brothers. The computers that I have are only : p500mhz and installing KDE took me about 26 hours. Try downloading the SystemRescueCD from http://www.sysresccd.org/ and use partimage. Lots of handy tools on that there CD... : Not wanting to sit through that long process I decided to try g4u : (http://www.feyrer.de/g4u/) and now I am day four and this thing is : still running. Either turn off the compression or change it to gzip instead of bzip2 (I'm guessing at this point that's what you're currently using, since I had the same thing happen ;) HTH Kev From mspitzer Thu Dec 23 15:56:35 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 15:56:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Imaging software for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <002701c4e930$c4df7f60$6400a8c0@olympus> References: <002701c4e930$c4df7f60$6400a8c0@olympus> Message-ID: <8c50a3c30412231256690075d4@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 23 Dec 2004 15:48:33 -0500, Kevin Reiter wrote: > : Does anyone know of a fast imaging program for BSD. I want to setup > : FreeBSD for my two little brothers. The computers that I have are only > : p500mhz and installing KDE took me about 26 hours. > > Try downloading the SystemRescueCD from http://www.sysresccd.org/ and use > partimage. Lots of handy tools on that there CD... > > : Not wanting to sit through that long process I decided to try g4u > : (http://www.feyrer.de/g4u/) and now I am day four and this thing is > : still running. > > Either turn off the compression or change it to gzip instead of bzip2 (I'm > guessing at this point that's what you're currently using, since I had the same > thing happen ;) > > HTH > Kev > this is not what you asked for but couldn't you just use binary packages for things like kde, or almost anything elses in the package tree? marc From george Thu Dec 23 17:39:36 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 17:39:36 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Gmail Accounts In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <85CF248D-5533-11D9-98A8-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 23, 2004, at 12:35 PM, swygue wrote: > Hi, > > I am new to nycbug list and I wanted to know if anyone wants a Gmail > account I have some invitation and since I currently do not have any > IT friends I would like to give them to users of my favorite OS. > what's gmail? just kidding. From george Thu Dec 23 19:12:47 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 19:12:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBSD Foundation. . . Message-ID: <8A9F0E2C-5540-11D9-98A8-000D9328615E@sddi.net> This is pretty impressive. . . 56% of the way to $32,000 2004 small donation goal thanks to 302 generous donations! Have *you* contributed yet? Now if Yahoo, Pair, NY Internet, etc., gave each of their employees a small bonus that they could donate directly to the FBSD Foundation. . . g From george Thu Dec 23 19:33:31 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 19:33:31 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Metalwire back up. . . Message-ID: <705509AC-5543-11D9-98A8-000D9328615E@sddi.net> http://www.metawire.org/ is back up. . . just setup an account. They provide free shell accounts running on OBSD. If anyone remembers, it was DDOS'd a while back and taken down. Good to see it's back up. . . It's efforts such as those admins that are vital to the community. . . George From swygue Thu Dec 23 19:46:38 2004 From: swygue (swygue) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 19:46:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Imaging software for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: <20041224000519.D670CA87A2@virtu.nyphp.org> References: <20041224000519.D670CA87A2@virtu.nyphp.org> Message-ID: Okay I will play with the compression and see what happen. Thanks On Thu, 23 Dec 2004 19:05:19 -0500 (EST), talk-request at lists.nycbug.org wrote: > Send talk mailing list submissions to > talk at lists.nycbug.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > talk-request at lists.nycbug.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > talk-owner at lists.nycbug.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of talk digest..." > > Today's Topics: > > 1. quagga (Dru) > 2. Another Live CD (fwd) (Dru) > 3. Re: Another Live CD (fwd) (G. Rosamond) > 4. GBIC's in the city (Okan Demirmen) > 5. Re: GBIC's in the city (G. Rosamond) > 6. Re: GBIC's in the city (G. Rosamond) > 7. Re: GBIC's in the city (alex at pilosoft.com) > 8. for those who love web/usermin (Dru) > 9. Re: quagga (Tillman Hodgson) > 10. Re: GBIC's in the city (Okan Demirmen) > 11. Gmail Accounts (swygue) > 12. Imaging software for FreeBSD (swygue) > 13. Re: Imaging software for FreeBSD (Kevin Reiter) > 14. Re: Imaging software for FreeBSD (Marc Spitzer) > 15. Re: Gmail Accounts (G. Rosamond) > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 21:02:54 -0500 (EST) > From: Dru > Subject: [nycbug-talk] quagga > To: NYC Bug List > Message-ID: <20041222210024.V575 at dru.domain.org> > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed > > Anyone here ever use /net/quagga (the new name for zebra)? The interface > is basically a stripped down Cisco IOS, but I seem to be missing how to > get the commands I enter while in vtysh to be saved to any of my config > files... > > Alternately, if I edit the routing config files manually, "sh run" is > still empty :-( > > Dru > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 21:09:22 -0500 (EST) > From: Dru > Subject: [nycbug-talk] Another Live CD (fwd) > To: NYC Bug List > Message-ID: <20041222210845.L575 at dru.domain.org> > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed > > This just got posted to another list I'm on: > > http://www.livebsd.com/ > > Based on Freesbie, full KDE install. > > Dru > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2004 22:09:45 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] Another Live CD (fwd) > To: Dru > Cc: NYC Bug List > Message-ID: <18C653C0-5490-11D9-859D-000D9328615E at sddi.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed > > On Dec 22, 2004, at 9:09 PM, Dru wrote: > > > > > This just got posted to another list I'm on: > > > > http://www.livebsd.com/ > > > > Based on Freesbie, full KDE install. > > > > A la Knoppix. Cool. (if you like KDE ;-) > > I think projects like this are hugely beneficial. I know that m0n0wall > really caught Mike's attention. IPCop, based on Linux is awesome, but > it's truly the BSD firewalls that set the tone. > > May this proliferation of BSD CDs continue. I know I keep several in > my bag, not to mention g4u. > > George > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:14:13 -0500 > From: Okan Demirmen > Subject: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: <20041223151413.GA97781 at yinaska.pair.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Hi - > > Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm > specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. > > Thanks, > Okan > > -- > Okan Demirmen > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:16:46 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city > To: Okan Demirmen > Cc: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed > > On Dec 23, 2004, at 10:14 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > > Hi - > > > > Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm > > specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. > > > > Woah . . . unlikely same day . . . > > I don't know anywhere with same day, but you might want to try some of > those places are sell used stuff. > > Try: http://www.bizinetworks.com/index.html > > I sold them some old Cisco stuff way back. .. > > g > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:20:49 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city > To: Okan Demirmen > Cc: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: <3A20ADCC-54F6-11D9-98A8-000D9328615E at sddi.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed > > On Dec 23, 2004, at 10:14 AM, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > > Hi - > > > > Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm > > specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. > > > > > > Or. . . maybe Manchester. . . they might be able to get you something > today. > > Their www site is http://mecnet.com/, but talk to Rich Klein at > 631-951-7360. > > They are in LI, so the sooner you call the better. . . > > George > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:15:41 -0500 (EST) > From: alex at pilosoft.com > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city > To: Okan Demirmen > Cc: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > On Thu, 23 Dec 2004, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > > Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm > > specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. > Come by our office (55 Broad St downtown), we have a boatload of SFPs and > GBIC, all types. > > 100$ for LC SX SFP. > > (call 917 407 8664) > > Alex Pilosov | DSL, Colocation, Hosting Services > President | alex at pilosoft.com > Pilosoft, Inc. | http://www.pilosoft.com > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:46:22 -0500 (EST) > From: Dru > Subject: [nycbug-talk] for those who love web/usermin > To: NYC Bug List > Message-ID: <20041223104444.Y574 at dru.domain.org> > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed > > www.swelltech.com/virtualmin > > Looks like a sweet way to manage virtual domains. The FreeBSD port is in > sysutils/virtualmin. > > Dru > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 10:08:47 -0600 > From: Tillman Hodgson > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] quagga > To: NYC Bug List > Message-ID: <20041223160847.GW2641 at seekingfire.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > On Wed, Dec 22, 2004 at 09:02:54PM -0500, Dru wrote: > > > > Anyone here ever use /net/quagga (the new name for zebra)? > > Yup, we use it on a community meta-network (a network composed of > tunnels across the Internet). We just added two more nodes this morning. > > > The interface is basically a stripped down Cisco IOS, but I seem to be > > missing how to get the commands I enter while in vtysh to be saved to > > any of my config files... > > Either "copy run start" or "write file" will do the trick. > > Note that Quagga writes the file from scratch, and thus it loses your > comments in the process. This sucks. See below. > > > Alternately, if I edit the routing config files manually, "sh run" is > > still empty :-( > > Restart the daemons after editing them. This is my preferred way to make > changes so that I can actually comment my config files. > > Alternatively, for a small change, I'll edit the config file then make > the same change in the "live" interface, skipping the "restart the > daemon" step. > > -T > > -- > Page 594: You will find that the Unix file system has a compelling > beauty: everything makes sense. > - Harley Hahn, _The Unix Companion_ > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 10 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 11:40:34 -0500 > From: Okan Demirmen > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] GBIC's in the city > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: <20041223164034.GA15403 at yinaska.pair.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Thanks for all your responses...I'm working on a few leads now... > > Cheers, > Okan > > On Thu 2004.12.23 at 10:14 -0500, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > Hi - > > > > Anyone know of a place in the city where I may find GBIC's? I'm > > specifically looking for LC SX (SFP) multimode ones. > > > > Thanks, > > Okan > > > > -- > > Okan Demirmen > > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > > _______________________________________________ > > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > > -- > Okan Demirmen > PGP-Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xB3670934 > PGP-Fingerprint: 226D B4AE 78A9 7F4E CD2B 1B44 C281 AF18 B367 0934 > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 11 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 12:35:33 -0500 > From: swygue > Subject: [nycbug-talk] Gmail Accounts > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Hi, > > I am new to nycbug list and I wanted to know if anyone wants a Gmail > account I have some invitation and since I currently do not have any > IT friends I would like to give them to users of my favorite OS. > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 12 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 12:50:36 -0500 > From: swygue > Subject: [nycbug-talk] Imaging software for FreeBSD > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > Hi guys, > > Does anyone know of a fast imaging program for BSD. I want to setup > FreeBSD for my two little brothers. The computers that I have are only > p500mhz and installing KDE took me about 26 hours. > > Not wanting to sit through that long process I decided to try g4u > (http://www.feyrer.de/g4u/) and now I am day four and this thing is > still running. > > I want fast imaging program that works with FreeBSD like symantec > ghost. Any suggestions ? Or can some one tell me how I can accomplish > this task some other way. I would like to get one PC build just the > way I want and copy it to the other PC. > > Thanks > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 13 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 15:48:33 -0500 > From: "Kevin Reiter" > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] Imaging software for FreeBSD > To: > Message-ID: <002701c4e930$c4df7f60$6400a8c0 at olympus> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > : Does anyone know of a fast imaging program for BSD. I want to setup > : FreeBSD for my two little brothers. The computers that I have are only > : p500mhz and installing KDE took me about 26 hours. > > Try downloading the SystemRescueCD from http://www.sysresccd.org/ and use > partimage. Lots of handy tools on that there CD... > > : Not wanting to sit through that long process I decided to try g4u > : (http://www.feyrer.de/g4u/) and now I am day four and this thing is > : still running. > > Either turn off the compression or change it to gzip instead of bzip2 (I'm > guessing at this point that's what you're currently using, since I had the same > thing happen ;) > > HTH > Kev > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 14 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 15:56:35 -0500 > From: Marc Spitzer > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] Imaging software for FreeBSD > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: <8c50a3c30412231256690075d4 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > On Thu, 23 Dec 2004 15:48:33 -0500, Kevin Reiter wrote: > > : Does anyone know of a fast imaging program for BSD. I want to setup > > : FreeBSD for my two little brothers. The computers that I have are only > > : p500mhz and installing KDE took me about 26 hours. > > > > Try downloading the SystemRescueCD from http://www.sysresccd.org/ and use > > partimage. Lots of handy tools on that there CD... > > > > : Not wanting to sit through that long process I decided to try g4u > > : (http://www.feyrer.de/g4u/) and now I am day four and this thing is > > : still running. > > > > Either turn off the compression or change it to gzip instead of bzip2 (I'm > > guessing at this point that's what you're currently using, since I had the same > > thing happen ;) > > > > HTH > > Kev > > > > this is not what you asked for but couldn't you just use binary > packages for things like kde, or almost anything elses in the package > tree? > > marc > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 15 > Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 17:39:36 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] Gmail Accounts > To: swygue > Cc: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: <85CF248D-5533-11D9-98A8-000D9328615E at sddi.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed > > On Dec 23, 2004, at 12:35 PM, swygue wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > I am new to nycbug list and I wanted to know if anyone wants a Gmail > > account I have some invitation and since I currently do not have any > > IT friends I would like to give them to users of my favorite OS. > > > > what's gmail? > > just kidding. > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > End of talk Digest, Vol 13, Issue 26 > ************************************ > From nycbug Thu Dec 23 19:56:25 2004 From: nycbug (a nice bug) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 19:56:25 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: Imaging software for FreeBSD In-Reply-To: References: <20041224000519.D670CA87A2@virtu.nyphp.org> Message-ID: <20041224005625.GA1068@florian.hastek.net> swygue: > Okay I will play with the compression and see what happen. The earlier suggestion to install packages (instead of building ports) was a good one.. otherwise you *will* be there until Christmas - wait, that's -- never mind. From louis Thu Dec 23 22:25:13 2004 From: louis (Louis Bertrand) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 22:25:13 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBSD Foundation. . . In-Reply-To: <8A9F0E2C-5540-11D9-98A8-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <8A9F0E2C-5540-11D9-98A8-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 23 Dec 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > This is pretty impressive. . . > > > 56% of the way to $32,000 2004 small donation goal thanks to 302 > generous donations! > > Have *you* contributed yet? > > Now if Yahoo, Pair, NY Internet, etc., gave each of their employees a > small bonus that they could donate directly to the FBSD Foundation. . . > Careful with suggestions like that. It's the sort of scheme that the tax law probably anticipates. Wouldn't want auditors getting excited now, would we? Ciao --Louis From george Thu Dec 23 22:56:46 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 23 Dec 2004 22:56:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBSD Foundation. . . In-Reply-To: References: <8A9F0E2C-5540-11D9-98A8-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: On Dec 23, 2004, at 10:25 PM, Louis Bertrand wrote: > On Thu, 23 Dec 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > >> This is pretty impressive. . . >> >> >> 56% of the way to $32,000 2004 small donation goal thanks to 302 >> generous donations! >> >> Have *you* contributed yet? >> >> Now if Yahoo, Pair, NY Internet, etc., gave each of their employees a >> small bonus that they could donate directly to the FBSD Foundation. . >> . >> > > Careful with suggestions like that. It's the sort of scheme that the > tax law > probably anticipates. Wouldn't want auditors getting excited now, > would we? > Right. . . but the point is clear. . . Those firms *do* lots to support BSD Land . . . PHK funded for a bit by Pair, etc. . . They could probably have some check box or even just a collection box with envelopes. . . That's a quick and easy mass to address. g From SKiefer Fri Dec 24 00:02:41 2004 From: SKiefer (SKiefer at bigben-interactive.de) Date: Fri, 24 Dec 2004 06:02:41 +0100 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: talk Digest, Vol 13, Issue 26 Message-ID: <05010562827405@mail.bigben-interactive.de> Vielen Dank f?r Ihre Nachricht! Ich bin am Montag, den 10.1.2005 wieder im Haus. In dringenden F?llen erreichen Sie mich Mobil : 0174-3474064 ch werde Ihnen schnellstm?glich antworten, sobald ich wieder im Haus bin. Thank you for your mail. I am out of the office until monday, january 10th 2004. In urgent cases please call me on my cellphone contact +49 174 34 740 64 I will get back to you as soon I am back in the office. Viele Gr??e, best regards, Stefan Kiefer From george Fri Dec 24 10:00:47 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 24 Dec 2004 10:00:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBSD Foundation update Message-ID: <980D4AE8-55BC-11D9-BBE3-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Sorry to keep posting this, but I think it's pretty amazing. From FreeBSDFoundation.org: 87% of the way to $32,000 2004 small (<8k) donation goal thanks to 556 generous donations! From george Sat Dec 25 22:39:00 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 25 Dec 2004 22:39:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Xorg warning Message-ID: warning: Just did a cvsup and portupgrade on my main FBSD 5.3 desktop. . . and have to reconfigure X completely. . . think I just lost my X config or something else. . . g From george Sun Dec 26 13:08:32 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2004 13:08:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Shmoocon registration Message-ID: <27274877-5769-11D9-B41C-000D9328615E@sddi.net> FYI. . . Shmoocon, a security conference to be held in DC in early February, has the registration price of $149 until December 31st. After that it increases to $199, then to $250. http://www.shmoocon.org/main.html There are a number of BSD-related speakers, including David Hulton, developer of bsd-airtools and an author who's writing a book on BSD security for O'Reilly. A number of us are attending. . . I may drive or take the Canal Street bus. . . g From tux Sun Dec 26 16:17:19 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2004 16:17:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Shmoocon registration References: <27274877-5769-11D9-B41C-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <005101c4eb90$49c4f8c0$6400a8c0@olympus> : A number of us are attending. . . I may drive or take the Canal Street : bus. . . I registered a few months ago. Don't know how I'm getting there, but ... From george Sun Dec 26 17:07:33 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2004 17:07:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBSD Foundation goals Message-ID: <8B19F749-578A-11D9-B41C-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Maybe we shouldn't have announced to talk. From FreeBSDFoundation.org: 123% of the way to $32,000 2004 small (<8k) donation goal thanks to 839 generous donations! Woah. g From elric Sun Dec 26 17:58:32 2004 From: elric (Roland C. Dowdeswell) Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2004 17:58:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] encrypt home space In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 10 Dec 2004 12:17:08 EST." <20041210121708.720d336e@delinux.abwatley.com> Message-ID: <20041226225832.B64C8174D7@arioch.imrryr.org> On 1102699028 seconds since the Beginning of the UNIX epoch michael wrote: > >I really liked Roland's talk. I may be wrong but, cgd seems NetBSD >specific. Because of that, I'm leaning toward gbde. Has anyone tried >something similar to what I'm talking about? Thanks. GBDE is the only disk encryption that FreeBSD supports [that I've seen], so if you are unwilling to switch to NetBSD then that is what you'll need to use. I think that GBDE has a number of issues with it that I think that I mentioned in my talk, but since you went to the talk you already know about them. -- Roland Dowdeswell http://www.Imrryr.ORG/~elric/ From george Sun Dec 26 20:07:08 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2004 20:07:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] dmesg online Message-ID: Michael W. has done some good work integrating the dmesg section into the www site. He has added some functional and organizational changes, including reordering into columns and row. http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=dmesgd Some additional changes will happen in the future time-permitting. I'm sure he'd love some feedback. . . on this list should be fine. Other ideas we're looking at include: filtering by OS, architecture, etc. setting up a form-based contact method so inquiring browsers can contact the poster MW has done great work in reworking this aspect of the site, which generally pulls in 10-12% of our monthly web traffic. Big thanks to MW. g From mspitzer Sun Dec 26 21:59:06 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2004 21:59:06 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] dmesg online In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8c50a3c3041226185925db2950@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, 26 Dec 2004 20:07:08 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > MW has done great work in reworking this aspect of the site, which > generally pulls in 10-12% of our monthly web traffic. Big thanks to > MW. > > g > ok I'ill bite, what is our monthly numbers? marc From george Sun Dec 26 23:57:12 2004 From: george (George Georgalis) Date: Sun, 26 Dec 2004 23:57:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] dmesg online In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20041227045712.GB23634@sta.local> On Sun, Dec 26, 2004 at 08:07:08PM -0500, G Rosamond wrote: >Michael W. has done some good work integrating the dmesg section into >the www site. > >He has added some functional and organizational changes, including >reordering into columns and row. > >http://nycbug.org/index.php?NAV=dmesgd It's slick! // George -- George Georgalis, systems architect, administrator Linux BSD IXOYE http://galis.org/george/ cell:646-331-2027 mailto:george at galis.org From george Mon Dec 27 00:24:19 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 00:24:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] dmesg online In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c3041226185925db2950@mail.gmail.com> References: <8c50a3c3041226185925db2950@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8EF25D9B-57C7-11D9-8C3F-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 26, 2004, at 9:59 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > On Sun, 26 Dec 2004 20:07:08 -0500, G. Rosamond > wrote: >> >> MW has done great work in reworking this aspect of the site, which >> generally pulls in 10-12% of our monthly web traffic. Big thanks to >> MW. >> >> g >> > > ok I'ill bite, what is our monthly numbers? > > marc > up to 70000 a mo, but usually in the 45-50k a month range. . . g From george Mon Dec 27 01:18:21 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 01:18:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Firefox on CNet Message-ID: <1B5D3B2B-57CF-11D9-8C3F-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Interesting article. . . The major hurdle to Firefox growth is highlighted: the lack of respected standards in site design. http://news.com.com/New+Years+resolution+for+Firefox+Grow/2100-1032_3 -5502672.html?tag=nefd.top It's nice to see open standards being mentioned, and the growth of Firefox has certainly reraised that issue which really seemed dead and gone for a while now. . . I thought W3C had gone into exile. But why an ActiveX alternative to MS's ActiveX? Why not just banish it and it's security-deficiencies? g From lists Mon Dec 27 09:29:55 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 09:29:55 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] [OT] bsdjobs In-Reply-To: <20041219153256.H16977@neptune.atopia.net> References: <20041219153256.H16977@neptune.atopia.net> Message-ID: <20041227092835.L27347@zoraida.natserv.net> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004, Matt Juszczak wrote: > As I mentioned at the party to some people, I'm currently working on a site > (bsdjobs.net) that will be a 100% free, public, open, etc. bsdjobs site for > posting and viewing. I think it's a great idea. Once I was thinking of doing a general open source jobs site. May be more usefull and broader acceptance. Doing a BSD only site will generate less traffic, less posting and less chance of helping either employers or people looking for jobs. From lists Mon Dec 27 10:36:31 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 10:36:31 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups Message-ID: <20041227103227.I28861@zoraida.natserv.net> I have always wanted to try other BSDs besides FreeBSD, but lacked the hardware. Got myself a 3 HD machine and would like suggestions on multi OS setups. In particular I think I want from the get go FreeBSD, Windows XP, Windows 2000. Then, would like to try NetBSD, OpenBSD, some sort of Linux (never installed Linux at all, not even to see how it's like) and possibly one or both of the FreeBSD offshoots out there. Any suggestions? I was thinking to use the first drive for Win XP, FreeBSD. Second drive Win 2K and backup drive for the first. Third drive fully for testing. From mspitzer Mon Dec 27 10:53:55 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 10:53:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041227103227.I28861@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041227103227.I28861@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <8c50a3c3041227075314a25438@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, 27 Dec 2004 10:36:31 -0500 (EST), Francisco Reyes wrote: > I have always wanted to try other BSDs besides FreeBSD, but lacked the > hardware. > > Got myself a 3 HD machine and would like suggestions on multi OS setups. > In particular I think I want from the get go FreeBSD, Windows XP, Windows > 2000. beware multibooting can be a royal PITA, especialy if you keep playing with the installed OS's > > Then, would like to try NetBSD, OpenBSD, some sort of Linux (never > installed Linux at all, not even to see how it's like) and possibly one or > both of the FreeBSD offshoots out there. > > Any suggestions? take all of the hard drives out of the box and buy one of those ide disk caddy things and 3 cases for the hard drives. put what you want on each and swap them out as needed. And if you want to play with more os's just buy some more hard drives and go for it. Also there is the VMWare aproach but I have not played with it much. > > I was thinking to use the first drive for Win XP, FreeBSD. > Second drive Win 2K and backup drive for the first. > Third drive fully for testing. be very careful here, you can easly hose production data(ok your important stuff) here. Good luck, marc > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From scottro Mon Dec 27 11:04:11 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 11:04:11 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c3041227075314a25438@mail.gmail.com> References: <20041227103227.I28861@zoraida.natserv.net> <8c50a3c3041227075314a25438@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041227160411.GA7089@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mon, Dec 27, 2004 at 10:53:55AM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > On Mon, 27 Dec 2004 10:36:31 -0500 (EST), Francisco Reyes > wrote: > > I have always wanted to try other BSDs besides FreeBSD, but lacked the > > hardware. > > > > Got myself a 3 HD machine and would like suggestions on multi OS setups. > > In particular I think I want from the get go FreeBSD, Windows XP, Windows > > 2000. > > beware multibooting can be a royal PITA, especialy if you keep playing with > the installed OS's I have a few test boxes, and I find that as long as I remember which O/S has the bootloader, I'm good. :) I use Grub on one of the Linuxes (Linii?). I'd install the MS stuff first, as it'll overwrite the boot loader, then put in the FreeBSD without worrying about it booting, eg don't install a boot loader. Then, put in a Linux and choose grub for the bootloader. I have a grub page that might help you there, at http://home.nyc.rr.com/computertaijutsu/grub.html What Marc says about losing data is of course a risk, but it makes life more interesting. Seriously, I haven't lost data to an install in awhile, but I became more careful about it after once blithely deleting the wrong partitions. :) As for which Linux--heh, there are something like 362 distros (or some absurd figure like that.) Go to http://www.distrowatch.com and poke around. Basically there are the desktop, newcomer oriented ones, such as Mepis (which I keep somewhere as my I don't care if it's bloated as long as it Just Works(TM) distro), the source ones, popularized by Gentoo, the Debian based ones (usually behind in software selection, but stable) Slackware types, etc. Almost all of them have live CDs these days so you can play with it before installing it. As a BSD-er, Gentoo will seem rather familiar in many ways (Its creator, Daniel Robbins, worked with FreeBSD for awhile and ports inspired portage) and Slackware is also nice. ArchLinux is a nice newcomer, binary package management (similar in execution, at least, to Deb's apt-get) lean, requires a bit of knowledge to get running, very fast. I could go on, but why don't you look at Distrowatch, see what interests you and post about it, and then people can give more in-depth reviews for you. - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Joyce: Have we met? Spike: You hit me with an ax one time. Remember? Uh, 'Get the hell away from my daughter!' Joyce: Oh. So, do you, uh, live here in town? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFB0DJ7+lTVdes0Z9YRAkY/AKDEGuUBZhtOW1WgszbZ4UNf53JMLwCgxEB2 931KypqcoMnxBIF5uNdxGKY= =82YL -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From louis Mon Dec 27 13:41:45 2004 From: louis (Louis Zhang) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 13:41:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] OpenBSD 3.6 and Intel Motherboard Compatibility Message-ID: <110417291301@mercury.hosting4u.net> Does anyone know if the Intel SE7210 1U P4 motherboard is support by OpenBSD 3.6? Thanks Louis Zhang General Computer & Services, Inc. 10 West 37th St. 5th Floor New York, NY 10018 (212) 594-1074 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20041227/75a54895/attachment.html From george Mon Dec 27 14:42:06 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 14:42:06 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] OpenBSD 3.6 and Intel Motherboard Compatibility In-Reply-To: <110417291301@mercury.hosting4u.net> References: <110417291301@mercury.hosting4u.net> Message-ID: <6395E2B5-583F-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> On Dec 27, 2004, at 1:41 PM, Louis Zhang wrote: > Does anyone know if the Intel SE7210 1U P4 motherboard is support by > OpenBSD 3.6? > You should try our dmesgd, and that thing called Google. . . Of course, I did tell Louis to query the list. . . g From lists Mon Dec 27 14:46:07 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 14:46:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041227160411.GA7089@scottro11.homeunix.net> References: <20041227103227.I28861@zoraida.natserv.net> <8c50a3c3041227075314a25438@mail.gmail.com> <20041227160411.GA7089@scottro11.homeunix.net> Message-ID: <20041227144049.C31428@zoraida.natserv.net> On Mon, 27 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > I use Grub on one of the Linuxes (Linii?). Would this be better than the FreeBSD boot loader? If so why? > I'd install the MS stuff > first, as it'll overwrite the boot loader That is my plan. > What Marc says about losing data is of course a risk I plan to install all the "real OSs" before I put any data. Since I plan to use a dedicated drive to play around I hope that will minimize the risks of loosing data. Plan to backup anyways, just in case. From george Mon Dec 27 15:09:56 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 15:09:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Streaming Server on BSD Message-ID: <472589E4-5843-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Anyone have experience with the Darwin Streaming Server on a BSD? Seems to be the only streaming server port on freshports . . . g From sunny-ml Mon Dec 27 15:15:49 2004 From: sunny-ml (Sunny Dubey) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 15:15:49 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Streaming Server on BSD In-Reply-To: <472589E4-5843-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <472589E4-5843-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <200412271515.50892.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> On Monday 27 December 2004 15:09, G. Rosamond wrote: > Seems to be the only streaming server port on freshports . . . > look for VLC (might be called vls) www.videolan.org for more info Sunny Dubey From george Mon Dec 27 15:20:21 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 15:20:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Streaming Server on BSD In-Reply-To: <200412271515.50892.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> References: <472589E4-5843-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <200412271515.50892.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> Message-ID: On Dec 27, 2004, at 3:15 PM, Sunny Dubey wrote: > On Monday 27 December 2004 15:09, G. Rosamond wrote: > >> Seems to be the only streaming server port on freshports . . . >> > > look for VLC (might be called vls) > > www.videolan.org for more info > Cool. . . thanks sunny. . . just what I was looking for . . . Do you have experience with it? g From sunny-ml Mon Dec 27 15:24:09 2004 From: sunny-ml (Sunny Dubey) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 15:24:09 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Streaming Server on BSD In-Reply-To: References: <472589E4-5843-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <200412271515.50892.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> Message-ID: <200412271524.10079.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> On Monday 27 December 2004 15:20, G. Rosamond wrote: > Cool. . . thanks sunny. . . just what I was looking for . . . > > Do you have experience with it? Yes I've found it a vastly better solution than Real's free binary only linux only streaming server software. Sunny Dubey From scottro Mon Dec 27 15:50:50 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 15:50:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041227144049.C31428@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041227103227.I28861@zoraida.natserv.net> <8c50a3c3041227075314a25438@mail.gmail.com> <20041227160411.GA7089@scottro11.homeunix.net> <20041227144049.C31428@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <20041227205050.GA22825@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mon, Dec 27, 2004 at 02:46:07PM -0500, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Mon, 27 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > > >I use Grub on one of the Linuxes (Linii?). > > Would this be better than the FreeBSD boot loader? If so why? Yes. Because I said so. Seriously, Grub is far easier to configure and, more importantly in a case like this, to reconfigure. There is also a bootloader called GAG which some folks prefer. I prefer Grub because if I put in one distribution, it's the only bootloader that I have to install. If you use GAG, you have to install grub on the root partition of each Linux you use. > > >What Marc says about losing data is of course a risk > > I plan to install all the "real OSs" before I put any data. > Since I plan to use a dedicated drive to play around I hope that will > minimize the risks of loosing data. Plan to backup anyways, just in case. Never hurts--of course, it's just when you get cocky that you say, "Hrrm, I can skip the backup this time" and we all know what happens ~that~ time. :) - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Buffy: Ampata wasn't evil. At least, not to begin with. And...I do think she cared about you. Xander: Yeah, but I think that whole sucking the life out of people thing would've been a strain on the relationship. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (FreeBSD) iD4DBQFB0HWq+lTVdes0Z9YRAtMEAJjmwQ0kzqbdyKefgz5Q7n7dxCojAJ41AOFj iBvAGfzyHP2JtuY1X44v4g== =8rll -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From sunny-ml Mon Dec 27 19:48:27 2004 From: sunny-ml (Sunny Dubey) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 19:48:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] dmesg online In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200412271948.27970.sunny-ml@opencurve.org> On Sunday 26 December 2004 20:07, G. Rosamond wrote: > Other ideas we're looking at include: > > filtering by OS, architecture, etc. good thing my netbsd running toaster is still there!! http://nycbug.org/?NAV=dmesgd&dmesgd_criteria=NetBSD&dmesgid=286#286 (some bastard on netbsd-user@ stole it and claimed it to be his own creation. He didn't even bother to fix the typos and such. What a great open source user!!) ~sd From mikel.king Tue Dec 28 02:15:33 2004 From: mikel.king (Mikel King) Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 02:15:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Streaming Server on BSD In-Reply-To: <472589E4-5843-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> References: <472589E4-5843-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Message-ID: <41D10815.7000108@ocsny.com> G. Rosamond wrote: > Anyone have experience with the Darwin Streaming Server on a BSD? > > Seems to be the only streaming server port on freshports . . . > > g > I set it up once back when it was first released...I found real to be a far bit easier to get going then...I'm sure they've made improvements since... As for streaming servers, depends on the content...there's a streamer there for vlc, and of course there's mod_mp3. There was a project for porting Helix to FreeBSD, but I don't know the stat of it right now... -- Cheers, Mikel King Optimized Computer Solutions, INC 39 West Fourteenth Street Second Floor New York, NY 10011 http://www.ocsny.com t: 212.727.2100x132 +------------------------------------------+ You may like them. You will see. You may like them in a tree. http://www.FreeBSD.org http://www.OpenOffice.org http://www.Mozilla.org +------------------------------------------+ How do you spell cooperation? Pessimists use each other, but optimists help each other. Collaboration feeds your spirit, while competition only stokes your ego. You'll find the best way to get along. +------------------------------------------+ From spork Mon Dec 27 21:22:01 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 21:22:01 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Streaming Server on BSD In-Reply-To: <41D10815.7000108@ocsny.com> References: <472589E4-5843-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <41D10815.7000108@ocsny.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 28 Dec 2004, Mikel King wrote: > As for streaming servers, depends on the content...there's a streamer there > for vlc, and of course there's mod_mp3. On the video side, I've used vlc as a client on my Mac quite a bit. With the vlc streaming server though, what common players (read: Windows) can view the stream? The last time I looked at all this mess, I had a hard time figuring it out. I still run a real networks freebie server. It's a bit of work to setup, but the one I'm running is FreeBSD native and it works well. It really wants to run as root, so there's some fiddling with ipf there to redirect the standard rtsp port to something the priv-less real server user can grab. Charles > -- > Cheers, > Mikel King > Optimized Computer Solutions, INC > 39 West Fourteenth Street > Second Floor > New York, NY 10011 > http://www.ocsny.com > t: 212.727.2100x132 > +------------------------------------------+ > You may like them. You will see. You may > like them in a tree. > http://www.FreeBSD.org > http://www.OpenOffice.org > http://www.Mozilla.org > +------------------------------------------+ > How do you spell cooperation? Pessimists use > each other, but optimists help each other. > Collaboration feeds your spirit, while > competition only stokes your ego. You'll > find the best way to get along. > +------------------------------------------+ > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From tux Mon Dec 27 23:44:22 2004 From: tux (Kevin Reiter) Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2004 23:44:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Streaming Server on BSD References: <472589E4-5843-11D9-9A83-000D9328615E@sddi.net> <41D10815.7000108@ocsny.com> Message-ID: <001c01c4ec97$e67bb3e0$6400a8c0@olympus> : As for streaming servers, depends on the content...there's a streamer : there for vlc, and of course there's mod_mp3. Don't forget icecast for streaming audio. I'm known for setting that up at all of my previous employer's locations (without them knowing it), and almost all of them are still running it, now that they know what it is :) From george Wed Dec 29 02:59:44 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2004 02:59:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] EPIC resolutions Message-ID: <9A3FAE90-596F-11D9-88FA-000D9328615E@sddi.net> Useful for your new year's. . . care of Mr. Schneier: http://www.epic.org/privacy/2004tips.html From spork Wed Dec 29 18:14:20 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2004 18:14:20 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD + OS-X TCP slowness Message-ID: Howdy, I have an odd problem at home. I have a FreeBSD box offering up web dav and afp to the Macs in the house. Transfers via either are very slow (200KB/S), also confirmed with simple ftp. UDP NFS is way fast. Transfers between OS-X and an OpenBSD box are quick (4-6 MB/S), and transfers between the OpenBSD box and the FreeBSD box are similarly fast. So it looks specific to the two OSes talking to each other via TCP. The FreeBSD box has done this under 4.8 and 4.10. Before I randomly start twiddling sysctl knobs, any ideas? Thanks, Charles From lists Thu Dec 30 13:23:41 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 13:23:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] OT: Satellite radio Message-ID: <20041230132225.X83977@zoraida.natserv.net> Anyone has tried satellite radio? I am curious in particular how it would work inside a building away from the windows. :-) At the desk I am at my cell barely has a signal. :-( From hans Thu Dec 30 13:47:52 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 10:47:52 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] OT: Satellite radio Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348CFC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > Anyone has tried satellite radio? > I am curious in particular how it would work inside a building away from > the windows. :-) Never used it myself, but if you try it, try Sirius (SIRI). Not that have shares or anything :) H From lists Thu Dec 30 13:55:36 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 13:55:36 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] OT: Satellite radio In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348CFC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348CFC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <20041230135448.G84379@zoraida.natserv.net> On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, Hans Zaunere wrote: > Never used it myself, but if you try it, try Sirius (SIRI). Not that > have shares or anything :) How come? What, if anything is better about it? It seems XM has more subscribers so far. From lists Thu Dec 30 13:58:07 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 13:58:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041227160411.GA7089@scottro11.homeunix.net> References: <20041227103227.I28861@zoraida.natserv.net> <8c50a3c3041227075314a25438@mail.gmail.com> <20041227160411.GA7089@scottro11.homeunix.net> Message-ID: <20041230135703.R84379@zoraida.natserv.net> On Mon, 27 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > I use Grub on one of the Linuxes (Linii?). .... > http://home.nyc.rr.com/computertaijutsu/grub.html I see there is a port in FreeBSD for grub, however it seems one also needs to make a boot disk. What if one doesn't have a floppy in the machine? :-( From jhlists Thu Dec 30 14:29:57 2004 From: jhlists (Jonathan Hirschman) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 14:29:57 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] OT: Satellite radio In-Reply-To: <20041230132225.X83977@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041230132225.X83977@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <41D45735.2040300@hirschman.net> Francisco Reyes wrote: > Anyone has tried satellite radio? > I am curious in particular how it would work inside a building away from > the windows. :-) > > At the desk I am at my cell barely has a signal. :-( My GF works for XM Radio. I'm becoming a big fan, although I haven't heard Sirius yet. I'm told that Sirius has better music for what I listen to. It needs a window for the antenna. Note that you can some VERY long antenna cables, and they're small. You might be able to run one from your desk to a window. Better OUT the window. Note that both companies have many, many terrestrial ground "repeaters" (it is arguable whether either is truly satellite radio, but that's a different story). You may find that one works better in a given location than the other. Also, this may be helpful: XM has the MyFi. It is a "walkman" style sat radio reciever with Tivo-like functionality - it has a 5 hour record buffer. Seems every employee got one w/ lifetime sub under the tree this year from Big Santa XM. It'll be mine today, bwah hah hah :) Not sure that I want it tho... we'll see. JH From john Thu Dec 30 14:45:34 2004 From: john (John Bacall) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 14:45:34 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] OT: Satellite radio In-Reply-To: <20041230135448.G84379@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348CFC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> <20041230135448.G84379@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <200412301445.34919.john@unixen.org> On Thursday 30 December 2004 01:55 pm, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, Hans Zaunere wrote: > > Never used it myself, but if you try it, try Sirius (SIRI). Not > > that have shares or anything :) > > How come? > What, if anything is better about it? > It seems XM has more subscribers so far. Ha. Funny you should mention that, I was flipping through the Crutchfield, http://www.crutchfield.com/guides/satellite/guide02.html paper catalog, last night, and I tried to decipher the offerings. No outstanding insight popped out as to what the real dif' is. Seen the portable XM (I think) gadget for offer? Nice, but at $350.00 it's too much, too ugly. Can't wait till these things miniuturize, and are popped into your mp3 player. Speaking of electronics, and cable TV, anyone seen this, http://www.nytimes.com/2004/12/30/technology/circuits/30stat.html?8br=&pagewanted=all&position= >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Streamlined Cable TV in a Card WHAT if I told you about a new product that could improve your TV picture, eliminate one of your remote controls, simplify your home-theater setup and save you money every month? And then what if I told you that your local distributor wished, in its heart of hearts, that nobody even knew about it? The brilliant invention really exists. It's the CableCard, a small metal card (a so-called PC card, actually, like the ones designed for laptops) that slides into a slot on the back of many new high-definition TV sets from nearly every manufacturer. The CableCard's simple mission is to eliminate your cable box. The card stores all the account information that used to be monitored by the box, like descramblers for your movie channels - a bit of circuitry miniaturization that's about 15 years overdue. Life without a cable box is blissfully simple. The cable-TV cable from the wall plugs directly into the TV. You change channels using the TV's own remote control. (Both the box and its remote go back to the mother ship. Incidentally, getting rid of the box makes an especially big difference when it comes to smaller screens, like kitchen-counter TV's.) ... <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Living in NYC, we've always been stuck with a cable TV `one-channel at a time, per feed, we don't trust you fuckers' tuning options. All the cures are piles of more setop boxes. *eek* A pain in the ass. Not that this is an antidote. As everyone of course knows, non-cityside dwellers are trusty fuckers. John 8-) From unixenigma Thu Dec 30 14:51:46 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 11:51:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041230135703.R84379@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <20041230195146.74772.qmail@web53901.mail.yahoo.com> --- Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Mon, 27 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > > > I use Grub on one of the Linuxes (Linii?). > .... > > http://home.nyc.rr.com/computertaijutsu/grub.html > > I see there is a port in FreeBSD for grub, however > it seems one also needs > to make a boot disk. What if one doesn't have a > floppy in the machine? :-( > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce > lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > Well usually they must have some boot CD image as well... If not there, than do your own bootable CD with the GRUB stuff on it. However, the best multi booter is of course - GAG I found it to be the best. http://gag.sourceforge.net/ Also has all kind of features and CD bootable image. "Allows boot of up to 9 different operating systems" Just don't get carried away :) GT __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From scottro Thu Dec 30 14:56:50 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 14:56:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041230135703.R84379@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041227103227.I28861@zoraida.natserv.net> <8c50a3c3041227075314a25438@mail.gmail.com> <20041227160411.GA7089@scottro11.homeunix.net> <20041230135703.R84379@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <20041230195650.GB83917@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Thu, Dec 30, 2004 at 01:58:07PM -0500, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Mon, 27 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > > >I use Grub on one of the Linuxes (Linii?). > .... > >http://home.nyc.rr.com/computertaijutsu/grub.html > > I see there is a port in FreeBSD for grub, however it seems one also needs > to make a boot disk. What if one doesn't have a floppy in the machine? :-( I've used FreeBSD's grub before--it was awhile back, but I'm sure I didn't have to make a boot disk. I'm not making a guarantee here, however, I know that you don't have to in NetBSD, - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Buffy: It's weird, though. In this way, I feel like he's still watching me. Willow: Well, in a way he sort of is...in the way of that he's right over there. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFB1F2C+lTVdes0Z9YRAq1LAJ0ZBjEROUeYxZIvDb9LVWME8TVOGwCfU+84 JSH8opRWdE019b0IcliofUA= =hkK3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From spork Thu Dec 30 15:44:17 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 15:44:17 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] OT: Satellite radio In-Reply-To: <20041230135448.G84379@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348CFC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> <20041230135448.G84379@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, Hans Zaunere wrote: > >> Never used it myself, but if you try it, try Sirius (SIRI). Not that >> have shares or anything :) > > > How come? Pump up the stock price. :) > What, if anything is better about it? > It seems XM has more subscribers so far. It's a tough choice. Most of the Sirius programming looks more attractive to me. It seems each service has a few "exclusives" (Sirius has a number of NPR programs) so you miss out on *something* unless you get both. XM on the other hand has some really cool receivers, including the portable one that you can walk around with... I'm waiting til they drop to $5/month. :) C > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From hans Thu Dec 30 19:27:29 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 16:27:29 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYPHP.org Server Upgrade Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348E95@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Hey folks, The servers will be offline for about 30 minutes while I do a standard upgrade of the base system. This includes all jails that the underlying system provides. I'll post out another message when things are back online to ensure everything is kosher. Regards, --- Hans Zaunere President, Founder New York PHP http://www.nyphp.org From hans Thu Dec 30 21:51:38 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 18:51:38 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYPHP.org Server Upgrade Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348EC8@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Everything is back online and should be functioning without a problem. If there are any issues, contact me offlist. > -----Original Message----- > From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Hans Zaunere > Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2004 7:27 PM > To: NYPHP Talk; nycbug List > Cc: Ben Ramsey > Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYPHP.org Server Upgrade > > > Hey folks, > > The servers will be offline for about 30 minutes while I do a standard > upgrade of the base system. This includes all jails that the underlying > system provides. > > I'll post out another message when things are back online to ensure > everything is kosher. > > Regards, > > > --- > Hans Zaunere > President, Founder > New York PHP > http://www.nyphp.org > > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month From hans Thu Dec 30 21:57:46 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 18:57:46 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] /usr/src/release/sysinstall and FreeBSD 4.11 Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348ECC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> So I just did a makeworld to 4.11 STABLE and everything panned out nicely. However, one odd occurrence was the lack of /usr/src/release/sysinstall. I typically go into that directory and do a make all install, but that directory (actually, all of /usr/src/release) doesn't exist anymore. Am I missing an update or some change somewhere? Thanks, --- Hans Zaunere President, Founder New York PHP http://www.nyphp.org From spork Thu Dec 30 22:03:54 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 22:03:54 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] /usr/src/release/sysinstall and FreeBSD 4.11 In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348ECC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348ECC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, Hans Zaunere wrote: > So I just did a makeworld to 4.11 STABLE and everything panned out > nicely. > > However, one odd occurrence was the lack of /usr/src/release/sysinstall. > I typically go into that directory and do a make all install, but that > directory (actually, all of /usr/src/release) doesn't exist anymore. Am > I missing an update or some change somewhere? Any chance that in your supfile you aren't specifying the "release" target? Also have a look at /usr/sup/refuse. Charles > Thanks, > > > --- > Hans Zaunere > President, Founder > New York PHP > http://www.nyphp.org > > > _______________________________________________ > % NYC*BUG talk mailing list > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > %Be sure to check out our Jobs and NYCBUG-announce lists > %We meet the first Wednesday of the month > From mspitzer Thu Dec 30 22:13:51 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 22:13:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] /usr/src/release/sysinstall and FreeBSD 4.11 In-Reply-To: References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348ECC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <8c50a3c304123019133f2ca961@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, 30 Dec 2004 22:03:54 -0500 (EST), Charles Sprickman wrote: > On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, Hans Zaunere wrote: > > > So I just did a makeworld to 4.11 STABLE and everything panned out > > nicely. > > > > However, one odd occurrence was the lack of /usr/src/release/sysinstall. > > I typically go into that directory and do a make all install, but that > > directory (actually, all of /usr/src/release) doesn't exist anymore. Am > > I missing an update or some change somewhere? > > Any chance that in your supfile you aren't specifying the "release" > target? Also have a look at /usr/sup/refuse. > > Charles /usr/src/release is there in my 4.11 laptop, try running cvsup again? marc From scottro Thu Dec 30 22:49:13 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 22:49:13 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] /usr/src/release/sysinstall and FreeBSD 4.11 In-Reply-To: <8c50a3c304123019133f2ca961@mail.gmail.com> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348ECC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> <8c50a3c304123019133f2ca961@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20041231034913.GB85966@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Thu, Dec 30, 2004 at 10:13:51PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > On Thu, 30 Dec 2004 22:03:54 -0500 (EST), Charles Sprickman > wrote: > > On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, Hans Zaunere wrote: > > > > > > > > However, one odd occurrence was the lack of /usr/src/release/sysinstall. > > > I typically go into that directory and do a make all install, but that > > > directory (actually, all of /usr/src/release) doesn't exist anymore. Am > > > I missing an update or some change somewhere? > > > > Any chance that in your supfile you aren't specifying the "release" > > target? Also have a look at /usr/sup/refuse. > > > > Charles > > /usr/src/release is there in my 4.11 laptop, try running cvsup again? > > marc You fiend!! You stole his /usr/src/release and put it in your laptop?? Give it back!! Unwinding after a rough day, - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Gunn: Fair Cordelia. You still savin' my life? Cordelia: Every minute. Gunn: How's that workin' out? Cordelia: You're alive aren't you? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFB1Mw5+lTVdes0Z9YRArvFAKCePZFWWGu3be7j7A9m4Y3DI8IccACgjfa2 9yIs6PKcZQEK+keUsQ8Q7l4= =X3O5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From mspitzer Thu Dec 30 22:55:48 2004 From: mspitzer (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2004 22:55:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] /usr/src/release/sysinstall and FreeBSD 4.11 In-Reply-To: <20041231034913.GB85966@scottro11.homeunix.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348ECC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> <8c50a3c304123019133f2ca961@mail.gmail.com> <20041231034913.GB85966@scottro11.homeunix.net> Message-ID: <8c50a3c304123019551c1e0a3b@mail.gmail.com> > > > You fiend!! You stole his /usr/src/release and put it in your laptop?? > Give it back!! > no From lists Fri Dec 31 11:01:50 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 11:01:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041230195146.74772.qmail@web53901.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20041230195146.74772.qmail@web53901.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20041231105606.V622@zoraida.natserv.net> On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, G T wrote: > However, the best multi booter is of course - GAG > I found it to be the best. > http://gag.sourceforge.net/ Thanks a ton for the link. Got Win 2k, Win XP and FreeBSD 5.X stable up. I must agree it's a great program. I also liked that one can save the configuration to floppy besides HD. Great as a backup (if one has a floppy disk). I found the spanish download pages to be funny. The author is spanish speaking. Most of the docs are in english, but he then has a file with spanish instructions and he wrote something like "spanish instructions so you don't have an excuse that you could not read the english instructions". :-) Although the program ONLY supports 9 boots I think of an easy way to handle more. Save a different configuration on a floppy. :-) Although I can't think ever having more than 4 or 5 bootable partitions. From scottro Fri Dec 31 11:12:18 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 11:12:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041231105606.V622@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041230195146.74772.qmail@web53901.mail.yahoo.com> <20041231105606.V622@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <20041231161218.GD4693@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Fri, Dec 31, 2004 at 11:01:50AM -0500, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, G T wrote: > > >However, the best multi booter is of course - GAG > >I found it to be the best. > >http://gag.sourceforge.net/ > > > Thanks a ton for the link. > Got Win 2k, Win XP and FreeBSD 5.X stable up. > I must agree it's a great program. I also liked that one can save the > configuration to floppy besides HD. Great as a backup (if one has a floppy > disk). Now, when you install the various Linux distros (don't know if it specifies this in the instructions, it's been awhile since I used it) be sure to install grub or lilo in the root partition--that is, if the Linux distro is on (in Linux parlance) /dev/hdb1, 1st partition, 2nd hard drive) install grub in its root partition, the /dev/hdb1. Most of the time, they'll ask do you want grub in the mbr or distro's root partition. With gag, if you don't have either lilo or grub installed in that root partition, gag won't be able to boot that distro. (That's the main reason I use grub, because with grub, I only have to install it in one distro, and if I have three on a machine, I don't have to install it in the other two--not that it's a big deal either way, but just one less thing to think about). - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Buffy: Besides, it's kind of my job. Spike: For now. Buffy: What, you want me to stop working? Spike: Well, let's see - do I want you to give up killing my friends? Yeah, I've given it some thought. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFB1Xpi+lTVdes0Z9YRAuXWAJ47AljcSUJDeDrLYBXF91LN1Jg1tgCeJzow i5cFDzKaIDJ67BKe9GXGnPE= =XjZZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From hans Fri Dec 31 11:41:03 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 08:41:03 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] /usr/src/release/sysinstall and FreeBSD 4.11 Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348F91@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > So I just did a makeworld to 4.11 STABLE and everything panned out > > nicely. > > > > However, one odd occurrence was the lack of /usr/src/release/sysinstall. > > I typically go into that directory and do a make all install, but that > > directory (actually, all of /usr/src/release) doesn't exist anymore. Am > > I missing an update or some change somewhere? > > Any chance that in your supfile you aren't specifying the "release" I do have src-release commented, but I have in the past, and always seemed to get release - perhaps something changed, or I just confused myself. > target? Also have a look at /usr/sup/refuse. refuse is ok - just blocking foreign languages. I uncommented src-release and it pulled in what I expected. Those damn system gnomes must have changed my config file :) Thanks, H From hans Fri Dec 31 11:44:56 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 08:44:56 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] OT: Satellite radio Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348F97@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > Never used it myself, but if you try it, try Sirius (SIRI). Not that > > have shares or anything :) > > > How come? > What, if anything is better about it? > It seems XM has more subscribers so far. I've heard they have better programming and exclusive shows (like Stern, for example). While XM has more subscribers total, SIRI's subscriber base has been increasing much faster. That, and the buzz around satellite radio surrounds SIRI more than XM these days. Please note, however, and DISCLAIMER: I own stock in SIRI, not XM, so these views could be skewed. That said, I have done research on both companies, and decided to go with SIRI (I was in at 2, out at 3, and now back in - wish I would have held it since it's at 8 :( H From lists Fri Dec 31 11:58:40 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 11:58:40 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] /usr/src/release/sysinstall and FreeBSD 4.11 In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348F91@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348F91@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <20041231115840.4286d7bf@delinux.abwatley.com> On Fri, 31 Dec 2004 08:41:03 -0800 "Hans Zaunere" wrote: > > I do have src-release commented, but I have in the past, and always > seemed to get release - perhaps something changed, or I just confused > myself. > My FreeBSD 6.0-CURRENT boxes do not have that directory. Have you run a dmesg or uname -a ? Michael -- --- From unixenigma Fri Dec 31 12:02:06 2004 From: unixenigma (G T) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 09:02:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Happy 2005 New Year! Message-ID: <20041231170207.99180.qmail@web53904.mail.yahoo.com> Let your all wishes come true next year. Happiness, health and prosperity to you and your family. All the best. Enjoy the New Year's Party. GT __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From hans Fri Dec 31 12:14:44 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 09:14:44 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] /usr/src/release/sysinstall and FreeBSD 4.11 Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348FAA@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > I do have src-release commented, but I have in the past, and always > > seemed to get release - perhaps something changed, or I just confused > > myself. > > > > My FreeBSD 6.0-CURRENT boxes do not have that directory. > Have you run a dmesg or uname -a ? Yeah - it's still good old 4.x (4.11 STABLE to be exact). H From lists Fri Dec 31 13:15:04 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 13:15:04 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] OT: Satellite radio In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348F97@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8707348F97@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <20041231130933.Q2226@zoraida.natserv.net> On Fri, 31 Dec 2004, Hans Zaunere wrote: > I've heard they have better programming and exclusive shows (like Stern, > for example). What would really be great is a radio that could play both. > companies, and decided to go with SIRI (I was in at 2, out at 3, and now > back in - wish I would have held it since it's at 8 :( Investing in stocks is such a gamble.. :-( The only thing I think tends to be true is that stocks usually are best held over a long time, as long as it is a stable company and the management doesn't do anything really silly or illegal (and get caught). From lists Fri Dec 31 13:19:09 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 13:19:09 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041231161218.GD4693@scottro11.homeunix.net> References: <20041230195146.74772.qmail@web53901.mail.yahoo.com> <20041231105606.V622@zoraida.natserv.net> <20041231161218.GD4693@scottro11.homeunix.net> Message-ID: <20041231131715.W2226@zoraida.natserv.net> On Fri, 31 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > With gag, if you don't have either lilo or grub installed in that root > partition, gag won't be able to boot that distro. Thanks for the pointer. Will keep that in mind. I probably will only install Linux once to take a peek (probably SUSE since an associate of mine uses it), so that extra step is not too bad. I am hoping to spend more time playing around with the BSDs, in particular want to get more familiar with OpenBSD. From scottro Fri Dec 31 13:34:02 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2004 13:34:02 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Multi OS setups In-Reply-To: <20041231131715.W2226@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20041230195146.74772.qmail@web53901.mail.yahoo.com> <20041231105606.V622@zoraida.natserv.net> <20041231161218.GD4693@scottro11.homeunix.net> <20041231131715.W2226@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <20041231183402.GA5968@scottro11.homeunix.net> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Fri, Dec 31, 2004 at 01:19:09PM -0500, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Fri, 31 Dec 2004, Scott Robbins wrote: > > >With gag, if you don't have either lilo or grub installed in that root > >partition, gag won't be able to boot that distro. > > Thanks for the pointer. Will keep that in mind. > I probably will only install Linux once to take a peek (probably SUSE > since an associate of mine uses it), so that extra step is not too bad. > > I am hoping to spend more time playing around with the BSDs, in particular > want to get more familiar with OpenBSD. I believe the same caveat will apply. (Could be wrong though). Be sure to install its bootloader, just not in the MBR. - -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Xander: And this...is called a snack food. Ampata: Snack food? Xander: Yeah. It's a delicious, spongy, golden cake stuffed with a delightful, creamy white substance of goodness. Xander: And the exciting part is that they have no ingredients that a human can pronounce, so it doesn't leave you with that heavy food feeling in your stomach. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFB1Zua+lTVdes0Z9YRAmmIAJwMw7Fg/Ya9iVXEAz2U+Arv+xvyYACgw4A6 sfAq+Ey1JYZFw8K5ttYLNb8= =MWoB -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----