From george Thu Jan 1 22:43:04 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2004 22:43:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] next tuesday Message-ID: as soon as wes can confirm that we can use sage for our tuesday meeting, we can finalize. i'll work on agenda and send to all for discussion before meeting. g From wes Sun Jan 4 02:49:41 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 02:49:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] next tuesday In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2247.24.189.246.95.1073202581.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Sorry guys -- was traveling the past week without internet access (oh my god! how did I survive?). Just caught up. Yes, tues at 6:30 at our office is fine. addr: 116 W 23rd St, 5th floor my office extension, in case there are any problems: 646-375-2302 come one come all -- I'll provide some basic consumables (chips, soft drinks) and a few six packs. Wes PS: I initiated talks with Tekserve, and got the name of the person who we need to talk to -- Dave Cook -- they've provided meeting space for user groups in the past, I think they'll be amenable to us. Time of day might be an issue though. I'll try to set up a meeting with him for 6pm -- if I can, perhaps a few might want to join me. Will keep ya posted. > as soon as wes can confirm that we can use sage for our tuesday meeting, > we can finalize. > > i'll work on agenda and send to all for discussion before meeting. > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From george Sun Jan 4 08:15:48 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 08:15:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] next tuesday In-Reply-To: <2247.24.189.246.95.1073202581.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: ->Sorry guys -- was traveling the past week without internet ->access (oh my god! how did I survive?). Just caught up. Yes, ->tues at 6:30 at our office is fine. i don't know if i could deal. when i got to poland with the wife, it's a nightmare to be on a e-1 that moves like a 14.4 in an internet cafe. but without even that? woah. ->addr: 116 W 23rd St, 5th floor ->my office extension, in case there are any problems: 646-375-2302 -> ->come one come all -- I'll provide some basic consumables (chips, soft ->drinks) and a few six packs. great. ->PS: I initiated talks with Tekserve, and got the name of the ->person who we need to talk to -- Dave Cook -- they've ->provided meeting space for user groups in the past, I think ->they'll be amenable to us. Time of day might be an issue ->though. I'll try to set up a meeting with him for 6pm -- if I ->can, perhaps a few might want to join me. Will keep ya posted. i'm there. send confirm. i stopped by and tried to find aaron there one day, but he wasn't around. i met him through bsdmall at macworld over the summer. agenda is coming. g From george Sun Jan 4 08:43:57 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 08:43:57 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] meeting on tuesday Message-ID: who *can't* make it for the tuesday planning meeting? who *can*? g From klimenta Sun Jan 4 09:23:26 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 09:23:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] meeting on tuesday References: Message-ID: <006301c3d2ce$5963e240$8d0d1b44@vinyl.tkvbp.com> > who *can't* make it for the tuesday planning meeting? > > who *can*? This time I am coming. From lists Sun Jan 4 12:11:53 2004 From: lists (Lists) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 12:11:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] next tuesday In-Reply-To: <2247.24.189.246.95.1073202581.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <2247.24.189.246.95.1073202581.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <20040104121153.462579bb.lists@genoverly.net> On Sun, 4 Jan 2004 02:49:41 -0500 (EST) "Wes Sonnenreich" wrote: > Yes, tues at 6:30 at our office > addr: 116 W 23rd St, 5th floor > I'm in.. what's the cross street? (All subway lines stop on 23rd) That is SageSecure, right? Is there a suite number or is it pretty obvious? Michael From hans Sun Jan 4 13:46:32 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 13:46:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] meeting on tuesday Message-ID: <688BD1502D7CA547800722B3501F62BB59DE05@ms03.mailstreet2003.net> > who *can*? +1 From mspitze1 Sun Jan 4 15:24:50 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2004 15:24:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] meeting on tuesday In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040104152450.655b70bc.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Sun, 04 Jan 2004 08:43:57 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > who *can't* make it for the tuesday planning meeting? > > who *can*? I will be there marc > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From george Mon Jan 5 22:54:28 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 22:54:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYCBUG Agenda Message-ID: <004a01c3d408$c8fe1ef0$6901a8c0@defbox> been very busy. . .but sorry for delay agenda is attached, along with announcement spiel, and list of places to advertise NYCBUG, bof and first meeting. comments appreciated, asap. i've been adding to the list, but i'm sure i forgot some things. . . see you all tomorrow at 6:30 at sage. g -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: AnnounceList.txt Url: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040105/1a9331af/attachment.txt -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: AnnouceSpiel.txt Url: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040105/1a9331af/attachment-0001.txt -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: Agenda010604.txt Url: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040105/1a9331af/attachment-0002.txt From george Tue Jan 6 13:33:33 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2004 13:33:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Tonight's Planning Meeting Message-ID: can someone shoot me wes' address. . . oops. g 917-968-1900 From wes Tue Jan 6 14:38:25 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2004 14:38:25 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Tonight's Planning Meeting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <12490.38.233.93.150.1073417905.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> 116 w 23rd St. 5th floor. 617.642.7101 > can someone shoot me wes' address. . . > > oops. > > g > 917-968-1900 > > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From George Tue Jan 6 15:32:53 2004 From: George (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2004 15:32:53 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Tonight's Planning Meeting In-Reply-To: <12490.38.233.93.150.1073417905.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <12490.38.233.93.150.1073417905.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <19911.208.37.164.162.1073421173.squirrel@mail.sddi.net> thanks. . .lost your card, but it was also on the www site. . . duh. g A wise person once said. . . Wes Sonnenreich > 116 w 23rd St. 5th floor. 617.642.7101 > >> can someone shoot me wes' address. . . >> >> oops. >> >> g >> 917-968-1900 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> talk mailing list >> talk at lists.nycbug.org >> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk >> > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * G. Rosamond Secure Design & Development, Inc. 917-968-1900 www.sddi.net George at sddi.net From george Tue Jan 6 22:10:10 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2004 22:10:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] 2nd Planning Meeting for NYCBUG 01/06/04 notes Message-ID: NYCBUG Planning Meeting January 6, 2004 notes by GEORGE present were: Kliment Marc Hans Wes Michael George Announcement Spiel Much discussion about spiel that will go on lists and www sites. (note that there were no comments when posted to the list in mid-December). Main points were emphasis and structure. Meeting title for Feb 4 determined to be "Secure by Default: Learning from OpenBSD." GEORGE will provide updated version shortly, and all can begin distributing. HANS will send him copy from today's meeting. !!!Everyone should have NYCBUG.org aliases to post announcement!!! Distribution broken down as follows: * Deja/usenet, covering all BSD and Mac lists, MARC * Mailing lists, advocacy & chat: FreeBSD, GEORGE OpenBSD, WES NetBSD, ARON Darwin/Mac, MARC * Sites Daemon News, GEORGE Deadly.org, WES bsdforums.org, MICHAEL bsdvault.net, KLIMENT bsdhound.com, GEORGE kerneltrap.org, KLIMENT rootprompt.org, HANS bsdatwork.com, MICHAEL bsdnet.org, MARC freebsddiary.org, GEORGE bsdusergroup.org, GEORGE other BUGS, GEORGE * IRC, KLIMENT And of course, everyone is encouraged to go through bookmarks and add to the list. It's a good idea to tell others via list other locations announcement is posted. BOF Meeting ARON isn't present, he was responsible for fliers for BOF & Feb 4th meeting flier. Vistaprint.com doesn't do fliers, so GEORGE will talk with ARON about an alternative. We should need approximately 500. Could order business cards with NYCBUG and wwww site from Vistaprint. GEORGE will chair meeting, Don from BSDMall will speak for five minutes, followed by Wes and Michael on NYCBUG. WES will also do a book signing and provide "Network Security Illustrated" 50% off. MARC will deal with refreshments. Linux Expo KLIMENT will deal with large signs (3) with NYCBUG logo & logos of the projects, and will send markups to list for review. Fliers & signs will be at NYPHP & BSDMall tables, at least. All should plan to volunteer a few hours over the duration of the show. GEORGE will talk to BSDMall about distributing WES' book, and having him at BSDMall table for book signing. SOMEONE (?) will take care of finding bar for informal get together after January 22nd BOF meeting. Vendor Relations We're getting a bunch of FBSD 4.8 cd's from BSDMall, Michael will speak to publishers about free books and discounts with lead from HANS. GEORGE will follow up with ARON about Wasabi. WES will follow up with Dave Cook at TekServe, also he should mention meeting space. NYCBUG Logo GEORGE will email Marshall about logo for approval. Possibly redesign to integrate different BSD variants. WWW Site Revision GEORGE & HANS will discuss. Mailing List Managed officially by MARC. Mail Accounts Going to stick to aliases, until we can get mail server. Regular Meeting Space Temporarily, we will use Sage, but should investigate larger space, such as TekServe. Free only, as in beer. Proposed Meetings Need to plan March 3rd meeting as soon as possible. ARON needs to talk to Wasabi about BSD & Embedded Systems talk, WES can talk to TekServe about BSD & OSX talk. Documentation Project Michael's laptop battle will be posted, possibly using CMS app from NYPHP. Will also consider a BSD "family watch" similar to Linux distrowatch.com BSD CAN MARC is taking responsibility for organization. Intel Centrino Open Letter By Friday, WES will either provide info about this, or another topic. NYC Vendor BSD List All will provide ten vendors via TALK to Kliment who will accumulate. We also should divide up and hit the LinuxExpo vendors. OpenlySecure.org WES will be upgrading the site, and we can then decide on role of NYCBUG. From george Tue Jan 6 22:42:26 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2004 22:42:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: daemon logo Message-ID: this is what i sent to marshall. . . greetings marshall we are starting up a bsd user group in nyc. one of the members had more graphically inclined individual "create" a logo for the group. it seems like it's one of your daemons and added an apple to the pitchfork (no, it's not an anti-mac comment). please check out www.nycbug.org and tell me how you feel. there is a link to your site in the links section. should we add your copyright commentary. it would be no hassle for us, but we all do respect you and your efforts to protect the daemon from the real devils in the world. thanks george george at nycbug.org From george Tue Jan 6 22:49:26 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2004 22:49:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: [nylug-talk] Laptop purchase Message-ID: from the NY Linux User Group (nylug.org) mailing list. i've heard much more convincing arguments against apple laptops than this. i can think of a number of reasons why apple are preferable, most importantly the core os. in addition is usability, security, performance and that apple software is made for the hardware, and vice versa, unlike the rest of us losers hacking *bsd on intel-made-for-windows laptops. thoughts? g -----Original Message----- From: nylug-talk-bounces at nylug.org [mailto:nylug-talk-bounces at nylug.org] On Behalf Of Sunny Dubey Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2004 10:45 PM To: NYLUG discussion list Subject: Re: [nylug-talk] Laptop purchase On Tuesday 06 January 2004 09:09 am, Henning Follmann wrote: > > First: Anyone who tells you to get an ibook/powermac needs to be > > punched in the face. 'Nuff said. > > OK then hit me. > I recently bought the Al Book 15". And it's good linux hardware! > Though some knowledge required. Well, I dislike Apple laptops for a few reasons. First is the fact that when you choose to buy into apple, you're given such a limited choice of laptops to buy from. Where as x86 laptops can have super-packed/full-features ones (fujitsu lifebook), super sturdy ones (panasonic?), laptops with too many damn features (generic Sager ones, comes with a built in TV tuner! go figure), basically the list is endless while's apple's is highly limited (duh) Secondly, my girlfriend has an apple, so here comes some more bias. Their support tends to suck IMO (I don't know about most people, but my girlfriend had to send in her laptop and wait 2 weeks for the problem to be diagnosed, and fixed). Additionally, visiting the "Genius Bar" in their SoHo store tends to be a big waste of time. Thirdly, can someone tell me why I need to pay an arm and a leg for a simple cable/accessory/etc ? All laptop companies charge at least an arm for even a screw, or even a piece of plastic ... but somehow the Apple prices always seem to come out higher. Lastly, and clearly the most important. (I hate to sound like an elitist prick ... buuuttt .... ) I'm part of that intelligent 5% that uses the second mouse button. In fact, the more I think about it, the more I realize how I can't live without it. Being that my books + laptop + lunch + bowling balls are heavy enough, I really don't feel like carrying a stupid mouse when my laptop should clearly come with two buttons and a partridge in a pear tree. HOWEVER!!! The day that Apple can get a sweet IBM PPC970 CPU on a laptop is the day when all of the above doesn't matter :^) As much as I love AMD and desperately want an AMD64 machine of my own, I can't even imagine them being power efficient in an effective manner. So far the few AMD64 laptop reviews haven't spoken all that greatly about the new power management scheme. Its still too early to tell however ... I'm sure AMD's alpha team can figure out something much better (and much better ODM's can make AMD64 laptops) Sunny Dubey _______________________________________________ The nylug-talk mailing list is at nylug-talk at nylug.org To subscribe or unsubscribe: http://www.nylug.org/mailman/listinfo/nylug-talk From george Tue Jan 6 22:56:08 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2004 22:56:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] thoughts on vistaprint card? Message-ID: see attached. . . it was actually fun to do g -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ssrview.asp.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 18381 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040106/5ef0627c/attachment.jpeg From lists Wed Jan 7 08:03:23 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 08:03:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] thoughts on vistaprint card? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040107080323.5f1abe39.lists@genoverly.net> On Tue, 6 Jan 2004 22:56:08 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > see attached. . . > > it was actually fun to do > > g > Not a bad start.. Do you hope to have these done in time for LinuxExpo? Kliment mentioned a long lead time. Michael From klimenta Wed Jan 7 10:46:20 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 10:46:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] v0.1 Message-ID: <000a01c3d535$6773c850$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Morning everyone... Here is the proposal. The plotter is HP DesignJet 500 (24' width). - Should I put www.xyzbsd.org beneath every logo? - Should I put our www.nucbug.org address beneath something??? -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ver-01.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 31830 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040107/811b7c41/attachment.jpg From george Wed Jan 7 11:45:46 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 11:45:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] thoughts on vistaprint card? In-Reply-To: <20040107080323.5f1abe39.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: paid 12.95 for 7 day delivery. hopefully i'll have them. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael ->Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 8:03 AM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] thoughts on vistaprint card? -> -> ->On Tue, 6 Jan 2004 22:56:08 -0500 ->"G. Rosamond" wrote: -> ->> see attached. . . ->> ->> it was actually fun to do ->> ->> g ->> -> ->Not a bad start.. ->Do you hope to have these done in time for LinuxExpo? ->Kliment mentioned a long lead time. Michael ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Wed Jan 7 11:54:31 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 11:54:31 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] v0.1 In-Reply-To: <000a01c3d535$6773c850$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Message-ID: good start. the problem with our logo is even clearer to me though. too much freebsd. that was fast work kliment. i think the urls are useful underneath the logos. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Kliment Andreev ->Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 10:46 AM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] v0.1 -> -> ->Morning everyone... -> ->Here is the proposal. The plotter is HP DesignJet 500 (24' width). -> ->- Should I put www.xyzbsd.org beneath every logo? ->- Should I put our www.nucbug.org address beneath something??? -> -> From george Wed Jan 7 12:05:03 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 12:05:03 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: daemon logo Message-ID: done. . . g -----Original Message----- From: Kirk McKusick [mailto:mckusick at beastie.mckusick.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 2:43 AM To: george at sddi.net Subject: Re: daemon logo From: Sender: "G. Rosamond" To: Subject: daemon logo Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2004 22:41:39 -0500 X-ASK-Info: Confirmed by User greetings marshall we are starting up a bsd user group in nyc. one of the members had more graphically inclined individual "create" a logo for the group. it seems like it's one of your daemons and added an apple to the pitchfork (no, it's not an anti-mac comment). please check out www.nycbug.org and tell me how you feel. there is a link to your site in the links section. should we add your copyright commentary. it would be no hassle for us, but we all do respect you and your efforts to protect the daemon from the real devils in the world. thanks george george at nycbug.org I prefer that the BSD Daemon be used in the context of BSD software. Clearly your usage qualifies. The only change that I request is that you add a link from the daemon picture to my copyright notice as described in the usage policy below. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Statement on the Use of the BSD Daemon Figure: The BSD Daemon is to be used in the context of BSD software. So, if you are using BSD software (FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, or BSD utilities) in your Intranet environment, then use of the daemon is appropriate. If you are a Microsoft or Linux shop, then it is not appropriate. Individuals may use the daemon for their personal use within the bounds of good taste (an example of bad taste was a picture of the BSD daemon blowtorching a Solaris logo). When reasonably possible, I would like the text ``BSD Daemon Copyright 1988 by Marshall Kirk McKusick. All Rights Reserved.'' to be included. This text need not be etched into the figure or garishly displayed when using the daemon as say an Icon in a Web window. A good example of how to handle the due credit in a web page is to create a link from the daemon picture to the following text: BSD Daemon Copyright 1988 by Marshall Kirk McKusick. All Rights Reserved. Permission to use the daemon may be obtained from: Marshall Kirk McKusick 1614 Oxford St Berkeley, CA 94709-1608 USA or via email at mckusick at mckusick.com If you are looking for daemon images or daemon shirts, a pictorial history of the daemon and daemon shirts are available at my site, http://www.mckusick.com/beastie/. If you are looking for daemon badges, see the site at http://www.scotgold.com/Daemon.htm). For other paraphanalia, see the site at http://www.freebsdmall.com/promotional/). If you want to mass produce the daemon on Tshirts, CDROM's, or other products you need to request permission in advance. In general, I require that the daemon be used in an appropriate way. This means that it has to be something related to BSD and not expropriated as a company logo (though I do allow companies with BSD-based products such as FreeBSD Mall or Daemon News to use it). I regret having to be so legalistic about the daemon, but I almost lost the daemon to a certain large company because I failed to show due diligence in protecting it. So, I've taken due diligence seriously since then. Marshall Kirk McKusick From klimenta Wed Jan 7 15:32:22 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 15:32:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 Message-ID: <000c01c3d55d$5da7aad0$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> I screwed up something. The attachment allowed is 40K and my first send message is in the queue for approval. Please review... The printer is HP design Jet 24 inch. http://www.futurebit.com/ver-01.jpg From klimenta Wed Jan 7 15:41:30 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 15:41:30 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 References: <000c01c3d55d$5da7aad0$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Message-ID: <000d01c3d55e$a233ed20$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> > I screwed up something. The attachment allowed is 40K and my first send > message is in the > queue for approval. > Please review... The printer is HP design Jet 24 inch. Should I remove NYCBUG logo until we find a new solution? From george Wed Jan 7 16:24:38 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 16:24:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 In-Reply-To: <000c01c3d55d$5da7aad0$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Message-ID: how about the url's underneath the logos? g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Kliment Andreev ->Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 3:32 PM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 -> -> ->I screwed up something. The attachment allowed is 40K and my ->first send message is in the queue for approval. Please ->review... The printer is HP design Jet 24 inch. -> ->http://www.futurebit.com/ver-01.jpg -> -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Wed Jan 7 16:24:38 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 16:24:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 In-Reply-To: <000d01c3d55e$a233ed20$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Message-ID: got me. . . any thoughts anyone? g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Kliment Andreev ->Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 3:42 PM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 -> -> ->> I screwed up something. The attachment allowed is 40K and my first ->> send message is in the queue for approval. ->> Please review... The printer is HP design Jet 24 inch. -> ->Should I remove NYCBUG logo until we find a new solution? ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From lists Wed Jan 7 16:43:02 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 16:43:02 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 In-Reply-To: <000d01c3d55e$a233ed20$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> References: <000c01c3d55d$5da7aad0$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> <000d01c3d55e$a233ed20$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Message-ID: <20040107164302.50259450.lists@genoverly.net> On Wed, 7 Jan 2004 15:41:30 -0500 "Kliment Andreev" wrote: > > I screwed up something. The attachment allowed is 40K and my first send > > message is in the > > queue for approval. > > Please review... The printer is HP design Jet 24 inch. > > Should I remove NYCBUG logo until we find a new solution? > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk Kliment, the work looks great. I'll agree that NYCBUG logo looks copied from the FreeBSD so... I vote YES, remove the NYCBUG logo until we can get one that is unique. I do NOT think URLs are necessary under each logo.. but maybe a name to identify each one. Michael From george Wed Jan 7 16:58:12 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 16:58:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 In-Reply-To: <20040107164302.50259450.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: agree with all of that michael. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael ->Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 4:43 PM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 -> -> ->On Wed, 7 Jan 2004 15:41:30 -0500 ->"Kliment Andreev" wrote: -> ->> > I screwed up something. The attachment allowed is 40K and ->my first ->> > send message is in the queue for approval. ->> > Please review... The printer is HP design Jet 24 inch. ->> ->> Should I remove NYCBUG logo until we find a new solution? ->> _______________________________________________ ->> talk mailing list ->> talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> -> -> ->Kliment, the work looks great. I'll agree that NYCBUG logo ->looks copied from the FreeBSD so... ->I vote YES, remove the NYCBUG logo until we can get one that ->is unique. I do NOT think URLs are necessary under each ->logo.. but maybe a name to identify each one. ->Michael ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org ->http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From lists Wed Jan 7 16:53:41 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2004 16:53:41 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 In-Reply-To: <20040107164302.50259450.lists@genoverly.net> References: <000c01c3d55d$5da7aad0$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> <000d01c3d55e$a233ed20$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> <20040107164302.50259450.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <20040107165341.3ce25814.lists@genoverly.net> On Wed, 7 Jan 2004 16:43:02 -0500 michael wrote: > > Kliment, the work looks great. I'll agree that NYCBUG logo looks copied from the FreeBSD so... > I vote YES, remove the NYCBUG logo until we can get one that is unique. I do NOT think URLs are necessary under each logo.. but maybe a name to identify each one. > Michael > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk If not a name under each logo, how about a catchy phrase? It is a banner right? or maybe "Which is your favorite flavor?" or "All 4.4BSD-based UNIX-like operating systems welcome" or "It's not just about the cartoons" or ... should I go on? From mspitze1 Wed Jan 7 21:05:54 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2004 21:05:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 In-Reply-To: <20040107164302.50259450.lists@genoverly.net> References: <000c01c3d55d$5da7aad0$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> <000d01c3d55e$a233ed20$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> <20040107164302.50259450.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <20040107210554.256cca89.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Wed, 07 Jan 2004 16:43:02 -0500 michael wrote: > Kliment, the work looks great. I'll agree that NYCBUG logo looks > copied from the FreeBSD so... I vote YES, remove the NYCBUG logo until > we can get one that is unique. I do NOT think URLs are necessary > under each logo.. but maybe a name to identify each one. Michael I think we should kill the logo for now also. One other comment could the project names and/or websites be below their logos? marc From george Thu Jan 8 01:15:43 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 01:15:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 In-Reply-To: <20040107210554.256cca89.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: ditto on those points. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Marc Spitzer ->Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 9:06 PM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] ver 0.1 -> -> ->On Wed, 07 Jan 2004 16:43:02 -0500 ->michael wrote: -> ->> Kliment, the work looks great. I'll agree that NYCBUG logo looks ->> copied from the FreeBSD so... I vote YES, remove the NYCBUG ->logo until ->> we can get one that is unique. I do NOT think URLs are necessary ->> under each logo.. but maybe a name to identify each one. Michael -> ->I think we should kill the logo for now also. One other ->comment could the project names and/or websites be below their logos? -> ->marc ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Thu Jan 8 01:20:27 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 01:20:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement Message-ID: hans: you gotta get me that version of the announcement you typed up. i'll use it as a base, and i'll get it to everyone asap. i think we have to move quick on this announcement. btw, bsdmall did very well at macworld in sf. the show was smaller than before, but interest was greater. g From klimenta Thu Jan 8 09:21:58 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 09:21:58 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] v0.2 Message-ID: <000d01c3d5f2$c7eac680$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Morning everyone http://www.futurebit.com/ver-02.jpg Can I start printing this? Three copies? Right? From george Thu Jan 8 10:30:39 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 10:30:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] v0.2 In-Reply-To: <000d01c3d5f2$c7eac680$ca0110ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Message-ID: *i* like it. . . anyone else? g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Kliment Andreev ->Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 9:22 AM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] v0.2 -> -> ->Morning everyone -> ->http://www.futurebit.com/ver-02.jpg -> ->Can I start printing this? Three copies? Right? -> -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From klimenta Thu Jan 8 12:11:54 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 12:11:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Posters Message-ID: <003601c3d60a$850bb5a0$0c0510ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Hi again... I've printed 3 copies of the latest image sent. One of them is with some small red dot over netbsd logo (probably ink leak) and the dragonfly logo wasn't on the white background so it looks a little bit sloppy if you look closer. But anyway, from a distance of more than 1 meter, it looks very nice. Does anyone need these prints before LinuxExpo? I'll send them by mail in a tube. From mspitze1 Thu Jan 8 13:16:21 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2004 13:16:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Posters In-Reply-To: <003601c3d60a$850bb5a0$0c0510ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> References: <003601c3d60a$850bb5a0$0c0510ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Message-ID: <20040108131621.5434c119.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Thu, 08 Jan 2004 12:11:54 -0500 Kliment Andreev wrote: > Hi again... > > I've printed 3 copies of the latest image sent. One of them is with > some small red dot over netbsd logo (probably ink leak) and the > dragonfly logo wasn't on the white background so it looks a little bit > sloppy if you look closer. But anyway, from a distance of more than 1 > meter, it looks very nice. Does anyone need these prints before > LinuxExpo? I'll send them by mail in a tube. no and thanks marc > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From george Thu Jan 8 13:23:39 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 13:23:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Posters In-Reply-To: <003601c3d60a$850bb5a0$0c0510ac@vinyl.tkvbp.com> Message-ID: sounds fine. no need before linuxexpo. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Kliment Andreev ->Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 12:12 PM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] Posters -> -> ->Hi again... -> ->I've printed 3 copies of the latest image sent. One of them ->is with some small red dot over netbsd logo (probably ink ->leak) and the dragonfly logo wasn't on the white background ->so it looks a little bit sloppy if you look closer. But ->anyway, from a distance of more than 1 meter, it looks very ->nice. Does anyone need these prints before LinuxExpo? I'll ->send them by mail in a tube. -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From lists Thu Jan 8 14:21:48 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 14:21:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040108142148.5b95dcf4.lists@genoverly.net> On Thu, 8 Jan 2004 01:20:27 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > hans: > > you gotta get me that version of the announcement you typed up. > i'll use it as a base, and i'll get it to everyone asap. > i think we have to move quick on this announcement. > btw, bsdmall did very well at macworld in sf. > the show was smaller than before, but interest was greater. > > g > George, You mentioned that when we post the announcement, you wanted it to be from nycebug.org addresses. I thought aliases are for receiving (and forwarding to another box) only... but I don't know much about it. Michael From george Thu Jan 8 14:56:07 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 14:56:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement In-Reply-To: <20040108142148.5b95dcf4.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: ->You mentioned that when we post the announcement, you wanted ->it to be from nycebug.org addresses. ->I thought aliases are for receiving (and forwarding to ->another box) only... but I don't know much about it. Michael you can also forge as return address, but i could be a problem. that's why i want pop or imap accounts. who has aliases setup beside me and hans? g From george Thu Jan 8 15:15:47 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 15:15:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: openbsd security meeting In-Reply-To: <20040108145758.6fe348f5.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: think it's been done. ..you might try to find. . . look through logo links on nycbug site ->-----Original Message----- ->From: michael [mailto:lists at genoverly.net] ->Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 2:58 PM ->To: Kliment Andreev ->Cc: george at sddi.net ->Subject: Re: openbsd security meeting -> -> ->On Fri, 5 Dec 2003 11:26:49 -0500 ->"Kliment Andreev" wrote: -> ->> BTW, any ideas for official NYCBUG mascot? Like daemonized ->Statue of ->> Liberty (just a thought). :))) ->> -> -> ->hhmmm... all the good ideas have been said already... -> From george Thu Jan 8 15:50:54 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 15:50:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] schneier. . . Message-ID: reminder: http://www.92y.org/shop/event_detail.asp?catalog=92y%5Fcatalog&productid =T%2DLC5CM09 g From lists Thu Jan 8 15:59:00 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 15:59:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] schneier. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040108155900.7fb123c5.lists@genoverly.net> On Thu, 8 Jan 2004 15:50:54 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > reminder: > > http://www.92y.org/shop/event_detail.asp?catalog=92y%5Fcatalog&productid > =T%2DLC5CM09 > > g > ... but I haven't gotten beyond fear and beyond terror yet... From george Thu Jan 8 16:12:36 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2004 16:12:36 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] schneier. . . In-Reply-To: <20040108155900.7fb123c5.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: dork. ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael ->Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 3:59 PM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] schneier. . . -> -> ->On Thu, 8 Jan 2004 15:50:54 -0500 ->"G. Rosamond" wrote: -> ->> reminder: ->> ->> ->http://www.92y.org/shop/event_detail.asp?->catalog=92y%5Fcatalog&produ ct ->> id ->> =T%2DLC5CM09 ->> ->> g ->> -> ->... but I haven't gotten beyond fear and beyond terror yet... -> _______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Fri Jan 9 16:58:18 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 16:58:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: BSDCan field trip Message-ID: fyi all. . .this is an email exchange i had with the bsdcan organizer. -----Original Message----- From: G. Rosamond [mailto:george at sddi.net] Sent: Friday, January 09, 2004 4:34 PM To: 'Dan Langille' Subject: RE: BSDCan field trip ->If anyone wishes to give a talk, they are welcome to it. i don't know if there is. . .i, for one, am not a developer. i'll forward your messages onto the nycbug.org list, which you're more than welcome to join. ->Also, if you need directions, maps, accomdation recommendations etc, ->we should have that all sorted for you. I've driven NYC to Ottawa ->before. It's a pretty good trip, especially if you go via Lake ->Placid and cross over at into Prescott (much quieter crossing). that's great. one of our members is from the ny/canada border, some i'm sure he'd concur. i know 87 to lake george, and find the ride very enjoyable. if there's anything we can do to help, let us know. we'll have a presence at linuxexp in a few weeks, so if you have a flier or anything, let us know. we'll duplicate and distribute. how many are registered now for bsdcan? what about the mailing list. . .seems to be dead. no messages in a few months. .. g From george Fri Jan 9 17:05:53 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 17:05:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] promotion for www hosting Message-ID: https://order.1and1.com/xml/static/Home;jsessionid=D40609D361B15F2E9ECAD 50B7027391C.TC62b?__frame=_top From lists Fri Jan 9 17:30:43 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2004 17:30:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] promotion for www hosting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040109173043.20baab62.lists@genoverly.net> On Fri, 9 Jan 2004 17:05:53 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > https://order.1and1.com/xml/static/Home;jsessionid=D40609D361B15F2E9ECAD > 50B7027391C.TC62b?__frame=_top > yea... I've got a 1and1 account. Free for 3 years. I think I started telling you guys in the last meeting. I really like the SecureSHell account access. You get something like 50 POP addresses too. (I've been sending mail to the list thru that account, check the envelope.) From george Mon Jan 12 18:54:55 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 18:54:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] revised and ready? Message-ID: please review. . . i'm not sending out until i get a few okays. . . g We have initiated a BSD user group in New York City called NYCBUG (pronounced "nice-bug"). There are two goals for this new user group: First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New York City to discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning more about or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session at LinuxWorld Expo at the Jacob Javits Center on January 22nd at 5:45pm, Room 1E15. We will have a presence at various tables at the expo, including those of BSDMall and New York PHP. Our first presentation, "Secure by Default: Learning from OpenBSD," will be held on Wednesday, February 4th at 7:00pm in the offices of SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and 6th Avenue on the fifth floor. To be given by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux and OpenBSD Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated," this talk will deal with crucial security concepts and best practices for today's computing environments. Subsequent meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the first Wednesday of the month. Our website is located at www.nycbug.org. The site will include a joint documentation project with New York PHP and OpenlySecure.org, focused on providing original documentation to new and experienced BSD users alike. NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists to assist in discussion and learning about the BSD world. Interested users join the mailing list at http://www.nycbug.org/mailinglist.html. NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not limited to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. Since the origins of Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) UNIX in the 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom servers of the world, powering internet service providers, hosting firms, and web sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist current users, those interested in learning more about this fundamental operating system family and various other BSD projects, and to provide a channel for community interaction. We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a variety of ways in the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG a success. From klimenta Mon Jan 12 21:38:04 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 02:38:04 -0000 Subject: [nycbug-talk] revised and ready? References: Message-ID: <008c01c2baac$a052aff0$9c9e5343@haledon> I am OK with this ----- Original Message ----- From: "G. Rosamond" To: Sent: Monday, January 12, 2004 6:54 PM Subject: [nycbug-talk] revised and ready? > please review. . . > > i'm not sending out until i get a few okays. . . > > g > > > > We have initiated a BSD user group in New York City called NYCBUG > (pronounced "nice-bug"). > > There are two goals for this new user group: > > First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New York City to > discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. > > Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning more about > or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. > > Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session at > LinuxWorld Expo at the Jacob Javits Center on January 22nd at 5:45pm, > Room 1E15. We will have a presence at various tables at the expo, > including those of BSDMall and New York PHP. > > Our first presentation, "Secure by Default: Learning from OpenBSD," > will be held on Wednesday, February 4th at 7:00pm in the offices of > SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and 6th Avenue on the fifth floor. To > be given by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux and OpenBSD > Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated," this talk will deal with > crucial security concepts and best practices for today's computing > environments. Subsequent meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the > first Wednesday of the month. > > Our website is located at www.nycbug.org. The site will include a > joint documentation project with New York PHP and OpenlySecure.org, > focused on providing original documentation to new and experienced BSD > users alike. NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists to assist in > discussion and learning about the BSD world. Interested users join the > mailing list at http://www.nycbug.org/mailinglist.html. > > NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not > limited to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, > OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. > > Since the origins of Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) UNIX in the > 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom servers of > the world, powering internet service providers, hosting firms, and web > sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist current > users, those interested in learning more about this fundamental > operating system family and various other BSD projects, and to provide > a channel for community interaction. > > We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a variety of ways in > the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG a > success. > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From hans Tue Jan 13 00:24:32 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 21:24:32 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] revised and ready? Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374A2E@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Looks good... I like the reordering of the paragraphs. H > -----Original Message----- > From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org > [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of G. Rosamond > Sent: Monday, January 12, 2004 6:55 PM > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Subject: [nycbug-talk] revised and ready? > > please review. . . > > i'm not sending out until i get a few okays. . . > > g > > > > We have initiated a BSD user group in New York City called NYCBUG > (pronounced "nice-bug"). > > There are two goals for this new user group: > > First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New York City to > discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. > > Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning > more about > or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. > > Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session at > LinuxWorld Expo at the Jacob Javits Center on January 22nd at 5:45pm, > Room 1E15. We will have a presence at various tables at the expo, > including those of BSDMall and New York PHP. > > Our first presentation, "Secure by Default: Learning from OpenBSD," > will be held on Wednesday, February 4th at 7:00pm in the offices of > SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and 6th Avenue on the fifth > floor. To > be given by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux and OpenBSD > Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated," this talk > will deal with > crucial security concepts and best practices for today's computing > environments. Subsequent meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the > first Wednesday of the month. > > Our website is located at www.nycbug.org. The site will include a > joint documentation project with New York PHP and OpenlySecure.org, > focused on providing original documentation to new and > experienced BSD > users alike. NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists > to assist in > discussion and learning about the BSD world. Interested > users join the > mailing list at http://www.nycbug.org/mailinglist.html. > > NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not > limited to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, > OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. > > Since the origins of Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) UNIX in the > 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom servers of > the world, powering internet service providers, hosting > firms, and web > sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist current > users, those interested in learning more about this fundamental > operating system family and various other BSD projects, and > to provide > a channel for community interaction. > > We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a variety > of ways in > the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG a > success. > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > From mspitze1 Tue Jan 13 02:38:46 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 02:38:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] revised and ready? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040113023846.17e0f636.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Mon, 12 Jan 2004 18:54:55 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > please review. . . > > i'm not sending out until i get a few okays. . . > > g Looks good marc > > > > We have initiated a BSD user group in New York City called NYCBUG > (pronounced "nice-bug"). > > There are two goals for this new user group: > > First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New York City to > discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. > > Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning more about > or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. > > Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session at > LinuxWorld Expo at the Jacob Javits Center on January 22nd at 5:45pm, > Room 1E15. We will have a presence at various tables at the expo, > including those of BSDMall and New York PHP. > > Our first presentation, "Secure by Default: Learning from OpenBSD," > will be held on Wednesday, February 4th at 7:00pm in the offices of > SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and 6th Avenue on the fifth floor. To > be given by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux and OpenBSD > Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated," this talk will deal with > crucial security concepts and best practices for today's computing > environments. Subsequent meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the > first Wednesday of the month. > > Our website is located at www.nycbug.org. The site will include a > joint documentation project with New York PHP and OpenlySecure.org, > focused on providing original documentation to new and experienced BSD > users alike. NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists to assist in > discussion and learning about the BSD world. Interested users join the > mailing list at http://www.nycbug.org/mailinglist.html. > > NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not > limited to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, > OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. > > Since the origins of Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) UNIX in the > 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom servers of > the world, powering internet service providers, hosting firms, and web > sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist current > users, those interested in learning more about this fundamental > operating system family and various other BSD projects, and to provide > a channel for community interaction. > > We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a variety of ways in > the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG a > success. > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From george Tue Jan 13 08:37:23 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 08:37:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announce spiel Message-ID: We have initiated a BSD user group in New York City called NYCBUG (pronounced "nice-bug"). There are two goals for this new user group: First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New York City to discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning more about or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session at LinuxWorld Expo at the Jacob Javits Center on January 22nd at 5:45pm, Room 1E15. We will have a presence at various tables at the expo, including those of BSDMall and New York PHP. Our first presentation, "Secure by Default: Learning from OpenBSD," will be held on Wednesday, February 4th at 7:00pm in the offices of SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and 6th Avenue on the fifth floor. To be given by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux and OpenBSD Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated," this talk will deal with crucial security concepts and best practices for today's computing environments. Subsequent meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the first Wednesday of the month. Our website is located at www.nycbug.org. The site will include a joint documentation project with New York PHP and OpenlySecure.org, focused on providing original documentation to new and experienced BSD users alike. NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists to assist in discussion and learning about the BSD world. Interested users join the mailing list at http://www.nycbug.org/mailinglist.html. NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not limited to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. Since the origins of Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) UNIX in the 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom servers of the world, powering internet service providers, hosting firms, and web sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist current users, those interested in learning more about this fundamental operating system family and various other BSD projects, and to provide a channel for community interaction. We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a variety of ways in the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG a success. From george Tue Jan 13 08:37:23 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 08:37:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] revised and ready? In-Reply-To: <20040113023846.17e0f636.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: okay. ..that's three. . . let's go. . .remember the hit lists. . . i'll resend to all. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: Marc Spitzer [mailto:mspitze1 at optonline.net] ->Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 2:39 AM ->To: General discussion ->Cc: george at sddi.net ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] revised and ready? -> -> ->On Mon, 12 Jan 2004 18:54:55 -0500 ->"G. Rosamond" wrote: -> ->> please review. . . ->> ->> i'm not sending out until i get a few okays. . . ->> ->> g -> ->Looks good -> ->marc -> ->> ->> ->> ->> We have initiated a BSD user group in New York City called NYCBUG ->> (pronounced "nice-bug"). ->> ->> There are two goals for this new user group: ->> ->> First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New ->York City to ->> discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. ->> ->> Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning more ->> about or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. ->> ->> Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session at ->> LinuxWorld Expo at the Jacob Javits Center on January 22nd ->at 5:45pm, ->> Room 1E15. We will have a presence at various tables at the expo, ->> including those of BSDMall and New York PHP. ->> ->> Our first presentation, "Secure by Default: Learning from ->OpenBSD," ->> will be held on Wednesday, February 4th at 7:00pm in the ->offices of ->> SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and 6th Avenue on the ->fifth floor. ->> To be given by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux ->and OpenBSD ->> Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated," this talk will deal ->> with crucial security concepts and best practices for ->today's computing ->> environments. Subsequent meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the ->> first Wednesday of the month. ->> ->> Our website is located at www.nycbug.org. The site will include a ->> joint documentation project with New York PHP and ->OpenlySecure.org, ->> focused on providing original documentation to new and experienced ->> BSD users alike. NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists to ->> assist in discussion and learning about the BSD world. Interested ->> users join the mailing list at ->> http://www.nycbug.org/mailinglist.html. ->> ->> NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not ->> limited to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, ->> OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. ->> ->> Since the origins of Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) ->UNIX in the ->> 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom ->servers of ->> the world, powering internet service providers, hosting firms, and ->> web sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist ->> current users, those interested in learning more about this ->> fundamental operating system family and various other BSD ->projects, ->> and to provide a channel for community interaction. ->> ->> We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a ->variety of ways ->> in the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG a ->> success. ->> ->> _______________________________________________ ->> talk mailing list ->> talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From lists Tue Jan 13 11:02:37 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 11:02:37 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] update In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040113110237.652774ba.lists@genoverly.net> UPDATE - Library, Education, Reviews, Publications, Vendors I would like to remind everyone that we have a newsletter that is printed on-line and contains regular book reviews. Therefore, I'll need to have an offline meeting with the webmaster to update our site with a library and review section. The purpose of that space would be to let our members submit reviews of books that are of interest to the rest of us. These can be your own books or books from our library, that have (hopefully) been sent to us by publishers to review. There is a remote possibility of getting some authors (other than Wes ) to present at meetings. We are recognized by the following Publishers: O'Reilly User Group Program SAMS Publishing, Sams User Group Program McGraw-Hill Osborne User Group Partnership Contacted: Prentice Hall Professional Technical Reference's User Group Program Addison-Wesley Researched but not contacted: Bit Tree Press Walnut Creek Newnes No Starch Press * Wrox * From No Starch website: Beginning January 1st, 2004 our US distributor is O'Reilly & Associates Side Note: Does anybody have a copy of... FreeBSD: An Open-Source Operating System for Your Personal Computer, Second Edition by Annelise Anderson Let me know if you want to add anything, Michael From george Tue Jan 13 11:59:21 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 11:59:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] update In-Reply-To: <20040113110237.652774ba.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: ->Does anybody have a copy of... ->FreeBSD: An Open-Source Operating System for Your Personal ->Computer, Second Edition by Annelise Anderson yes. more on the other stuff later. . . ->Let me know if you want to add anything, ->Michael ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From lists Tue Jan 13 16:19:24 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 16:19:24 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] LinuxWorld In-Reply-To: <20040113110237.652774ba.lists@genoverly.net> References: <20040113110237.652774ba.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <20040113161924.5431489e.lists@genoverly.net> FYI -- Eric Raymond author of The Cathedral and Bazaar and The Art of UNIX Programming > Hi Michael, > > Yes, please do stop by to meet Eric Raymond starting around noon, Wed. 1/21, AW/PH > PTR Booth #132. Eric Raymond will be at the show on Wed. only. Please pass around > to the rest of your group. > > ************************* > Heather Fox, Publicist > Addison-Wesley & Prentice Hall PTR -- --- From isptech151 Tue Jan 13 18:09:54 2004 From: isptech151 (Gerald) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 15:09:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mailing list + intro Message-ID: <20040113230954.66361.qmail@web10702.mail.yahoo.com> Greetings, I'm a sysadmin for an NYC FreeBSD based ISP. (Internet Channel or inch.com). Thought I would point out to hopefully get resolved quickly that the article here: http://daily.daemonnews.org/view_story.php3?story_id=4353 links to here: http://www.nycbug.org/mailinglist.html Which is a dead link. Not sure if you were aiming for here: http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk Glad to hear of the group being started. Gerald __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From hans Tue Jan 13 19:10:00 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 16:10:00 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mailing list + intro Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374B4A@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > I'm a sysadmin for an NYC FreeBSD based ISP. (Internet > Channel or inch.com). Hi Gerald... nice to meet you. > Thought I would point out to hopefully get resolved > quickly that the article here: > > http://daily.daemonnews.org/view_story.php3?story_id=4353 > > links to here: > > http://www.nycbug.org/mailinglist.html > > Which is a dead link. I added a redirect, which should hold us for now. Thanks for the note. H From rbrown Tue Jan 13 22:43:19 2004 From: rbrown (Rodrick R. Brown) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 22:43:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Greetings All. Message-ID: <200401140341.i0E3faGV038559@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Hello just saying hi, really nice to be apart of the NYC BSD users group hope to see most of you guys at the first meet. - Rodrick Brown - UNIX Systems Engineer -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040113/5823c5d2/attachment.html From george Tue Jan 13 22:45:49 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 22:45:49 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Greetings All. In-Reply-To: <200401140341.i0E3faGV038559@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Message-ID: thanks for joining us rodrick. happy to have you aboard. feel free to browse the archives and peruse the issues. . . g -----Original Message----- From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Rodrick R. Brown Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 10:43 PM To: talk at lists.nycbug.org Subject: [nycbug-talk] Greetings All. Hello just saying hi, really nice to be apart of the NYC BSD users group hope to see most of you guys at the first meet. - Rodrick Brown - UNIX Systems Engineer -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040113/c35f68ba/attachment.html From george Tue Jan 13 22:50:21 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 22:50:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] update In-Reply-To: <20040113110237.652774ba.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: ->UPDATE - Library, Education, Reviews, Publications, Vendors -> ->I would like to remind everyone that we have a newsletter ->that is printed on-line and contains regular book reviews. uh. . .what newsletter? check the meeting notes. . . ->Therefore, I'll need to have an offline meeting with the ->webmaster to update our site with a library and review ->section. The purpose of that space would be to let our ->members submit reviews of books that are of interest to the ->rest of us. These can be your own books or books from our ->library, that have ->(hopefully) been sent to us by publishers to review. There ->is a remote possibility of getting some authors (other than ->Wes ) to present at meetings. sounds good. i'm ploughing through wes' book right now. will put together a review. ->We are recognized by the following Publishers: ->O'Reilly User Group Program ->SAMS Publishing, Sams User Group Program ->McGraw-Hill Osborne User Group Partnership yipee. ..nice job. ->Contacted: ->Prentice Hall Professional Technical Reference's User Group ->Program Addison-Wesley excellent. ->Researched but not contacted: ->Bit Tree Press ->Walnut Creek ->Newnes ->No Starch Press * ->Wrox talk to don witt at bsdmall about anyone else. witt at cylogistics.com introduce yourself. ->* From No Starch website: Beginning January 1st, 2004 our US ->distributor is O'Reilly & Associates cool. ->Side Note: ->Does anybody have a copy of... ->FreeBSD: An Open-Source Operating System for Your Personal ->Computer, Second Edition by Annelise Anderson kick ass job michael. we have *some* bases covered. . . fliers for next week? i got my 250 vistaprint.com nycbug cards. . .not bad. g From george Tue Jan 13 23:09:30 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 23:09:30 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] oops. . . Message-ID: this apparently didn't make the list today. . . hit daemon news, bsdusergroups.org, advocacy and chat for freebsd lists. let's kick it off. . . we should keep a list of what we've hit. btw, kliment, remember that list of bsd vendors, etc? there's a discussion about it right now on freebsd advocacy. i'll aggregate and forward to this list later. From george Tue Jan 13 23:58:26 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2004 23:58:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsd user groups Message-ID: on sending nycbug announcement to user groups: using bsdusergroups.org (which i submitted info about us to already, but not yet posted), hit north america, which for you geographically handicapped individuals, includes canada and mexico. sent *only* to those with bsd in their user group name. . . the following *didn't* bounce back to me. . . bay area milwaukee houston mexico silicon valley openbsd portland, or san diego sf netbsd sf openbsd silicon valley st louis salt lake city research triangle, nc vancouver the following bounced: greater toronto ne/boston (maybe since the red sox suck) se michigan tacoma, wa (voted to the worst place to live in us recently) wichita, ks (poor poor dorothy) g From lists Wed Jan 14 07:57:54 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 07:57:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsd user groups In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040114075754.0d1bdeaa.lists@genoverly.net> On Tue, 13 Jan 2004 23:58:26 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > on sending nycbug announcement to user groups: > Are you posting from your own email or a nycbug.org address? > > uh. . .what newsletter? check the meeting notes. . . > The newsletter reminder was because I had to check that box off when I registered for 'free stuff'. I didn't want to mis-represent ourselves to a potential sponser, or anyone for that matter. The website acts a newsletter, right? ... I think I just volunteered to keep us in compliance. > > fliers for next week? > How can I help? Michael From dan Wed Jan 14 06:53:45 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 06:53:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] BSDCan Message-ID: <4004E779.12757.1AFB4A6C@localhost> Hi folks, I found out your group may be coming to BSDCan (http://www.bsdcan.org/). I have been hoping that people would attend from New York (state/city). It's so close... People are coming from Detroit, Montreal, and Toronto. The North East should be well represented. Let me know if there's anything I can do to help with your plans. cheers -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From george Wed Jan 14 08:58:53 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 08:58:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] BSDCan In-Reply-To: <4004E779.12757.1AFB4A6C@localhost> Message-ID: thanks dan. how about throwing something up on freebsddiary.org about us starting up? you'll find our announcement on daemon news. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Dan Langille ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 6:54 AM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] BSDCan -> -> ->Hi folks, -> ->I found out your group may be coming to BSDCan ->(http://www.bsdcan.org/). I have been hoping that people would ->attend from New York (state/city). It's so close... -> ->People are coming from Detroit, Montreal, and Toronto. The North ->East should be well represented. -> ->Let me know if there's anything I can do to help with your plans. -> ->cheers ->-- ->Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Wed Jan 14 09:12:04 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 09:12:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: BSDUserGroups Group Submitted Message-ID: meant to forward this yesterday. . . is info at nycbug.org setup? g -----Original Message----- From: webmaster at bsdusergroups.com [mailto:webmaster at bsdusergroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 13, 2004 8:46 AM To: george at nycbug.org Subject: BSDUserGroups Group Submitted Your group is currently awaiting moderator approval. You will receive another email when your group has been approved and added to the site. Group Name: New York City *BSD User Group Contact Name: George Contact Email: george at nycbug.org Website URL: http://www.nycbug.org Meeting Times: First Wednesday of each month BSD Flavors: FreeBSD:OpenBSD:NetBSD:MacOSX: City: New York Province: NY Country: United States of America Continent: North America Description: This has been an automated response from BSDUserGroups.com. From george Wed Jan 14 09:13:50 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 09:13:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsd user groups In-Reply-To: <20040114075754.0d1bdeaa.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: ->> on sending nycbug announcement to user groups: ->Are you posting from your own email or a nycbug.org address? own email. . .depends on the service. aliases don't work if your email is your login. ->> uh. . .what newsletter? check the meeting notes. . . ->The newsletter reminder was because I had to check that box ->off when I ->registered for 'free stuff'. I didn't want to mis-represent ->ourselves to a ->potential sponser, or anyone for that matter. The website ->acts a newsletter, ->right? ... I think I just volunteered to keep us in compliance. nice. . . ->> fliers for next week? ->How can I help? unless aron shows up. . .we need to take care of it. maybe he's stick at macworld still. . . . g From hans Wed Jan 14 09:28:41 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 06:28:41 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: BSDUserGroups Group Submitted Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374BC9@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > is info at nycbug.org setup? Yeah From george Wed Jan 14 09:30:28 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 09:30:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: BSDUserGroups Group Submitted In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374BC9@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: and who does it forward to? g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Hans Zaunere ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 9:29 AM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] FW: BSDUserGroups Group Submitted -> -> -> ->> is info at nycbug.org setup? -> ->Yeah -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From hans Wed Jan 14 09:35:06 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 06:35:06 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: BSDUserGroups Group Submitted Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374BCB@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > and who does it forward to? You and I... others? H From hans Wed Jan 14 09:38:22 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 06:38:22 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374BCC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > who has aliases setup beside me and hans? Right now it's myself, George and Marc. If there are others, tell me the address to forward to. To send from the alias, just add another "dummy" account in either Mozilla or Outlook. Then if someone replies, it'll go to the alias and get forwarded to your real mailbox. H From george Wed Jan 14 09:40:43 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 09:40:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374BCC@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: well. . . we've hit 20 list members. . . we're on our way. . . i guess i could get my mother to unsubscribe now. . . ;-) g From hans Wed Jan 14 10:02:15 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 07:02:15 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] 2nd Planning Meeting for NYCBUG 01/06/04 notes Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374BCD@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> I'm playing catchup... > NYCBUG Planning Meeting January 6, 2004 > > notes by GEORGE > > present were: > > Kliment > Marc > Hans > Wes > Michael > George > > Announcement Spiel > > Much discussion about spiel that will go on lists and www > sites. (note > that there were no comments when posted to the list in mid-December). > Main points were emphasis and structure. Meeting title for Feb 4 > determined to be "Secure by Default: Learning from OpenBSD." GEORGE > will provide updated version shortly, and all can begin distributing. > HANS will send him copy from today's meeting. > > !!!Everyone should have NYCBUG.org aliases to post announcement!!! Pass me an address to forward to and I'll setup an alias. > Distribution broken down as follows: > > * Deja/usenet, covering all BSD and Mac lists, MARC > * Mailing lists, advocacy & chat: > FreeBSD, GEORGE > OpenBSD, WES > NetBSD, ARON > Darwin/Mac, MARC > * Sites > Daemon News, GEORGE > Deadly.org, WES > bsdforums.org, MICHAEL > bsdvault.net, KLIMENT > bsdhound.com, GEORGE > kerneltrap.org, KLIMENT > rootprompt.org, HANS Done. > bsdatwork.com, MICHAEL > bsdnet.org, MARC > freebsddiary.org, GEORGE > bsdusergroup.org, GEORGE > other BUGS, GEORGE > * IRC, KLIMENT > > And of course, everyone is encouraged to go through bookmarks and add > to the list. It's a good idea to tell others via list other > locations announcement is posted. > > > BOF Meeting > > ARON isn't present, he was responsible for fliers for BOF & Feb 4th > meeting flier. > > Vistaprint.com doesn't do fliers, so GEORGE will talk with ARON about > an alternative. We should need approximately 500. Could order > business cards with NYCBUG and wwww site from Vistaprint. > > GEORGE will chair meeting, Don from BSDMall will speak for five > minutes, followed by Wes and Michael on NYCBUG. WES will also do a > book signing and provide "Network Security Illustrated" 50% > off. MARC will deal with refreshments. > > Linux Expo > > KLIMENT will deal with large signs (3) with NYCBUG logo & > logos of the projects, and will send markups to list for review. Fliers & signs > will be at NYPHP & BSDMall tables, at least. All should plan to > volunteer a few hours over the duration of the show. > > GEORGE will talk to BSDMall about distributing WES' book, and having > him at BSDMall table for book signing. > > SOMEONE (?) will take care of finding bar for informal get together > after January 22nd BOF meeting. > > Vendor Relations > > We're getting a bunch of FBSD 4.8 cd's from BSDMall, Michael > will speak to publishers about free books and discounts with lead from HANS. Good progress Michael - my work here is done :) > GEORGE will follow up with ARON about Wasabi. WES will > follow up with Dave Cook at TekServe, also he should mention meeting space. > > NYCBUG Logo > > GEORGE will email Marshall about logo for approval. Possibly > redesign to integrate different BSD variants. > > WWW Site Revision > > GEORGE & HANS will discuss. Couple minor revisions/fixes to the site... more to come. > Mailing List > > Managed officially by MARC. > > Mail Accounts > > Going to stick to aliases, until we can get mail server. > > Regular Meeting Space > > Temporarily, we will use Sage, but should investigate larger space, > such as TekServe. Free only, as in beer. > > Proposed Meetings > > Need to plan March 3rd meeting as soon as possible. ARON > needs to talk to Wasabi about BSD & Embedded Systems talk, WES can > talk to TekServe about BSD & OSX talk. > > Documentation Project > > Michael's laptop battle will be posted, possibly using CMS app from > NYPHP. Will also consider a BSD "family watch" similar to Linux The CMS is in the works. I'll keep everyone updated. All from here, H > distrowatch.com > > BSD CAN > > MARC is taking responsibility for organization. > > Intel Centrino Open Letter > > By Friday, WES will either provide info about this, or another topic. > > NYC Vendor BSD List > > All will provide ten vendors via TALK to Kliment who will accumulate. > We also should divide up and hit the LinuxExpo vendors. > > OpenlySecure.org > > WES will be upgrading the site, and we can then decide on role of > NYCBUG. > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > From george Wed Jan 14 10:03:48 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:03:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] important issues Message-ID: our three immediate tasks, i think, are as follows: 1. dealing with fliers for linux expo. should include spiel or a version of it, and advertise bof and feb 4th meetings. should be done in pdf. . . 2. scheduling topics for march 3 and april 7th meetings. michael: talk to wasabi about netbsd and embedded systems. wes: maybe osx talk if you make contact with tekserve. ideas? we need to have flier for march 3rd meeting at feb 4th meeting. 3. getting the announce spiel out there. . .usenet? deadly.org? kerneltrap? bsdatwork? net, open, darwin lists? any other issues? g From george Wed Jan 14 10:32:25 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:32:25 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: bsd user group In-Reply-To: <061601c3b8f2$08caa300$685e9dac@JeremyThinkPad> Message-ID: greetings jeremy. not sure if aron has contacted you, but are you interested in having a brief (ie, 5") speaker at our bof meeting at linuxexpo jan 22nd at 5:45 pm in room 1e15? thanks g From lists Wed Jan 14 10:26:39 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:26:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] important issues In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040114102639.19ca0b80.lists@genoverly.net> On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:03:48 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > our three immediate tasks, i think, are as follows: > > 1. dealing with fliers for linux expo. should include spiel or a > version of it, and advertise bof and feb 4th meetings. should be done > in pdf. . . > Who does 'flyers' locally? I know George already spend 12 bucks at vistaprint.com. If you guys can get me a pdf.. I'll run with it. > 2. scheduling topics for march 3 and april 7th meetings. michael: talk > to wasabi about netbsd and embedded systems. wes: maybe osx talk if you > make contact with tekserve. ideas? we need to have flier for march 3rd > meeting at feb 4th meeting. I never even heard of wasabi before our last meeting. Am I the best man for that job? > > 3. getting the announce spiel out there. . .usenet? deadly.org? > kerneltrap? bsdatwork? net, open, darwin lists? > > any other issues? bsdatwork is pending approval > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -- --- From george Wed Jan 14 10:36:50 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 10:36:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] important issues In-Reply-To: <20040114102639.19ca0b80.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: ->Who does 'flyers' locally? I know George already spend 12 ->bucks at vistaprint.com. If you guys can get me a pdf.. I'll ->run with it. i'm doing the pdf right now. . .i'll send it out to you guys, and if can make copies, great. ->> 2. scheduling topics for march 3 and april 7th meetings. michael: ->> talk to wasabi about netbsd and embedded systems. wes: ->maybe osx talk ->> if you make contact with tekserve. ideas? we need to have ->flier for ->> march 3rd meeting at feb 4th meeting. ->I never even heard of wasabi before our last meeting. Am I ->the best man for that job? i meant aron. sorry. ->bsdatwork is pending approval very nice. g From george Wed Jan 14 11:02:10 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:02:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . Message-ID: see attached. g -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: LinuxExpoFlier01.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 196994 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040114/b9c3fbd0/attachment.pdf From jschauma Wed Jan 14 11:28:10 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:28:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] important issues In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040114162810.GB24905@netmeister.org> "G. Rosamond" wrote: > 2. scheduling topics for march 3 and april 7th meetings. BSD install fest. The person bringing the weirdest piece of hardware to get *BSD installed on gets a free beverage from every lame-o i386 person. ;-) -Jan -- "Ford," he said, "you're turning into a penguin. Stop it." -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040114/f7f71afa/attachment.bin From lists Wed Jan 14 06:43:04 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:43:04 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question In-Reply-To: <20040114162810.GB24905@netmeister.org> References: <20040114162810.GB24905@netmeister.org> Message-ID: <20040114114046.B10367@zoraida.natserv.net> Hi. Just found out about the group at daemon news... Quick question.. For the Jan 22 meeting a Javits center does one have to register? From george Wed Jan 14 11:43:33 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:43:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question In-Reply-To: <20040114114046.B10367@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: nope. ..just for linuxexpo. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Francisco Reyes ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 6:43 AM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question -> -> ->Hi. ->Just found out about the group at daemon news... -> ->Quick question.. For the Jan 22 meeting a Javits center does ->one have to register? _______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From lists Wed Jan 14 06:54:55 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:54:55 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040114115428.A10457@zoraida.natserv.net> On Wed, 14 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > nope. ..just for linuxexpo. One has to register for Linuxexpo? Can't one just show up and pay admission? From george Wed Jan 14 11:55:46 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 11:55:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question In-Reply-To: <20040114115428.A10457@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: if you prefer that, okay. or we can get you a free entrance card. .. your choice. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Francisco Reyes ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 6:55 AM ->To: General discussion ->Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question -> -> ->On Wed, 14 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: -> ->> nope. ..just for linuxexpo. -> ->One has to register for Linuxexpo? Can't one just show up and ->pay admission? _______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From hans Wed Jan 14 11:56:22 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 08:56:22 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374BF0@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > nope. ..just for linuxexpo. > > One has to register for Linuxexpo? Can't one just show up and pay > admission? We have a bunch of free passes for the expo floor. If you need one, email me offlist and we can meetup at the show (I'll be there the whole time). H From ojo Wed Jan 14 12:18:24 2004 From: ojo (ojo at ravilla.com) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 12:18:24 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question Message-ID: <63B941F39AFA481C00008D387C9142CE.MAI@ravilla.com> that extremely high courtesy can apply to me also? this e-mail is powered by http://www.ravilla.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Hans Zaunere To: "General discussion" Sent: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 08:56:22 -0800 Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question > > nope. ..just for linuxexpo. >=20 > One has to register for Linuxexpo? Can't one just show up and pay > admission? We have a bunch of free passes for the expo floor. If you need one, email me offlist and we can meetup at the show (I'll be there the whole time). H _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From hans Wed Jan 14 12:21:13 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 09:21:13 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Hello and Jan 22 meeting question Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374C07@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > that extremely high courtesy can apply to me also? Sure... just about anyone.. we have quite a few. Email offlist for time/date to meet in front of Javits. From george Wed Jan 14 13:59:59 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 13:59:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ??? Message-ID: apparently some people aren't happy with the non-synchronous release of the announcement. . . 1. i don't give a f(*& what he says 2. the announcement happened to go out first on freebsd lists first, since i sent them there, and they were part of my responsibility. Others are responsible for the other lists, and should bang it out soon. so let's go. Subject: Re: NYCBUG To: None From: Perry E. Metzger List: netbsd-advocacy Date: 01/13/2004 13:50:55 Jan Schaumann writes: > http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-advocacy/2004-January/000873. html I like the idea of a BSD users group being announced solely to the FreeBSD lists. Demonstrates enlightened ecumenicism. Perry From aron Wed Jan 14 14:11:40 2004 From: aron (Aron Roberts) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:11:40 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] ??? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4005946C.4000405@slam.cc> Sent to the NYC Regional NetBSD mailing list. Hopefully panties will become unbunched now. I'll report back letting y'all know. G. Rosamond wrote: >apparently some people aren't happy with the non-synchronous release of >the announcement. . . > >1. i don't give a f(*& what he says > >2. the announcement happened to go out first on freebsd lists first, >since i sent them there, and they were part of my responsibility. >Others are responsible for the other lists, and should bang it out soon. > >so let's go. > >Subject: Re: NYCBUG >To: None >From: Perry E. Metzger >List: netbsd-advocacy >Date: 01/13/2004 13:50:55 > >Jan Schaumann writes: > > >http://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-advocacy/2004-January/000873. >html > >I like the idea of a BSD users group being announced solely to the >FreeBSD lists. Demonstrates enlightened ecumenicism. > >Perry > >_______________________________________________ >talk mailing list >talk at lists.nycbug.org >http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > From george Wed Jan 14 14:24:23 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:24:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated Message-ID: COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf comments? g From lists Wed Jan 14 16:46:18 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 16:46:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040114164618.49a8483d.lists@genoverly.net> On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:24:23 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf > B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf > > comments? > > g I called Kinkos. I can give them a PDF and they can print 1) 1000 black on white paper for around $70. 2) 1000 black on color paper for around $100. 3) color printing is NUTS -- --- From lists Wed Jan 14 17:29:07 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 17:29:07 -0500 Subject: Fw: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated Message-ID: <20040114172907.04212720.lists@genoverly.net> Begin forwarded message: Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 17:22:42 -0500 From: Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated As a contribution I can printed half of that price if somebody pick it up on Fifth Avenue, Brooklyn either color paper or b/w. in offset from the pdf file this e-mail is powered by http://www.ravilla.com ----- Original Message ----- From: michael To: talk at lists.nycbug.org Sent: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 16:46:18 -0500 Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:24:23 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf > B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf > > comments? > > g I called Kinkos. I can give them a PDF and they can print 1) 1000 black on white paper for around $70. 2) 1000 black on color paper for around $100. 3) color printing is NUTS -- --- _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -- --- From jschauma Wed Jan 14 17:43:56 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 17:43:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] key-signing at BoF Message-ID: <20040114224356.GD1814@netmeister.org> Hi, While I unfortunately won't be able to attend the BoF, it just occurred to me that you might want to use the occasion to also do some key-signing while people get to know each other. Just a though. -Jan -- "`Oh dear,' says God, `I hadn't thought of that,' and promptly vanished in a puff of logic. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040114/5dd43cb1/attachment.bin From wes Wed Jan 14 18:18:04 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:18:04 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] announce notices sent to... Message-ID: <32746.38.233.93.150.1074122284.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> openbsd announce, advocacy lists deadly.org bsdforums.org -- I put it in two places and emailed the administrator. From george Wed Jan 14 18:49:27 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:49:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated In-Reply-To: <20040114172907.04212720.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: i think a few people can pitch in, but i'm sure some have free copying ability. and if we could get 40 or so color. . . ;-) g ->As a contribution I can printed half of that price if ->somebody pick it up on Fifth Avenue, Brooklyn either color ->paper or b/w. in offset from the pdf file -> ->> COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf ->> B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf ->> ->> comments? -> ->I called Kinkos. I can give them a PDF and they can print -> ->1) 1000 black on white paper for around $70. ->2) 1000 black on color paper for around $100. ->3) color printing is NUTS -> -> ->-- ->--- ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> -> -> -> ->-- ->--- ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Wed Jan 14 18:50:13 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:50:13 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announce notices sent to... In-Reply-To: <32746.38.233.93.150.1074122284.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: cool. don't know if anybody's pissed on the obsd end ;-) . . .i actually submitted to deadly.org earlier this afternoon. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Wes Sonnenreich ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 6:18 PM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] announce notices sent to... -> -> ->openbsd announce, advocacy lists ->deadly.org ->bsdforums.org -- I put it in two places and emailed the ->administrator. _______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Wed Jan 14 18:53:35 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:53:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] further publicity. . . Message-ID: anybody on the opendarwin mailing lists? how about the other darwin-related lists? wes: did you establish contact with tekserve? what about the intel issue? g From wes Wed Jan 14 18:57:41 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 18:57:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed] Message-ID: <5589.38.233.93.150.1074124661.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Someone want to follow this up? ---------------------------- Original Message ---------------------------- Subject: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed From: "Chuck Yerkes" Date: Wed, January 14, 2004 6:42 pm To: "Wes Sonnenreich" -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quoting Wes Sonnenreich (wes at openlysecure.org): ... > NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not limited to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. I run a lot of BSD utilities on Solaris. That doesn't make Solaris a BSD. I have a laptop that uses BSD utilities on a Mach Kernel. That doesn't make MacOS a BSD. I forwarded your message to nysa.org and you should forward it to unigroup (both NY Unix groups (whos boards I used to be on). From george Wed Jan 14 19:17:55 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 19:17:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user groupformed] In-Reply-To: <5589.38.233.93.150.1074124661.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: ->Someone want to follow this up? ->Subject: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed ->From: "Chuck Yerkes" ->Date: Wed, January 14, 2004 6:42 pm ->To: "Wes Sonnenreich" ->Quoting Wes Sonnenreich (wes at openlysecure.org): ->... ->> NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not ->> limited ->to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, ->OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. ->I run a lot of BSD utilities on Solaris. ->That doesn't make Solaris a BSD. no one would argue that, despite how much code sun may have borrowed from bsd. microsoft's tcp/ip stack is from bsd. . .maybe they *are* a bsd. . . ->I have a laptop that uses BSD utilities on a Mach Kernel. ->That doesn't make MacOS a BSD. it is part of the bsd family, or more accurately, a derivative from the bsd family. not sure of your point. the reality today is that mac osx users who want to get into the heart of their system want to know bsd. that seems a reason to open the door to them. ->I forwarded your message to nysa.org and you should forward ->it to unigroup (both NY Unix groups (whos boards I used to be on). not to be factious, for spreading the word or to reprimand us? i find the message a bit unclear. . . g From jeffknight Wed Jan 14 19:51:17 2004 From: jeffknight (PUTAMARE) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 19:51:17 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed] Message-ID: If anyone is actually interested in a fairly detailed explanation of what OS X is, find it here http://www.kernelthread.com/mac/osx/arch_xnu.html While it is most certainly not a let us all split hairs pure 100% *BSD, it is also more *BSD than a little or a lot of "BSD utilities". Certainly, if an OS X user wants to solve a problem or learn more about what is under the hood, a BSD-user group would be as good place as any to start assuming, of course, they were welcome. Jeff Knight jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com From george Wed Jan 14 20:14:45 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:14:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdmeetup Message-ID: aron had mentioned this to me before. . .but apparently http://bsd.meetup.com/ is having some bsd meet up on jan 21 in chelsea or something. is anyone on that list? can someone mention the bof and jan 22? g From rbrown Wed Jan 14 20:31:48 2004 From: rbrown (Rodrick R. Brown) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:31:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200401150130.i0F1UdGV046396@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Nice flyer :) I know you guys are just getting this group started but are there any promo codes for registering @ Linux world this year as a BUG member ? -----Original Message----- From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of G. Rosamond Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 11:02 AM To: 'General discussion' Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . see attached. g From george Wed Jan 14 20:33:00 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:33:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . In-Reply-To: <200401150130.i0F1UdGV046396@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Message-ID: marc? what's the deal with that discount? for exhibition, we can get passes from nyphp (hans) or bsdmall (me). g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Rodrick R. Brown ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 8:32 PM ->To: 'General discussion' ->Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . -> -> ->Nice flyer :) -> ->I know you guys are just getting this group started but are ->there any promo codes for registering @ Linux world this year ->as a BUG member ? -> ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] ->On Behalf Of G. ->Rosamond ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 11:02 AM ->To: 'General discussion' ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . -> ->see attached. -> ->g -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From klimenta Wed Jan 14 20:36:33 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 01:36:33 -0000 Subject: [nycbug-talk] oops. . . References: Message-ID: <021801c2bc36$398af8a0$9c9e5343@haledon> > btw, kliment, remember that list of bsd vendors, etc? there's a > discussion about it right now on freebsd advocacy. i'll aggregate and > forward to this list later. Spiel sent to kerneltrap.org and bsdvault. Pending. From rbrown Wed Jan 14 20:54:53 2004 From: rbrown (Rodrick R. Brown) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:54:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated In-Reply-To: <20040114164618.49a8483d.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <200401150153.i0F1rcGV048292@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> I say go with Color for the extra $30 ill sponsor it :) -----Original Message----- From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 4:46 PM To: talk at lists.nycbug.org Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:24:23 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf > B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf > > comments? > > g I called Kinkos. I can give them a PDF and they can print 1) 1000 black on white paper for around $70. 2) 1000 black on color paper for around $100. 3) color printing is NUTS -- --- _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From okan Wed Jan 14 20:59:44 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:58:44 -0501 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated In-Reply-To: <200401150153.i0F1rcGV048292@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> References: <20040114164618.49a8483d.lists@genoverly.net> <200401150153.i0F1rcGV048292@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Message-ID: <20040115015906.GX10877@stravinsky.khaoz.org> ditto - i'll split it with you. On Wed 2004.01.14 at 20:54 -0500, Rodrick R. Brown wrote: > I say go with Color for the extra $30 ill sponsor it :) > > -----Original Message----- > From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] > On Behalf Of michael > Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 4:46 PM > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated > > On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:24:23 -0500 > "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > > COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf > > B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf > > > > comments? > > > > g > > > I called Kinkos. I can give them a PDF and they can print > > 1) 1000 black on white paper for around $70. > 2) 1000 black on color paper for around $100. > 3) color printing is NUTS > > > -- > --- > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -- From rbrown Wed Jan 14 21:01:21 2004 From: rbrown (Rodrick R. Brown) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:01:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD usergroupformed] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <200401150200.i0F204GV049807@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> "no one would argue that, despite how much code sun may have borrowed from bsd." As an Advid Solaris GURU @ work I have to defend SUN here, SUN was BSD way before FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD were conceived. SunOS userland and kernel were BSD in the core from the start :) -----Original Message----- From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of G. Rosamond Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 7:18 PM To: talk at lists.nycbug.org Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD usergroupformed] ->Someone want to follow this up? ->Subject: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed ->From: "Chuck Yerkes" ->Date: Wed, January 14, 2004 6:42 pm ->To: "Wes Sonnenreich" ->Quoting Wes Sonnenreich (wes at openlysecure.org): ->... ->> NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not ->> limited ->to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, ->OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. ->I run a lot of BSD utilities on Solaris. ->That doesn't make Solaris a BSD. no one would argue that, despite how much code sun may have borrowed from bsd. microsoft's tcp/ip stack is from bsd. . .maybe they *are* a bsd. . . ->I have a laptop that uses BSD utilities on a Mach Kernel. ->That doesn't make MacOS a BSD. it is part of the bsd family, or more accurately, a derivative from the bsd family. not sure of your point. the reality today is that mac osx users who want to get into the heart of their system want to know bsd. that seems a reason to open the door to them. ->I forwarded your message to nysa.org and you should forward ->it to unigroup (both NY Unix groups (whos boards I used to be on). not to be factious, for spreading the word or to reprimand us? i find the message a bit unclear. . . g _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From george Wed Jan 14 21:02:22 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:02:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD usergroupformed] In-Reply-To: <200401150200.i0F204GV049807@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Message-ID: not referring to the decade old bsd's, but the decades old bsd. and there is no crime in borrowing from bsd, within the license. ->"no one would argue that, despite how much code sun may have ->borrowed from bsd." -> ->As an Advid Solaris GURU @ work I have to defend SUN here, ->SUN was BSD way before FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD were conceived. -> ->SunOS userland and kernel were BSD in the core from the start :) From rbrown Wed Jan 14 21:05:44 2004 From: rbrown (Rodrick R. Brown) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:05:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] BUG PayPal Account In-Reply-To: <20040115015906.GX10877@stravinsky.khaoz.org> Message-ID: <200401150204.i0F24RGV050118@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> We should or the founders should setup a paypal account so members can donate funds to when needed for group activates and such just a thought. - RB -----Original Message----- From: Okan Demirmen [mailto:okan at demirmen.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 9:00 PM To: Rodrick R. Brown Cc: 'michael'; talk at lists.nycbug.org Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated ditto - i'll split it with you. On Wed 2004.01.14 at 20:54 -0500, Rodrick R. Brown wrote: > I say go with Color for the extra $30 ill sponsor it :) > > -----Original Message----- > From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] > On Behalf Of michael > Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 4:46 PM > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated > > On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:24:23 -0500 > "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > > COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf > > B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf > > > > comments? > > > > g > > > I called Kinkos. I can give them a PDF and they can print > > 1) 1000 black on white paper for around $70. > 2) 1000 black on color paper for around $100. > 3) color printing is NUTS > > > -- > --- > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -- From mspitze1 Wed Jan 14 21:49:42 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:49:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . In-Reply-To: References: <200401150130.i0F1UdGV046396@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Message-ID: <20040114214942.0c17c6f0.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:33:00 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > marc? > > what's the deal with that discount? no clue, if I knew I forgot. I got sent a mail for speakers stuff but I think I got the wrong mail for bof people. marc > > for exhibition, we can get passes from nyphp (hans) or bsdmall (me). > > g > > ->-----Original Message----- > ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org > ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Rodrick R. Brown > ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 8:32 PM > ->To: 'General discussion' > ->Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . > -> > -> > ->Nice flyer :) > -> > ->I know you guys are just getting this group started but are > ->there any promo codes for registering @ Linux world this year > ->as a BUG member ? > -> > ->-----Original Message----- > ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org > ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] > ->On Behalf Of G. > ->Rosamond > ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 11:02 AM > ->To: 'General discussion' > ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . > -> > ->see attached. > -> > ->g > -> > ->_______________________________________________ > ->talk mailing list > ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > -> > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From mspitze1 Wed Jan 14 21:57:58 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:57:58 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] BUG PayPal Account In-Reply-To: <200401150204.i0F24RGV050118@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> References: <20040115015906.GX10877@stravinsky.khaoz.org> <200401150204.i0F24RGV050118@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Message-ID: <20040114215758.6f15e740.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:05:44 -0500 "Rodrick R. Brown" wrote: > We should or the founders should setup a paypal account so members can > donate funds to when needed for group activates and such just a > thought. Well we are all founders, for whatever its worth. Now with that said lets just keep it simple for the next couple of months. Who knows who the officers are going to be and we do not have a business structure to put the money in. Besides we are not talking about a lot of money and as a group our individual words are good, as far as I am concerned. Now on the other hand if you pledge support here and stiff some one why do we want to know you. And for a small geographic group that will work fine. marc > > - RB > > -----Original Message----- > From: Okan Demirmen [mailto:okan at demirmen.com] > Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 9:00 PM > To: Rodrick R. Brown > Cc: 'michael'; talk at lists.nycbug.org > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated > > ditto - i'll split it with you. > > On Wed 2004.01.14 at 20:54 -0500, Rodrick R. Brown wrote: > > I say go with Color for the extra $30 ill sponsor it :) > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org > > [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael > > Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 4:46 PM > > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated > > > > On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:24:23 -0500 > > "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > > > > COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf > > > B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf > > > > > > comments? > > > > > > g > > > > > > I called Kinkos. I can give them a PDF and they can print > > > > 1) 1000 black on white paper for around $70. > > 2) 1000 black on color paper for around $100. > > 3) color printing is NUTS > > > > > > -- > > --- > > _______________________________________________ > > talk mailing list > > talk at lists.nycbug.org > > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > > > _______________________________________________ > > talk mailing list > > talk at lists.nycbug.org > > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > -- > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From mspitze1 Wed Jan 14 22:04:19 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:04:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD usergroupformed] In-Reply-To: <200401150200.i0F204GV049807@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> References: <200401150200.i0F204GV049807@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Message-ID: <20040114220419.12eefb2c.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:01:21 -0500 "Rodrick R. Brown" wrote: > > "no one would argue that, despite how much code sun may have borrowed > from bsd." > > As an Advid Solaris GURU @ work I have to defend SUN here, SUN was BSD > way before FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD were conceived. > > SunOS userland and kernel were BSD in the core from the start :) Let me say I like Solaris but it is not bsd based it is System V based with a bunch of bsd tools in /usr/ucb and usr/ccs/ now if you want to talk about SunOS then it was bsd based but sun has killed the product off in favor of Solaris. And when you talk about Sun today you talk about Solaris. And I have an ultra 60 at home. marc > > > -----Original Message----- > From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org > [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of G. Rosamond > Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 7:18 PM > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD > usergroupformed] > > ->Someone want to follow this up? > > ->Subject: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed > ->From: "Chuck Yerkes" > ->Date: Wed, January 14, 2004 6:42 pm > ->To: "Wes Sonnenreich" > > ->Quoting Wes Sonnenreich (wes at openlysecure.org): > ->... > ->> NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not > ->> limited > ->to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, > ->OpenDarwin, Darwin and Mac OSX. > ->I run a lot of BSD utilities on Solaris. > ->That doesn't make Solaris a BSD. > > no one would argue that, despite how much code sun may have borrowed > from bsd. > > microsoft's tcp/ip stack is from bsd. . .maybe they *are* a bsd. . . > > ->I have a laptop that uses BSD utilities on a Mach Kernel. > ->That doesn't make MacOS a BSD. > > it is part of the bsd family, or more accurately, a derivative from > the bsd family. > > not sure of your point. the reality today is that mac osx users who > want to get into the heart of their system want to know bsd. that > seems a reason to open the door to them. > > ->I forwarded your message to nysa.org and you should forward > ->it to unigroup (both NY Unix groups (whos boards I used to be on). > > not to be factious, for spreading the word or to reprimand us? > > i find the message a bit unclear. . . > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From aron Wed Jan 14 22:38:14 2004 From: aron (Aron Roberts) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:38:14 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD usergroupformed] In-Reply-To: <20040114220419.12eefb2c.mspitze1@optonline.net> References: <200401150200.i0F204GV049807@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> <20040114220419.12eefb2c.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: <402194A8-470C-11D8-9E5B-000502916C37@slam.cc> On Jan 14, 2004, at 10:04 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 21:01:21 -0500 > "Rodrick R. Brown" wrote: > >> >> "no one would argue that, despite how much code sun may have borrowed >> from bsd." >> >> As an Advid Solaris GURU @ work I have to defend SUN here, SUN was BSD >> way before FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD were conceived. >> >> SunOS userland and kernel were BSD in the core from the start :) > > Let me say I like Solaris but it is not bsd based it is System V based > with a bunch of bsd tools in /usr/ucb and usr/ccs/ now if you want to > talk about SunOS then it was bsd based but sun has killed the product > off in favor of Solaris. And when you talk about Sun today you talk > about Solaris. And I have an ultra 60 at home. > Yeah but I think you are missing his point about original SunOS.... if it were not for some stupid BBS in Seattle I was on where I had to learn SunOS 4.x.x_x (blah blah) I don't think I would have ever turned into a UNIX geek. And it was all BSD before they went to "Solaris" So yes the product is dead... but it doesn't remove the history of what you used "back in the day" From aron Wed Jan 14 22:45:55 2004 From: aron (Aron Roberts) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:45:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdmeetup In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52AEE0E3-470D-11D8-9E5B-000502916C37@slam.cc> Actually I created the original BSD Meetup Group..however I think only 2 other people signed up in NYC so AFAIK there have been no NYC meetings but they have been happening in other places.. I would be happy and shocked if there has actually been a real meetup in NYC so far. On Jan 14, 2004, at 8:14 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > aron had mentioned this to me before. . .but apparently > http://bsd.meetup.com/ is having some bsd meet up on jan 21 in chelsea > or something. > > is anyone on that list? can someone mention the bof and jan 22? > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From aron Wed Jan 14 22:49:37 2004 From: aron (Aron Roberts) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:49:37 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed] In-Reply-To: <5589.38.233.93.150.1074124661.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <5589.38.233.93.150.1074124661.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: I certainly cannot properly reply to this but I would argue that while the Mach Kernel is certainly not BSD... the FreeBSD userland they have implemented is quite impressive and you'd have to say that MacOS is as BSD-like as it possibly can be. On Jan 14, 2004, at 6:57 PM, Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > Someone want to follow this up? > > ---------------------------- Original Message > ---------------------------- > Subject: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed > From: "Chuck Yerkes" > Date: Wed, January 14, 2004 6:42 pm > To: "Wes Sonnenreich" > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > > Quoting Wes Sonnenreich (wes at openlysecure.org): > ... >> NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but not >> limited > to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, OpenDarwin, Darwin > and Mac OSX. > > I run a lot of BSD utilities on Solaris. > That doesn't make Solaris a BSD. > > I have a laptop that uses BSD utilities on a Mach Kernel. > That doesn't make MacOS a BSD. > > > I forwarded your message to nysa.org and you should forward > it to unigroup (both NY Unix groups (whos boards I used to be on). > > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From mspitze1 Wed Jan 14 23:38:11 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 23:38:11 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD usergroupformed] In-Reply-To: <402194A8-470C-11D8-9E5B-000502916C37@slam.cc> References: <200401150200.i0F204GV049807@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> <20040114220419.12eefb2c.mspitze1@optonline.net> <402194A8-470C-11D8-9E5B-000502916C37@slam.cc> Message-ID: <20040114233811.25d77c4c.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:38:14 -0500 Aron Roberts wrote: > Yeah but I think you are missing his point about original SunOS.... I am aware of the history, I worked on hpux 9.X wich was also bsd based and apollo domain(what HP bought to get into the workstation market) boxes in college. But with that said if you talk Sun today you are talking Solaris and it is that simple. And the only reason that unix converged the way it did in the 80's and 90's was that for cheap money you could buy the basis of your OS cutting a year off of the development time. And even current Unix is still not where VAX/VMS was back in 1990. And in many ways it could have been done much better, root is a design flaw and /etc/passwd with the passwords world readable was also just not a good idea. marc > > if it were not for some stupid BBS in Seattle I was on where I had to > learn SunOS 4.x.x_x (blah blah) I don't think I would have ever turned > into a UNIX geek. And it was all BSD before they went to "Solaris" > So yes the product is dead... but it doesn't remove the history of > what you used "back in the day" > From rbrown Wed Jan 14 23:51:43 2004 From: rbrown (Rodrick R. Brown) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 23:51:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSDusergroupformed] In-Reply-To: <20040114233811.25d77c4c.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: <200401150449.i0F4ndGV063623@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Marc, please read what I wrote and Aron got the point I was trying to make not sure why you didn't :-) "SOLARIS WAS BSD" you can't take that away from it period so all the extra stuff about your background isnt necessary :) Just my 2cents. - RB -----Original Message----- From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Marc Spitzer Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 11:38 PM To: talk at lists.nycbug.org Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSDusergroupformed] On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:38:14 -0500 Aron Roberts wrote: > Yeah but I think you are missing his point about original SunOS.... I am aware of the history, I worked on hpux 9.X wich was also bsd based and apollo domain(what HP bought to get into the workstation market) boxes in college. But with that said if you talk Sun today you are talking Solaris and it is that simple. And the only reason that unix converged the way it did in the 80's and 90's was that for cheap money you could buy the basis of your OS cutting a year off of the development time. And even current Unix is still not where VAX/VMS was back in 1990. And in many ways it could have been done much better, root is a design flaw and /etc/passwd with the passwords world readable was also just not a good idea. marc > > if it were not for some stupid BBS in Seattle I was on where I had to > learn SunOS 4.x.x_x (blah blah) I don't think I would have ever turned > into a UNIX geek. And it was all BSD before they went to "Solaris" > So yes the product is dead... but it doesn't remove the history of > what you used "back in the day" > _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From okan Wed Jan 14 23:54:07 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 23:54:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdmeetup In-Reply-To: <52AEE0E3-470D-11D8-9E5B-000502916C37@slam.cc> References: <52AEE0E3-470D-11D8-9E5B-000502916C37@slam.cc> Message-ID: <20040115045429.GA15423@stravinsky.khaoz.org> On Wed 2004.01.14 at 22:45 -0500, Aron Roberts wrote: > Actually I created the original BSD Meetup Group..however I think only > 2 other people signed up in NYC so AFAIK there have been no NYC > meetings but they have been happening in other places.. I would be > happy and shocked if there has actually been a real meetup in NYC so > far. funny you say that. after reading the below post, i went ahead and voted/signed up for the next one, only to get a cancelation email 5 hours later, claiming fewer than 5 showed interest ;) > > On Jan 14, 2004, at 8:14 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > > >aron had mentioned this to me before. . .but apparently > >http://bsd.meetup.com/ is having some bsd meet up on jan 21 in chelsea > >or something. > > > >is anyone on that list? can someone mention the bof and jan 22? > > > >g > > > >_______________________________________________ > >talk mailing list > >talk at lists.nycbug.org > >http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -- From okan Thu Jan 15 00:09:47 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 00:08:47 -0501 Subject: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York *BSDusergroupformed] In-Reply-To: <200401150449.i0F4ndGV063623@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> References: <20040114233811.25d77c4c.mspitze1@optonline.net> <200401150449.i0F4ndGV063623@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Message-ID: <20040115050909.GB15423@stravinsky.khaoz.org> On Wed 2004.01.14 at 23:51 -0500, Rodrick R. Brown wrote: > Marc, please read what I wrote and Aron got the point I was trying to make > not sure why you didn't :-) "SOLARIS WAS BSD" you can't take that away from > it period so all the extra stuff about your background isnt necessary :) I think we are all stuck in symantecs (OS vs OS vs Name of Company). SunOS was a BSD core, not Solaris (Two different OS's). Solaris has BSD elements left over. SUN is the name of the company, and if we want history, formally known as Stanford University Network. I'm lost on the purpose of this thread, for the OP was caught up in symantecs himself: BSD or not BSD. and my $0.02 okan > Just my 2cents. > > - RB > > -----Original Message----- > From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] > On Behalf Of Marc Spitzer > Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 11:38 PM > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] [Fwd: Re: Announcement: New York > *BSDusergroupformed] > > On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:38:14 -0500 > Aron Roberts wrote: > > > Yeah but I think you are missing his point about original SunOS.... > > I am aware of the history, I worked on hpux 9.X wich was also bsd based > and apollo domain(what HP bought to get into the workstation market) boxes > in college. But with that said if you talk Sun today you are talking > Solaris and it is that simple. And the only reason that unix > converged the way it did in the 80's and 90's was that for cheap money > you could buy the basis of your OS cutting a year off of the development > time. And even current Unix is still not where VAX/VMS was back in 1990. > And in many ways it could have been done much better, root is > a design flaw and /etc/passwd with the passwords world readable was also > just not a good idea. > > marc > > > > > if it were not for some stupid BBS in Seattle I was on where I had to > > learn SunOS 4.x.x_x (blah blah) I don't think I would have ever turned > > into a UNIX geek. And it was all BSD before they went to "Solaris" > > So yes the product is dead... but it doesn't remove the history of > > what you used "back in the day" > > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -- From george Thu Jan 15 00:25:18 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 00:25:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . In-Reply-To: <20040114214942.0c17c6f0.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: there was some discount if we wanted to go to the conference speakers. . i'll forward tomorrow. . . g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Marc Spitzer ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 9:50 PM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . -> -> ->On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 20:33:00 -0500 ->"G. Rosamond" wrote: -> ->> marc? ->> ->> what's the deal with that discount? -> ->no clue, if I knew I forgot. I got sent a mail for speakers ->stuff but I think I got the wrong mail for bof people. -> ->marc -> ->> ->> for exhibition, we can get passes from nyphp (hans) or bsdmall (me). ->> ->> g ->> ->> ->-----Original Message----- ->> ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->> ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of ->Rodrick R. Brown ->> ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 8:32 PM ->> ->To: 'General discussion' ->> ->Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . ->> -> ->> -> ->> ->Nice flyer :) ->> -> ->> ->I know you guys are just getting this group started but are ->> ->there any promo codes for registering @ Linux world this year ->> ->as a BUG member ? ->> -> ->> ->-----Original Message----- ->> ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->> ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] ->> ->On Behalf Of G. ->> ->Rosamond ->> ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 11:02 AM ->> ->To: 'General discussion' ->> ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier. . . ->> -> ->> ->see attached. ->> -> ->> ->g ->> -> ->> ->_______________________________________________ ->> ->talk mailing list ->> ->talk at lists.nycbug.org ->http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk ->> -> ->> ->> ->_______________________________________________ ->> talk mailing list ->> talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Thu Jan 15 00:29:26 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 00:29:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdmeetup In-Reply-To: <52AEE0E3-470D-11D8-9E5B-000502916C37@slam.cc> Message-ID: so go and make a statement. . . if they haven't heard already. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: Aron Roberts [mailto:aron at slam.cc] ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 10:46 PM ->To: george at sddi.net ->Cc: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] bsdmeetup -> -> ->Actually I created the original BSD Meetup Group..however I ->think only ->2 other people signed up in NYC so AFAIK there have been no NYC ->meetings but they have been happening in other places.. I would be ->happy and shocked if there has actually been a real meetup in NYC so ->far. -> -> ->On Jan 14, 2004, at 8:14 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: -> ->> aron had mentioned this to me before. . .but apparently ->> http://bsd.meetup.com/ is having some bsd meet up on jan 21 ->in chelsea ->> or something. ->> ->> is anyone on that list? can someone mention the bof and jan 22? ->> ->> g ->> ->> _______________________________________________ ->> talk mailing list ->> talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Thu Jan 15 00:31:27 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 00:31:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdmeetup In-Reply-To: <20040115045429.GA15423@stravinsky.khaoz.org> Message-ID: yeah, get with the program aron. not that *i* signed up or anything. . . g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: Okan Demirmen [mailto:okan at demirmen.com] ->Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2004 11:54 PM ->To: Aron Roberts ->Cc: george at sddi.net; talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] bsdmeetup -> -> ->On Wed 2004.01.14 at 22:45 -0500, Aron Roberts wrote: ->> Actually I created the original BSD Meetup Group..however I ->think only ->> 2 other people signed up in NYC so AFAIK there have been no NYC ->> meetings but they have been happening in other places.. I would be ->> happy and shocked if there has actually been a real meetup ->in NYC so ->> far. -> ->funny you say that. after reading the below post, i went ->ahead and voted/signed up for the next one, only to get a ->cancelation email 5 hours later, claiming fewer than 5 showed ->interest ;) -> ->> ->> On Jan 14, 2004, at 8:14 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: ->> ->> >aron had mentioned this to me before. . .but apparently ->> >http://bsd.meetup.com/ is having some bsd meet up on jan 21 in ->> >chelsea or something. ->> > ->> >is anyone on that list? can someone mention the bof and jan 22? ->> > ->> >g ->> > ->> >_______________________________________________ ->> >talk mailing list ->> >talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk ->> ->> _______________________________________________ ->> talk mailing list ->> talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> ->-- -> From dan Thu Jan 15 07:21:12 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 07:21:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD for Linux users Message-ID: <40063F68.480.52C3DDC@localhost> Of all the things to take to Linux World, what about Mathew Fuller's "FreeBSD for Linux users"? I haven't read it yet, but on the surface, it might be a good candidate for publicity. cheers -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From lists Thu Jan 15 07:51:47 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 07:51:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD for Linux users In-Reply-To: <40063F68.480.52C3DDC@localhost> References: <40063F68.480.52C3DDC@localhost> Message-ID: <20040115075147.408ac08d.lists@genoverly.net> On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 07:21:12 -0500 "Dan Langille" wrote: > Of all the things to take to Linux World, what about > Mathew Fuller's "FreeBSD for Linux users"? > > I haven't read it yet, but on the surface, it might be a > good candidate for publicity. > > cheers > -- > Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ I actually took the time to read it yesterday. I thought it was well written but with a 'fun' approach. Pay attention to his disclaimers, he tries to head off the trolls and other petty bickering. There is a heavy slant, but he _is_ a fbsd guy. I think we can still present the ideas without the Linux bashing to an Expo crowd. -- --- From dan Thu Jan 15 08:29:39 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 08:29:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD for Linux users In-Reply-To: <20040115075147.408ac08d.lists@genoverly.net> References: <40063F68.480.52C3DDC@localhost> Message-ID: <40064F73.15189.56AE79A@localhost> On 15 Jan 2004 at 7:51, michael wrote: > On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 07:21:12 -0500 > "Dan Langille" wrote: > > > Of all the things to take to Linux World, what about > > Mathew Fuller's "FreeBSD for Linux users"? > > > > I haven't read it yet, but on the surface, it might be a > > good candidate for publicity. > > I actually took the time to read it yesterday. I thought it > was well written but with a 'fun' approach. > > Pay attention to his disclaimers, he tries to head off the > trolls and other petty bickering. There is a heavy slant, > but he _is_ a fbsd guy. The slant should be obvious from the "title": FreeBSD for Linux users". But that's OK. There is nothing wrong with slant so long as the facts are correct. > I think we can still present the ideas without the Linux > bashing to an Expo crowd. Linux bashing, or any other bashing for that matter, has no place in advocacy. The object of your advocacy either wins on merit, or it doesn't. If one has to resort to bashing, the home work has not been done. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From george Thu Jan 15 10:13:34 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:13:34 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD for Linux users In-Reply-To: <20040115075147.408ac08d.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: i also gave it a quick read yesterday, and thought it was an interesting perspective. kind of like a 'think unix' approach. it's an idea. . .any other thoughts? g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael ->Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 7:52 AM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD for Linux users -> -> ->On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 07:21:12 -0500 ->"Dan Langille" wrote: -> ->> Of all the things to take to Linux World, what about ->> Mathew Fuller's "FreeBSD for Linux users"? ->> ->> I haven't read it yet, but on the surface, it might be a ->> good candidate for publicity. ->> ->> cheers ->> -- ->> Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ -> ->I actually took the time to read it yesterday. I thought it ->was well written but with a 'fun' approach. -> ->Pay attention to his disclaimers, he tries to head off the ->trolls and other petty bickering. There is a heavy slant, but ->he _is_ a fbsd guy. -> ->I think we can still present the ideas without the Linux ->bashing to an Expo crowd. -> ->-- ->--- ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Thu Jan 15 10:17:45 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 10:17:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] wasabi. . . Message-ID: spoke to jeremy sohn at wasabi (netbsd), and he's going to give a brief thing at the bof. i'll add him to the flier later. g From gary Thu Jan 15 11:52:46 2004 From: gary (Gary) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:52:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD for Linux users In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4006C55E.2040602@sergievsky.cpmc.columbia.edu> > ->On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 07:21:12 -0500 > ->"Dan Langille" wrote: > -> > ->> Of all the things to take to Linux World, what about > ->> Mathew Fuller's "FreeBSD for Linux users"? > ->> I'm new to this list. Can someone tell me what this is? Couldn't find it with Google. Gary From jschauma Thu Jan 15 12:03:27 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 12:03:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD for Linux users In-Reply-To: <4006C55E.2040602@sergievsky.cpmc.columbia.edu> References: <4006C55E.2040602@sergievsky.cpmc.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <20040115170327.GH4022@netmeister.org> Gary wrote: > >->On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 07:21:12 -0500 > >->"Dan Langille" wrote: > >-> > >->> Of all the things to take to Linux World, what about > >->> Mathew Fuller's "FreeBSD for Linux users"? > >->> > > I'm new to this list. Can someone tell me what this is? Couldn't find it > with Google. http://daily.daemonnews.org -> http://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/rants/bsd4linux/bsd4linux1.php -Jan -- Probability factor of one to one. We have normality. I repeat, we have normality. Anything you still can't cope with is therefore your own lookout. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040115/dab0ac85/attachment.bin From lists Thu Jan 15 11:56:12 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:56:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FreeBSD for Linux users In-Reply-To: <4006C55E.2040602@sergievsky.cpmc.columbia.edu> References: <4006C55E.2040602@sergievsky.cpmc.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <20040115115612.16a1dd7d.lists@genoverly.net> On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:52:46 -0500 Gary wrote: > > ->On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 07:21:12 -0500 > > ->"Dan Langille" wrote: > > -> > > ->> Of all the things to take to Linux World, what about > > ->> Mathew Fuller's "FreeBSD for Linux users"? > > ->> > > I'm new to this list. Can someone tell me what this is? > Couldn't find it with Google. > > Gary > Sorry Gary, I found this posted in several places.. OSNews, BSDForums, etc. but did not post it here. Michael http://www.over-yonder.net/~fullermd/rants/bsd4linux/bsd4linux1.php -- --- -- --- From dan Thu Jan 15 16:58:30 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 16:58:30 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] BSDCan brochure Message-ID: <4006C6B6.15809.73CCEB6@localhost> Today was a complete disaster from a work point of view, but I did find time I didn't know I'd have. I found an MS Word template which had a brochure in it. I did substituations and created .doc and .pdf files. The results are at: http://www.freebsddiary.org/advocacy/ Anyone is free to take these and modify them for their own use. Suggestions for improvement welcomed. I'll be handing these out at Linux World. I will also have a similar brochure for favourite network backup tool, Bacula . -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From george Thu Jan 15 17:13:36 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:13:36 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results Message-ID: i think this is very good news. "not officially supported" but in development is a big step in the right direction. g -----Original Message----- From: owner-freebsd-advocacy at freebsd.org [mailto:owner-freebsd-advocacy at freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Matt Olander Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 5:00 PM To: advocacy at freebsd.org Subject: Oracle Meeting Results Today Peter Wemm and I met with Edward Screven the CTO at Oracle to discuss the possiblity of Oracle on FreeBSD natively. The meeting went very well overall and Edward seemed to be cool with the idea. Of course, the Oracle marketing engine is concerned if there is a viable market for gearing up to do something of this nature. What we ended up discussing is a 'not officially supported' development version of Oracle downloadable from their website after filling in the standard who, what, where, and why type of form with the typical disclaimers, which I believe they already do for the other development versions. In an attempt to placate his concerns about supporting a test download like this, we informed him that the FreeBSD community is used to figuring out things on their own, and that we could possibly have a couple of DBA contacts within the community act as primary contacts for initial support and an oracle specific mailing list. I'll keep the list posted as we get any further (or not). thanks Peter! -- Matt Olander (408)943-4100 Phone (408)943-4101 Fax www.offmyserver.com -- "Those who don't read have no advantage over those who can't" -Mark Twain _______________________________________________ freebsd-advocacy at freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-advocacy-unsubscribe at freebsd.org" From hans Thu Jan 15 17:19:22 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 14:19:22 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374D3B@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > i think this is very good news. > > "not officially supported" but in development is a big step > in the right direction. This is exciting news - maybe this is a petition topic? H > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-freebsd-advocacy at freebsd.org > [mailto:owner-freebsd-advocacy at freebsd.org] On Behalf Of Matt Olander > Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 5:00 PM > To: advocacy at freebsd.org > Subject: Oracle Meeting Results > > > Today Peter Wemm and I met with Edward Screven the CTO at Oracle to > discuss the possiblity of Oracle on FreeBSD natively. The > meeting went > very well overall and Edward seemed to be cool with the idea. > > Of course, the Oracle marketing engine is concerned if there > is a viable > market for gearing up to do something of this nature. > > What we ended up discussing is a 'not officially supported' > development > version of Oracle downloadable from their website after filling in the > standard who, what, where, and why type of form with the typical > disclaimers, which I believe they already do for the other development > versions. > > In an attempt to placate his concerns about supporting a test download > like this, we informed him that the FreeBSD community is used to > figuring > out things on their own, and that we could possibly have a > couple of DBA > contacts within the community act as primary contacts for initial > support and an oracle specific mailing list. > > I'll keep the list posted as we get any further (or not). > > thanks Peter! > > -- > Matt Olander > (408)943-4100 Phone > (408)943-4101 Fax > www.offmyserver.com From dan Thu Jan 15 17:34:02 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:34:02 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flierS updated In-Reply-To: <20040114164618.49a8483d.lists@genoverly.net> References: Message-ID: <4006CF0A.1308.75D58C7@localhost> On 14 Jan 2004 at 16:46, michael wrote: > On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 14:24:23 -0500 > "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > > COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf > > B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf > > > > comments? > > > > g > > > I called Kinkos. I can give them a PDF and they can print > > 1) 1000 black on white paper for around $70. > 2) 1000 black on color paper for around $100. > 3) color printing is NUTS I called my local staples.ca and asked them for prices for a double sided brochure (B+W). They charge this rate for this many pages: $0.03 cents a page for 1000 or over copies $0.04 cents a page for 500-999 copies $0.05 cents a page for 100-499 copies So 1000 double sided brochures is actually 2000 copies or $60 (US$45) 500 is $40 (US$30) 100 is $10 (US$7.50) All prices are CAD$ unless otherwise stated. How many brochures are you folks printing? -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From wes Thu Jan 15 17:40:52 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:40:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374D3B@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia. net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374D3B@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <22491.38.233.93.150.1074206452.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> >> i think this is very good news. >> >> "not officially supported" but in development is a big step >> in the right direction. > > This is exciting news - maybe this is a petition topic? > > H Good idea for BOF and BSDcan petition, but probably won't interest many regular linuxexpo goers. Sorry for being so lame about this petition thing... I'm working on it today... I just want to make sure the issue is as relevant as possible. Wes From mspitze1 Thu Jan 15 17:48:18 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:48:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results In-Reply-To: <22491.38.233.93.150.1074206452.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374D3B@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> <22491.38.233.93.150.1074206452.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <20040115174818.29844119.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 17:40:52 -0500 (EST) Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > >> i think this is very good news. > >> > >> "not officially supported" but in development is a big step > >> in the right direction. > > > > This is exciting news - maybe this is a petition topic? > > > > H > > Good idea for BOF and BSDcan petition, but probably won't interest > many regular linuxexpo goers. I think this could be very useful, I think many, if not, all of its competitors will follow it to freebsd. If Oracle does it it *must* be a good idea after all. marc From wes Thu Jan 15 18:00:41 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:00:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] linuxtag people Message-ID: <13038.38.233.93.150.1074207641.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Who wants to meet with these guys? I'll be around... should we try to schedule a meeting at my office? I can reserve a conference room, etc. -- Wes ---------------------------- Original Message ---------------------------- Subject: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed From: "Nils Magnus" Date: Thu, January 15, 2004 5:33 pm To: wes at openlysecure.org Cc: "Robert Depenbrock" "Klaus Knopper" -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Re, > Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 17:52:18 -0500 (EST) > From: Wes Sonnenreich > To: advocacy at openbsd.org, announce at openbsd.org > Subject: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed > > We have initiated a BSD user group in New York City called NYCBUG (pronounced "nice-bug"). [...] Nice to hear about such initiatives. We wish you a lot of success with the new group. We are representatives from LinuxTag, the most important Open Source/Free Software Conference and Exhibition in Europe. And to start with, despite our name (meaning "LinuxCon" as in "Convention" if translated) we have a long tradition in hosting all kinds of *BSD groups as well ;) We are heading to NYC for LWE next saturday and seek contact to all kinds of user groups as well as multiplicators as for the exchange of experiences. We'll be in NYC the whole next week and would like to ask whom to speak to and when about these issues. Regards, Nils Magnus Program-Chair LinuxTag 2004 Free Conference Program LinuxTag 2004: Where .com meets .org - magnus at linuxtag.org From george Thu Jan 15 18:06:19 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:06:19 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] linuxtag people In-Reply-To: <13038.38.233.93.150.1074207641.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: i'll there. . .count me in. . . what is the purpose though. . .anything concrete? g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Wes Sonnenreich ->Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2004 6:01 PM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] linuxtag people -> -> ->Who wants to meet with these guys? I'll be around... should ->we try to schedule a meeting at my office? I can reserve a ->conference room, etc. -> ->-- Wes -> ->---------------------------- Original Message ->---------------------------- ->Subject: Re: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed ->From: "Nils Magnus" ->Date: Thu, January 15, 2004 5:33 pm ->To: wes at openlysecure.org ->Cc: "Robert Depenbrock" -> "Klaus Knopper" ->-------------------------------------------------------------- ->------------ -> ->Re, -> ->> Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2004 17:52:18 -0500 (EST) ->> From: Wes Sonnenreich ->> To: advocacy at openbsd.org, announce at openbsd.org ->> Subject: Announcement: New York *BSD user group formed ->> ->> We have initiated a BSD user group in New York City called NYCBUG ->(pronounced "nice-bug"). ->[...] -> ->Nice to hear about such initiatives. We wish you a lot of ->success with the new group. -> ->We are representatives from LinuxTag, the most important Open ->Source/Free Software Conference and Exhibition in Europe. And ->to start with, despite our name (meaning "LinuxCon" as in ->"Convention" if ->translated) we have a long tradition in hosting all kinds of ->*BSD groups as well ;) -> ->We are heading to NYC for LWE next saturday and seek contact ->to all kinds of user groups as well as multiplicators as for ->the exchange of experiences. -> ->We'll be in NYC the whole next week and would like to ask ->whom to speak to and when about these issues. -> ->Regards, -> ->Nils Magnus ->Program-Chair LinuxTag 2004 Free Conference Program -> ->LinuxTag 2004: Where .com meets .org - magnus at linuxtag.org -> -> -> -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From lists Thu Jan 15 18:31:45 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:31:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flyers Message-ID: <20040115183145.32c84a82.lists@genoverly.net> We have offers from Brooklyn to Ottawa to get this done cheaper than the Kinkos downtown here. I'm ready to take somebody up on this but first... 1. Does everyone agree on George's [fantastic] artwork? COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf 2. Where/When exactly are these going to be handed out? The whole show? Just the BOF? This should help us decide on volume. 3. I like a single side black on white paper. That way I could use a little of the company resources . (and so could you, and you, and you... and pretty soon we have it done under budget) Comments? -- --- From dan Thu Jan 15 18:45:28 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:45:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flyers In-Reply-To: <20040115183145.32c84a82.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <4006DFC8.31190.79EC102@localhost> On 15 Jan 2004 at 18:31, michael wrote: > We have offers from Brooklyn to Ottawa to get this done > cheaper than the Kinkos downtown here. I'm ready to take > somebody up on this but first... NOTE: the prices I stated are based on a double sided result. Half the prices if we're just single sided. > 1. Does everyone agree on George's [fantastic] artwork? > COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf > B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf I like it. > 2. Where/When exactly are these going to be handed out? > The whole show? Just the BOF? > This should help us decide on volume. Just the BOF means you want to remove the BOF ad from the document. I suggest you hand it out during the entire show. You want people at the BOF and/or you want them at the meeting. > 3. I like a single side black on white paper. That way I > could use a little of the company resources . > (and so could you, and you, and you... and pretty soon we > have it done under budget) Single sided is cheaper. I went for double-sided because I had more information to deliver. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From george Thu Jan 15 18:48:27 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:48:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flyers In-Reply-To: <20040115183145.32c84a82.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: ->We have offers from Brooklyn to Ottawa to get this done ->cheaper than the Kinkos downtown here. I'm ready to take ->somebody up on this but first... . . . ->1. Does everyone agree on George's [fantastic] artwork? ->COLOR: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01color.pdf ->B/W: www.nycbug.org/LinuxExpoFlier01bw.pdf let's not exaggerate now. . . ;-) ->2. Where/When exactly are these going to be handed out? ->The whole show? Just the BOF? ->This should help us decide on volume. my feeling is that we should have a few stacks around. .. .nyphp, nylug, bsdmall. . .and stick the 4color ones up on walls. . . ->3. I like a single side black on white paper. That way I ->could use a little of the company resources . ->(and so could you, and you, and you... and pretty soon we ->have it done under budget) my thinking precisely. . . g From george Fri Jan 16 09:39:42 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 09:39:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] status of announcement? Message-ID: still not up on. . . usenet/deja MARC ?obsd lists WES (no accurate list archives) bsdforums.org MICHAEL bsdvault.net KLIMENT rootprompt.org HANS bsdatwork.com MICHAEL ?bsdnet.org MARC (list archives?) bsdusergroups.org GEORGE (submitted, not posted) i think usenet is important, as are the openbsd lists. status? any other place to hit? i'll put out a link with the announcements later. not much discussion anywhere about it. g From okan Fri Jan 16 10:12:00 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 10:12:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] status of announcement? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040116151222.GU15423@stravinsky.khaoz.org> On Fri 2004.01.16 at 09:39 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > still not up on. . . > > usenet/deja MARC > > ?obsd lists WES (no accurate list archives) advocacy at openbsd.org and annouce at openbsd.org got the announcement http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-announce&m=107412170808408&w=2 http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-advocacy&m=107412094707264&w=2 > bsdforums.org MICHAEL > > bsdvault.net KLIMENT > > rootprompt.org HANS > > bsdatwork.com MICHAEL > > ?bsdnet.org MARC (list archives?) > > bsdusergroups.org GEORGE (submitted, not posted) > > i think usenet is important, as are the openbsd lists. > > status? any other place to hit? > > i'll put out a link with the announcements later. not much discussion > anywhere about it. > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -- From george Fri Jan 16 10:15:59 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 10:15:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] status of announcement? In-Reply-To: <20040116151222.GU15423@stravinsky.khaoz.org> Message-ID: thanks. . . so many archives for obsd list, so little accuracy. . . ->advocacy at openbsd.org and annouce at openbsd.org got the announcement -> ->http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-announce&m=107412170808408&w=2 ->http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-advocacy&m=107412094707264&w=2 From george Fri Jan 16 10:55:06 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 10:55:06 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bof Message-ID: dan: the bof on jan 22nd at linux expo would be a good opportunity to announce bsdcan. i know you'll have brochures, but it might be good for you to make a strong pitch. we can have a sign up sheet for those interested in car pooling with other nycbug people. g From dan Fri Jan 16 11:01:49 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 11:01:49 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: bof In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4007C49D.18315.B1CB0C9@localhost> On 16 Jan 2004 at 10:55, G. Rosamond wrote: > the bof on jan 22nd at linux expo would be a good opportunity to > announce bsdcan. Coincidentally, I was just compiling my list of events I'll be attending. The BOF was already on the list. > i know you'll have brochures, but it might be good for you to make a > strong pitch. Will I able to leave brochures at the NYCBUG table during the event? That will be a good distribution point. > we can have a sign up sheet for those interested in car pooling with > other nycbug people. Car pooling to head up to BSDCan? If people want to take the train, it's pretty scenery, and you can have a hack-a-thon on the way up/back. But the drive is good too. I did that last August. Mostly Interstate type roads, but a side trip through Lake Placid is refreshing. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From hans Fri Jan 16 11:02:42 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 08:02:42 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] status of announcement? Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374DC9@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > rootprompt.org HANS Submitted, haven't heard back. Pinged the editor to determine if he got the message, or is just ignoring it - haven't heard back. H From george Fri Jan 16 11:05:27 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 11:05:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: bof In-Reply-To: <4007C49D.18315.B1CB0C9@localhost> Message-ID: ->Coincidentally, I was just compiling my list of events I'll be ->attending. The BOF was already on the list. cool. ->Will I able to leave brochures at the NYCBUG table during the event? ->That will be a good distribution point. we won't have a table, but i'm sure there will be room at bsdmall, etc. ->Car pooling to head up to BSDCan? If people want to take the train, ->it's pretty scenery, and you can have a hack-a-thon on the way ->up/back. But the drive is good too. I did that last August. Mostly ->Interstate type roads, but a side trip through Lake Placid is ->refreshing. at least a group discount. . .with amtrak. . . g From lists Fri Jan 16 11:10:53 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 11:10:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] status of announcement? In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374DC9@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F87374DC9@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <20040116111053.18bd3eb6.lists@genoverly.net> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 08:02:42 -0800 "Hans Zaunere" wrote: > > > rootprompt.org HANS > > Submitted, haven't heard back. Pinged the editor to > determine if he got the message, or is just ignoring it - > haven't heard back. > > H -- --- ditto.. bsdforums.org MICHAEL bsdatwork.com MICHAEL From dan Fri Jan 16 13:21:28 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:21:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier - how many are you printing? Message-ID: <4007E558.31304.B9C8AB3@localhost> To gauge my own printing quantities, I want to get an idea of how many you folks are printing. Any ideas? I don't even know how many people are coming to Linux World... -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From wes Fri Jan 16 13:31:32 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... Message-ID: <19453.38.233.93.150.1074277892.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix fame) will be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th at 6pmish. They want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody besides George in on this? > Re, > > On Thu, Jan 15, 2004 at 07:23:37PM -0500, Wes Sonnenreich wrote: >> Nils, >> >> Do you mean monday the 19th or monday the 26th? Either afternoon world >> work, but the later on the 19th the better (I'm returning from a skiing >> trip monday) perhaps around 5 or 6pm? The 26th is wide open. > > We fly to NYC tomorrow, thus I meant the 19th. Later is no problem at > all. We stay at the Helmsley, Park Lane. Can you give me directions? > > Regards, > > Nils Magnus > Program-Chair LinuxTag 2004 Free Conference Program > > LinuxTag 2004: Where .com meets .org - magnus at linuxtag.org > From jschauma Fri Jan 16 13:57:05 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:57:05 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier - how many are you printing? In-Reply-To: <4007E558.31304.B9C8AB3@localhost> References: <4007E558.31304.B9C8AB3@localhost> Message-ID: <20040116185705.GG13385@netmeister.org> Dan Langille wrote: > To gauge my own printing quantities, I want to get an idea of how > many you folks are printing. Any ideas? I don't even know how many > people are coming to Linux World... LinuxWorld is fairly large. Last year, we (NetBSD) started out with 150 flyers, which were gone by noon the first day. Then we printed some more and eventually handed out a total of about 450 until we ran out again. Had we had more the last day, we probably could have given out another 100. So, if you have a booth, I'd say the ballpark is ~500. I now have about 150 of our flyers (see http://www.netbsd.org/gallery/advocacy/), which I'll be happy to drop off anywhere possible (since we don't have a booth this year). -Jan -- This one's tricky. You have to use imaginary numbers, like eleventeen... -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040116/15a9a4f2/attachment.bin From mspitze1 Fri Jan 16 15:02:27 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 15:02:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: bof In-Reply-To: References: <4007C49D.18315.B1CB0C9@localhost> Message-ID: <20040116150227.62917d43.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 11:05:27 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > ->Car pooling to head up to BSDCan? If people want to take the train, > ->it's pretty scenery, and you can have a hack-a-thon on the way > ->up/back. But the drive is good too. I did that last August. Mostly > ->Interstate type roads, but a side trip through Lake Placid is > ->refreshing. > > at least a group discount. . .with amtrak. . . Amtrak has outlets in their seats ... marc From mspitze1 Fri Jan 16 15:03:29 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 15:03:29 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... In-Reply-To: <19453.38.233.93.150.1074277892.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <19453.38.233.93.150.1074277892.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <20040116150329.04a683b3.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix fame) will > be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th at 6pmish. They > want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody besides > George in on this? I think I can make it. marc > > > Re, > > > > On Thu, Jan 15, 2004 at 07:23:37PM -0500, Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > >> Nils, > >> > >> Do you mean monday the 19th or monday the 26th? Either afternoon > >world> work, but the later on the 19th the better (I'm returning from > >a skiing> trip monday) perhaps around 5 or 6pm? The 26th is wide > >open. > > > > We fly to NYC tomorrow, thus I meant the 19th. Later is no problem > > at all. We stay at the Helmsley, Park Lane. Can you give me > > directions? > > > > Regards, > > > > Nils Magnus > > Program-Chair LinuxTag 2004 Free Conference Program > > > > LinuxTag 2004: Where .com meets .org - magnus at linuxtag.org > > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From hans Fri Jan 16 17:13:19 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:13:19 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group Launch: http://www.NYCBUG.org/ Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752A9FE@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Thanks John. H > -----Original Message----- > From: nylug-announce-bounces at mail.nylug.org > [mailto:nylug-announce-bounces at mail.nylug.org] On Behalf Of > John Bajana-Bacalle > Sent: Friday, January 16, 2004 4:13 PM > To: New York Linux Users Group Announce List > Subject: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group Launch: > http://www.NYCBUG.org/ > > ----- Forwarded message from Hans Zaunere ----- > > From: "Hans Zaunere" > Subject: NYC *BSD User Group Launch: http://www.NYCBUG.org/ > > We have founded a new *BSD User Group in New York City, the New York > City BSD Users Group (, pronounced > "nice-bug"). > It is our goal to make this B.U.G. a longtime success, and a permanent > bright fixture in the skyline of New York City Metro's I.T. technical > communities. > > There are two goals for this new user group. > > First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New York City to > discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. > > Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning more about > or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. > > - Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session at > LinuxWorld Conference & Expo, at the Jacob Javits Center > on Thursday, > January 22nd, at 5:45pm, Room 1E15. We will have a presence at > various tables at the expo, including those of BSDMall and New York > PHP. > > - Our first monthly meeting will present on, "Secure by Default: > Learning from OpenBSD," will be held on Wednesday, February 4th at > 7:00pm in the offices of: SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and 6th > Avenue, on the fifth floor. > > Presented by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux > and OpenBSD > Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated." This talk will deal > with crucial security concepts and best practices for today's > computing environments. > > Subsequent monthly meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the first > Wednesday of the month. > > Our website is located at . > > o NYCBUG will include a joint documentation project with New York PHP > () and OpenlySecure.org, focused on > providing > original documentation to new and experienced BSD users alike. > > o NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists to assist in > discussion > and learning about the BSD world. Interested users, please join the > mailing list(s) at . > > NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but > not limited > to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, > OpenDarwin, Darwin > and Mac OSX. > > Since the origins of the Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) Unix in > the 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom servers > of the world, powering internet service providers, hosting firms, and > web sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist current > users, those interested in learning more about this fundamental > operating system family and various other BSD projects, and > to provide a > channel for community interaction. > > We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a variety > of ways in > the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG > a success. > E pluribus unum. > > We kindly endorse the distribution of this announcement among your > colleagues, and potential *BSD users. Thank you. > > ----- End forwarded message ----- > _______________________________________________ > nylug-announce mailing list > nylug-announce at mail.nylug.org > http://www.nylug.org/mailman/listinfo/nylug-announce > > From hans Fri Jan 16 17:46:58 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:46:58 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0A@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > >> i think this is very good news. > > >> > > >> "not officially supported" but in development is a big step > > >> in the right direction. > > > > > > This is exciting news - maybe this is a petition topic? > > > > > > H > > > > Good idea for BOF and BSDcan petition, but probably won't interest > > many regular linuxexpo goers. > > I think this could be very useful, I think many, if not, all of its > competitors will follow it to freebsd. If Oracle does it it *must* be > a good idea after all. Following up on this... Just got off the phone with an OTN (Oracle Technical Network) organizer for LinuxWorld. They'll be having an installfest, and although focused on Linux, I pinged him about the BSDs. We've got the go ahead if anyone wants to demo or share experiences on installing and using Oracle on a BSD :) H From hans Fri Jan 16 17:53:12 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:53:12 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0E@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) > Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > > > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix fame) will > > be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th at 6pmish. They > > want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody besides > > George in on this? > > I think I can make it. I'll plan on attending, too. H From george Fri Jan 16 19:12:57 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:12:57 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier - how many are you printing? In-Reply-To: <20040116185705.GG13385@netmeister.org> Message-ID: that number makes sense jan. but considering we'll have a presence at bsdmall & nyphp, plus the bof, i think we should increase slightly. not that i have any f'g idea. . . g ->LinuxWorld is fairly large. Last year, we (NetBSD) started ->out with 150 flyers, which were gone by noon the first day. ->Then we printed some more and eventually handed out a total ->of about 450 until we ran out again. Had we had more the ->last day, we probably could have given out another 100. ->So, if you have a booth, I'd say the ballpark is ~500. ->I now have about 150 of our flyers (see ->http://www.netbsd.org/gallery/advocacy/), ->which I'll be happy ->to drop off anywhere possible (since we don't have a booth this year). From george Fri Jan 16 19:14:59 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:14:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0E@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: guess i should try out knoppix *before* the meeting . . . still a bit confused of the concrete goal of this meeting, to be honest. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Hans Zaunere ->Sent: Friday, January 16, 2004 5:53 PM ->To: Marc Spitzer; talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... -> -> -> ->> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) ->> Wes Sonnenreich wrote: ->> ->> > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix fame) ->> > will be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th ->at 6pmish. ->> > They want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody ->> > besides George in on this? ->> ->> I think I can make it. -> ->I'll plan on attending, too. -> ->H -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Fri Jan 16 19:14:59 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:14:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0A@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: nice work fence post. . . i'd be interested also. g ->Just got off the phone with an OTN (Oracle Technical Network) ->organizer for LinuxWorld. They'll be having an installfest, ->and although focused on Linux, I pinged him about the BSDs. ->We've got the go ahead if anyone wants to demo or share ->experiences on installing and using Oracle on a BSD :) From george Fri Jan 16 19:23:07 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:23:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] computer book works on reade street Message-ID: for those who don't know this store, it's between broadway and church street by city hall. they have an enormous selection of technical books, heavily discounted. as a side note, they do not seem to be carrying wes' recent project, network security illustrated. since 9/11 in particular, they are hurting for business. i spoke to the main man there (david) and find that they are no longer open on sunday. they've lost the critical member of the staff who is technically proficient. first, i want to encourage all to use their store. cheaper than amazon and b&n by far. mention nycbug when you're there. also, considering they are only selling online through amazon, and they are solely devoted to tech books, they have a problem. maybe a group of www design, dev and sysadmin-types in nycbug could help them out. . . currently, they have an issue keeping their pos database and online database synced. although this is second-hand from david who's non-technical, it sounds like whatever firm that is helping them is f'g them . . .saying they have to export the data daily to keep it synced. . .woah. so 1985. anyway, they are an important institution in nyc for all technical users, particularly us. they will have a presence at linuxexpo. stop by, buy some books from them. introduce yourself. how do people feel about possibly assisting them in redesigning their pos and ecommerce database? maybe a few people would like to volunteer and help them out. . . g From george Fri Jan 16 19:26:36 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:26:36 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement. . . Message-ID: i don't mean to keep beating this dead horse, but i'm a bit confused by the announcements not getting posted on bsdforums, bsdvault, etc. i know they've been sent, but how come they weren't posted? also, marc, get your sh*t together. it takes two minutes to hit usenet/deja and attack them. if you remember, that's where i first contacted *you* about getting a bsd user group started in nyc. i think a few others are also from there too. g From george Fri Jan 16 19:36:15 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:36:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] fbsd 5.2 Message-ID: some recent experiences. . . 1. the install process adds a couple of more questions, including whether you want to allow ssh logins. 2. seems that everytime you go into sysinstall, a whole set of comments are added to the rc.conf, which i think is a pain in the ass. so you're having a problem using the ports, and decide to use sysinstall's packages. boom, three or so lines of code clogging up your rc.conf. 3. also, for some reason, when i enable linux compatibility *each* time during the install process, it bombs out and i need to do it manually later on. comments? common experiences? g From george Fri Jan 16 20:07:15 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:07:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] a question. . . Message-ID: glad you can make the bof. we'd be honored to have wasabi present. are you going to have a table at linuxexpo? if so, could you donate 8.5" x 11" of table space for our fliers? it would be appreciated. also, is there a possibility of wasabi doing a meeting for nycbug on netbsd & embedded systems? thanks again for your followup. g From mspitze1 Fri Jan 16 20:40:11 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:40:11 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040116204011.116d6e0f.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:26:36 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > i don't mean to keep beating this dead horse, but i'm a bit confused > by the announcements not getting posted on bsdforums, bsdvault, etc. > > i know they've been sent, but how come they weren't posted? > > also, marc, get your sh*t together. it takes two minutes to hit > usenet/deja and attack them. if you remember, that's where i first > contacted *you* about getting a bsd user group started in nyc. i > think a few others are also from there too. > > g Have you read/comprehended any books or courses how not to step on your dick while trying to get things done in a group? If you have reread them and pay attention this time, fee free to take notes. If not then read some, again feel free to take notes. Now let me give you some general guidelines about managing groups to get good results: 1: praise in public 2: discipline in private 3: before you discipline you should investigate what is going on, there may have been a good reason why X did not get done. Now let me explain what actions your management has encouraged: 1: this letter 2: watch stargate 3: get pizza after stargate 4: then post btw 1: was get the posts done that I committed to. Now since we appear to be done cracking the whip of management, can we get back to our regularly scheduled programming. Also trying to get people to volunteer when you decide to attack them out of the blue and in a public archived list is not the best way to get people to step forward. Now one last thing sh*t is spelled 'shit' please use a spell checker. marc From george Fri Jan 16 20:48:05 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:48:05 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement. . . In-Reply-To: <20040116204011.116d6e0f.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: cool. i assume that means you've posted it then? g ->Have you read/comprehended any books or courses how not to ->step on your dick while trying to get things done in a ->group? If you have reread them and pay attention this time, ->fee free to take notes. If not then read some, again feel ->free to take notes. ->Now let me give you some general guidelines about managing ->groups to get good results: -> ->1: praise in public ->2: discipline in private ->3: before you discipline you should investigate what is going ->on, there ->may have been a good reason why X did not get done. -> ->Now let me explain what actions your management has encouraged: -> ->1: this letter ->2: watch stargate ->3: get pizza after stargate ->4: then post -> ->btw -> ->1: was get the posts done that I committed to. -> ->Now since we appear to be done cracking the whip of ->management, can we get back to our regularly scheduled programming. -> ->Also trying to get people to volunteer when you decide to ->attack them out of the blue and in a public archived list is ->not the best way to get people to step forward. -> ->Now one last thing sh*t is spelled 'shit' please use a spell checker. -> ->marc From scottro Fri Jan 16 20:49:41 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:49:41 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] fbsd 5.2 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040117014941.GA1550@scottro11.homeunix.net> On Fri, Jan 16, 2004 at 07:36:15PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > some recent experiences. . . > > 1. the install process adds a couple of more questions, including > whether you want to allow ssh logins. Yeah, I tabbed through that a time or two, and had to go back at the end, when they asked do you want to go back for more options. Oops. > > 2. seems that everytime you go into sysinstall, a whole set of comments > are added to the rc.conf, which i think is a pain in the ass. so you're > having a problem using the ports, and decide to use sysinstall's > packages. boom, three or so lines of code clogging up your rc.conf. Hrrm, this I didn't see. > > 3. also, for some reason, when i enable linux compatibility *each* time > during the install process, it bombs out and i need to do it manually > later on. No, I didn't have this issue either--on a couple of boxes, some vanilla ones and a couple of old Dell Dimensions. One thing I did run into... My first upgrade from 5.1 to 5.2 on a test box went without problem. So, then I did it on my workstation at home and it died in make installworld. Tried a couple of other test upgrades, no problem. So, getting bold, decided to do it on my workstation at work. (To make it funnier, backed up important things, and this was late Friday--on Monday, when I came in, forgot that I hadn't yet moved the tarball to another box) Again, it died during installworld. I still haven't figured out why--the only major warning I see in UPDATING is to be sure you have the COMPAT stuff in the kernel, which I did. Googling indicated a ~few~ people with the same problem, but not many--so apparently I've just been unlucky. On the other hand, I'm not willing to try it again with a box with important things, at least not without being sure I backed them up first (I did get the tarball off the other hard drive--it wouldn't boot, but I put it in another machine and just copied the stuff off of it.) That's the only real problem I've had with 5.2, that upgrade from 5.1. Clean installs went without any noticeable glitches. -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 D575 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Wesley: Back, creature of the night! Leave this place! Evil Willow: Don't wanna. Wesley: (threatens with holy water) Evil Willow: (sighs) Whatever. From mspitze1 Fri Jan 16 21:04:59 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 21:04:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement. . . In-Reply-To: References: <20040116204011.116d6e0f.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: <20040116210459.3fce9fc7.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:48:05 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > cool. i assume that means you've posted it then? clearly you have not read my time line. marc > > g > > > ->Have you read/comprehended any books or courses how not to > ->step on your dick while trying to get things done in a > ->group? If you have reread them and pay attention this time, > ->fee free to take notes. If not then read some, again feel > ->free to take notes. > ->Now let me give you some general guidelines about managing > ->groups to get good results: > -> > ->1: praise in public > ->2: discipline in private > ->3: before you discipline you should investigate what is going > ->on, there > ->may have been a good reason why X did not get done. > -> > ->Now let me explain what actions your management has encouraged: > -> > ->1: this letter > ->2: watch stargate > ->3: get pizza after stargate > ->4: then post > -> > ->btw > -> > ->1: was get the posts done that I committed to. > -> > ->Now since we appear to be done cracking the whip of > ->management, can we get back to our regularly scheduled programming. > -> > ->Also trying to get people to volunteer when you decide to > ->attack them out of the blue and in a public archived list is > ->not the best way to get people to step forward. > -> > ->Now one last thing sh*t is spelled 'shit' please use a spell checker. > -> > ->marc > From joshmccormack Sat Jan 17 01:21:36 2004 From: joshmccormack (Josh McCormack) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 01:21:36 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] new to freebsd install on thinkpad 560x Message-ID: <4008D470.8030005@travelersdiary.com> Hey, I'm new to freebsd and want to install on a thinkpad 560x (external floppy). Anyone have any pointers or advice? Josh From JBrown Sat Jan 17 10:08:29 2004 From: JBrown (Brown, James Jim) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 10:08:29 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] new to freebsd install on thinkpad 560x Message-ID: Hi Josh, FreeBSD 4.9 is the latest production code. 5.2 is the latest "new-technology" release. I run 4.9 on my Thinkpad and 5.2 on some servers that I don't care about. That said, many folks find 5.x behaves quite well. I'd recommend downloading the ISO image for whichever release you decide to use and booting from that. It also helps to have another Internet connection handy to refer to the FreeBSD handbook- http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/index.html See Chapter 2 for Installation. Happy Installing! jpb === -----Original Message----- From: Josh McCormack To: talk at lists.nycbug.org Sent: 1/17/04 1:21 AM Subject: [nycbug-talk] new to freebsd install on thinkpad 560x Hey, I'm new to freebsd and want to install on a thinkpad 560x (external floppy). Anyone have any pointers or advice? Josh _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk Note: The information contained in this message may be privileged and confidential and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to the message and deleting it from your computer. Thank you. ThruPoint, Inc. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040117/9164966d/attachment.html From lists Sat Jan 17 10:12:48 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 10:12:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] new to freebsd install on thinkpad 560x In-Reply-To: <4008D470.8030005@travelersdiary.com> References: <4008D470.8030005@travelersdiary.com> Message-ID: <20040117101248.3c21ec15.lists@genoverly.net> On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 01:21:36 -0500 Josh McCormack wrote: > Hey, > > I'm new to freebsd and want to install on a thinkpad 560x (external > floppy). Anyone have any pointers or advice? > > Josh > Josh, It sounds like you are looking for general advice. I installed FreeBSD on a laptop recently. Mine was an older Dell so the hardware has been around for a while and is well supported. The only problem I had out of the gate was the pcmcia network card. I couldn't get it to work.. and sure enough, it was NOT on the supported hardware list. So my first 'pointer' would be to point to that list. Make sure all your hardware is supported before you start. Other than that, everything went well and the ol' laptop seems to be running faster than it ever did. My second 'pointer' would be to follow the installation instructions, even if you are a seasoned systems guy. Assuming version 5.2R, check hardware... http://www.freebsd.org/releases/5.2R/hardware.html I know you already know this.. but the hand book is your friend. http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/index.html Step-by-step installation directions: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/install.html these are some good laptop related links: http://www.zapatec.com/freebsd/laptop/ http://www.cse.ucsc.edu/~dkulp/fbsd/laptop.html The BSD forums are a great resource. If there was ever a problem, resolution, opinion, tip.. etc, then this is the place. BSD on Laptops: http://www.bsdforums.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=64 Google it!! warning, long links: Groups: http://www.google.com/groups?as_q=thinkpad%20560x%20freebsd&safe=images&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&as_drrb=b&as_mind=12&as_minm=5&as_miny=2003&as_maxd=31&as_maxm=12&as_maxy=2004&lr=lang_en&num=30&hl=en Web: http://www.google.com/search?num=30&hl=en&lr=lang_en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&as_drrb=b&q=thinkpad+560x+freebsd&as_mind=12&as_minm=5&as_miny=2003&as_maxd=31&as_maxm=12&as_maxy=2004&sa=N&tab=gw Post back here and let us know how it went. In fact, if you feel motivated, write up an install diary and maybe we can add it to the documentation section. If you have more questions, feel free to post. Hope this helps and good luck, Michael -- -- From george Sat Jan 17 11:37:16 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:37:16 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] new to freebsd install on thinkpad 560x In-Reply-To: <4008D470.8030005@travelersdiary.com> Message-ID: these are a couple of the general and useful sites on laptops with freebsd. http://www.cse.ucsc.edu/~dkulp/fbsd/laptop.html http://www.zapatec.com/freebsd/laptop/ but as always, for freebsd, the best place to start is the handbook. http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/index.html one stupid side note on laptops, be prepared to spend some time in the bios. you may need to do some tweaking there first. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Josh McCormack ->Sent: Saturday, January 17, 2004 1:22 AM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] new to freebsd install on thinkpad 560x -> -> ->Hey, -> ->I'm new to freebsd and want to install on a thinkpad 560x (external ->floppy). Anyone have any pointers or advice? -> ->Josh -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Sat Jan 17 11:41:44 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:41:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] centrino Message-ID: from slashdot.org yesterday. . . openbsd & centrino. . . http://bsd.slashdot.org/bsd/04/01/16/1621212.shtml?tid=122&tid=185&tid=1 90 not sure if it's relevant to our earlier discussions about open standards and intel. . . g From marco Sat Jan 17 12:08:37 2004 From: marco (Marco Scoffier) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 12:08:37 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Newbie mailman from ports Message-ID: <20040117170837.GC863@metm.org> Hello, This new group corresponds perfectly with my first attempt to install FreeBSD ;) The box will be a server for a non-profit. Things went pretty smoothly, I managed to upgrade the 4.8 system I had off a CD to the current 4.9 using "make world" and I rebuilt the kernel. I got the /usr/ports directory using cvsup. I have been installing the necessary programs through ports. I have successfully installed postgres, apache+ssl but am having problems with mailman. mailman-2.1.4 is looking to install python-2.3.3 but /usr/ports/lang/python/distinfo only has Python-2.2.2 how should I go about resolving this? Thanks, -- Marco From mspitze1 Sat Jan 17 12:37:06 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 12:37:06 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Newbie mailman from ports In-Reply-To: <20040117170837.GC863@metm.org> References: <20040117170837.GC863@metm.org> Message-ID: <20040117123706.2738b0ec.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 12:08:37 -0500 Marco Scoffier wrote: > This new group corresponds perfectly with my first attempt to install FreeBSD ;) > > The box will be a server for a non-profit. Things went pretty smoothly, > I managed to upgrade the 4.8 system I had off a CD to the current 4.9 > using "make world" and I rebuilt the kernel. I got the /usr/ports > directory using cvsup. I have been installing the necessary programs > through ports. I have successfully installed postgres, apache+ssl but > am having problems with mailman. for the system don't use 'make world', I do not know if it still works correctly. Use the handbook approved way: make buildworld make buildkernel (if kernel not generic add: KERNCONF=FILENAME, no pathinfo needed) make installkernel as above reboot and watch for wierd shit, if none continue to make installworld mergemaster, between 4.8 and 4.9 there were config file changes and the need to be synced with the files that exist if you see wierd shit mv /kernel.old to /kernel and /modules.old to /modules and reboot, this should put you back where you were. 1: install /usr/ports/net/cvsup and type make update in /usr/ports to update your tree add the following to /etc/make.conf to get cvsup working: # SUP_UPDATE= yes # SUP= /usr/local/bin/cvsup SUPFLAGS= -g -L 2 -b /usr/share/examples/cvsup/ SUPHOST= cvsup.uk.FreeBSD.org SUPFILE= /usr/share/examples/cvsup/stable-supfile PORTSSUPFILE= /usr/share/examples/cvsup/ports-supfile DOCSUPFILE= /usr/share/examples/cvsup/doc-supfile 2: cd /usr/ports make update 3: install /usr/ports/sysutils/portupgrade 4: type portsdb -Uu 5: type pkgdb -F , you may not need this but it wont hurt 6: type portinstall -R portname marc ps make update will also work in /usr/src now marc From dan Sat Jan 17 12:49:13 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 12:49:13 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flier - how many are you printing? In-Reply-To: References: <20040116185705.GG13385@netmeister.org> Message-ID: <40092F49.31106.10A57694@localhost> On 16 Jan 2004 at 19:12, G. Rosamond wrote: > ->LinuxWorld is fairly large. Last year, we (NetBSD) started > ->out with 150 flyers, which were gone by noon the first day. > ->Then we printed some more and eventually handed out a total > ->of about 450 until we ran out again. Had we had more the > ->last day, we probably could have given out another 100. > > ->So, if you have a booth, I'd say the ballpark is ~500. > that number makes sense jan. but considering we'll have a presence > at bsdmall & nyphp, plus the bof, i think we should increase > slightly. FYI & FWIW: I've just printed my master copies, and I'm heading over to Staples later today to print 750 copies of BSDCan and 500 copies of Bacula. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From lists Sat Jan 17 13:49:38 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:49:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flyers In-Reply-To: <20040115183145.32c84a82.lists@genoverly.net> References: <20040115183145.32c84a82.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <20040117134938.22282a84.lists@genoverly.net> On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:31:45 -0500 michael wrote: > > 3. I like a single side black on white paper. That way I > could use a little of the company resources . > (and so could you, and you, and you... and pretty soon we > have it done under budget) > > Comments? > I'm in for 500 (see above). George, please post the final version when it is ready. Michael -- From george Sat Jan 17 13:53:20 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 13:53:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] flyers In-Reply-To: <20040117134938.22282a84.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: the final is up. what needs to be changed. ..? no one suggested anything. . . g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael ->Sent: Saturday, January 17, 2004 1:50 PM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] flyers -> -> ->On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 18:31:45 -0500 ->michael wrote: ->> ->> 3. I like a single side black on white paper. That way I ->could use a ->> little of the company resources . (and so could you, and you, ->> and you... and pretty soon we have it done under budget) ->> ->> Comments? ->> -> ->I'm in for 500 (see above). George, please post the final ->version when it is ready. -> ->Michael ->-- ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From hans Sat Jan 17 14:22:19 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 11:22:19 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA51@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > nice work fence post. . . > > i'd be interested also. Great... has anyone actually done any Oracle on BSD? As an aside, the Oracle installfest is looking for people generally familiar in Oracle, Java, PHP, etc. The top Oracle developer on the Open Source front will be there so that's nice, too. If you'd like to help around the installfest (it's on Wed.) please contact hans at nyphp.com and there are free passes available if needed. H > ->Just got off the phone with an OTN (Oracle Technical Network) > ->organizer for LinuxWorld. They'll be having an installfest, > ->and although focused on Linux, I pinged him about the BSDs. > ->We've got the go ahead if anyone wants to demo or share > ->experiences on installing and using Oracle on a BSD :) From marco Sat Jan 17 14:43:04 2004 From: marco (Marco Scoffier) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 14:43:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Newbie mailman from ports In-Reply-To: <20040117123706.2738b0ec.mspitze1@optonline.net> References: <20040117170837.GC863@metm.org> <20040117123706.2738b0ec.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: <20040117194304.GD863@metm.org> On Sat, Jan 17, 2004 at 12:37:06PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > mergemaster, between 4.8 and 4.9 there were config file changes and the need to be synced with the files that exist > SUPHOST= cvsup.uk.FreeBSD.org > 3: install /usr/ports/sysutils/portupgrade Wow thanks Marc, and here I was expecting an RTFM :^) Actually I was imprecise in my email, I had followed the handbook pretty closely and did a "make buildworld" and not "make world" sorry. I redid mergemaster, cause I don't remember if I did that or not and it seems not. I had already updated my make.conf except that I used a us site and not the uk one you suggest (this is for the encryption exporting stuff right?) like debian non-us. I am updating ports now, and will tryout the portupgrade as you suggested. I will call out again if I have more trouble, Thanks, -- Marco From mspitze1 Sat Jan 17 21:55:40 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:55:40 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Newbie mailman from ports In-Reply-To: <20040117194304.GD863@metm.org> References: <20040117170837.GC863@metm.org> <20040117123706.2738b0ec.mspitze1@optonline.net> <20040117194304.GD863@metm.org> Message-ID: <20040117215540.146bf528.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 14:43:04 -0500 Marco Scoffier wrote: > On Sat, Jan 17, 2004 at 12:37:06PM -0500, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > > mergemaster, between 4.8 and 4.9 there were config file changes and > > the need to be synced with the files that exist > > > SUPHOST= cvsup.uk.FreeBSD.org > > > 3: install /usr/ports/sysutils/portupgrade > > Wow thanks Marc, and here I was expecting an RTFM :^) > > Actually I was imprecise in my email, I had followed the handbook > pretty closely and did a "make buildworld" and not "make world" sorry. > I redid > mergemaster, cause I don't remember if I did that or not and it seems > not. I had already updated my make.conf except that I used a us site > and not the uk one you suggest (this is for the encryption exporting > stuff right?) like debian non-us. yup > > I am updating ports now, and will tryout the portupgrade as you > suggested. I will call out again if I have more trouble, portupgrade is fun, it saves somuch effort. marc > > Thanks, > > -- > Marco > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From dglasner Sun Jan 18 02:54:30 2004 From: dglasner (Danny G) Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 23:54:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 In-Reply-To: <20040117010744.92E67A87B6@virtu.nyphp.org> Message-ID: <20040118075430.43283.qmail@web41301.mail.yahoo.com> Hi, I was wondering if there is an announcement only version of this email list. while I may be interested in other users messages, right now I'd like to only receive important announcements about NYCBUG. Thanks in advance --- talk-request at lists.nycbug.org wrote: > Send talk mailing list submissions to > talk at lists.nycbug.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > talk-request at lists.nycbug.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > talk-owner at lists.nycbug.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of talk digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: RE: bof (Marc Spitzer) > 2. Re: LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... (Marc Spitzer) > 3. RE: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group Launch: > http://www.NYCBUG.org/ (Hans Zaunere) > 4. RE: FW: Oracle Meeting Results (Hans Zaunere) > 5. RE: LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... (Hans Zaunere) > 6. RE: flier - how many are you printing? (G. Rosamond) > 7. RE: LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... (G. Rosamond) > 8. RE: FW: Oracle Meeting Results (G. Rosamond) > 9. computer book works on reade street (G. Rosamond) > 10. announcement. . . (G. Rosamond) > 11. fbsd 5.2 (G. Rosamond) > 12. a question. . . (G. Rosamond) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 15:02:27 -0500 > From: Marc Spitzer > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] RE: bof > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: <20040116150227.62917d43.mspitze1 at optonline.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 11:05:27 -0500 > "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > > ->Car pooling to head up to BSDCan? If people want to take the > train, > > ->it's pretty scenery, and you can have a hack-a-thon on the way > > ->up/back. But the drive is good too. I did that last August. > Mostly > > ->Interstate type roads, but a side trip through Lake Placid is > > ->refreshing. > > > > at least a group discount. . .with amtrak. . . > > Amtrak has outlets in their seats ... > > marc > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 15:03:29 -0500 > From: Marc Spitzer > Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... > To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: <20040116150329.04a683b3.mspitze1 at optonline.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > > On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) > Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > > > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix fame) > will > > be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th at 6pmish. > They > > want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody > besides > > George in on this? > > I think I can make it. > > marc > > > > > > Re, > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 15, 2004 at 07:23:37PM -0500, Wes Sonnenreich > wrote: > > >> Nils, > > >> > > >> Do you mean monday the 19th or monday the 26th? Either > afternoon > > >world> work, but the later on the 19th the better (I'm returning > from > > >a skiing> trip monday) perhaps around 5 or 6pm? The 26th is wide > > >open. > > > > > > We fly to NYC tomorrow, thus I meant the 19th. Later is no > problem > > > at all. We stay at the Helmsley, Park Lane. Can you give me > > > directions? > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Nils Magnus > > > Program-Chair LinuxTag 2004 Free Conference Program > > > > > > LinuxTag 2004: Where .com meets .org - magnus at linuxtag.org > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > talk mailing list > > talk at lists.nycbug.org > > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:13:19 -0800 > From: "Hans Zaunere" > Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group > Launch: http://www.NYCBUG.org/ > To: > Cc: General discussion > Message-ID: > > <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752A9FE at ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > > > Thanks John. > > H > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: nylug-announce-bounces at mail.nylug.org > > [mailto:nylug-announce-bounces at mail.nylug.org] On Behalf Of > > John Bajana-Bacalle > > Sent: Friday, January 16, 2004 4:13 PM > > To: New York Linux Users Group Announce List > > Subject: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group Launch: > > http://www.NYCBUG.org/ > > > > ----- Forwarded message from Hans Zaunere ----- > > > > From: "Hans Zaunere" > > Subject: NYC *BSD User Group Launch: http://www.NYCBUG.org/ > > > > We have founded a new *BSD User Group in New York City, the New > York > > City BSD Users Group (, pronounced > > "nice-bug"). > > It is our goal to make this B.U.G. a longtime success, and a > permanent > > bright fixture in the skyline of New York City Metro's I.T. > technical > > communities. > > > > There are two goals for this new user group. > > > > First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New York City > to > > discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. > > > > Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning more > about > > or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. > > > > - Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session > at > > LinuxWorld Conference & Expo, at the Jacob Javits Center > > on Thursday, > > January 22nd, at 5:45pm, Room 1E15. We will have a presence at > > various tables at the expo, including those of BSDMall and New > York > > PHP. > > > > - Our first monthly meeting will present on, "Secure by Default: > > Learning from OpenBSD," will be held on Wednesday, February > 4th at > > 7:00pm in the offices of: SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and > 6th > > Avenue, on the fifth floor. > > > > Presented by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux > > and OpenBSD > > Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated." This talk will > deal > > with crucial security concepts and best practices for today's > > computing environments. > > > > Subsequent monthly meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the > first > > Wednesday of the month. > > > > Our website is located at . > > > > o NYCBUG will include a joint documentation project with New > York PHP > > () and OpenlySecure.org, focused on > > providing > > original documentation to new and experienced BSD users alike. > > > > o NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists to assist in > > discussion > > and learning about the BSD world. Interested users, please > join the > > mailing list(s) at . > > > > NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but > > not limited > > to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, > > OpenDarwin, Darwin > > and Mac OSX. > > > > Since the origins of the Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) > Unix in > > the 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom > servers > > of the world, powering internet service providers, hosting firms, > and > > web sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist > current > > users, those interested in learning more about this fundamental > > operating system family and various other BSD projects, and > > to provide a > > channel for community interaction. > > > > We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a variety > > of ways in > > the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG > > a success. > > E pluribus unum. > > > > We kindly endorse the distribution of this announcement among > your > > colleagues, and potential *BSD users. Thank you. > > > > ----- End forwarded message ----- > > _______________________________________________ > > nylug-announce mailing list > > nylug-announce at mail.nylug.org > > http://www.nylug.org/mailman/listinfo/nylug-announce > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:46:58 -0800 > From: "Hans Zaunere" > Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results > To: "General discussion" > Message-ID: > > <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0A at ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > > > > >> i think this is very good news. > > > >> > > > >> "not officially supported" but in development is a big step > > > >> in the right direction. > > > > > > > > This is exciting news - maybe this is a petition topic? > > > > > > > > H > > > > > > Good idea for BOF and BSDcan petition, but probably won't > interest > > > many regular linuxexpo goers. > > > > I think this could be very useful, I think many, if not, all of > its > > competitors will follow it to freebsd. If Oracle does it it > *must* be > > a good idea after all. > > Following up on this... > > Just got off the phone with an OTN (Oracle Technical Network) > organizer for LinuxWorld. They'll be having an installfest, and > although focused on Linux, I pinged him about the BSDs. We've got > the go ahead if anyone wants to demo or share experiences on > installing and using Oracle on a BSD :) > > H > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:53:12 -0800 > From: "Hans Zaunere" > Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... > To: "Marc Spitzer" , > > Message-ID: > > <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0E at ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > > > On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) > > Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > > > > > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix > fame) will > > > be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th at 6pmish. > They > > > want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody > besides > > > George in on this? > > > > I think I can make it. > > I'll plan on attending, too. > > H > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:12:57 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] flier - how many are you printing? > To: > Message-ID: > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > that number makes sense jan. but considering we'll have a presence > at > bsdmall & nyphp, plus the bof, i think we should increase slightly. > > not that i have any f'g idea. . . > > g > > ->LinuxWorld is fairly large. Last year, we (NetBSD) started > ->out with 150 flyers, which were gone by noon the first day. > ->Then we printed some more and eventually handed out a total > ->of about 450 until we ran out again. Had we had more the > ->last day, we probably could have given out another 100. > > ->So, if you have a booth, I'd say the ballpark is ~500. > > ->I now have about 150 of our flyers (see > ->http://www.netbsd.org/gallery/advocacy/), ->which I'll be happy > ->to drop off anywhere possible (since we don't have a booth this > year). > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:14:59 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... > To: "'Hans Zaunere'" , "'Marc Spitzer'" > , > Message-ID: > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > guess i should try out knoppix *before* the meeting . . . > > still a bit confused of the concrete goal of this meeting, to be > honest. > > g > > ->-----Original Message----- > ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org > ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Hans Zaunere > ->Sent: Friday, January 16, 2004 5:53 PM > ->To: Marc Spitzer; talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... > -> > -> > -> > ->> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) > ->> Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > ->> > ->> > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix > fame) > ->> > will be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th > ->at 6pmish. > ->> > They want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... > Anybody > ->> > besides George in on this? > ->> > ->> I think I can make it. > -> > ->I'll plan on attending, too. > -> > ->H > -> > ->_______________________________________________ > ->talk mailing list > ->talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > -> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:14:59 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results > To: "'Hans Zaunere'" , "'General discussion'" > > Message-ID: > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > nice work fence post. . . > > i'd be interested also. > > g > > ->Just got off the phone with an OTN (Oracle Technical Network) > ->organizer for LinuxWorld. They'll be having an installfest, > ->and although focused on Linux, I pinged him about the BSDs. > ->We've got the go ahead if anyone wants to demo or share > ->experiences on installing and using Oracle on a BSD :) > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:23:07 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: [nycbug-talk] computer book works on reade street > To: > Message-ID: > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > for those who don't know this store, it's between broadway and > church > street by city hall. > > they have an enormous selection of technical books, heavily > discounted. > as a side note, they do not seem to be carrying wes' recent > project, > network security illustrated. > > since 9/11 in particular, they are hurting for business. i spoke > to the > main man there (david) and find that they are no longer open on > sunday. > they've lost the critical member of the staff who is technically > proficient. > > first, i want to encourage all to use their store. cheaper than > amazon > and b&n by far. > > mention nycbug when you're there. > > also, considering they are only selling online through amazon, and > they > are solely devoted to tech books, they have a problem. maybe a > group of > www design, dev and sysadmin-types in nycbug could help them out. . > . > > currently, they have an issue keeping their pos database and online > database synced. although this is second-hand from david who's > non-technical, it sounds like whatever firm that is helping them is > f'g > them . . .saying they have to export the data daily to keep it > synced. > . .woah. so 1985. > > anyway, they are an important institution in nyc for all technical > users, particularly us. > > they will have a presence at linuxexpo. stop by, buy some books > from > them. introduce yourself. > > how do people feel about possibly assisting them in redesigning > their > pos and ecommerce database? > > > maybe a few people would like to volunteer and help them out. . . > g > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 10 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:26:36 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement. . . > To: > Message-ID: > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > i don't mean to keep beating this dead horse, but i'm a bit > confused by > the announcements not getting posted on bsdforums, bsdvault, etc. > > i know they've been sent, but how come they weren't posted? > > also, marc, get your sh*t together. it takes two minutes to hit > usenet/deja and attack them. if you remember, that's where i first > contacted *you* about getting a bsd user group started in nyc. i > think > a few others are also from there too. > > g > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 11 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:36:15 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: [nycbug-talk] fbsd 5.2 > To: > Message-ID: > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > some recent experiences. . . > > 1. the install process adds a couple of more questions, including > whether you want to allow ssh logins. > > 2. seems that everytime you go into sysinstall, a whole set of > comments > are added to the rc.conf, which i think is a pain in the ass. so > you're > having a problem using the ports, and decide to use sysinstall's > packages. boom, three or so lines of code clogging up your > rc.conf. > > 3. also, for some reason, when i enable linux compatibility *each* > time > during the install process, it bombs out and i need to do it > manually > later on. > > comments? common experiences? > > g > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 12 > Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:07:15 -0500 > From: "G. Rosamond" > Subject: [nycbug-talk] a question. . . > To: "'Jeremy Sohn'" > Cc: talk at lists.nycbug.org > Message-ID: > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > glad you can make the bof. we'd be honored to have wasabi present. > > are you going to have a table at linuxexpo? if so, could you > donate > 8.5" x 11" of table space for our fliers? it would be appreciated. > > also, is there a possibility of wasabi doing a meeting for nycbug > on > netbsd & embedded systems? > > thanks again for your followup. > > g > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > > End of talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 > *********************************** __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus From george Sun Jan 18 19:42:41 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 19:42:41 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: a question. . . In-Reply-To: <050f01c3ddff$90124020$8501470a@JeremyThinkPad> Message-ID: ->I don't believe Wasabi is planning on having a presence at ->LinuxExpo. In the past, we have done so, but it has not been ->very profitable for us. Sorry. understood. will you have anyone at linuxexpo to give a short spiel at the bof? ->Regarding leading a discussion about NetBSD and embedded ->systems, we would be happy to do that. Is there a date that ->you would prefer? Is there any specific component of embedded ->systems that most interests the group? this is something i've mentioned as a meeting topic before in the planning meetings. not sure on a date yet. in terms of the topic, maybe you could provide us some insight, and also, now that the list has 50+ members, i would be interested in what others think about the topic and a possible angle. ideas? g From george Sun Jan 18 19:47:07 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 19:47:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 In-Reply-To: <20040118075430.43283.qmail@web41301.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: we had talked about this. . .but that was before we past the 50 subscriber mark. other people have feelings about this? i agree it time for announce only list. . . g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Danny G ->Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 2:55 AM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 -> -> ->Hi, I was wondering if there is an announcement only version ->of this email list. while I may be interested in other users ->messages, right now I'd like to only receive important ->announcements about NYCBUG. -> -> ->Thanks in advance -> ->--- talk-request at lists.nycbug.org wrote: ->> Send talk mailing list submissions to ->> talk at lists.nycbug.org ->> ->> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ->> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk ->> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ->> talk-request at lists.nycbug.org ->> ->> You can reach the person managing the list at ->> talk-owner at lists.nycbug.org ->> ->> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific ->> than "Re: Contents of talk digest..." ->> ->> ->> Today's Topics: ->> ->> 1. Re: RE: bof (Marc Spitzer) ->> 2. Re: LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... (Marc Spitzer) ->> 3. RE: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group Launch: ->> http://www.NYCBUG.org/ (Hans Zaunere) ->> 4. RE: FW: Oracle Meeting Results (Hans Zaunere) ->> 5. RE: LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... (Hans Zaunere) ->> 6. RE: flier - how many are you printing? (G. Rosamond) ->> 7. RE: LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... (G. Rosamond) ->> 8. RE: FW: Oracle Meeting Results (G. Rosamond) ->> 9. computer book works on reade street (G. Rosamond) ->> 10. announcement. . . (G. Rosamond) ->> 11. fbsd 5.2 (G. Rosamond) ->> 12. a question. . . (G. Rosamond) ->> ->> ->> ->---------------------------------------------------------------------- ->> ->> Message: 1 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 15:02:27 -0500 ->> From: Marc Spitzer ->> Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] RE: bof ->> To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->> Message-ID: <20040116150227.62917d43.mspitze1 at optonline.net> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII ->> ->> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 11:05:27 -0500 ->> "G. Rosamond" wrote: ->> ->> > ->Car pooling to head up to BSDCan? If people want to take the ->> train, ->> > ->it's pretty scenery, and you can have a hack-a-thon on the way ->> > ->up/back. But the drive is good too. I did that last August. ->> Mostly ->> > ->Interstate type roads, but a side trip through Lake Placid is ->> > ->refreshing. ->> > ->> > at least a group discount. . .with amtrak. . . ->> ->> Amtrak has outlets in their seats ... ->> ->> marc ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 2 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 15:03:29 -0500 ->> From: Marc Spitzer ->> Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... ->> To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->> Message-ID: <20040116150329.04a683b3.mspitze1 at optonline.net> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII ->> ->> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) ->> Wes Sonnenreich wrote: ->> ->> > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix fame) ->> will ->> > be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th at 6pmish. ->> They ->> > want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody ->> besides ->> > George in on this? ->> ->> I think I can make it. ->> ->> marc ->> ->> > ->> > > Re, ->> > > ->> > > On Thu, Jan 15, 2004 at 07:23:37PM -0500, Wes Sonnenreich ->> wrote: ->> > >> Nils, ->> > >> ->> > >> Do you mean monday the 19th or monday the 26th? Either ->> afternoon ->> > >world> work, but the later on the 19th the better (I'm returning ->> from ->> > >a skiing> trip monday) perhaps around 5 or 6pm? The 26th is wide ->> > >open. ->> > > ->> > > We fly to NYC tomorrow, thus I meant the 19th. Later is no ->> problem ->> > > at all. We stay at the Helmsley, Park Lane. Can you give me ->> > > directions? ->> > > ->> > > Regards, ->> > > ->> > > Nils Magnus ->> > > Program-Chair LinuxTag 2004 Free Conference Program ->> > > ->> > > LinuxTag 2004: Where .com meets .org - magnus at linuxtag.org ->> > > ->> > _______________________________________________ ->> > talk mailing list ->> > talk at lists.nycbug.org ->http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 3 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:13:19 -0800 ->> From: "Hans Zaunere" ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group ->> Launch: http://www.NYCBUG.org/ ->> To: ->> Cc: General discussion ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> -><41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752A9FE at ehost011-1.exch011.int ->ermedia.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ->> ->> ->> ->> Thanks John. ->> ->> H ->> ->> > -----Original Message----- ->> > From: nylug-announce-bounces at mail.nylug.org ->> > [mailto:nylug-announce-bounces at mail.nylug.org] On Behalf Of ->> > John Bajana-Bacalle ->> > Sent: Friday, January 16, 2004 4:13 PM ->> > To: New York Linux Users Group Announce List ->> > Subject: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group Launch: ->> > http://www.NYCBUG.org/ ->> > ->> > ----- Forwarded message from Hans Zaunere ----- ->> > ->> > From: "Hans Zaunere" ->> > Subject: NYC *BSD User Group Launch: http://www.NYCBUG.org/ ->> > ->> > We have founded a new *BSD User Group in New York City, the New ->> York ->> > City BSD Users Group (, pronounced ->> > "nice-bug"). ->> > It is our goal to make this B.U.G. a longtime success, and a ->> permanent ->> > bright fixture in the skyline of New York City Metro's I.T. ->> technical ->> > communities. ->> > ->> > There are two goals for this new user group. ->> > ->> > First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New York City ->> to ->> > discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. ->> > ->> > Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning more ->> about ->> > or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. ->> > ->> > - Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session ->> at ->> > LinuxWorld Conference & Expo, at the Jacob Javits Center ->> > on Thursday, ->> > January 22nd, at 5:45pm, Room 1E15. We will have a presence at ->> > various tables at the expo, including those of BSDMall and New ->> York ->> > PHP. ->> > ->> > - Our first monthly meeting will present on, "Secure by Default: ->> > Learning from OpenBSD," will be held on Wednesday, February ->> 4th at ->> > 7:00pm in the offices of: SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and ->> 6th ->> > Avenue, on the fifth floor. ->> > ->> > Presented by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux ->> > and OpenBSD ->> > Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated." This talk will ->> deal ->> > with crucial security concepts and best practices for today's ->> > computing environments. ->> > ->> > Subsequent monthly meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the ->> first ->> > Wednesday of the month. ->> > ->> > Our website is located at . ->> > ->> > o NYCBUG will include a joint documentation project with New ->> York PHP ->> > () and OpenlySecure.org, focused on ->> > providing ->> > original documentation to new and experienced BSD users alike. ->> > ->> > o NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists to assist in ->> > discussion ->> > and learning about the BSD world. Interested users, please ->> join the ->> > mailing list(s) at . ->> > ->> > NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but ->> > not limited ->> > to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, ->> > OpenDarwin, Darwin ->> > and Mac OSX. ->> > ->> > Since the origins of the Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) ->> Unix in ->> > the 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom ->> servers ->> > of the world, powering internet service providers, hosting firms, ->> and ->> > web sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist ->> current ->> > users, those interested in learning more about this fundamental ->> > operating system family and various other BSD projects, and to ->> > provide a channel for community interaction. ->> > ->> > We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a variety ->> > of ways in ->> > the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG ->> > a success. ->> > E pluribus unum. ->> > ->> > We kindly endorse the distribution of this announcement among ->> your ->> > colleagues, and potential *BSD users. Thank you. ->> > ->> > ----- End forwarded message ----- ->> > _______________________________________________ ->> > nylug-announce mailing list ->> > nylug-announce at mail.nylug.org ->> > http://www.nylug.org/mailman/listinfo/nylug-announce ->> > ->> > ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 4 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:46:58 -0800 ->> From: "Hans Zaunere" ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results ->> To: "General discussion" ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> -><41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0A at ehost011-1.exch011.int ->ermedia.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ->> ->> ->> > > >> i think this is very good news. ->> > > >> ->> > > >> "not officially supported" but in development is a ->big step in ->> > > >> the right direction. ->> > > > ->> > > > This is exciting news - maybe this is a petition topic? ->> > > > ->> > > > H ->> > > ->> > > Good idea for BOF and BSDcan petition, but probably won't ->> interest ->> > > many regular linuxexpo goers. ->> > ->> > I think this could be very useful, I think many, if not, all of ->> its ->> > competitors will follow it to freebsd. If Oracle does it it ->> *must* be ->> > a good idea after all. ->> ->> Following up on this... ->> ->> Just got off the phone with an OTN (Oracle Technical Network) ->> organizer for LinuxWorld. They'll be having an installfest, and ->> although focused on Linux, I pinged him about the BSDs. ->We've got the ->> go ahead if anyone wants to demo or share experiences on installing ->> and using Oracle on a BSD :) ->> ->> H ->> ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 5 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:53:12 -0800 ->> From: "Hans Zaunere" ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... ->> To: "Marc Spitzer" , ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> -><41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0E at ehost011-1.exch011.int ->ermedia.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ->> ->> ->> > On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) ->> > Wes Sonnenreich wrote: ->> > ->> > > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix ->> fame) will ->> > > be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th at 6pmish. ->> They ->> > > want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody ->> besides ->> > > George in on this? ->> > ->> > I think I can make it. ->> ->> I'll plan on attending, too. ->> ->> H ->> ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 6 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:12:57 -0500 ->> From: "G. Rosamond" ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] flier - how many are you printing? ->> To: ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAAVmFYPU8vyk+RgX1nXQW/oAEAAAAA at sddi.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ->> ->> that number makes sense jan. but considering we'll have a presence ->> at ->> bsdmall & nyphp, plus the bof, i think we should increase slightly. ->> ->> not that i have any f'g idea. . . ->> ->> g ->> ->> ->LinuxWorld is fairly large. Last year, we (NetBSD) started ->> ->out with 150 flyers, which were gone by noon the first day. ->> ->Then we printed some more and eventually handed out a total ->> ->of about 450 until we ran out again. Had we had more the ->> ->last day, we probably could have given out another 100. ->> ->> ->So, if you have a booth, I'd say the ballpark is ~500. ->> ->> ->I now have about 150 of our flyers (see ->> ->http://www.netbsd.org/gallery/advocacy/), ->which I'll be happy ->> ->to drop off anywhere possible (since we don't have a booth this ->> year). ->> ->> ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 7 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:14:59 -0500 ->> From: "G. Rosamond" ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... ->> To: "'Hans Zaunere'" , "'Marc Spitzer'" ->> , ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAAqlKXwhoG50CLbDILYe5HogEAAAAA at sddi.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ->> ->> guess i should try out knoppix *before* the meeting . . . ->> ->> still a bit confused of the concrete goal of this meeting, to be ->> honest. ->> ->> g ->> ->> ->-----Original Message----- ->> ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->> ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Hans Zaunere ->> ->Sent: Friday, January 16, 2004 5:53 PM ->> ->To: Marc Spitzer; talk at lists.nycbug.org ->> ->Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... ->> -> ->> -> ->> -> ->> ->> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) ->> ->> Wes Sonnenreich wrote: ->> ->> ->> ->> > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix ->> fame) ->> ->> > will be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th ->> ->at 6pmish. ->> ->> > They want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... ->> Anybody ->> ->> > besides George in on this? ->> ->> ->> ->> I think I can make it. ->> -> ->> ->I'll plan on attending, too. ->> -> ->> ->H ->> -> ->> ->_______________________________________________ ->> ->talk mailing list ->> ->talk at lists.nycbug.org ->> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk ->> -> ->> ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 8 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:14:59 -0500 ->> From: "G. Rosamond" ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results ->> To: "'Hans Zaunere'" , "'General discussion'" ->> ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAATK57+ivS80e6vM7g2Nfd7QEAAAAA at sddi.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ->> ->> nice work fence post. . . ->> ->> i'd be interested also. ->> ->> g ->> ->> ->Just got off the phone with an OTN (Oracle Technical Network) ->> ->organizer for LinuxWorld. They'll be having an installfest, ->> ->and although focused on Linux, I pinged him about the BSDs. ->> ->We've got the go ahead if anyone wants to demo or share ->> ->experiences on installing and using Oracle on a BSD :) ->> ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 9 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:23:07 -0500 ->> From: "G. Rosamond" ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] computer book works on reade street ->> To: ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAA///IR/N2Y0irDB/AItqtXQEAAAAA at sddi.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ->> ->> for those who don't know this store, it's between broadway and ->> church ->> street by city hall. ->> ->> they have an enormous selection of technical books, heavily ->> discounted. ->> as a side note, they do not seem to be carrying wes' recent ->> project, ->> network security illustrated. ->> ->> since 9/11 in particular, they are hurting for business. i spoke ->> to the ->> main man there (david) and find that they are no longer open on ->> sunday. ->> they've lost the critical member of the staff who is technically ->> proficient. ->> ->> first, i want to encourage all to use their store. cheaper than ->> amazon ->> and b&n by far. ->> ->> mention nycbug when you're there. ->> ->> also, considering they are only selling online through amazon, and ->> they ->> are solely devoted to tech books, they have a problem. maybe a ->> group of ->> www design, dev and sysadmin-types in nycbug could help them out. . ->> . ->> ->> currently, they have an issue keeping their pos database and online ->> database synced. although this is second-hand from david who's ->> non-technical, it sounds like whatever firm that is helping them is ->> f'g ->> them . . .saying they have to export the data daily to keep it ->> synced. ->> . .woah. so 1985. ->> ->> anyway, they are an important institution in nyc for all technical ->> users, particularly us. ->> ->> they will have a presence at linuxexpo. stop by, buy some books ->> from ->> them. introduce yourself. ->> ->> how do people feel about possibly assisting them in redesigning ->> their ->> pos and ecommerce database? ->> ->> ->> maybe a few people would like to volunteer and help them out. . . ->> g ->> ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 10 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:26:36 -0500 ->> From: "G. Rosamond" ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement. . . ->> To: ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAA5s/np9Y3k0yet13RGoLEIAEAAAAA at sddi.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ->> ->> i don't mean to keep beating this dead horse, but i'm a bit ->> confused by ->> the announcements not getting posted on bsdforums, bsdvault, etc. ->> ->> i know they've been sent, but how come they weren't posted? ->> ->> also, marc, get your sh*t together. it takes two minutes to hit ->> usenet/deja and attack them. if you remember, that's where i first ->> contacted *you* about getting a bsd user group started in nyc. i ->> think ->> a few others are also from there too. ->> ->> g ->> ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 11 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:36:15 -0500 ->> From: "G. Rosamond" ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] fbsd 5.2 ->> To: ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAAvfHElIfpQEy7laRiSRTrvQEAAAAA at sddi.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ->> ->> some recent experiences. . . ->> ->> 1. the install process adds a couple of more questions, including ->> whether you want to allow ssh logins. ->> ->> 2. seems that everytime you go into sysinstall, a whole set of ->> comments ->> are added to the rc.conf, which i think is a pain in the ass. so ->> you're ->> having a problem using the ports, and decide to use sysinstall's ->> packages. boom, three or so lines of code clogging up your ->> rc.conf. ->> ->> 3. also, for some reason, when i enable linux compatibility *each* ->> time ->> during the install process, it bombs out and i need to do it ->> manually ->> later on. ->> ->> comments? common experiences? ->> ->> g ->> ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> Message: 12 ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:07:15 -0500 ->> From: "G. Rosamond" ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] a question. . . ->> To: "'Jeremy Sohn'" ->> Cc: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->> Message-ID: ->> ->> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAAaKBsD6O8nkGIRUbj6GbbnQEAAAAA at sddi.net> ->> ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ->> ->> glad you can make the bof. we'd be honored to have wasabi present. ->> ->> are you going to have a table at linuxexpo? if so, could you ->> donate ->> 8.5" x 11" of table space for our fliers? it would be appreciated. ->> ->> also, is there a possibility of wasabi doing a meeting for nycbug ->> on ->> netbsd & embedded systems? ->> ->> thanks again for your followup. ->> ->> g ->> ->> ->> ------------------------------ ->> ->> _______________________________________________ ->> talk mailing list ->> talk at lists.nycbug.org ->> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk ->> ->> ->> End of talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 ->> *********************************** -> -> -> -> ->__________________________________ ->Do you Yahoo!? ->Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes ->http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org ->http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Sun Jan 18 20:13:54 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 20:13:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] knoppix Message-ID: wes: are we still on for knoppix at 6 pm at sagesecure tomorrow night? g From george Sun Jan 18 20:19:08 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 20:19:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] linux expo Message-ID: just to review linuxexpo issues: kliment: the signs for nycbug marc: refreshments for bof michael: speaker for nycbug at bof (with don from bsdmall, someone from wasabi?, wes, dan from bsdcan, george will chair) michael, etc: photocopying fliers for nyphp, bsdmall table i also have 250 business cards for nycbug to have around. and i want to encourage all to assist bsdmall & nyphp at the tables. i have worked the bsdmall for a few years, and can say there are times when it's a bit overwhelming with the number of discussions around bsd take off. . .too many people to address easily at once. i will be at the conference almost the whole time. what am i forgetting here? g 917-968-1900 From joshmccormack Sun Jan 18 22:15:53 2004 From: joshmccormack (Josh McCormack) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 22:15:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: a question. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <400B4BE9.7000402@travelersdiary.com> I'm new to the *bsds, but my research into making a firewall/dmz/access point and more sort of hardware has inevitably led to *bsd projects. I've heard of the security of netbsd and of course that it runs on just about everything, so my interest was peaked, but I haven't been able to find a great deal of information that's been helpful. To sum it up, I'd be interested in hearing about -cross compiling and porting from x86 to other platforms -how netbsd compares to other options for embedded systems in terms of system size & requirements, performance and security, particularly as it relates to network related equipment Josh G. Rosamond wrote: > ->I don't believe Wasabi is planning on having a presence at > ->LinuxExpo. In the past, we have done so, but it has not been > ->very profitable for us. Sorry. > > understood. will you have anyone at linuxexpo to give a short spiel at > the bof? > > ->Regarding leading a discussion about NetBSD and embedded > ->systems, we would be happy to do that. Is there a date that > ->you would prefer? Is there any specific component of embedded > ->systems that most interests the group? > > this is something i've mentioned as a meeting topic before in the > planning meetings. > > not sure on a date yet. > > in terms of the topic, maybe you could provide us some insight, and > also, now that the list has 50+ members, i would be interested in what > others think about the topic and a possible angle. > > ideas? > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From dan Sun Jan 18 22:32:24 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 22:32:24 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] linux expo In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <400B0978.15635.17E1E1B2@localhost> On 18 Jan 2004 at 20:19, G. Rosamond wrote: > i will be at the conference almost the whole time. Same here. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From jschauma Sun Jan 18 22:42:33 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 22:42:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: a question. . . In-Reply-To: <400B4BE9.7000402@travelersdiary.com> References: <400B4BE9.7000402@travelersdiary.com> Message-ID: <20040119034233.GB24260@netmeister.org> Josh McCormack wrote: > -cross compiling and porting from x86 to other platforms Some URLs: http://www.netbsd.org/Documentation/cross/ http://www.netbsd.org/guide/en/chap-build.html http://citeseer.nj.nec.com/552552.html http://www.usenix.org/events/bsdcon02/full_papers/linden/linden_html/ http://www.google.com/search?q=porting+netbsd -Jan -- "Ford," he said, "you're turning into a penguin. Stop it." -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040118/28330356/attachment.bin From george Sun Jan 18 22:46:43 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 22:46:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: a question. . . In-Reply-To: <400B4BE9.7000402@travelersdiary.com> Message-ID: josh: i think you're raising the crucial point: this talk (and nycbug in general) needs to address an audience aware of the advantages of the bsd's, but also unfamiliar with exactly why. while the embedded system approach with netbsd isn't exactly beginner-to- intermediate hacker material for the home user, there is an opening to make the case. i know that the latest windows embedded systems have made a big comeback with digital video recording systems, side-swiping linux in the process. but while there may not be many embedded systems/system on chips people around, i do know that the netbsd case for itself a great meeting topic. g ->I'm new to the *bsds, but my research into making a ->firewall/dmz/access ->point and more sort of hardware has inevitably led to *bsd projects. ->I've heard of the security of netbsd and of course that it ->runs on just ->about everything, so my interest was peaked, but I haven't ->been able to ->find a great deal of information that's been helpful. To sum ->it up, I'd ->be interested in hearing about -> -cross compiling and porting from x86 to other platforms -> -how netbsd compares to other options for embedded ->systems in terms of ->system size & requirements, performance and security, ->particularly as it ->relates to network related equipment From george Sun Jan 18 22:47:59 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2004 22:47:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: a question. . . In-Reply-To: <20040119034233.GB24260@netmeister.org> Message-ID: i see another great meeting on this one. . . bring in your device (usb flash drive, amiga, toaster oven) and we can have a day long install fest with netbsd. . . g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Jan Schaumann ->Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 10:43 PM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] RE: a question. . . -> -> ->Josh McCormack wrote: -> ->> -cross compiling and porting from x86 to other platforms -> ->Some URLs: -> ->http://www.netbsd.org/Documentation/cross/ ->http://www.netbsd.org/guide/en/chap-build.html -> ->http://citeseer.nj.nec.com/552552.html ->http://www.usenix.org/events/bsdcon02/full_papers/linden/linden_html/ ->http://www.google.com/search?q=porting+netbsd -> ->-Jan -> ->-- ->"Ford," he said, "you're turning into a penguin. Stop it." -> From george Mon Jan 19 09:37:16 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 09:37:16 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] knoppix Message-ID: i may have a problem making the 6 pm meeting tonight. i am the delivery point via ups for all the bsdmall stuff for linuxexpo, and if i don't get the delivery, i have to drive to canarsie to get the stuff. i'll keep you informed. . . g From lists Mon Jan 19 10:10:15 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 10:10:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] knoppix In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040119101015.1c6e0dc6.lists@genoverly.net> On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 09:37:16 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > i may have a problem making the 6 pm meeting tonight. > > i am the delivery point via ups for all the bsdmall stuff for linuxexpo, > and if i don't get the delivery, i have to drive to canarsie to get the > stuff. > > i'll keep you informed. . . > > g > I'd like to stop in, if I could be of any help. I was hoping to drop off a batch of flyers with someone. Since George may or may not be around, will someone else be there who is going in to the Expo on Tuesday for setup? I'll be at work Tuesday.. I have to put in at least some time this week at the office. Michael -- From george Mon Jan 19 11:17:09 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 11:17:09 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] knoppix In-Reply-To: <20040119101015.1c6e0dc6.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: just got the bsdmall boxes. . . so i'll be there at 6 pm. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael ->Sent: Monday, January 19, 2004 10:10 AM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] knoppix -> -> ->On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 09:37:16 -0500 ->"G. Rosamond" wrote: -> ->> i may have a problem making the 6 pm meeting tonight. ->> ->> i am the delivery point via ups for all the bsdmall stuff for ->> linuxexpo, and if i don't get the delivery, i have to drive to ->> canarsie to get the stuff. ->> ->> i'll keep you informed. . . ->> ->> g ->> -> ->I'd like to stop in, if I could be of any help. -> ->I was hoping to drop off a batch of flyers with someone. ->Since George may or may not be around, will someone else be ->there who is going in to the Expo on Tuesday for setup? I'll ->be at work Tuesday.. I have to put in at least some time this ->week at the office. -> ->Michael ->-- ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From spork Mon Jan 19 13:04:20 2004 From: spork (Charles Sprickman) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:04:20 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040119130354.C709@green.nat.fasttrackmonkey.com> On Sun, 18 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > we had talked about this. . .but that was before we past the 50 > subscriber mark. > > other people have feelings about this? Yes, I'd like to see an announcement-only list. Charles > i agree it time for announce only list. . . > > g > > ->-----Original Message----- > ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org > ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Danny G > ->Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 2:55 AM > ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 > -> > -> > ->Hi, I was wondering if there is an announcement only version > ->of this email list. while I may be interested in other users > ->messages, right now I'd like to only receive important > ->announcements about NYCBUG. > -> > -> > ->Thanks in advance > -> > ->--- talk-request at lists.nycbug.org wrote: > ->> Send talk mailing list submissions to > ->> talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->> > ->> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > ->> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > ->> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > ->> talk-request at lists.nycbug.org > ->> > ->> You can reach the person managing the list at > ->> talk-owner at lists.nycbug.org > ->> > ->> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > ->> than "Re: Contents of talk digest..." > ->> > ->> > ->> Today's Topics: > ->> > ->> 1. Re: RE: bof (Marc Spitzer) > ->> 2. Re: LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... (Marc Spitzer) > ->> 3. RE: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group Launch: > ->> http://www.NYCBUG.org/ (Hans Zaunere) > ->> 4. RE: FW: Oracle Meeting Results (Hans Zaunere) > ->> 5. RE: LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... (Hans Zaunere) > ->> 6. RE: flier - how many are you printing? (G. Rosamond) > ->> 7. RE: LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... (G. Rosamond) > ->> 8. RE: FW: Oracle Meeting Results (G. Rosamond) > ->> 9. computer book works on reade street (G. Rosamond) > ->> 10. announcement. . . (G. Rosamond) > ->> 11. fbsd 5.2 (G. Rosamond) > ->> 12. a question. . . (G. Rosamond) > ->> > ->> > ->> > ->---------------------------------------------------------------------- > ->> > ->> Message: 1 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 15:02:27 -0500 > ->> From: Marc Spitzer > ->> Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] RE: bof > ->> To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->> Message-ID: <20040116150227.62917d43.mspitze1 at optonline.net> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > ->> > ->> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 11:05:27 -0500 > ->> "G. Rosamond" wrote: > ->> > ->> > ->Car pooling to head up to BSDCan? If people want to take the > ->> train, > ->> > ->it's pretty scenery, and you can have a hack-a-thon on the way > ->> > ->up/back. But the drive is good too. I did that last August. > ->> Mostly > ->> > ->Interstate type roads, but a side trip through Lake Placid is > ->> > ->refreshing. > ->> > > ->> > at least a group discount. . .with amtrak. . . > ->> > ->> Amtrak has outlets in their seats ... > ->> > ->> marc > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 2 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 15:03:29 -0500 > ->> From: Marc Spitzer > ->> Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... > ->> To: talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->> Message-ID: <20040116150329.04a683b3.mspitze1 at optonline.net> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII > ->> > ->> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) > ->> Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > ->> > ->> > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix fame) > ->> will > ->> > be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th at 6pmish. > ->> They > ->> > want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody > ->> besides > ->> > George in on this? > ->> > ->> I think I can make it. > ->> > ->> marc > ->> > ->> > > ->> > > Re, > ->> > > > ->> > > On Thu, Jan 15, 2004 at 07:23:37PM -0500, Wes Sonnenreich > ->> wrote: > ->> > >> Nils, > ->> > >> > ->> > >> Do you mean monday the 19th or monday the 26th? Either > ->> afternoon > ->> > >world> work, but the later on the 19th the better (I'm returning > ->> from > ->> > >a skiing> trip monday) perhaps around 5 or 6pm? The 26th is wide > ->> > >open. > ->> > > > ->> > > We fly to NYC tomorrow, thus I meant the 19th. Later is no > ->> problem > ->> > > at all. We stay at the Helmsley, Park Lane. Can you give me > ->> > > directions? > ->> > > > ->> > > Regards, > ->> > > > ->> > > Nils Magnus > ->> > > Program-Chair LinuxTag 2004 Free Conference Program > ->> > > > ->> > > LinuxTag 2004: Where .com meets .org - magnus at linuxtag.org > ->> > > > ->> > _______________________________________________ > ->> > talk mailing list > ->> > talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 3 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:13:19 -0800 > ->> From: "Hans Zaunere" > ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group > ->> Launch: http://www.NYCBUG.org/ > ->> To: > ->> Cc: General discussion > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -><41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752A9FE at ehost011-1.exch011.int > ->ermedia.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > ->> > ->> > ->> > ->> Thanks John. > ->> > ->> H > ->> > ->> > -----Original Message----- > ->> > From: nylug-announce-bounces at mail.nylug.org > ->> > [mailto:nylug-announce-bounces at mail.nylug.org] On Behalf Of > ->> > John Bajana-Bacalle > ->> > Sent: Friday, January 16, 2004 4:13 PM > ->> > To: New York Linux Users Group Announce List > ->> > Subject: [nylug-announce] NYC *BSD User Group Launch: > ->> > http://www.NYCBUG.org/ > ->> > > ->> > ----- Forwarded message from Hans Zaunere ----- > ->> > > ->> > From: "Hans Zaunere" > ->> > Subject: NYC *BSD User Group Launch: http://www.NYCBUG.org/ > ->> > > ->> > We have founded a new *BSD User Group in New York City, the New > ->> York > ->> > City BSD Users Group (, pronounced > ->> > "nice-bug"). > ->> > It is our goal to make this B.U.G. a longtime success, and a > ->> permanent > ->> > bright fixture in the skyline of New York City Metro's I.T. > ->> technical > ->> > communities. > ->> > > ->> > There are two goals for this new user group. > ->> > > ->> > First, to provide a forum for the many BSD users in New York City > ->> to > ->> > discuss and debate topics of interest to the BSD community. > ->> > > ->> > Second, to provide a bridge to users interested in learning more > ->> about > ->> > or expanding their knowledge of the BSD family. > ->> > > ->> > - Our kick-off event will be a free "birds-of-a-feather" session > ->> at > ->> > LinuxWorld Conference & Expo, at the Jacob Javits Center > ->> > on Thursday, > ->> > January 22nd, at 5:45pm, Room 1E15. We will have a presence at > ->> > various tables at the expo, including those of BSDMall and New > ->> York > ->> > PHP. > ->> > > ->> > - Our first monthly meeting will present on, "Secure by Default: > ->> > Learning from OpenBSD," will be held on Wednesday, February > ->> 4th at > ->> > 7:00pm in the offices of: SageSecure, 116 West 23rd Street and > ->> 6th > ->> > Avenue, on the fifth floor. > ->> > > ->> > Presented by Wes Sonnenreich, author of "Building Linux > ->> > and OpenBSD > ->> > Firewalls" and "Network Security Illustrated." This talk will > ->> deal > ->> > with crucial security concepts and best practices for today's > ->> > computing environments. > ->> > > ->> > Subsequent monthly meetings will take place at 7:00pm on the > ->> first > ->> > Wednesday of the month. > ->> > > ->> > Our website is located at . > ->> > > ->> > o NYCBUG will include a joint documentation project with New > ->> York PHP > ->> > () and OpenlySecure.org, focused on > ->> > providing > ->> > original documentation to new and experienced BSD users alike. > ->> > > ->> > o NYCBUG also provides community mailing lists to assist in > ->> > discussion > ->> > and learning about the BSD world. Interested users, please > ->> join the > ->> > mailing list(s) at . > ->> > > ->> > NYCBUG is open to all interested individuals, including, but > ->> > not limited > ->> > to, users of FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, DragonFlyBSD, > ->> > OpenDarwin, Darwin > ->> > and Mac OSX. > ->> > > ->> > Since the origins of the Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD) > ->> Unix in > ->> > the 1970's, BSD has been a consistent force among the backroom > ->> servers > ->> > of the world, powering internet service providers, hosting firms, > ->> and > ->> > web sites such as Yahoo! and 2600.com. NYCBUG works to assist > ->> current > ->> > users, those interested in learning more about this fundamental > ->> > operating system family and various other BSD projects, and to > ->> > provide a channel for community interaction. > ->> > > ->> > We look forward to supporting the BSD community in a variety > ->> > of ways in > ->> > the coming months and years. Please join us in making NYCBUG > ->> > a success. > ->> > E pluribus unum. > ->> > > ->> > We kindly endorse the distribution of this announcement among > ->> your > ->> > colleagues, and potential *BSD users. Thank you. > ->> > > ->> > ----- End forwarded message ----- > ->> > _______________________________________________ > ->> > nylug-announce mailing list > ->> > nylug-announce at mail.nylug.org > ->> > http://www.nylug.org/mailman/listinfo/nylug-announce > ->> > > ->> > > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 4 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:46:58 -0800 > ->> From: "Hans Zaunere" > ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results > ->> To: "General discussion" > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -><41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0A at ehost011-1.exch011.int > ->ermedia.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > ->> > ->> > ->> > > >> i think this is very good news. > ->> > > >> > ->> > > >> "not officially supported" but in development is a > ->big step in > ->> > > >> the right direction. > ->> > > > > ->> > > > This is exciting news - maybe this is a petition topic? > ->> > > > > ->> > > > H > ->> > > > ->> > > Good idea for BOF and BSDcan petition, but probably won't > ->> interest > ->> > > many regular linuxexpo goers. > ->> > > ->> > I think this could be very useful, I think many, if not, all of > ->> its > ->> > competitors will follow it to freebsd. If Oracle does it it > ->> *must* be > ->> > a good idea after all. > ->> > ->> Following up on this... > ->> > ->> Just got off the phone with an OTN (Oracle Technical Network) > ->> organizer for LinuxWorld. They'll be having an installfest, and > ->> although focused on Linux, I pinged him about the BSDs. > ->We've got the > ->> go ahead if anyone wants to demo or share experiences on installing > ->> and using Oracle on a BSD :) > ->> > ->> H > ->> > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 5 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 14:53:12 -0800 > ->> From: "Hans Zaunere" > ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... > ->> To: "Marc Spitzer" , > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -><41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AA0E at ehost011-1.exch011.int > ->ermedia.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > ->> > ->> > ->> > On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) > ->> > Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > ->> > > ->> > > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix > ->> fame) will > ->> > > be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th at 6pmish. > ->> They > ->> > > want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... Anybody > ->> besides > ->> > > George in on this? > ->> > > ->> > I think I can make it. > ->> > ->> I'll plan on attending, too. > ->> > ->> H > ->> > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 6 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:12:57 -0500 > ->> From: "G. Rosamond" > ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] flier - how many are you printing? > ->> To: > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAAVmFYPU8vyk+RgX1nXQW/oAEAAAAA at sddi.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > ->> > ->> that number makes sense jan. but considering we'll have a presence > ->> at > ->> bsdmall & nyphp, plus the bof, i think we should increase slightly. > ->> > ->> not that i have any f'g idea. . . > ->> > ->> g > ->> > ->> ->LinuxWorld is fairly large. Last year, we (NetBSD) started > ->> ->out with 150 flyers, which were gone by noon the first day. > ->> ->Then we printed some more and eventually handed out a total > ->> ->of about 450 until we ran out again. Had we had more the > ->> ->last day, we probably could have given out another 100. > ->> > ->> ->So, if you have a booth, I'd say the ballpark is ~500. > ->> > ->> ->I now have about 150 of our flyers (see > ->> ->http://www.netbsd.org/gallery/advocacy/), ->which I'll be happy > ->> ->to drop off anywhere possible (since we don't have a booth this > ->> year). > ->> > ->> > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 7 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:14:59 -0500 > ->> From: "G. Rosamond" > ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... > ->> To: "'Hans Zaunere'" , "'Marc Spitzer'" > ->> , > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAAqlKXwhoG50CLbDILYe5HogEAAAAA at sddi.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > ->> > ->> guess i should try out knoppix *before* the meeting . . . > ->> > ->> still a bit confused of the concrete goal of this meeting, to be > ->> honest. > ->> > ->> g > ->> > ->> ->-----Original Message----- > ->> ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org > ->> ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Hans Zaunere > ->> ->Sent: Friday, January 16, 2004 5:53 PM > ->> ->To: Marc Spitzer; talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->> ->Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] LinuxTag/Knoppix people coming... > ->> -> > ->> -> > ->> -> > ->> ->> On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) > ->> ->> Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > ->> ->> > ->> ->> > LinuxTag people (including possibly Mr. Knopper of Knoppix > ->> fame) > ->> ->> > will be coming to SageSecure offices on Monday the 19th > ->> ->at 6pmish. > ->> ->> > They want to talk about community relations w/NYCBug... > ->> Anybody > ->> ->> > besides George in on this? > ->> ->> > ->> ->> I think I can make it. > ->> -> > ->> ->I'll plan on attending, too. > ->> -> > ->> ->H > ->> -> > ->> ->_______________________________________________ > ->> ->talk mailing list > ->> ->talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > ->> -> > ->> > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 8 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:14:59 -0500 > ->> From: "G. Rosamond" > ->> Subject: RE: [nycbug-talk] FW: Oracle Meeting Results > ->> To: "'Hans Zaunere'" , "'General discussion'" > ->> > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAATK57+ivS80e6vM7g2Nfd7QEAAAAA at sddi.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > ->> > ->> nice work fence post. . . > ->> > ->> i'd be interested also. > ->> > ->> g > ->> > ->> ->Just got off the phone with an OTN (Oracle Technical Network) > ->> ->organizer for LinuxWorld. They'll be having an installfest, > ->> ->and although focused on Linux, I pinged him about the BSDs. > ->> ->We've got the go ahead if anyone wants to demo or share > ->> ->experiences on installing and using Oracle on a BSD :) > ->> > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 9 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:23:07 -0500 > ->> From: "G. Rosamond" > ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] computer book works on reade street > ->> To: > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAA///IR/N2Y0irDB/AItqtXQEAAAAA at sddi.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > ->> > ->> for those who don't know this store, it's between broadway and > ->> church > ->> street by city hall. > ->> > ->> they have an enormous selection of technical books, heavily > ->> discounted. > ->> as a side note, they do not seem to be carrying wes' recent > ->> project, > ->> network security illustrated. > ->> > ->> since 9/11 in particular, they are hurting for business. i spoke > ->> to the > ->> main man there (david) and find that they are no longer open on > ->> sunday. > ->> they've lost the critical member of the staff who is technically > ->> proficient. > ->> > ->> first, i want to encourage all to use their store. cheaper than > ->> amazon > ->> and b&n by far. > ->> > ->> mention nycbug when you're there. > ->> > ->> also, considering they are only selling online through amazon, and > ->> they > ->> are solely devoted to tech books, they have a problem. maybe a > ->> group of > ->> www design, dev and sysadmin-types in nycbug could help them out. . > ->> . > ->> > ->> currently, they have an issue keeping their pos database and online > ->> database synced. although this is second-hand from david who's > ->> non-technical, it sounds like whatever firm that is helping them is > ->> f'g > ->> them . . .saying they have to export the data daily to keep it > ->> synced. > ->> . .woah. so 1985. > ->> > ->> anyway, they are an important institution in nyc for all technical > ->> users, particularly us. > ->> > ->> they will have a presence at linuxexpo. stop by, buy some books > ->> from > ->> them. introduce yourself. > ->> > ->> how do people feel about possibly assisting them in redesigning > ->> their > ->> pos and ecommerce database? > ->> > ->> > ->> maybe a few people would like to volunteer and help them out. . . > ->> g > ->> > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 10 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:26:36 -0500 > ->> From: "G. Rosamond" > ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] announcement. . . > ->> To: > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAA5s/np9Y3k0yet13RGoLEIAEAAAAA at sddi.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > ->> > ->> i don't mean to keep beating this dead horse, but i'm a bit > ->> confused by > ->> the announcements not getting posted on bsdforums, bsdvault, etc. > ->> > ->> i know they've been sent, but how come they weren't posted? > ->> > ->> also, marc, get your sh*t together. it takes two minutes to hit > ->> usenet/deja and attack them. if you remember, that's where i first > ->> contacted *you* about getting a bsd user group started in nyc. i > ->> think > ->> a few others are also from there too. > ->> > ->> g > ->> > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 11 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 19:36:15 -0500 > ->> From: "G. Rosamond" > ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] fbsd 5.2 > ->> To: > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAAvfHElIfpQEy7laRiSRTrvQEAAAAA at sddi.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > ->> > ->> some recent experiences. . . > ->> > ->> 1. the install process adds a couple of more questions, including > ->> whether you want to allow ssh logins. > ->> > ->> 2. seems that everytime you go into sysinstall, a whole set of > ->> comments > ->> are added to the rc.conf, which i think is a pain in the ass. so > ->> you're > ->> having a problem using the ports, and decide to use sysinstall's > ->> packages. boom, three or so lines of code clogging up your > ->> rc.conf. > ->> > ->> 3. also, for some reason, when i enable linux compatibility *each* > ->> time > ->> during the install process, it bombs out and i need to do it > ->> manually > ->> later on. > ->> > ->> comments? common experiences? > ->> > ->> g > ->> > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> Message: 12 > ->> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:07:15 -0500 > ->> From: "G. Rosamond" > ->> Subject: [nycbug-talk] a question. . . > ->> To: "'Jeremy Sohn'" > ->> Cc: talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->> Message-ID: > ->> > ->> > -> ->Jf/oR4JcKAAAAQAAAAaKBsD6O8nkGIRUbj6GbbnQEAAAAA at sddi.net> > ->> > ->> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > ->> > ->> glad you can make the bof. we'd be honored to have wasabi present. > ->> > ->> are you going to have a table at linuxexpo? if so, could you > ->> donate > ->> 8.5" x 11" of table space for our fliers? it would be appreciated. > ->> > ->> also, is there a possibility of wasabi doing a meeting for nycbug > ->> on > ->> netbsd & embedded systems? > ->> > ->> thanks again for your followup. > ->> > ->> g > ->> > ->> > ->> ------------------------------ > ->> > ->> _______________________________________________ > ->> talk mailing list > ->> talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->> http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > ->> > ->> > ->> End of talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 > ->> *********************************** > -> > -> > -> > -> > ->__________________________________ > ->Do you Yahoo!? > ->Yahoo! Hotjobs: Enter the "Signing Bonus" Sweepstakes > ->http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/signingbonus > ->_______________________________________________ > ->talk mailing list > ->talk at lists.nycbug.org > ->http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > -> > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From jschauma Mon Jan 19 13:16:47 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:16:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 In-Reply-To: <20040119130354.C709@green.nat.fasttrackmonkey.com> References: <20040119130354.C709@green.nat.fasttrackmonkey.com> Message-ID: <20040119181647.GB14021@netmeister.org> [this mail not directed at Charles in particular, but to everybody] Charles Sprickman wrote: > On Sun, 18 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > > > we had talked about this. . .but that was before we past the 50 > > subscriber mark. > > > > other people have feelings about this? > > Yes, I'd like to see an announcement-only list. [snip entire digest quoted multiple times] I'd like to see: - no more top-posting - no more full-body quotes Dirk Nimmich wrote a useful article called ``How do I quote correctly in Usenet?'', which I translated into English (http://www.netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html). The concepts translates well to mailing lists, too. Now, everybody, please don't get offended -- it just makes it easier for everybody to read the list (and stay on it). Thanks. :) -Jan -- chown -R us:enemy your_base -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040119/88df481f/attachment.bin From george Mon Jan 19 13:24:26 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:24:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: Links In-Reply-To: <1261.66.61.64.199.1074535871.squirrel@www.uid500.org> Message-ID: done. . . thanks to you. g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: Admins [mailto:admins at freebsdaddicts.org] ->Sent: Monday, January 19, 2004 1:11 PM ->To: george at nycbug.org ->Subject: Links -> -> ->We just added your site to our links section at: ->http://freebsdaddicts.org/modules.php?name=Web_Links&l_op=view ->link&cid=4 -> ->If you find the time, we would appreciate a link to our site (FreeBSD ->Addicts) on your links page at: http://www.nycbug.org/links.html -> -> ->Thanks! -> ->-- ->http://freebsdaddicts.org/ ->FreeBSD Addicts -> From dan Mon Jan 19 13:36:36 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 13:36:36 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: talk Digest, Vol 2, Issue 17 In-Reply-To: <20040119130354.C709@green.nat.fasttrackmonkey.com> References: Message-ID: <400BDD64.12487.1B1DC5AF@localhost> On 19 Jan 2004 at 13:04, Charles Sprickman wrote: > On Sun, 18 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > > > we had talked about this. . .but that was before we past the 50 > > subscriber mark. > > > > other people have feelings about this? > > Yes, I'd like to see an announcement-only list. It makes sense. Many people may not wish to be involved in the day to day activity, but do wish to know there's a booth at LWE for example... They would also like to hear about the topic of the next meeting, but don't want to be involved in the debate about how many fliers are needed... -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From klimenta Mon Jan 19 21:43:28 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 02:43:28 -0000 Subject: [nycbug-talk] linux expo References: Message-ID: <008d01c2c02d$4b3ceae0$9c9e5343@haledon> > just to review linuxexpo issues: > kliment: the signs for nycbug I have the signs. For thursday (LinuxEXPO) , I am out of work at 5PM at Teterboro. Last time almost 2hr from there to Sage. If anyone needs these signs earlier for the setup, please tell, I am willing to ship them overnight via UPS vs. FedEx. :) I'll take my shots with Canon too. A pleasure to see you all of you there... From george Mon Jan 19 22:52:26 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 22:52:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] linux expo In-Reply-To: <008d01c2c02d$4b3ceae0$9c9e5343@haledon> Message-ID: i think we should have them for wednesday am . . . g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: Kliment Andreev [mailto:klimenta at futurebit.com] ->Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2003 9:40 PM ->To: General discussion; george at sddi.net ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] linux expo -> -> -> -> ->> just to review linuxexpo issues: ->> kliment: the signs for nycbug -> ->I have the signs. ->For thursday (LinuxEXPO) , I am out of work at 5PM at ->Teterboro. Last time almost 2hr from there to Sage. If anyone ->needs these signs earlier for the setup, please tell, I am ->willing to ship them overnight via UPS vs. FedEx. :) -> ->I'll take my shots with Canon too. -> ->A pleasure to see you all of you there... -> From george Mon Jan 19 23:16:40 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 23:16:40 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bruce schneier Message-ID: as i mentioned last week, bruce schneier, the god of security, spoke at the 92nd street Y. (http://www.schneier.com/) while his talk was mostly focused at the "where do i sit in the plane" crowd, i did manage to speak to him briefly before the presentation about nycbug. he said he would be glad to speak for us, and that i should shoot him an email. i don't know about his specific views on bsd, but i do know he's pro-open source, and that his blowfish is the default encryption for the passwd file in openbsd. i think it would be a big deal for the nyc tech community for him to speak at a free, open meeting. i will email him this week and do some followup. see you all at linux expo. hans will be at nyphp, me at bsdmall, and we'll all be at the bof. michael gave me 500 fliers for the expo, and i'll get more made tomorrow. look forward to meeting more of you face-to-face. g From george Tue Jan 20 17:57:44 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 17:57:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] linux expo Message-ID: just an update. . . worked with don witt from daemon news/bsdmall to setup the booth at the javits center. we're isolated way back in the corner, unfortunately. we have approximately 700 fliers for nycbug, to be used at nyphp and bsdmall tables. plus 10 color ones for display. i have a bunch of free passes if anyone needs. call me outside the conference and i'll come out and give you one (or more) if needed. . . look forward to meeting more of you over the next few days. g 917-968-1900 From lists Tue Jan 20 15:31:55 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 20:31:55 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] linux expo In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040120203005.E70981@zoraida.natserv.net> > i have a bunch of free passes if anyone needs. call me outside the > conference and i'll come out and give you one (or more) if needed. . . I may take you up on that offer. :-) I was hoping to meet with Hans today at 4pm (he mentioned he was giving some tickets at that time), but things went pretty bad at a client and instead of spending a few hours I ended up spending 8 hours at the client. :-( Hoping to make it between 1pm and 2pm wednesday... From jschauma Tue Jan 20 22:24:08 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 22:24:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NetBSD T-Shirts available Message-ID: <20040121032408.GM20424@netmeister.org> Hi, I have a bunch of NetBSD T-Shirts available for sale. The T-Shirts are white Fruit-of-the-loom shirts with the center-graphic from this poster on the front ftp://ftp.netbsd.org/pub/NetBSD/misc/hubertf/poster1e.jpg and a green list of ports and the dates they first were supported on the back (up to 2000). The shirts are known as the ``one size fits all - World Tour'' shirts. I have only a few in size L and a fair number in size XL. If you're interested, please contact me. I could drop off a handful tomorrow in the afternoon at LinuxWorld at the bsdmall stand (if that's feasible). (Unfortunately I won't be able to attend the BoF, as I said.) Price: dunno, have to make up my mind. I was thinking around $15, unless that seems unreasonably steep. (Feel free to offer more, since absolutely every penny goes directory to the NetBSD Foundation. :-) -Jan -- "I am so amazingly cool you could keep a side of meat in me for a month. I am so hip I have difficulty seeing over my pelvis." -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040120/48def7c2/attachment.bin From dan Tue Jan 20 22:36:43 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 22:36:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] NetBSD T-Shirts available In-Reply-To: <20040121032408.GM20424@netmeister.org> References: <20040121032408.GM20424@netmeister.org> Message-ID: <20040120223451.U87150@xeon.unixathome.org> On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, Jan Schaumann wrote: > Hi, > > I have a bunch of NetBSD T-Shirts available for sale. The T-Shirts are > white Fruit-of-the-loom shirts with the center-graphic from this poster > on the front ftp://ftp.netbsd.org/pub/NetBSD/misc/hubertf/poster1e.jpg > and a green list of ports and the dates they first were supported on the > back (up to 2000). > > The shirts are known as the ``one size fits all - World Tour'' shirts. > I have only a few in size L and a fair number in size XL. > > If you're interested, please contact me. I could drop off a handful > tomorrow in the afternoon at LinuxWorld at the bsdmall stand (if that's > feasible). (Unfortunately I won't be able to attend the BoF, as I > said.) > > Price: dunno, have to make up my mind. I was thinking around $15, > unless that seems unreasonably steep. (Feel free to offer more, since > absolutely every penny goes directory to the NetBSD Foundation. :-) Jan: Perhaps David Maxwell would like one. Unfortunately, I don't have his email address to hand (I'm in George's apartment now...). If someone could email David and let him know about the above, I'll take one back to Ottawa if he wants one. From jschauma Tue Jan 20 22:40:15 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 22:40:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NetBSD T-Shirts available In-Reply-To: <20040120223451.U87150@xeon.unixathome.org> References: <20040121032408.GM20424@netmeister.org> <20040120223451.U87150@xeon.unixathome.org> Message-ID: <20040121034015.GP20424@netmeister.org> Dan Langille wrote: > Jan: Perhaps David Maxwell would like one. Unfortunately, I don't have > his email address to hand (I'm in George's apartment now...). If someone > could email David and let him know about the above, I'll take one back to > Ottawa if he wants one. I doubt he would -- he just shipped them to me. :-) -Jan -- Except most of the good bits were about frogs, I remember that. You would not believe some of the things about frogs. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040120/7136f67f/attachment.bin From dan Tue Jan 20 22:53:44 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 22:53:44 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] NetBSD T-Shirts available In-Reply-To: <20040121034015.GP20424@netmeister.org> References: <20040121032408.GM20424@netmeister.org> <20040120223451.U87150@xeon.unixathome.org> <20040121034015.GP20424@netmeister.org> Message-ID: <20040120225258.V87150@xeon.unixathome.org> On Tue, 20 Jan 2004, Jan Schaumann wrote: > Dan Langille wrote: > > > Jan: Perhaps David Maxwell would like one. Unfortunately, I don't have > > his email address to hand (I'm in George's apartment now...). If someone > > could email David and let him know about the above, I'll take one back to > > Ottawa if he wants one. > > I doubt he would -- he just shipped them to me. :-) Hell, I could have saved him the shipping costs! From george Tue Jan 20 22:53:29 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 22:53:29 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NetBSD T-Shirts available In-Reply-To: <20040121034015.GP20424@netmeister.org> Message-ID: nice list we're on. . . ->> Jan: Perhaps David Maxwell would like one. Unfortunately, I don't ->I doubt he would -- he just shipped them to me. :-) jan: bring them tomorrow. . .but bring a coat hanger so we can show them off. . .we don't have the usual *bsd tshirts, so we should be able to get rid of these easy. . . g From george Wed Jan 21 07:20:43 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 07:20:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bof listing. . . Message-ID: fyi. . . http://www.linuxworldexpo.com/linuxworldny/V40/conference/session.cvn?eI D=403 a little bit of advertising. . . g From george Wed Jan 21 23:43:29 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 23:43:29 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] linuxexpo Message-ID: today illustrated the increasing relevance of bsd in a way i haven't seen in years. we were regularly *mobbed* by people gazing, asking questions, listening carefully. the most interesting point to me was the many people who approached the table and said, "i was using redhat, but the licensing change isn't making me happy. so i decided to look at xxxbsd. . ." the "old" stalwart of funy (free)bsd users of new york was with us regularly, and had much insight into the operation of a bsd user group. additionally, someone i spoke to briefly via freebsd-advocacy was there all day dealing with questions. we now have over sixty users on the mailing list. in years past, we had some downtime. this year, we barely had any. redhat, sco, bsd reputation. . .it was a combination of many factors i'm sure. but the important thing is that we are able to address people's questions about the bsd family. jan from netbsd brought some dated but awesome netbsd tshirts we are selling for $15. dan from bsdcan has the brochures for the ottawa convention in may, which some of us are planning to attend. we also met a group of mac/unix users who meet monthly, even if the date falls on xmas and turkey day. they were enthusiastic about our outreaching to the apple world. some of us have also had some discussions with the two visiting linux tag (one of the most important open source conferences around) from germany. they also created knoppix, the cd-bootable version of linux. we should consider the notion of an open source conference in nyc at some point, with the linux user groups, new york php, etc, as this is probably the last year for linuxexpo and macworld in nyc. they're both most likely moving to boston. i want to encourage all to hang out at the table and get involved. we are making a splash, even though we may have the worst table location in the place. and didn't receive the most recent netbsd and openbsd cd's. and freebsd 5.2 isn't out yet. looking forward to the bof tomorrow. we'll have a speaker from bsdmall, wasabi, michael from nycbug and wes. be there and get involved. g From ike Thu Jan 22 03:26:00 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2004 03:26:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] linuxexpo In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9BE6A22E-4CB4-11D8-9572-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hello George, All, A quick shout out from the Lower East Side Mac Unix Users Group (lesmuug)- was a real pleasure to meet a few of yall' today at the BSDmall booth! On behalf of lesmuug, I will be coming tomorrow as the unofficial lesmuug ambassador, to cheer and participate, as yall' break the champagne on the bow for nycbug tomorrow! > they were enthusiastic about our outreaching to > the apple world. Indeed- like meeting a cousin that we didn't know existed, looking foreword to good times and sharing! Rocket, .ike http://lesmuug.org On Jan 21, 2004, at 11:43 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > today illustrated the increasing relevance of bsd in a way i haven't > seen in years. > > we were regularly *mobbed* by people gazing, asking questions, > listening > carefully. > > the most interesting point to me was the many people who approached the > table and said, "i was using redhat, but the licensing change isn't > making me happy. so i decided to look at xxxbsd. . ." > > the "old" stalwart of funy (free)bsd users of new york was with us > regularly, and had much insight into the operation of a bsd user group. > additionally, someone i spoke to briefly via freebsd-advocacy was there > all day dealing with questions. > > we now have over sixty users on the mailing list. > > in years past, we had some downtime. this year, we barely had any. > redhat, sco, bsd reputation. . .it was a combination of many factors > i'm > sure. but the important thing is that we are able to address people's > questions about the bsd family. > > jan from netbsd brought some dated but awesome netbsd tshirts we are > selling for $15. dan from bsdcan has the brochures for the ottawa > convention in may, which some of us are planning to attend. we also > met > a group of mac/unix users who meet monthly, even if the date falls on > xmas and turkey day. they were enthusiastic about our outreaching to > the apple world. > > some of us have also had some discussions with the two visiting linux > tag (one of the most important open source conferences around) from > germany. they also created knoppix, the cd-bootable version of linux. > we should consider the notion of an open source conference in nyc at > some point, with the linux user groups, new york php, etc, as this is > probably the last year for linuxexpo and macworld in nyc. they're both > most likely moving to boston. > > i want to encourage all to hang out at the table and get involved. we > are making a splash, even though we may have the worst table location > in > the place. and didn't receive the most recent netbsd and openbsd cd's. > and freebsd 5.2 isn't out yet. > > looking forward to the bof tomorrow. we'll have a speaker from > bsdmall, > wasabi, michael from nycbug and wes. > > be there and get involved. > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin) iD8DBQFAD4kYnsU/iA32NRARAq5NAJ9euJ7ouDDdGxvMVd/0g/KjnoDRKQCeO2og X50dYwu9PVAqz5KmOEGhnXc= =SExe -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From jschauma Thu Jan 22 10:02:42 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2004 10:02:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] linuxexpo In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040122150242.GB10539@netmeister.org> "G. Rosamond" wrote: > i want to encourage all to hang out at the table and get involved. we > are making a splash, even though we may have the worst table location in > the place. and didn't receive the most recent netbsd and openbsd cd's. > and freebsd 5.2 isn't out yet. Last year, I spent a lot of time just burning the latest version of NetBSD/i386 on blank CDs and giving them away for free. We gave out about 130 CDs or so. I'll try to drop off a stack on Friday and possibly hang around for a bit. Thanks to BSDmall and George for helping all BSDs get more publicity! -Jan -- "Life," said Marvin, "don't talk to me about life." -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040122/e544ed8a/attachment.bin From george Fri Jan 23 03:36:17 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2004 03:36:17 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] merrrrry xmas Message-ID: http://bsdforums.org/ finally they posted us. . . g From george Fri Jan 23 18:43:57 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2004 18:43:57 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: In-Reply-To: <1074872046.40113eee04e89@localhost> Message-ID: ->Edwin here, I was at the meeting yesterday with Josh Klein. ->Just wanted to extend my services to nyc bug. If you web ->design help give me a hollar. Free of charge :) thanks edwin. . .appreciate that. maybe we could hook you up with some of the nycbug php-heads, i understand that most have no design skills whatsoever. . .they can't even match their clothes. . . ;-' see you feb 4th? g From lists Sat Jan 24 09:03:09 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 09:03:09 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Intel Centrino Message-ID: <20040124090309.10b3c1d4.lists@genoverly.net> Sorry if someone else already posted this... I know some of the list members have been talking about Intel Centrino support Intel mulls Linux Centrino support on News.com http://news.com.com/2100-7344-5145073.html This article also mentions a petition http://www.petitiononline.com/xanthan/petition.html -- From george Sat Jan 24 09:28:32 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 09:28:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FW: [nylug-talk] Smack your penguin! Message-ID: don't take this as being divisive. . . i got it off the ny linux user group list. . . g -----Original Message----- From: nylug-talk-bounces at nylug.org [mailto:nylug-talk-bounces at nylug.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 2:40 AM To: nylug-talk at nylug.org Subject: [nylug-talk] Smack your penguin! Hit it out of the park!! http://leo.sumy.ua/prikol/games/linux.swf My record- 287.4. Enjoy. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040124/d13dc4cf/attachment.html From george Sat Jan 24 09:39:38 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 09:39:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Intel Centrino In-Reply-To: <20040124090309.10b3c1d4.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: thanks michael. useful info. this does illustrate quite clearly that the open source world has a lot to work together around. ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael ->Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 9:03 AM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] Intel Centrino -> -> ->Sorry if someone else already posted this... -> ->I know some of the list members have been talking about Intel ->Centrino support -> ->Intel mulls Linux Centrino support on News.com ->http://news.com.com/2100-7344-5145073.html -> ->This article also ->mentions a petition ->->http://www.petitiononline.com/xanthan/petition.h->tml -> ->-- -> -> ->_______________________________________________ -> ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From lists Sat Jan 24 05:07:46 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 10:07:46 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYC hardware integrator Message-ID: <20040124100331.U2700@zoraida.natserv.net> Anyone has any hardware integrator in the NYC area they use? I get parts from http:/shentech.com, but they don't really make systems, except for some Bare Bones. From cistalk Sat Jan 24 13:09:02 2004 From: cistalk (Az) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 13:09:02 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Microsoft won't go soft on Mike Rowe Message-ID: <000501c3e2a5$25bb77f0$6400a8c0@a0> microsoft goes after mikerowesoft.com http://www.canoe.ca/NewsStand/LondonFreePress/News/2004/01/19/317906.html From mspitze1 Sat Jan 24 15:34:51 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 15:34:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? Message-ID: <20040124153451.00c29c15.mspitze1@optonline.net> I cannot get to www.bsdcan.org or bsdcan.org, dns is timing out. Can anybody else get there? From george Sat Jan 24 16:57:21 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 16:57:21 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYC hardware integrator In-Reply-To: <20040124100331.U2700@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: ->Anyone has any hardware integrator in the NYC area they use? ->I get parts from http:/shentech.com, but they don't really ->make systems, except for some Bare Bones. francisco: i don't know that firm, but i have used gcs at 10 w. 37th street for years and years. . . http://www.gcserve.com/ the www site is being redone now, so don't just them by that. talk to louis and mention me. . . he's a great guy. g From george Sat Jan 24 16:59:22 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 16:59:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: <20040124153451.00c29c15.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: seems fine here. . . ->I cannot get to www.bsdcan.org or bsdcan.org, dns is timing out. -> ->Can anybody else get there? g From george Fri Jan 23 19:55:24 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2004 19:55:24 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] open source conference Message-ID: we are meeting tomorrow at noon at 211 e 5th street at the three jewels internet cafe in manhattan with a range of open source user groups in nyc to discuss organizing an open source conference for next year. with no linuxexpo or macworld, there is a huge vacuum that we could fill. nils and klaus from linuxtag are instrumental in their advice on this, as they have organized *the* open source european event. it would be good if some people from nycbug joined michael and myself in being there. i know it's last minute, but i think it's also clear that we have a lot to offer organizationally. included groups are the various linux groups, new york php, mac unix users (i hope, since they're *very* cool), ny lisp, etc. g From lists Sat Jan 24 13:05:19 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 18:05:19 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040124180316.V4593@zoraida.natserv.net> On Sat, 24 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > seems fine here. . . > > ->I cannot get to www.bsdcan.org or bsdcan.org, dns is timing out. > -> > ->Can anybody else get there? Can't get here. DNS doesn't seem to be up. Perhaps some servers still have it in cache. NSlookup to my ISP's DNS comes up with no response. From lists Sat Jan 24 13:09:29 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 18:09:29 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYC hardware integrator In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040124180638.I4593@zoraida.natserv.net> On Sat, 24 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > i don't know that firm, Shentech is great for parts. They are local. In queens or brooklyn (can't remember). I have ordered lots of parts for myself and clients throughtout the years. Just wished they did entire systems too. :-( > but i have used gcs at 10 w. 37th street for > years and years. . . > http://www.gcserve.com/ Thanks. Do you have an email for them? They don't have any contact info besides phone.. From dan Sat Jan 24 20:04:27 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 20:04:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: <20040124180316.V4593@zoraida.natserv.net> References: Message-ID: <4012CFCB.28544.36412151@localhost> On 24 Jan 2004 at 18:05, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Sat, 24 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > > > seems fine here. . . > > > > ->I cannot get to www.bsdcan.org or bsdcan.org, dns is timing out. > > -> > > ->Can anybody else get there? > > Can't get here. > DNS doesn't seem to be up. Perhaps some servers still have it in cache. > NSlookup to my ISP's DNS comes up with no response. Well, that's interesting. Try again. I know the primary DNS server is down, but that shouldn't be stopping you totally. It should just take a while. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From lists Sat Jan 24 16:51:15 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 21:51:15 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: <4012CFCB.28544.36412151@localhost> References: <4012CFCB.28544.36412151@localhost> Message-ID: <20040124214445.P5810@zoraida.natserv.net> On Sat, 24 Jan 2004, Dan Langille wrote: > Well, that's interesting. Try again. I know the primary DNS server > is down, but that shouldn't be stopping you totally. It should just > take a while. Just tried again. Same result for both bsdcan.org and www.bsdcan.org. My isp uses ns1.acecape.com as their DNS. Just for the heck of it also tried the DNS server from another company I use.. zoneedit. In particular I tried ns1.zoneedit.org From dan Sat Jan 24 21:55:55 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 21:55:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: <20040124214445.P5810@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <4012CFCB.28544.36412151@localhost> Message-ID: <4012E9EB.21838.36A72FC0@localhost> On 24 Jan 2004 at 21:51, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Sat, 24 Jan 2004, Dan Langille wrote: > > > Well, that's interesting. Try again. I know the primary DNS server > > is down, but that shouldn't be stopping you totally. It should just > > take a while. > > > Just tried again. > Same result for both bsdcan.org and www.bsdcan.org. > My isp uses ns1.acecape.com as their DNS. > > Just for the heck of it also tried the DNS server from another > company I use.. zoneedit. In particular I tried ns1.zoneedit.org I suggest that your ISPs DNS is messed up. If someone can prove otherwise, please let me know. The name servers, as found in whois bsdcan.org, are: Name Server:NEZLOK.UNIXATHOME.ORG Name Server:M20.UNIXATHOME.ORG I know for sure that m20.unixathome.org is offline. Which leaves nezlok up and running. $ dig @nezlok.unixathome.org www.bsdcan.org ; <<>> DiG 8.3 <<>> @nezlok.unixathome.org www.bsdcan.org ; (1 server found) ;; res options: init recurs defnam dnsrch ;; got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 4 ;; flags: qr aa rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 2, ADDITIONAL: 2 ;; QUERY SECTION: ;; www.bsdcan.org, type = A, class = IN ;; ANSWER SECTION: www.bsdcan.org. 3D IN A 66.154.97.250 ;; AUTHORITY SECTION: bsdcan.org. 3D IN NS m20.unixathome.org. bsdcan.org. 3D IN NS nezlok.unixathome.org. ;; ADDITIONAL SECTION: m20.unixathome.org. 3D IN A 66.11.169.50 nezlok.unixathome.org. 3D IN A 66.154.97.250 ;; Total query time: 36 msec ;; FROM: toxic.magnesium.net to SERVER: nezlok.unixathome.org 66.154.97.250 ;; WHEN: Sat Jan 24 18:54:43 2004 ;; MSG SIZE sent: 32 rcvd: 130 That looks right to me. Anyone see any problems there? -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From mspitze1 Sat Jan 24 18:57:23 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 18:57:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] open source conference In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040124185723.63bccc5a.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 19:55:24 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > included groups are the various linux groups, new york php, mac unix > users (i hope, since they're *very* cool), ny lisp, etc. Also lispnyc put on the ALU (assoc. of lisp users) show at the new yorker hotel(it's at 8th and 35th st or so) and it was a good show, lasted for 4 days and was in the black after the show. marc > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From george Sat Jan 24 22:48:31 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 24 Jan 2004 22:48:31 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? Message-ID: apparently, my email about this was held up by the mailing list. so i apologize that i didn't notify all sooner. as mentioned earlier, a few of us had an informal meeting with linuxtag's klaus and niels on monday. klaus is klaus knopple of knoppix, the well-known bootable linux cd. linuxtag in germany is probably the most important open source conference in the continent. there were some 20000 participants, even though it was not held in a major city. the discussion moved to the vision of having some type of technical, open source related conference in nyc next year. during linuxexpo, scattered representatives of various user groups and technical organizations assembled and planned for a meeting that occured today at noon in the east village. the meeting was a bit chaotic, unrepresentative and unwieldy. nevertheless, it was also a huge step forward. the central focus of the meeting was the linuxtag guys describing how they began their event and how it's developed since 1996. operationally, not much was accomplished. we did decide the following: in general, we were looking to organize a replacement for the fleeing idg shows, namely macworld and linuxexpo which will be held in boston next year. second, most participants today expressed frustration with the increasing marginalization of the .org pavillion and its user group participants. third, that a new technology event in new york would continue to include corporate sponsors and participants, but that the priority would be on technology, not marketing spiels. fourth, that in order to make the conference as inclusive and open as possible, the costs would be kept to a minimum. finally, and most importantly on the operational level, we would have more organized planning meeting on february 8th. the meeting would include two delegates from each user group, technical organization, etc, and there would be one vote per delegate. what direction this moves in, we don't know. it's quite possible that personal differences could severely frustrate many involved in organizing the event. the high costs of conference space, hotels, etc, could also harm the effort. however, it's quite clear that there is a real opportunity for a more technically inclined approach to a major annual conference. there were a total of some 30 people in attendance. from nycbug, george and michael were in attendance. additionally, hans from new york php and ike from the lower east side mac unix users group. other organizations included lisp nyc, ny linux user groups, lxny, gnome foundation, gnubies, deluge. thoughts? g From john Sun Jan 25 01:46:12 2004 From: john (John Bacalle) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 01:46:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] open source conference In-Reply-To: <20040124185723.63bccc5a.mspitze1@optonline.net> References: <20040124185723.63bccc5a.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: <20040125064612.GB3651@dancer> * Marc Spitzer [20040124 18:57]: > On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 19:55:24 -0500 > "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > included groups are the various linux groups, new york php, mac unix > > users (i hope, since they're *very* cool), ny lisp, etc. > > Also lispnyc put on the ALU (assoc. of lisp users) show at the new > yorker hotel(it's at 8th and 35th st or so) and it was a good show, > lasted for 4 days and was in the black after the show. That's an excellent point, the 2003 ALU conference. Raymond de Lacaze, President ALU, lives here in NYC, and along with LispNYC, can be tapped for their insights. George, make note. John From george Sun Jan 25 04:19:00 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 04:19:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] open source conference In-Reply-To: <20040125064612.GB3651@dancer> Message-ID: great. . .i assume someone should invite them to the feb 8th meeting and list. ->> Also lispnyc put on the ALU (assoc. of lisp users) show at the new ->> yorker hotel(it's at 8th and 35th st or so) and it was a good show, ->> lasted for 4 days and was in the black after the show. -> ->That's an excellent point, the 2003 ALU conference. Raymond ->de Lacaze, President ALU, lives here in NYC, and along with ->LispNYC, can be tapped for their insights. George, make note. -> -> John From ike Sun Jan 25 07:28:03 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 07:28:03 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] PyCon - East Coast Python Conference Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Wordemup All, Just thought I'd pass on for anyone interested, PyCon is coming up soon, March 24-26 in DC, Early Bird Registration. ends Jan. 31, Last year rocked- http://pycon.org/ - -- Thought it relevant to pass on this East Coast Event, someone feel free to smack me if I'm off-topic! Rocket, .ike -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin) iD8DBQFAE7ZTnsU/iA32NRARAvh2AJ0QtGXW7k5GSoOcCylOUY2BVBaHrgCdFcpH UjGouKo8gGNugVyvKy9KgzM= =jtA9 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From ike Sun Jan 25 07:42:42 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 07:42:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Word to the Bootable-Distro folks, A quick nod to the Knoppix conversation (mentioned at 1st meeting Thursday), fresh on slashdot this AM, Knoppix, Feather Linux, Gnoppix and MEPIS Linux reviewed 'Four Linux Live CDs, The Executive Summary': http://slashdot.org/articles/04/01/25/0340221.shtml? tid=106&tid=185&tid=190 The Comparsion Article: http://www.extremetech.com/print_article/0,3998,a=117223,00.asp Rocket- .ike On Jan 24, 2004, at 10:48 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > as mentioned earlier, a few of us had an informal meeting with > linuxtag's klaus and niels on monday. klaus is klaus knopple of > knoppix, the well-known bootable linux cd. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin) iD8DBQFAE7nCnsU/iA32NRARAuK3AJ9hq54DVjqOC601WUBGDyAwL5IHDACfbFbS PmWXIOcOVwnnTkcG28IjwmE= =ubbq -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From ike Sun Jan 25 07:58:37 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 07:58:37 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Bootable Distro Note In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3135B62D-4F36-11D8-9572-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 One more word to the Bootable-Distro folks, http://wifibsd.org/ Their project would have a lot in common, it seems to me, with a bootable BSD distro- I believe it may be worth diving into for those interested in BSD bootable distro- this thing is pretty young and moving at a pace on par with long-term goals, it seems. This project is much like locustworld for those who know that project- except it's BSD, For those who don't know either locustworld (linux) or wifibsd, both are a CD bootable wifi Access Point distro. Rocket- .ike PS- I'll watch my subject lines closer here for folks following threads :) On Jan 25, 2004, at 7:42 AM, Isaac Levy wrote: > Word to the Bootable-Distro folks, > > A quick nod to the Knoppix conversation (mentioned at 1st meeting > Thursday), > fresh on slashdot this AM, Knoppix, Feather Linux, Gnoppix and MEPIS > Linux reviewed > > 'Four Linux Live CDs, The Executive Summary': > http://slashdot.org/articles/04/01/25/0340221.shtml? > tid=106&tid=185&tid=190 > > The Comparsion Article: > http://www.extremetech.com/print_article/0,3998,a=117223,00.asp > > Rocket- > .ike > > > On Jan 24, 2004, at 10:48 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > >> as mentioned earlier, a few of us had an informal meeting with >> linuxtag's klaus and niels on monday. klaus is klaus knopple of >> knoppix, the well-known bootable linux cd. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin) iD8DBQFAE719nsU/iA32NRARAlppAKCGZn98LN0FusxtAlIa/OWt2OWtmACdEZ0n pyRBfX+UzF/nUhOEgRwT6Es= =Fabf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From lists Sun Jan 25 03:51:04 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 08:51:04 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040125084858.W11323@zoraida.natserv.net> On Sat, 24 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > the discussion moved to the vision of having some type of technical, > open source related conference in nyc next year. > thoughts? Between now and the next meeting why not create a forum or mailing list so the group can better organize. I think more can be accompleshided if there is some prior planning. Just my $.02 From lists Sun Jan 25 03:54:02 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 08:54:02 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYC hardware integrator In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040125085304.L11323@zoraida.natserv.net> On Sat, 24 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > ... i have used gcs at 10 w. 37th street for > years and years. . . > http://www.gcserve.com/ Are they BSD aware? May need 3 machines, 2 of which will likely be running FreeBSD. From lists Sun Jan 25 09:39:04 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 09:39:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040125093904.6212866e.lists@genoverly.net> On Sat, 24 Jan 2004 22:48:31 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > as mentioned earlier, a few of us had an informal meeting with > linuxtag's klaus and niels on monday. klaus is klaus knopple of > knoppix, the well-known bootable linux cd. > > linuxtag in germany is probably the most important open source > conference in the continent. there were some 20000 participants, even > though it was not held in a major city. > Additions and Corrections: Nils Magnus & Klaus Knopper LinuxTag http://www.linuxtag.org/ Knoppix Linux http://www.knoppix.org/ Michael -- From lists Sun Jan 25 09:39:38 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 09:39:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Bootable Distro Note In-Reply-To: <3135B62D-4F36-11D8-9572-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> References: <3135B62D-4F36-11D8-9572-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <20040125093938.7e002114.lists@genoverly.net> I'll add to the bootable Distro... http://www.freesbie.org/ What is FreeSBIE? Simply: a live system on CD, or an operating system that is able to load directly from a bootable CD, without any installation process, without any hard disk. It's based on the FreeBSD operating system. The project is developed by the main Italian FreeBSD User Group: GUFI (I've not tried it, but, I read that the keyboard is mapped to italian.) Michael -- From ray Sun Jan 25 01:50:52 2004 From: ray (Ray) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 01:50:52 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] open source conference In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040125065052.GA29828@cybertron.cyth.net> On Fri, Jan 23, 2004 at 07:55:24PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > we are meeting tomorrow at noon at 211 e 5th street at the three Define ``tomorrow.'' Your E-mail client says you sent it Friday, but my headers claim you sent it Saturday. -Ray- From dan Sun Jan 25 10:57:59 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 10:57:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] open source conference In-Reply-To: <20040125065052.GA29828@cybertron.cyth.net> References: Message-ID: <4013A137.3137.39733F26@localhost> On 25 Jan 2004 at 1:50, Ray wrote: > On Fri, Jan 23, 2004 at 07:55:24PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > we are meeting tomorrow at noon at 211 e 5th street at the three > > Define ``tomorrow.'' Your E-mail client says you sent it Friday, > but my headers claim you sent it Saturday. It was Saturday. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From dan Sun Jan 25 11:29:10 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 11:29:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: <20040124215447.J5810@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20040124214445.P5810@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <4013A886.13728.398FCB83@localhost> On 24 Jan 2004 at 21:56, lists at natserv.net wrote: > On Sat, 24 Jan 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: > > Just tried again. > > Same result for both bsdcan.org and www.bsdcan.org. > > My isp uses ns1.acecape.com as their DNS. > > > Tried one more thing.. I sshed to a web provider I use. Their DNS was able > to see (or maybe still has cached) www.bsdcan.org, but did not have > bsdcan.org > > The DNS server they use is ns.hub.org I just fixed a problem with nezlok.unixathome.org. To quote someone else: A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET points the world at TLD2.ULTRADNS.NET (for .org) and it still thinks nezlok.unixathome.org is at 64.251.88.60 But nezlok is actually 66.154.97.250 Things should improve now. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From trish Sun Jan 25 11:42:37 2004 From: trish (Trish Lynch) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 11:42:37 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] I've arrived.... Message-ID: <20040125114155.A37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> THe party can now officially begin ;) -Trish -- Trish Lynch trish at bsdunix.net Ecartis Core Team trish at listmistress.org EFNet IRC Operator/SysAdmin @ irc.dkom.at AilleCat at EFNet Key fingerprint = 781D 2B47 AA4B FC88 B919 0CD6 26B2 1D62 6FC1 FF16 From jschauma Sun Jan 25 11:51:30 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 11:51:30 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Bootable Distro Note In-Reply-To: <20040125093938.7e002114.lists@genoverly.net> References: <3135B62D-4F36-11D8-9572-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> <20040125093938.7e002114.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <20040125165130.GB15950@netmeister.org> michael wrote: > > I'll add to the bootable Distro... As shall I: NetBSD Live! CDs are also available and possible. The first NetBSD Live! CD (created by Joerg Braun) was a CD that boots NetBSD 1.5.2/i386 from CDROM, allows some system config (german language dialogs, sorry!), selection of X config, then allows starting one of several window managers, e.g. KDE2. Under KDE2, Koffice is ready to run. The ISO image can be obtained from ftp://ftp.NetBSD.org/pub/NetBSD/iso/1.5.2/i386live.iso.gz (also available: md5sum and a cover (by Hubert Feyrer)). Note that the scripts to (re)create the CD are also part of the image. All credits and many thanks go to J?rg Braun (jb at toolbox-mag dot de), who developed this gem. Please see the README (ftp://ftp.NetBSD.org/pub/NetBSD/iso/1.5.2/README.i386live) for more details. Finally, some more instructions on creating your custom Live! CD are at http://www.reedmedia.net/misc/netbsd/live-cd.html -Jan -- I always said there was something fundamentally wrong with the universe. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040125/e0b5df84/attachment.bin From hans Sun Jan 25 11:52:02 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 08:52:02 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Bootable Distro Note Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752AFFE@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > One more word to the Bootable-Distro folks, > > http://wifibsd.org/ This brings to mind NYC Wireless (http://nycwireless.net). They've been doing some work, and looking for help, in getting a quick and easy way for putting APs online. H From pete Sun Jan 25 12:35:47 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 12:35:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: <4013A886.13728.398FCB83@localhost> References: <20040124214445.P5810@zoraida.natserv.net> <4013A886.13728.398FCB83@localhost> Message-ID: <4013FE73.1010809@nomadlogic.org> Dan Langille wrote: >On 24 Jan 2004 at 21:56, lists at natserv.net wrote: > > > >>On Sat, 24 Jan 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: >> >> >>>Just tried again. >>>Same result for both bsdcan.org and www.bsdcan.org. >>>My isp uses ns1.acecape.com as their DNS. >>> >>> >>Tried one more thing.. I sshed to a web provider I use. Their DNS was able >>to see (or maybe still has cached) www.bsdcan.org, but did not have >>bsdcan.org >> >>The DNS server they use is ns.hub.org >> >> > >I just fixed a problem with nezlok.unixathome.org. To quote someone >else: A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET points the world at TLD2.ULTRADNS.NET (for >.org) and it still thinks nezlok.unixathome.org is at 64.251.88.60 > >But nezlok is actually 66.154.97.250 > >Things should improve now. > > i've just tested it and things look good from here (nyc area). cheers, pete wright From george Sun Jan 25 13:25:54 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 13:25:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Bootable Distro Note In-Reply-To: <20040125165130.GB15950@netmeister.org> Message-ID: ->NetBSD Live! CDs are also available and possible. The first ->The ISO image can be obtained from ->->ftp://ftp.NetBSD.org/pub/NetBSD/iso/1.5.2/i386li->ve.iso.gz downloaded and burned iso. . .didn't work with my dell poweredge 2400, mounting issues with cd. . . but no issues at all with a piii compaq deskpro. working on XFree now. . . ->Finally, some more instructions on creating your custom Live! ->CD are at http://www.reedmedia.net/misc/netbsd/live-cd.html this should be investigated. . . 1. eng documentation 2. updated locate db 3. us keyboard mapping 4. autodetect xfree settings. . .like knoppix 5. user shell to bash (?) 6. ability to mount other file systems thoughts? From ike Sun Jan 25 14:52:27 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 14:52:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: <4013FE73.1010809@nomadlogic.org> References: <20040124214445.P5810@zoraida.natserv.net> <4013A886.13728.398FCB83@localhost> <4013FE73.1010809@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <00D38DFA-4F70-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 [...domain conversation...] >> Things should improve now. >> > i've just tested it and things look good from here (nyc area). With a shout and cheer, bsdcan.org resolving fine now from Brooklyn- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin) iD8DBQFAFB21nsU/iA32NRARApMXAJ9L1Oh1HX2O5ppPMF8EoUfNafOi7wCdF+On lTE9NgZEvux67tckZWUtfwk= =JX10 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From george Sun Jan 25 15:13:05 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:13:05 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision Message-ID: okay. . .it's definitely time. . . 1. new logo one that covers all the bsd family, including darwin & osx. our current one is just the fbsd beastie. and obviously nyc overtones. .. 2. revised www site with submission forms for each: book reviews product reviews documentation move site to amp backend. do we have volunteers? we could have a little competition on the logo. . .to imitate netbsd. . . thoughts? who wants to run this and organize the effort? g From jeffknight Sun Jan 25 15:31:37 2004 From: jeffknight (PUTAMARE) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:31:37 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <792B37FA-4F75-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> On Jan 25, 2004, at 3:13 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > do we have volunteers? I can help with the site design and getting it all xhtml/css/jafa compliant & shit. I worked on NYPHP.org, although for many reasons that site didn't end up that compliant with anything, it shouldn't be too hard to tow the line with nycbug since it hasn't had too much "feature creep" yet. Jeff Knight jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com 212/213-6558 x 203 LUSH media 110 W 40th St #1502 New York, NY 10018 From george Sun Jan 25 15:35:47 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:35:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <792B37FA-4F75-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: ->I can help with the site design and getting it all xhtml/css/jafa ->compliant & shit. I worked on NYPHP.org, although for many great. . .let's see who else wants to join in. . . ->reasons that ->site didn't end up that compliant with anything, it shouldn't be too ->hard to tow the line with nycbug since it hasn't had too much ->"feature ->creep" yet. maybe the site isn't compliant in anything since i did the site in fbsd openoffice and. . . .vi. . . i'm no www guy at all. thanks for jumping in jeff. g From george Sun Jan 25 15:45:15 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:45:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <20040125154211.0697e53d.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: great. . . ->-----Original Message----- ->From: michael [mailto:lists at genoverly.net] ->Sent: Sunday, January 25, 2004 3:42 PM ->To: george at sddi.net ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] www revision -> -> ->On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:13:05 -0500 ->"G. Rosamond" wrote: -> ->> okay. . .it's definitely time. . . ->> ->> 2. revised www site -> ->I'm in for web site stuff, if needed. ->-- -> From jeffknight Sun Jan 25 15:57:12 2004 From: jeffknight (PUTAMARE) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:57:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0C9C9B62-4F79-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> On Jan 25, 2004, at 3:13 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > 1. new logo > one that covers all the bsd family, including darwin & osx. our > current > one is just the fbsd beastie. and obviously nyc overtones. .. My advice here is to keep it simple. Abandon the expensive to print 4-color animal logos (a cockroach waving a gun with beastie tattooed on its arm anybody?) so popular with *NIX user groups as they'll only cause you grief in the long run. Although I constantly kid Hans about his choice of font (& color), I think the NYPHP logo does a pretty good job: immediately recognizable & cheap and easy to print. Jeff Knight jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com 212/213-6558 x 203 LUSH media 110 W 40th St #1502 New York, NY 10018 From george Sun Jan 25 16:07:17 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:07:17 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <0C9C9B62-4F79-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: ->My advice here is to keep it simple. Abandon the expensive to print ->4-color animal logos (a cockroach waving a gun with beastie ->tattooed on ->its arm anybody?) so popular with *NIX user groups as they'll only why? i would think a decent 4 color logo would work nice. . .when are we printing on a regular basis. . .? ->cause you grief in the long run. Although I constantly kid Hans about ->his choice of font (& color), I think the NYPHP logo does a ->pretty good ->job: immediately recognizable & cheap and easy to print. it's accepted on this list already that hans is design-incompetent, and i certainly fit in the same pool. but i agree simplicity for the site is key, but with the logo, i'd need some convincing. . .4color, funky could only help us in recognition. ..tshirts? sticks? etc. . . g From mspitze1 Sun Jan 25 16:26:14 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:26:14 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <0C9C9B62-4F79-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> References: <0C9C9B62-4F79-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: <20040125162614.736563f6.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 15:57:12 -0500 PUTAMARE wrote: > On Jan 25, 2004, at 3:13 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > > 1. new logo > > one that covers all the bsd family, including darwin & osx. our > > current > > one is just the fbsd beastie. and obviously nyc overtones. .. > > My advice here is to keep it simple. Abandon the expensive to print > 4-color animal logos (a cockroach waving a gun with beastie tattooed > on its arm anybody?) so popular with *NIX user groups as they'll only > cause you grief in the long run. Although I constantly kid Hans about > his choice of font (& color), I think the NYPHP logo does a pretty > good job: immediately recognizable & cheap and easy to print. How about a red apple with BSD, in black, stamped on it. For black and white just draw the outline of the apple and leave the BSD part on. You have cheap printing and 4 color version and its easy to remember. marc From ike Sun Jan 25 16:27:08 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:27:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <0C9C9B62-4F79-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> References: <0C9C9B62-4F79-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: <3AB234F0-4F7D-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 George, Jeff, All, While I agree in spirit with the NetBSD-like idea (and can immeadiately see all the various mascots hanging out on the same page- and have never seen that before...), I feel compelled to humbly echo Jeff's sentiment re. graphic simplicity. I'm going to put a shout in for graphic, as even the NetBSD folks are soon retiring their logo here- http://mail-index.netbsd.org/netbsd-advocacy/2004/01/14/0001.html VERY hard to maintain, though a lovable and awesome logo. - --- Here's what I want to offer in as positive alternative: I'd shoot for something very graphic and simple that can reproduce well at small sizes even, and do some hysterics with mascots' graphics ad-hock on the site as time goes on- (mascots hanging out on the subway, top of empire state building, etc...) Much fun can be had there I feel- but it's NO fun to have to get some flyer out the door and spend a few hours at copy-shop getting it to look right... Orgs that have various people who will need to use the logo for things over time, can do so without someone really managing it if it's kept simple enough. Makes me think of early Russian Constructivist Graphic Design, lots of clean lines, easy to mechanically reproduce. Magazines of that era like 'Novyi Lief' all kept consistency in graphic identity (really beautiful stuff), though they were run mostly by volunteers who would come and go... Much like the design of the BSD's themselves, good foundations lead to natural development based on understanding via osmosis... Clean graphic framework can be thought of as similar. My .04cents, for however the logo ends up, I'll proudly sport it- Rocket- .ike On Jan 25, 2004, at 3:57 PM, PUTAMARE wrote: > On Jan 25, 2004, at 3:13 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: >> 1. new logo >> one that covers all the bsd family, including darwin & osx. our >> current >> one is just the fbsd beastie. and obviously nyc overtones. .. > > My advice here is to keep it simple. Abandon the expensive to print > 4-color animal logos (a cockroach waving a gun with beastie tattooed > on its arm anybody?) so popular with *NIX user groups as they'll only > cause you grief in the long run. Although I constantly kid Hans about > his choice of font (& color), I think the NYPHP logo does a pretty > good job: immediately recognizable & cheap and easy to print. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin) iD8DBQFAFDSunsU/iA32NRARAhi0AJ9Rhzr6orREyvLafBBnTa1IBELujwCfbybW aUXKO5G7hRYi24ykLhq6gLk= =/AwO -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From george Sun Jan 25 16:30:01 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:30:01 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <20040125162614.736563f6.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: ->How about a red apple with BSD, in black, stamped on it. For ->black and white just draw the outline of the apple and leave ->the BSD part on. -> ->You have cheap printing and 4 color version and its easy to remember. don't know how well that particular design would work, but i like the approach. g From john Sun Jan 25 16:43:57 2004 From: john (John Bacalle) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:43:57 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] open source conference In-Reply-To: <4013A137.3137.39733F26@localhost> References: <4013A137.3137.39733F26@localhost> Message-ID: <20040125214357.GE1246@dancer> * Dan Langille [20040125 10:57]: > On 25 Jan 2004 at 1:50, Ray wrote: > > Define ``tomorrow.'' Your E-mail client says you sent it Friday, > > but my headers claim you sent it Saturday. > It was Saturday. *hehe* You meant to say: It'll take place yestarday, and don't be late! Seriously, I would've checked the headers for relay times, although that's not perfect, unless you know the timeliness of those times. UCE culling has a way of effing up, clogging stuff up for a day or more. John From ike Sun Jan 25 16:44:41 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:44:41 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 BTW- The cosntructivist comment- wasn't meant as a nod at all to the communists; but to early industrialism, as new types of printing presses and mechanical reproduction posed many of the same graphic challenges that the web currently does IMHO. It was a time of many leaping changes in process... Defined a strong aesthetic and voice based on changing and often new material constraints, in a rapidly accelerating world. On Jan 25, 2004, at 4:30 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > ->How about a red apple with BSD, in black, stamped on it. For > ->black and white just draw the outline of the apple and leave > ->the BSD part on. > -> > ->You have cheap printing and 4 color version and its easy to remember. 4-color can totally rock, so long as the logo holds it's essence when printed monochrome- IMHO > > don't know how well that particular design would work, but i like the > approach. > > g /me wants to see it!!! Rocket- .ike -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin) iD8DBQFAFDjLnsU/iA32NRARAleYAJ91XwoQNAzelyd4REPaTLabQG8TCgCeN5Ue Zr6EEk7qKfkSS9St0PQC2uM= =pm8O -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From lists Sun Jan 25 16:52:58 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:52:58 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <3AB234F0-4F7D-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> References: <0C9C9B62-4F79-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> <3AB234F0-4F7D-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <20040125165258.129ef400.lists@genoverly.net> On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:27:08 -0500 Isaac Levy wrote: > I'd shoot for something very graphic and simple that can reproduce > well at small sizes even, > Makes me think of early Russian Constructivist Graphic > Design, lots of clean lines, easy to mechanically reproduce. > Magazines of that era like 'Novyi Lief' all kept consistency in > graphic identity (really beautiful stuff), though they were run mostly > by volunteers who would come and go... Sounds like you might have something in mind, Ike... Bring it on! (graphic eye for the geek guy) Marc Spitzer's apple sounds clean but, at-a-glance may look like an exclusive Mac group. (not that there is anything wrong with that) Nothin' says bug in New York City like Jeff's cockroach. I like the idea of a little friendly competition. From jeffknight Sun Jan 25 16:54:28 2004 From: jeffknight (PUTAMARE) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 16:54:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision Message-ID: <0C62DC51-4F81-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> On Jan 25, 2004, at 4:07 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > why? i would think a decent 4 color logo would work nice. . .when are > we printing on a regular basis. . .? > > but i agree simplicity for the site is key, but with the logo, i'd need > some convincing. . .4color, funky could only help us in recognition. > ..tshirts? sticks? etc. . . Whatever your replication needs are, a one or two-color design is substantially cheaper than 4-color (CMYK). Post-its, pens, lanyards, t-shirts, any kind of swag you can think of, really, the cost of applying the ink is the limiting factor. As far as recognition goes, simpler is actually more recognizable than complicated. Look around you, and you'll see that most logos (except for open source groups) are made to look good in one color (sometimes two). If you have a single color logo, you can do a lot with it, if not you end up being stuck. Look at O'REILLY (a two-color logo), Verizon, IBM, Microsoft, Oracle, UPS. They do a lot while staying easy to print and aren't much more than type treatments. While I'm at it I'd also advise staying away from the "representational". It often makes things look cheesy, and again limits your options for future growth. No offense to the guy that suggested an apple, but what if NYLUG, NYPHP, and any other NYC based user group all independently decided to put LUG, PHP, etc. inside of apples and all showed up a LinuxWorld next year? As an aside, can we get the From of this list set to talk at lists.nycbug.org and not whomever posted? I just sent george at sddi.net this message. Jeff Knight jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com 212/213-6558 x 203 LUSH media 110 W 40th St #1502 New York, NY 10018 From jschauma Sun Jan 25 17:01:06 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:01:06 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] reply-munging (was: www revision) In-Reply-To: <0C62DC51-4F81-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> References: <0C62DC51-4F81-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: <20040125220106.GF15950@netmeister.org> PUTAMARE wrote: > As an aside, can we get the From of this list set to > talk at lists.nycbug.org and not whomever posted? I just sent > george at sddi.net this message. Please don't. Google for ``reply-to munging''. -Jan -- Tradition is the illusion of permanence. -- Woody Allen -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040125/62a011e8/attachment.bin From george Sun Jan 25 17:15:48 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:15:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] open source conference In-Reply-To: <20040125214357.GE1246@dancer> Message-ID: the issue was this. ..there were to many recipients, mailman held up as spam, and as the notifications were turned off (too many cooks in the kitchen), i just happened to catch it saturday. .. g ->*hehe* You meant to say: It'll take place yestarday, and ->don't be late! -> ->Seriously, I would've checked the headers for relay times, ->although that's not perfect, unless you know the timeliness ->of those times. UCE culling has a way of effing up, clogging ->stuff up for a day or more. From george Sun Jan 25 17:22:14 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:22:14 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <0C62DC51-4F81-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: ->As far as recognition goes, simpler is actually more ->and aren't much more than type treatments. *that's* convincing to me. . .in total agreement jeff. . .although what ike said about having a 4c logo that could print nicely b/w is also something to note. . . ->While I'm at it I'd also advise staying away from the ->"representational". It often makes things look cheesy, and ->again limits ->your options for future growth. No offense to the guy that ->suggested an ->apple, but what if NYLUG, NYPHP, and any other NYC based user ->group all ->independently decided to put LUG, PHP, etc. inside of apples and all ->showed up a LinuxWorld next year? well. .. those groups haven't. and we already started with that approach. i think that the apple issue is only important in relation to APPLE and our osx relations. . .stabbing it isn't a nice point. why don't people just start shooting out some markups? ->As an aside, can we get the From of this list set to ->talk at lists.nycbug.org and not whomever posted? I just sent ->george at sddi.net this message. didn't get a message from you about this. . .but i follow jan's comment. g From dan Sun Jan 25 17:30:42 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:30:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] reply-munging (was: www revision) In-Reply-To: <20040125220106.GF15950@netmeister.org> References: <0C62DC51-4F81-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: <4013FD42.19147.3ADAD26B@localhost> On 25 Jan 2004 at 17:01, Jan Schaumann wrote: > PUTAMARE wrote: > > > As an aside, can we get the From of this list set to > > talk at lists.nycbug.org and not whomever posted? I just sent > > george at sddi.net this message. > > Please don't. Google for ``reply-to munging''. I'll second what Jan said. Leave it as it. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From jeffknight Sun Jan 25 17:37:15 2004 From: jeffknight (PUTAMARE) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:37:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <06A5EB7F-4F87-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> On Jan 25, 2004, at 5:22 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > why don't people just start shooting out some markups? To get the ball rolling, I've posted a pdf with NYCBUG written out in a number of fonts from dorky to dull. http://www.putamare.net/nycbug.pdf Don't ask me which one (if any) is best, I've been doing this way too long and hate them all. Besides, there's no reason the design couldn't take a more "collaborative" approach than people just submitting suggestions. Note there's no reason NYC & BUG should be in the same font. NYC could be a formal "new york" looking font, and BUG could be a more casual "user group" look... Once the group has decided on a font, it wouldn't be that hard to add some graphic elements, and then you have a logo. Jeff Knight jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com 212/213-6558 x 203 LUSH media 110 W 40th St #1502 New York, NY 10018 From lists Sun Jan 25 17:59:49 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:59:49 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <06A5EB7F-4F87-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> References: <06A5EB7F-4F87-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: <20040125175949.67bd4d0e.lists@genoverly.net> On Sun, 25 Jan 2004 17:37:15 -0500 PUTAMARE wrote: > http://www.putamare.net/nycbug.pdf Good opener, Jeff.. > Note there's no reason NYC & BUG should be in the same font. On that same thought, could it be NYC-BSD (or BSD-NYC.. or stacked over each other), maybe with user group written below it. The acronym 'bug' doesn't really ring my bell. Is it wrong to say that? I think it is because I referenced the group members as nice-buggers once and ... From ike Sun Jan 25 18:01:35 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 18:01:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6CED680F-4F8A-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Word- On Jan 25, 2004, at 5:22 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > why don't people just start shooting out some markups? Crude shot at starting a dialouge: (there is no U train, I know). Font is Helvetica Neue, actual NYC transit typeface, though the type and general spacing could use some tweaking. Also points off for multiple colors, (hex values below), black and full-bleed SUCKS to work with in print- but here's for some visuals for the dialogue... If anyone wants the source to hack on email me and I'll send it to you (tried sending here, 200k too big for the list- which is sane). Rocket- .ike -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 0_1.gif Type: image/gif Size: 21429 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040125/b024a865/attachment.gif -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040125/b024a865/attachment.bin From ike Sun Jan 25 18:06:12 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 18:06:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <20040125175949.67bd4d0e.lists@genoverly.net> References: <06A5EB7F-4F87-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> <20040125175949.67bd4d0e.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <11C7E619-4F8B-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> On Jan 25, 2004, at 5:59 PM, michael wrote: > Good opener, Jeff.. Agreed! Cool to see the feel of it in so many typographic flavors- they all have very different sensibility, to say the least- > >> Note there's no reason NYC & BUG should be in the same font. /me chomping on all this... Rocket- .ike (ps- action-packed list here, gonna quit with the PGP sig) From lists Sun Jan 25 14:48:44 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 19:48:44 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: <4013FE73.1010809@nomadlogic.org> References: <20040124214445.P5810@zoraida.natserv.net> <4013A886.13728.398FCB83@localhost> <4013FE73.1010809@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20040125194807.X13956@zoraida.natserv.net> On Sun, 25 Jan 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > i've just tested it and things look good from here (nyc area). I got www.bsdcan.org, but bsdcan.org still doesn't show up with an IP for me. From jeffknight Sun Jan 25 20:04:55 2004 From: jeffknight (PUTAMARE) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 20:04:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: <6CED680F-4F8A-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> References: <6CED680F-4F8A-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: I think Isaac Levy's design would work great as a T-Shirt. I'd buy one. Remember, T-shirts don't have to be the logo, you can have all sorts of creative and interesting design promoting NYCBUG by starting with a very simple logo and extrapolating from it. By choosing a logo that only works on black, you're already painting yourself into a corner. I'd say choose one or two popular fonts, then add some simple graphic detail. I smacked out a couple sketches to show you what I'm talking about. In the examples below I just took the tail of beastie and ran it either way. What you want is something that has multiple interpretations, to evoke, not illustrate. The arrow could be just beasties tail, or an indication of the forward thinking of the group. http://www.putamare.net/nycbuglogo.gif Jeff Knight jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com 212/213-6558 x 203 LUSH media 110 W 40th St #1502 New York, NY 10018 From dan Sun Jan 25 21:33:45 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2004 21:33:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] bsdcan, can you get to it? In-Reply-To: <20040125194807.X13956@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <4013FE73.1010809@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <40143639.21086.3BB958BF@localhost> On 25 Jan 2004 at 19:48, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Sun, 25 Jan 2004, Pete Wright wrote: > > > i've just tested it and things look good from here (nyc area). > > I got www.bsdcan.org, but bsdcan.org still doesn't show up with an IP for > me. That's OK. bsdcan.org doesn't have an IP. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ From ike Mon Jan 26 00:22:23 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 00:22:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] www revision In-Reply-To: References: <6CED680F-4F8A-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <9F4DF63C-4FBF-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Yeah! On Jan 25, 2004, at 8:04 PM, PUTAMARE wrote: > I think Isaac Levy's design would work great as a T-Shirt. I'd buy > one. Remember, T-shirts don't have to be the logo, you can have all > sorts of creative and interesting design promoting NYCBUG by starting > with a very simple logo and extrapolating from it. Agreed- > > By choosing a logo that only works on black, you're already painting > yourself into a corner. Yeah. I completely agree- even the MTA doesn't use black cards- (white with navy MTA logo on their cards- look kindof um, like a city agency). > > I'd say choose one or two popular fonts, then add some simple graphic > detail. I smacked out a couple sketches to show you what I'm talking > about. In the examples below I just took the tail of beastie and ran > it either way. What you want is something that has multiple > interpretations, to evoke, not illustrate. The arrow could be just > beasties tail, or an indication of the forward thinking of the group. > http://www.putamare.net/nycbuglogo.gif Yeah- I dig the arrorw/tail - esp. in the top one- feels very classic nyc street something- We should all keep popping stuff to the list! Rocket- .ike From trish Mon Jan 26 10:17:54 2004 From: trish (Trish Lynch) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 10:17:54 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] reply-munging (was: www revision) In-Reply-To: <20040125220106.GF15950@netmeister.org> References: <0C62DC51-4F81-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> <20040125220106.GF15950@netmeister.org> Message-ID: <20040126101520.I37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> On Sun, 25 Jan 2004, Jan Schaumann wrote: > PUTAMARE wrote: > > > As an aside, can we get the From of this list set to > > talk at lists.nycbug.org and not whomever posted? I just sent > > george at sddi.net this message. > > Please don't. Google for ``reply-to munging''. > > -Jan > > -- > Tradition is the illusion of permanence. -- Woody Allen > Lets *not* get into this. This is a strictly religious argument on the level of vi vs. emacs. There are reasons to have reply-to: fields, and the reasons are especially when you want to direct all mail replied to list mail to the list. THis relies on your client not being broken, and not the headers. I'm not going to have this argument here, but there are valid reasons for it, and lets not start this stuff again. It happens on every list I've run or been on, and thats saying "over 200". -Trish (who writes damned mailing list manager software) -- Trish Lynch trish at bsdunix.net Ecartis Core Team trish at listmistress.org EFNet IRC Operator/SysAdmin @ irc.dkom.at AilleCat at EFNet Key fingerprint = 781D 2B47 AA4B FC88 B919 0CD6 26B2 1D62 6FC1 FF16 From dsolomon Mon Jan 26 12:54:53 2004 From: dsolomon (David Solomonoff) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 12:54:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings Message-ID: <20040126175453.GB2237@aloha.downstate.edu> A presentation on encrypted and steganographic filesystems for BSD would be good. This feature is especially important for people who are carrying data around on portable media. It is also an issue for any environment that is not completely physically secure. There is a privacy-enhanced version of Knoppix, http://www.bouissou.net/knoppix-mib/doc-html/Knoppix-Mib.html#english_version that has an encrypted filesystem as an option. This would be a great feature for a Knoppix-like BSD version/distro. -- David Solomonoff dsolomon at nycap.rr.com From george Mon Jan 26 13:53:24 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 13:53:24 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <20040126175453.GB2237@aloha.downstate.edu> Message-ID: ->A presentation on encrypted and steganographic filesystems ->for BSD would be good. This feature is especially important ->for people who are carrying data around on portable media. i know there was a recent article about this at http://www.bsdnews.org/03/cryptusb.php i think it's an awesome topic. ideas on speakers? ->There is a privacy-enhanced version of Knoppix, -> ->http://www.bouissou.net/knoppix-mib/doc-html/Knoppix-Mib.html# english_version that has an encrypted filesystem as an option. >This would be a great feature for a Knoppix-like BSD version/distro. agree. From scottro Mon Jan 26 14:33:49 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:33:49 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] reply-munging (was: www revision) In-Reply-To: <20040126101520.I37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> References: <0C62DC51-4F81-11D8-B347-000393B9FB36@mac.com> <20040125220106.GF15950@netmeister.org> <20040126101520.I37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> Message-ID: <20040126193349.GA2319@nyserve1.starlofashions.com> On Mon, Jan 26, 2004 at 10:17:54AM -0500, Trish Lynch wrote: > On Sun, 25 Jan 2004, Jan Schaumann wrote: > > > > As an aside, can we get the From of this list set to > > > talk at lists.nycbug.org and not whomever posted? I just sent > > > george at sddi.net this message. > > > > Please don't. Google for ``reply-to munging''. > > > > > > Lets *not* get into this. This is a strictly religious argument on the > level of vi vs. emacs. Agreed, a religious war. :) When the Gentoo lists went over to this, there was a great deal of debate about it, and it kept coming up. Therefore, (modest cough) I submitted a possible faq question and answer about it (very neutral in tone, simply explaining the reasons) that is now part of their faq and can be viewed at http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/faq.xml#doc_chap8_sect4 -- Scott GPG KeyID EB3467D6 ( 1B848 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 D575 EB34 67D6) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Ford: I wanna be like you...A vampire. Spike: I've known you for two minutes and I can't stand you. I don't really feature you living forever. Can I eat him now love? -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 187 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040126/321daff8/attachment.bin From george Mon Jan 26 14:35:53 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:35:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] reply-munging (was: www revision) In-Reply-To: <20040126193349.GA2319@nyserve1.starlofashions.com> Message-ID: sorry, but how can this be compared to a religious war? you know vi is *the* way to go. . . ;-) will read the faq. . . ->> Lets *not* get into this. This is a strictly religious ->argument on the ->> level of vi vs. emacs. ->Agreed, a religious war. :) ->When the Gentoo lists went over to this, there was a great ->reasons) that is now part of their faq and can be viewed at -> ->http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/faq.xml#doc_chap8_sect4 g From george Mon Jan 26 14:38:34 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:38:34 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] dn posting. . . Message-ID: fyi. . . http://daily.daemonnews.org/view_story.php3?story_id=4368 g From jschauma Mon Jan 26 14:58:22 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:58:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <20040126175453.GB2237@aloha.downstate.edu> References: <20040126175453.GB2237@aloha.downstate.edu> Message-ID: <20040126195822.GA5926@netmeister.org> David Solomonoff wrote: > A presentation on encrypted and steganographic filesystems > for BSD would be good. This feature is especially important > for people who are carrying data around on portable media. Yes, that would be a good topic. NetBSD has the Cryptographic Disk Driver (cgd), and the developer who wrote it happens to be a NYC local. Maybe we can entice him to give a presentation by promising him beer. http://www.netbsd.org/guide/en/chap-cgd.html I'm using cgd to encrypt my lapdog's home and swap, and it works quite nicely. -Jan -- Time is an illusion, lunchtime doubly so. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040126/95b2b7b7/attachment.bin From george Mon Jan 26 14:58:11 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:58:11 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <20040126195822.GA5926@netmeister.org> Message-ID: jan: that's great. . .tell him we'll even buy him two beers if it's good. sounds like a bootable bsd cd meeting should also be on the table. . . any leads on that? g ->Yes, that would be a good topic. NetBSD has the ->Cryptographic Disk Driver (cgd), and the developer who wrote ->it happens to be a NYC local. Maybe we can entice him to give ->a presentation by promising him beer. -> ->http://www.netbsd.org/guide/en/chap-cgd.html -> ->I'm using cgd to encrypt my lapdog's home and swap, and it ->works quite nicely. From lists Mon Jan 26 10:22:47 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 15:22:47 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040126152219.G21383@zoraida.natserv.net> Another simmilar topic. Tunneling and VPNs. From carlyle1789 Mon Jan 26 15:47:08 2004 From: carlyle1789 (Thomas Carlyle) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 12:47:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Newbie: Aironet 350 PCMCIA; How to join WEP network Message-ID: <20040126204708.27626.qmail@web41308.mail.yahoo.com> Hi guys, I'm running FreeBSD 4.9 and have a Cisco Aironet 350 pcmcia wireless card. My understanding is that this card is very well supported by the BSDs, but for the life of me I haven't been able to make it work. I've looked at the handbook and through the newsgroups and tried using both ifconfig and ancontrol. I can send commands to the card without a problem and it is recognized by the OS, etc. But even with the proper channel, ssid, and wep password set I get "no carrier". This is on a networks I can connect fine to using the airport card on my powerbook. Does anyone use this card and if so what commands do you issue to join a wep network? My understanding is that the card does not require an external antenna (I don't have one). Perhaps I need one? Thanks in advance, Michael __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From okan Mon Jan 26 16:16:40 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 16:15:40 -0501 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Newbie: Aironet 350 PCMCIA; How to join WEP network In-Reply-To: <20040126204708.27626.qmail@web41308.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040126204708.27626.qmail@web41308.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040126211602.GK3905@stravinsky.khaoz.org> On Mon 2004.01.26 at 12:47 -0800, Thomas Carlyle wrote: > > Hi guys, > > I'm running FreeBSD 4.9 and have a Cisco Aironet 350 > pcmcia wireless card. My understanding is that this > card is very well supported by the BSDs, but for the > life of me I haven't been able to make it work. > > I've looked at the handbook and through the newsgroups > and tried using both ifconfig and ancontrol. I can > send commands to the card without a problem and it is > recognized by the OS, etc. But even with the proper > channel, ssid, and wep password set I get "no > carrier". This is on a networks I can connect fine to > using the airport card on my powerbook. > > Does anyone use this card and if so what commands do > you issue to join a wep network? how are you setting wep? make sure you prepend with "0x" if you are inputing the key in hex. > My understanding is that the card does not require an > external antenna (I don't have one). Perhaps I need > one? shouldn't need one. okan -- From klimenta Mon Jan 26 16:34:45 2004 From: klimenta (Kliment Andreev) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 16:34:45 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Newbie: Aironet 350 PCMCIA; How to join WEP network References: <20040126204708.27626.qmail@web41308.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001401c3e454$39857820$f2234a0a@USWD275PG01> > Does anyone use this card and if so what commands do > you issue to join a wep network? I was running this card on my old laptop. As far as I remember, I was using an0 driver. Can you send me the output of /var/log/messages and give me the output of "ifconfig". What's in your conf file for the card (key, passphrase, etc...). I remember getting some weird messages on the console (like expected 300 got 250 or something) but besides that it was working perfect. From mspitze1 Mon Jan 26 17:01:55 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 17:01:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: References: <20040126195822.GA5926@netmeister.org> Message-ID: <20040126170155.775010ad.mspitze1@optonline.net> Another good one would be 'large plant' issues, why bsd is good for people who manage lots of computers marc From carlyle1789 Mon Jan 26 19:05:17 2004 From: carlyle1789 (Michael Morefield) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 16:05:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Newbie: Aironet 350 PCMCIA; How to join WEP network Message-ID: <20040127000517.37728.qmail@web41306.mail.yahoo.com> ---On Jan 26, 2004, at 4:34 PM, Kliment Andreev wrote:--- I was running this card on my old laptop. As far as I remember, I was using an0 driver. Can you send me the output of /var/log/messages and give me the output of "ifconfig". What's in your conf file for the card (key, passphrase, etc...). I remember getting some weird messages on the console (like expected 300 got 250 or something) but besides that it was working perfect. ---------------------------------------------------------- Ok, thanks. By the way, this machine is a Toshiba Portege 7010CT. I don't have any conf file for the card -- just trying to get it up using the command line. Here is the info you requested: Immediately after boot, running "ifconfig" yields: lp0: flags=8810 mtu 1500 lo0: flags=8049 mtu 16384 inet6 ::1 prefixlen 128 inet6 fe80::1%lo0 prefixlen 64 scopeid 0x2 inet 127.0.0.1 netmask 0xff000000 pp0: flags=8010 mtu 1500 sl0: flags=c010 mtu 552 faith0: flags=8002 mtu 1500 an0: flags=8843 mtu 1500 inet6 fe80:20d:29ff:fe3a:64f1%an0 prefixlen64 scopeid 0x6 inet 0.0.0.0 netmask 0xff000000 broadcast 255.255.255.255 ether 00:0d:29:3a:64:f1 media: IEEE 802.11 Wireless Ethernet autoselect (DS/11Mbps) status: no carrier ssid: " " stationname FreeBSD channel 6 authmode OPEN powersavemode OFF powersavesleep 200 wepmode OFF weptxkey 1 wepkey 1:128-bit Relevant portions of "dmesg" (Sorry, I'm retyping this by hand, so am not including the whole thing -- hope that is OK.): FreeBSD 4.9-RELEASE #3 [...] pci_cfgintr_unique: hard-routed to irq 11 pci_cfginter: 0:11 INTA routed to irq 11 pcic0: irq 11 at device 11.0 on pci0 pcic0: PCI Memory allocated: 0x88000000 pccard1: on pcic0 pci_cfgintr_linked: linked (61) to hard-routed irq 11 pci_cfgintr: 0:11 INTB routed to irq 11 pcic1: irq 11 at device 11.1 on pci0 pcic1: PCI Memory allocated: 0x88001000 pccard1: on pcic1 [...] pccard: card inserted, slot 1 pccard: card removed, slot 1 pccard: card inserted, slot 1 an0: at port 0x240-0x27f irq 11 slot 1 on pccard1 an0: got RSSI <-> dBM map an0: Ethernet address: 00:0d:29:3a:64:f1 The contents of /var/log/messages is similar to the dmesg. Here are to parts that don't seem to be in the dmesg results: Jan 26 17:23:27 SPARROW PCCARDD[58]: CARD "CISCO SYSTEMS" ("350 Series Wireless LAN Adapter") [[none]] [[none]] matched "Cisco Systems" ("350 Series Wireless LAN Adapter") [[null]] [[null]] [...] Jan 26 17:23:59 sparrow login: ROOT LOGIN (root) ON ttyv0 Jan 26 17:24:44 sparrow pccardd[58]: pccardd started Then I run: ancontrol -a 00:50:18:05:1A:40 [the access point as displayed by my mac with airport card] ancontrol -K 2 ancontrol -W 1 ancontrol -e 0 ancontrol -n [Name] The password is in the chip, channel is already set to channel 6, which is correct. "ifconfig an0" results in: an0: flags=8843 mtu 1500 inet6 fe80:20d:29ff:fe3a:64f1%an0 prefixlen64 scopeid 0x6 inet 0.0.0.0 netmask 0xff000000 broadcast 255.255.255.255 ether 00:0d:29:3a:64:f1 media: IEEE 802.11 Wireless Ethernet autoselect (DS/11Mbps) status: no carrier ssid: "[Name]" stationname FreeBSD channel 6 authmode SHARED powersavemode OFF powersavesleep 200 wepmode ON weptxkey 1 wepkey 1:128-bit "ping nycbug.org" results in: ping: cannot resolve nycbug.org: Host name lookup failure /var/log/messges now includes the following lines at the end: Jan 26 18:13:53 sparrow dhclient: send_packet: No buffer space available Jan 26 18:17:23 sparrow dhclient: send_packet: No buffer space available Jan 26 18:18:05 sparrow last message repeated 4 times Jan 26 18:28:53 sparrow last message repeated 11 times Jan 26 18:39:14 sparrow last message repeated 7 times Jan 26 18:47:42 sparrow last message repeated 9 times Best, Michael __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From okan Mon Jan 26 19:27:47 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 19:26:47 -0501 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Newbie: Aironet 350 PCMCIA; How to join WEP network In-Reply-To: <20040127000517.37728.qmail@web41306.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20040127000517.37728.qmail@web41306.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20040127002709.GN3905@stravinsky.khaoz.org> On Mon 2004.01.26 at 16:05 -0800, Michael Morefield wrote: [snip] > FreeBSD 4.9-RELEASE #3 [snip] > an0: flags=8843 mtu 1500 > inet6 fe80:20d:29ff:fe3a:64f1%an0 prefixlen64 scopeid 0x6 > inet 0.0.0.0 netmask 0xff000000 broadcast 255.255.255.255 > ether 00:0d:29:3a:64:f1 > media: IEEE 802.11 Wireless Ethernet autoselect (DS/11Mbps) > status: no carrier > ssid: "[Name]" > stationname FreeBSD > channel 6 authmode SHARED powersavemode OFF powersavesleep 200 > wepmode ON weptxkey 1 > wepkey 1:128-bit > > "ping nycbug.org" results in: > ping: cannot resolve nycbug.org: Host name lookup failure > > /var/log/messges now includes the following lines at the end: > > Jan 26 18:13:53 sparrow dhclient: send_packet: No buffer space available > Jan 26 18:17:23 sparrow dhclient: send_packet: No buffer space available > Jan 26 18:18:05 sparrow last message repeated 4 times > Jan 26 18:28:53 sparrow last message repeated 11 times > Jan 26 18:39:14 sparrow last message repeated 7 times > Jan 26 18:47:42 sparrow last message repeated 9 times netstat -m ? are you running anything else (pf/ipf)? also, try not starting dhclient until after you config your an(4). i don't use freebsd, so i won't guess too much, but check the mbufs. okan -- From george Mon Jan 26 19:44:32 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 19:44:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] centrino on /. Message-ID: from slashdot. . . http://developers.slashdot.org/developers/04/01/26/1148256.shtml?tid=118 &tid=137&tid=187&tid=193 From mspitze1 Mon Jan 26 20:08:58 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 20:08:58 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] basic freebsd install doc Message-ID: <20040126200858.2e017c41.mspitze1@optonline.net> While surfing the net I found this, there is some additional material but it is a good walk through of basic OS install on freebsd, lots of pictures. Take a look: http://sguil.sourceforge.net/downloads/sguil_0-3-0_on_freebsd_4-9-REL.pdf marc From george Mon Jan 26 20:28:26 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 20:28:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] basic freebsd install doc In-Reply-To: <20040126200858.2e017c41.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: i think it's a great document. . . not much different than annelise's book, but a bit more current. it's amazing, people say fbsd installs are difficult, but if you just understand two or three options that might be confusing for someone who's completely new to unix, it's very simple. some people are just turned off by the text/gui approach, as opposed to the full gui (w32, some linux) or pure text (obsd) g -> ->While surfing the net I found this, there is some additional ->material but it is a good walk through of basic OS install on ->freebsd, lots of pictures. Take a look: ->http://sguil.sourceforge.net/downloads/sguil_0-3-0_on_freebsd_ 4-9-REL.pdf marc _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From ike Mon Jan 26 20:28:57 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 20:28:57 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <20040126170155.775010ad.mspitze1@optonline.net> References: <20040126195822.GA5926@netmeister.org> <20040126170155.775010ad.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: <2D6B4B12-5068-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> I'd cheer the 'large plant' topic- and also, can add that I could 'sing backup vocals', from the perspective of my small hosting company, where we manage lots of computers- (less about hardware, more about jailing though). In a nutshell, we like to be able to sleep, hence, BSD. Rocket- .ike On Jan 26, 2004, at 5:01 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > Another good one would be 'large plant' issues, why bsd is good > for people who manage lots of computers > > marc From george Mon Jan 26 20:31:51 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 20:31:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <2D6B4B12-5068-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: ditto. . . there's a number of people in nycbug who are focused on individual servers or desktops, and that's great. but the true strength of bsd is in the 'plant' environment. think of yahoo, or the backrooms of large investment banking firms: it's these places where cvsup, stability, etc, really shine. marc, did you have someone in mind for this talk? could we pull someone from yahoo!??? i can talk to bsdmall about this. . . g ->I'd cheer the 'large plant' topic- and also, can add that I ->could 'sing ->backup vocals', from the perspective of my small hosting ->company, where ->we manage lots of computers- (less about hardware, more about jailing ->though). -> ->In a nutshell, we like to be able to sleep, hence, BSD. -> ->Rocket- ->.ike -> ->On Jan 26, 2004, at 5:01 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: -> ->> Another good one would be 'large plant' issues, why bsd is good for ->> people who manage lots of computers ->> ->> marc -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From lists Mon Jan 26 15:37:11 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 20:37:11 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] My posts In-Reply-To: <2D6B4B12-5068-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> References: <20040126195822.GA5926@netmeister.org> <20040126170155.775010ad.mspitze1@optonline.net> <2D6B4B12-5068-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <20040126203613.H68691@zoraida.natserv.net> Are posts to the list taking longer than usual? ... or perhaps a problem with my system. Just saw a whole lot of posts I did a few days ago. I think even from different days. From lists Mon Jan 26 15:41:34 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 20:41:34 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] My posts In-Reply-To: <20040126203613.H68691@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20040126195822.GA5926@netmeister.org> <20040126170155.775010ad.mspitze1@optonline.net> <2D6B4B12-5068-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> <20040126203613.H68691@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <20040126204014.R68716@zoraida.natserv.net> On Mon, 26 Jan 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: > Are posts to the list taking longer than usual? > ... or perhaps a problem with my system. Just saw a whole lot of posts I > did a few days ago. I think even from different days. Tried to look at the headers, but don't see anything strange, yet several posts I sent at a couple of different days all just appeared in my mailbox.. Anyone else having any simmilar issues? From ike Mon Jan 26 21:15:38 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 21:15:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] My posts In-Reply-To: <20040126204014.R68716@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20040126195822.GA5926@netmeister.org> <20040126170155.775010ad.mspitze1@optonline.net> <2D6B4B12-5068-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> <20040126203613.H68691@zoraida.natserv.net> <20040126204014.R68716@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: Nope, I believe getting posts almost as fast as it's been posted- Rocket- :( .ike On Jan 26, 2004, at 3:41 PM, Francisco Reyes wrote: > On Mon, 26 Jan 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: > >> Are posts to the list taking longer than usual? >> ... or perhaps a problem with my system. Just saw a whole lot of >> posts I >> did a few days ago. I think even from different days. > > > Tried to look at the headers, but don't see anything strange, yet > several > posts I sent at a couple of different days all just appeared in my > mailbox.. Anyone else having any simmilar issues? > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > From ike Mon Jan 26 21:23:03 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 21:23:03 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] basic freebsd install doc In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Jan 26, 2004, at 8:28 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > some people are just turned off by the text/gui approach, as opposed to > the full gui (w32, some linux) or pure text (obsd) Personally, I think it's pretty sexy, very distinctive middlespace, never even thought of it as weird really. I've seen some tools that use similar text/window approaches at the shell, and think it can be great if it's used for something which is to be a focused, self-contained task. (i.e. if my cellphone UI folks would implement something similar for various features, instead of the mixed text/pictograph appstuuff, they may be actually functional IMHO...) .ike From mspitze1 Mon Jan 26 21:25:01 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 21:25:01 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: References: <2D6B4B12-5068-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <20040126212501.2df4ece8.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Mon, 26 Jan 2004 20:31:51 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > ditto. . . > > there's a number of people in nycbug who are focused on individual > servers or desktops, and that's great. > > but the true strength of bsd is in the 'plant' environment. > > think of yahoo, or the backrooms of large investment banking firms: > it's these places where cvsup, stability, etc, really shine. > > marc, did you have someone in mind for this talk? could we pull > someone from yahoo!??? I know no one at yahoo. But with that said I could do a bit on how trivial it is to build a scripted build tool/environment and how to use the tools available to set up a custom local package server. I could even write a gui configuration manager to drive the process. All the tools are there, mostly. And since we meet early in the month I could do it for April, possibly March. marc ps Could we please stop top posting as it makes it hard to follow the thread. From jeffknight Mon Jan 26 21:58:28 2004 From: jeffknight (PUTAMARE) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 21:58:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Things to do while compiling a kernel: Message-ID: Curved lines are more interesting than straight, and who doesn't feel the patriotic thrill of red, white and blue.... -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: nycbugRB.gif Type: image/gif Size: 4260 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040126/5293917d/attachment.gif -------------- next part -------------- Jeff Knight jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com 212/213-6558 x 203 LUSH media 110 W 40th St #1502 New York, NY 10018 From george Mon Jan 26 22:02:54 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 22:02:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Things to do while compiling a kernel: In-Reply-To: Message-ID: i like it. . .how about red and black. . .for the daemonic thrill? g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of PUTAMARE ->Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 9:58 PM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] Things to do while compiling a kernel: -> -> ->Curved lines are more interesting than straight, and who doesn't feel ->the patriotic thrill of red, white and blue.... -> -> From ike Mon Jan 26 22:04:17 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 22:04:17 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] reply-munging (was: www revision) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7EB3F93D-5075-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> On Jan 26, 2004, at 2:35 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > you know vi is *the* way to go. . . /me chucks empty sake ceraffe across Brooklyn at G's head, with a rude ascii-art hand-gesture stuffed inside, written using pico (just because) ;) -- On a more constructive note, this is a link to that nifty Rendezvous/Zero-Conf enabled text editor for OSX that I beleive I mentioned to some of the crew the other day... http://www.codingmonkeys.de/subethaedit/ It's pretty nifty- haven't really used it hardcore with others though... but makes an excellent minimal gui editor by itself. Rocket- .ike From kim Tue Jan 27 11:09:12 2004 From: kim (Kim) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:09:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Things to do while compiling a kernel: In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1075219751.52989.6.camel@localhost> Very nice Jeff, But I am not crazy about the colors either On Mon, 2004-01-26 at 21:58, PUTAMARE wrote: > Curved lines are more interesting than straight, and who doesn't feel > the patriotic thrill of red, white and blue.... > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Jeff Knight > jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com > 212/213-6558 x 203 > LUSH media > 110 W 40th St #1502 > New York, NY 10018 > > ______________________________________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From ike Mon Jan 26 22:16:25 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 22:16:25 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Things to do while compiling a kernel: In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <30DC9140-5077-11D8-A3D2-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> On Jan 26, 2004, at 9:58 PM, PUTAMARE wrote: > Curved lines are more interesting than straight, and who doesn't feel > the patriotic thrill of red, white and blue.... > > > Dude- this thing is SWEET. Really holds it's form well here- I'd be proud to wear that logo on a baseball cap any day... slick, but not hokey, clean but not generic- Re. Black vs. Blue vs. etc... I'd make a move to leave color somewhat open, since the graphic form of this thing is so strong? It could change colors in different contexts and totally hold it's form- Perhaps always keeping the BUG part red? I'm just blabbing here- ideas anyone? I totally love this one- Jeff, you rock for putting energy into this! Rocket- .ike From jschauma Mon Jan 26 22:21:35 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 22:21:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Things to do while compiling a kernel: In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040127032135.GD24208@netmeister.org> PUTAMARE wrote: > Curved lines are more interesting than straight Indeed. > and who doesn't feel the patriotic thrill of red, white and blue.... Ugh, I don't. At all. -Jan -- Of course it runs NetBSD! http://www.netbsd.org -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040126/5889b956/attachment.bin From jeffknight Mon Jan 26 22:47:50 2004 From: jeffknight (PUTAMARE) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 22:47:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] still a ways from done Message-ID: <942BEC90-507B-11D8-979C-000393B9FB36@mac.com> These things are best left mulled over, but I think I'm on to something. I'm still not satisfied with the U & G (the B worked so well with the tail though), and am probably going to have to use another font. I also think I went a little cram crazy on this revision. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: nycbug.gif Type: image/gif Size: 4096 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040126/fe71a697/attachment.gif -------------- next part -------------- Its going to be a little hard to reproduce in ASCII-art though... Jeff Knight jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com 212/213-6558 x 203 LUSH media 110 W 40th St #1502 New York, NY 10018 From ray Mon Jan 26 23:00:53 2004 From: ray (Ray) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:00:53 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] still a ways from done In-Reply-To: <942BEC90-507B-11D8-979C-000393B9FB36@mac.com> References: <942BEC90-507B-11D8-979C-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: <20040127040053.GB29828@cybertron.cyth.net> This one looks much better than the one with the USA colors. From ike Mon Jan 26 23:03:50 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:03:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] still a ways from done In-Reply-To: <942BEC90-507B-11D8-979C-000393B9FB36@mac.com> References: <942BEC90-507B-11D8-979C-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: On Jan 26, 2004, at 10:47 PM, PUTAMARE wrote: > These things are best left mulled over, but I think I'm on to > something. I'm still not satisfied with the U & G (the B worked so > well with the tail though), and am probably going to have to use > another font. I also think I went a little cram crazy on this > revision. Yeah- feels a bit choked in the U and G- but I like the tightening up a bit. The tail/arrow in the first one though, the curve it made at longer width, really like that personally... It's all subjective though, and these both look pretty great- > > > > Its going to be a little hard to reproduce in ASCII-art though... :) Rocket- .ike From george Mon Jan 26 23:15:49 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:15:49 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] still a ways from done In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ->Yeah- feels a bit choked in the U and G- but I like the ->tightening up ->a bit. ditto ->The tail/arrow in the first one though, the curve it made at longer ->width, really like that personally... It's all subjective ->though, and ->these both look pretty great- ditto ->> Its going to be a little hard to reproduce in ASCII-art though... i'm working on it. . .but it's not looking too good. . . and no arrow, of course. From george Mon Jan 26 23:27:00 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:27:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] My posts In-Reply-To: <20040126204014.R68716@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: your posts may have been held up since you didn't use the address you subscribed with, then i allowed them when they were stuck in the queue. ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Francisco Reyes ->Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 3:42 PM ->To: NYC Bug List ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] My posts -> -> ->On Mon, 26 Jan 2004, Francisco Reyes wrote: -> ->> Are posts to the list taking longer than usual? ->> ... or perhaps a problem with my system. Just saw a whole ->lot of posts ->> I did a few days ago. I think even from different days. -> -> ->Tried to look at the headers, but don't see anything strange, ->yet several posts I sent at a couple of different days all ->just appeared in my mailbox.. Anyone else having any simmilar ->issues? _______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From john Tue Jan 27 01:15:58 2004 From: john (John Bacalle) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 01:15:58 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? In-Reply-To: <20040125093904.6212866e.lists@genoverly.net> References: <20040125093904.6212866e.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <20040127061558.GB473@dancer> * michael [20040125 09:39]: > LinuxTag > http://www.linuxtag.org/ The pages are in German, there's an ongoing effort to translate into English throughout the month of January. Relatedly, Nils informed me the problem is not translators, but, the backend infrastructure to make internationalization happen right. John From ike Tue Jan 27 05:58:51 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 05:58:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? In-Reply-To: <20040127061558.GB473@dancer> References: <20040125093904.6212866e.lists@genoverly.net> <20040127061558.GB473@dancer> Message-ID: On Jan 27, 2004, at 1:15 AM, John Bacalle wrote: > Relatedly, Nils informed me the problem is not translators, but, the > backend infrastructure to make internationalization happen right. What are they doing backend? Rocket- .ike From john Tue Jan 27 06:26:43 2004 From: john (John Bacalle) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 06:26:43 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? In-Reply-To: References: <20040125093904.6212866e.lists@genoverly.net> <20040127061558.GB473@dancer> Message-ID: <20040127112643.GH473@dancer> * Isaac Levy [20040127 05:58]: > On Jan 27, 2004, at 1:15 AM, John Bacalle wrote: > > >Relatedly, Nils informed me the problem is not translators, but, the > >backend infrastructure to make internationalization happen right. > > What are they doing backend? The problem is the backend applications, technologies that LinuxTag has available to it. To wit, they "are given infrastrure, packages, applications, etc. by people, that they find leading edge, or newest," Nils told me. "Not what is best for us. Unfortunately." So if anyone here is clued in to inter'n, and/or has hardware resources LinuxTag folks could use it. John From lists Tue Jan 27 07:00:28 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 07:00:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] still a ways from done In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040127070028.2a08b780.lists@genoverly.net> At the risk of being blasphemous, I'm going to open my mouth. I really like the work that Jeff has done but... do you think it might be a little too 'daemonic'. Granted we ALL understand the mascot -- and the history that goes back to very early users manuals (4.3?), but, imagine seeing that for the first time. As someone said about other art.. this would be a cool t-shirt. I'll admit, it is a subtle and creative use of a very over-used theme, but does it fit what we were hoping to evoke? Michael From trish Tue Jan 27 07:32:08 2004 From: trish (Trish Lynch) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 07:32:08 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] I've arrived redux... Message-ID: <20040127072220.S37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> So George wanted me to introduce myself a bit.... I'm Trish (aka Pat), and I'm a geek (no duh, but had to go with the AA approach) But seriously... I started the original BSD users group here in NYC, a few years ago, which was more of a social group, we did dinners and such, and somewhere I still have pictues of when we entertained two out of town committers who came from Europe. The users group sorta fell apart when I mvoed out of town, this one has quite a bit more momentum. I am also on the core team for an open source mailing list manager called Ecartis (formerly Listar) which is a LISTSERV-a-like. And I've been involved on and off in FreeBSD development, maintain a few ports, and for a while was one of the biggest international advocates. I worked for VA Linux and wrote for Slashdot (under the names BSD-Pat and AilleCat), as well as putting two FreeBSD firewalls right in front of OSDN's network (hence in front of Slashjdot/Freshmeat/Thinkgeek/Newsforge). Lately I just don;t have as much time, as I'm very active in several non-computing communities, doing activism in those communities, have a 15 month old son, etc. etc. etc. I currently work for a department/division of Walt Disney Internet Group that uses FreeBSD extensively, and is actively migrating to FreeBSD 5.x from Linux. I'm more here in a possible advisory capacity, I don;t have enough time or energy to devote immense amounts of time, but G. has things well in hands with everyone else :) I can speak about my experiences with *BSD (Free/Net/Open) in commercial and academic environments, or talk about what it was like to do some major advocacy, as well as maybe do some work here and there, and even do something like a FreeBSD "Munch" type thing, where we do dinner and talk and drink and have a good time, outside the formal meetings. -Trish -- Trish Lynch trish at bsdunix.net Ecartis Core Team trish at listmistress.org EFNet IRC Operator/SysAdmin @ irc.dkom.at AilleCat at EFNet Key fingerprint = 781D 2B47 AA4B FC88 B919 0CD6 26B2 1D62 6FC1 FF16 From hans Tue Jan 27 08:46:30 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 05:46:30 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B187@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > > >Relatedly, Nils informed me the problem is not translators, but, the > > >backend infrastructure to make internationalization happen right. > > > > What are they doing backend? > > The problem is the backend applications, technologies that > LinuxTag has > available to it. To wit, they "are given infrastrure, packages, > applications, etc. by people, that they find leading edge, or newest," > Nils told me. "Not what is best for us. Unfortunately." > > So if anyone here is clued in to inter'n, and/or has hardware > resources LinuxTag folks could use it. I have server resources here in the states if needed. This offer also extends to any other group on this list. Hans - New York PHP From john Tue Jan 27 09:04:48 2004 From: john (John Bacalle) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 09:04:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B187@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B187@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <20040127140447.GE5792@dancer> * Hans Zaunere [20040127 05:46]: > I have server resources here in the states if needed. I got the gist it's not as simple as that. But I'll contact Nils and inform him of your kind offer, Hans. John -- John Bacalle Pride is an abomination. One must forgo the self to attain total spiritual creaminess, and avoid the chewy chunks of degradation. --A. Ventura From danielk Tue Jan 27 10:16:13 2004 From: danielk (Daniel Krook) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:16:13 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] still a ways from done In-Reply-To: <942BEC90-507B-11D8-979C-000393B9FB36@mac.com> Message-ID: I dig it, tail and all. Daniel Krook, Application Developer, Production Services, ibm.com 1133 Westchester Avenue, White Plains, NY 10604 Tel: (914) 642-4474, Tieline 224-4474 danielk at us.ibm.com Personal: http://info.krook.org/ Persona: http://w3.ibm.com/persona/users/9/0/x/90MC212-P.html From paul Tue Jan 27 10:41:11 2004 From: paul (Paul Dlug) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:41:11 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3BDFADC2-50DF-11D8-A68C-000393BB3E22@aps.org> I'm not sure how large of a "plant" you're looking for. Our organization, American Physical Society, utilizes FreeBSD extensively. We manage around 20 BSD servers and another 20 solaris hosts. Except for the Oracle database and some legacy applications which rely on Solaris we are moving everything remaining on Sun to FreeBSD servers (but if Oracle ran on BSD.....). We also support a large Mac OS X desktop deployment with management tools, LDAP servers and NFS shares from FreeBSD servers. My colleague Mark Pheffer and I were at the meeting the other night and would be happy to speak about the advantages and challenges of running a mid-sized FreeBSD server deployment along with some notes about migrating from Solaris and the tools/scripts we use for this. --Paul On Jan 26, 2004, at 8:31 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > > ditto. . . > > there's a number of people in nycbug who are focused on individual > servers or desktops, and that's great. > > but the true strength of bsd is in the 'plant' environment. > > think of yahoo, or the backrooms of large investment banking firms: > it's > these places where cvsup, stability, etc, really shine. > > marc, did you have someone in mind for this talk? could we pull > someone > from yahoo!??? > > i can talk to bsdmall about this. . . > > g > > ->I'd cheer the 'large plant' topic- and also, can add that I > ->could 'sing > ->backup vocals', from the perspective of my small hosting > ->company, where > ->we manage lots of computers- (less about hardware, more about jailing > ->though). > -> > ->In a nutshell, we like to be able to sleep, hence, BSD. > -> > ->Rocket- > ->.ike > -> > ->On Jan 26, 2004, at 5:01 PM, Marc Spitzer wrote: > -> > ->> Another good one would be 'large plant' issues, why bsd is good for > ->> people who manage lots of computers > ->> > ->> marc > -> > ->_______________________________________________ > ->talk mailing list > ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > -> > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From george Tue Jan 27 10:46:07 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:46:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: it's like american always need special efforts from the rest of the f'g world. it's like you're in country X, and they speak X language, and go, wait, those fools b/w the atlantic and pacific have special needs. . . g ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Isaac Levy ->Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2004 5:59 AM ->To: John Bacalle ->Cc: NYC Bug List ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] nyc technology conference? -> -> ->On Jan 27, 2004, at 1:15 AM, John Bacalle wrote: -> ->> Relatedly, Nils informed me the problem is not translators, ->but, the ->> backend infrastructure to make internationalization happen right. -> ->What are they doing backend? -> ->Rocket- ->.ike -> ->_______________________________________________ ->talk mailing list ->talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -> From george Tue Jan 27 10:48:06 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:48:06 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] still a ways from done In-Reply-To: <20040127070028.2a08b780.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: ->At the risk of being blasphemous, I'm going to open my mouth. ->I really like the work that Jeff has done but... do you think ->it might be a little too 'daemonic'. Granted we ALL ->understand the mascot -- and the history that goes back to ->very early users manuals (4.3?), but, imagine seeing that for ->the first time. As someone said about other art.. this would ->be a cool t-shirt. see you're point, and you're right in many ways.. .but. . .you're being blashphemous ->I'll admit, it is a subtle and creative use of a very ->over-used theme, but does it fit what we were hoping to ->evoke? Michael yes. . .we want to piss off jerry falwell. g From lists Tue Jan 27 10:56:59 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:56:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <3BDFADC2-50DF-11D8-A68C-000393BB3E22@aps.org> References: <3BDFADC2-50DF-11D8-A68C-000393BB3E22@aps.org> Message-ID: <20040127105659.76c91c55.lists@genoverly.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:41:11 -0500 Paul Dlug wrote: > > My colleague Mark Pheffer and I were at the meeting the > other night and would be happy to speak about the > advantages and challenges of running a mid-sized FreeBSD > server deployment along with some notes about migrating > from Solaris and the tools/scripts we use for this. > > --Paul > .. migrating from Solaris.. I'd really like to chat with y'all Michael From joshmccormack Tue Jan 27 11:14:00 2004 From: joshmccormack (joshmccormack at travelersdiary.com) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:14:00 -0600 (CST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <20040127105659.76c91c55.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: A dispassionate comparison of Linux (Debian & Gentoo are particularly of interest to me) and FreeBSD (others also if desired). Just some ideas on how you do things in *BSD that you do in Linux, where each shine, etc. Josh From george Tue Jan 27 11:42:35 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:42:35 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: Greetings from Apple - LinuxWorld In-Reply-To: Message-ID: greetings Leslie. we are very interested in having a meeting about OSX and its relation to BSD. as you can tell from our fliers, www site, etc, we consider OSX and Darwin to be a basic part of the BSD community. at this point, we aren't looking to have any marketing/sales type meetings. what can Apple offer us in terms of speakers on technical issues? george Hello NYCBugs! The local Apple NYC Enterprise team would like to join you at an upcoming meeting and discuss our advantages with Mac OS X and our server and storage strategies. Let us know if you would be interested! We are looking for new customers! Regards, Leslie Leslie M. Schwartz Apple Computer Sales Animal 917 885 9540 leslies at Apple.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040127/bdab2601/attachment.html From paul Tue Jan 27 11:48:24 2004 From: paul (Paul Dlug) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:48:24 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <20040127105659.76c91c55.lists@genoverly.net> References: <3BDFADC2-50DF-11D8-A68C-000393BB3E22@aps.org> <20040127105659.76c91c55.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <9FAC998C-50E8-11D8-A68C-000393BB3E22@aps.org> If I can help at all please feel free to contact me. --Paul On Jan 27, 2004, at 10:56 AM, michael wrote: > On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:41:11 -0500 > Paul Dlug wrote: >> >> My colleague Mark Pheffer and I were at the meeting the >> other night and would be happy to speak about the >> advantages and challenges of running a mid-sized FreeBSD >> server deployment along with some notes about migrating >> from Solaris and the tools/scripts we use for this. >> >> --Paul >> > > .. migrating from Solaris.. > I'd really like to chat with y'all > Michael > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From dan Tue Jan 27 11:55:27 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:55:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: Greetings from Apple - LinuxWorld In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <401651AF.21990.609AD32@localhost> On 27 Jan 2004 at 11:42, G. Rosamond wrote: > greetings Leslie. Anyone replying to the above message: please be very discreet and careful with what you say and to whom. It wouldn't help to go flaming off in some direction and have that CC'd to Apple... -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ The first North America BSD Conference outside California: BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From wes Tue Jan 27 13:13:05 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:13:05 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists Message-ID: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Folks, We've reached the point where list volume is getting significant. We need an announce list. We also could use an admin list for organizers, or people interested in getting involved in organizing. It would also be nice to start segmenting general talk discussions into: - community networking (the personal type, vs. the cat-5 type) - technical chat - help (newbie -> root) - security related discussions - misc chat etc. As proposed earlier, web forums would be ideal for this, especially if the forums had some sort of bridge to the discussion lists. With that in mind, I've started to set up some forums on the openlysecure site. I'm going to try to install the m2f plugin for phpbb, which might allow us to link the web forums with various discussion lists. if anyone cares to take a look at it, it's here: http://www.openlysecure.org/forums/index.php?c=8 Thoughts? Wes From trish Tue Jan 27 13:12:52 2004 From: trish (Trish Lynch) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:12:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <20040127131101.M37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004, Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > if anyone cares to take a look at it, it's here: > > http://www.openlysecure.org/forums/index.php?c=8 > > Thoughts? > > Wes > > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > Email's easy for me, web forums take too much time. If there was some kind of Yahoo!-like list/forum/group merge interface I'd be happy because then I can keep using my email. Otherwise email is the way, I don;t care much about volume, I filter into separate folders, and storage is cheap these days. I have email going back several years on here. -Trish -- Trish Lynch trish at bsdunix.net Ecartis Core Team trish at listmistress.org EFNet IRC Operator/SysAdmin @ irc.dkom.at AilleCat at EFNet Key fingerprint = 781D 2B47 AA4B FC88 B919 0CD6 26B2 1D62 6FC1 FF16 From jschauma Tue Jan 27 13:26:31 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:26:31 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <20040127182631.GA29263@netmeister.org> Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > As proposed earlier, web forums would be ideal for this, especially if the > forums had some sort of bridge to the discussion lists. I find email much more convenient. In fact, I wouldn't bother subscribing to or using any web forums. While an -announce list would be good, I don't think that we've reached a point where we need to split the general purpose group any further. Variety of topics is a good thing. :-) -Jan -- A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040127/5549749f/attachment.bin From okan Tue Jan 27 13:30:20 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:30:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <20040127182631.GA29263@netmeister.org> References: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> <20040127182631.GA29263@netmeister.org> Message-ID: <20040127183042.GP3905@stravinsky.khaoz.org> On Tue 2004.01.27 at 13:26 -0500, Jan Schaumann wrote: > Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > > > As proposed earlier, web forums would be ideal for this, especially if the > > forums had some sort of bridge to the discussion lists. > > I find email much more convenient. In fact, I wouldn't bother > subscribing to or using any web forums. While an -announce list would > be good, I don't think that we've reached a point where we need to split > the general purpose group any further. Variety of topics is a good > thing. :-) i second that. (and adding announce@ would make searching/limiting for such easier) okan > -Jan > > -- > A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely > foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools. > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -- From mspitze1 Tue Jan 27 13:39:27 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:39:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <20040127133927.7ba4a1d6.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:13:05 -0500 (EST) Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > Folks, > > We've reached the point where list volume is getting significant. I count 20 so far today and 41 yesterday, volume is not that bad > > We need an announce list. I agree with that > > We also could use an admin list for organizers, or people interested > > in getting involved in organizing. That I do not think we need, yet. It is still a small enough group that it is good to keep people aware of what is happening. > > It would also be nice to start segmenting general talk discussions into: > > - community networking (the personal type, vs. the cat-5 type) > - technical chat > - help (newbie -> root) > - security related discussions > - misc chat I think that this would be a bad idea at the present time, the volume is still low enough that the exposure to other sub groups is good. My personal threshold is around 150-200 messages/day before it becomes an issue for me. After all everything goes in a folder and you do not have to read it. > > etc. > > As proposed earlier, web forums would be ideal for this, especially if the > forums had some sort of bridge to the discussion lists. > > With that in mind, I've started to set up some forums on the openlysecure > site. I'm going to try to install the m2f plugin for phpbb, which might > allow us to link the web forums with various discussion lists. > > if anyone cares to take a look at it, it's here: > > http://www.openlysecure.org/forums/index.php?c=8 > > Thoughts? > > Wes Since you are doing it already I vote fewer groups is better: BSDTech Social Security We can always add more. And do we really want the linux groups there? marc From ike Tue Jan 27 13:44:47 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:44:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] I've arrived redux... In-Reply-To: <20040127072220.S37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> References: <20040127072220.S37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> Message-ID: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Jan 27, 2004, at 7:32 AM, Trish Lynch wrote: > and even do something like a FreeBSD "Munch" type thing, > where we do dinner and talk and drink and have a good time, outside the > formal meetings. > > > -Trish Thanks for the background info Trish, and anything involving food and casual etc... I'd totally help with, even if that just means cheering! :) Rocket- .ike -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.3 (Darwin) iD8DBQFAFrGfnsU/iA32NRARAi4qAJ0RrLoJ1EcOBTpKdiAkdZ5Z/KOChwCePB1D oAAn8ZmO9dRf4X0woCdqgmw= =HwiF -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From hans Tue Jan 27 13:45:56 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 10:45:56 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B1F1@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > On Tue, 27 Jan 2004, Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > > > if anyone cares to take a look at it, it's here: > > > > http://www.openlysecure.org/forums/index.php?c=8 > > > > Email's easy for me, web forums take too much time. > > If there was some kind of Yahoo!-like list/forum/group merge > interface I'd be happy because then I can keep using my email. Not to cross-promote, but we (NYPHP) are working on just such a system. While bridges exist, from what we've seen you don't get a very good system in the end. This system (clew) will be a fully integrated package from the ground up. Some links: http://paragon.nyphp.org/clew/ http://paragon.nyphp.org/clew/docs/ http://lists.nyphp.org/pipermail/dev/ We've yet to put solid documentation and feature listings online, but that last link has the discussion archives. Able bodied developers are always welcome. All this said, I do think it's time for an announce list. However, breaking the main discussion/talk list into multiple lists has not worked well in the past (at least at NYPHP). It tends to break conversation up, and makes people reluctant to post because they might be posting to the wrong list. H From dan Tue Jan 27 13:48:10 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:48:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B1F1@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <40166C1A.11063.670DFA6@localhost> On 27 Jan 2004 at 10:45, Hans Zaunere wrote: > > > On Tue, 27 Jan 2004, Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > > > > > if anyone cares to take a look at it, it's here: > > > > > > http://www.openlysecure.org/forums/index.php?c=8 > > > > > > > Email's easy for me, web forums take too much time. > > > > If there was some kind of Yahoo!-like list/forum/group merge > > interface I'd be happy because then I can keep using my email. > > Not to cross-promote, but we (NYPHP) are working on just such a system. > While bridges exist, from what we've seen you don't get a very good > system in the end. This system (clew) will be a fully integrated > package from the ground up. Some links: > > http://paragon.nyphp.org/clew/ > http://paragon.nyphp.org/clew/docs/ > http://lists.nyphp.org/pipermail/dev/ See also http://www.phorum.org/ which has bridges between forums and mailing lists. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ The first North America BSD Conference outside California: BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From pete Tue Jan 27 13:57:12 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:57:12 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <20040127182631.GA29263@netmeister.org> References: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> <20040127182631.GA29263@netmeister.org> Message-ID: <4016B488.70808@nomadlogic.org> Jan Schaumann wrote: >Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > > > >>As proposed earlier, web forums would be ideal for this, especially if the >>forums had some sort of bridge to the discussion lists. >> >> > >I find email much more convenient. In fact, I wouldn't bother >subscribing to or using any web forums. While an -announce list would >be good, I don't think that we've reached a point where we need to split >the general purpose group any further. Variety of topics is a good >thing. :-) > >-Jan > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >talk mailing list >talk at lists.nycbug.org >http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > i agree here, an -annouce list would be great. don't mind lots of chatter on my mailing lists, esp. with the "thread" feature in most modern email clients (moz, evolution). just my 2bits cheers, pete wright -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From wes Tue Jan 27 15:10:42 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 15:10:42 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <20040127131101.M37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> References: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> <20040127131101.M37139@ultra.bsdunix.net> Message-ID: <48632.38.233.93.150.1075234242.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> > If there was some kind of Yahoo!-like list/forum/group merge interface I'd > be happy because then I can keep using my email. That's essentially what I'm trying to get going. There are a number of initiatives to do this, but none are really in full production. I'll probably have to do some php hacking. > Otherwise email is the way, I don;t care much about volume, I filter into > separate folders, and storage is cheap these days. I have email going back > several years on here. I do the same, but there is an organizational win to forums for people who aren't subscribed to the lists, and don't want to subscribe, but want to easily sift through resources. The way I have the forums organized, it would take 5 or more separate mailing lists to accomplish the same thing. It's much easier for someone coming at the group for the first time to see what's going on (especially with the sticky ability on critical posts, something most mailing list archives lack). Clearly, the ideal situation is some sort of bridge... because we don't want email sophistication level creating a barrier to participation in the group. In my experience, the vast majority of email users don't know anything about filtering or mailing lists, but are very comfortable in forums. Some of these newbies might want to try a BSD. So, we'll see how successful I am at this integration thing. But it certainly doesn't minimize the need for some type of higher lieve organization... the subject line simply doesn't cut it in my book. From wes Tue Jan 27 15:33:24 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 15:33:24 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <20040127133927.7ba4a1d6.mspitze1@optonline.net> References: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> <20040127133927.7ba4a1d6.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: <55274.38.233.93.150.1075235604.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> >> It would also be nice to start segmenting general talk discussions into: ... > I think that this would be a bad idea at the present time, the volume is > still low enough that the exposure to other sub groups is good. My > personal threshold is around 150-200 messages/day before it becomes an > issue for me. After all everything goes in a folder and you do not have > to read it. I'm thinking 3 mailing lists: announce (corresponding to the NYCBUG forum category) talk (corresponding to the *BSD Technical) help (corresponding to the *BSD Help) I think we can handle those three at the moment, which corresponds to your thoughts. > We can always add more. And do we really want the linux groups there? Yes, because openlysecure is an open source site. Our lists won't be connected to the linux forums, don't worry... From wes Tue Jan 27 15:47:07 2004 From: wes (Wes Sonnenreich) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 15:47:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <40166C1A.11063.670DFA6@localhost> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B1F1@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> <40166C1A.11063.670DFA6@localhost> Message-ID: <61159.38.233.93.150.1075236427.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> I think people might be overlooking two major points here... 1) regarding volume... we all have different thresholds and time constraints. I'd like to be able to help the group, but I simply can't deal with reading more than a handful of messages a day. Therefore, I'd like to ensure that I see all the critical messages... To me, critical messages are announcements and help requests. I want to make sure that people get their questions answered, vs. lost in "chat". Therefore, even though the volume is "light" for some people, I don't think it's too soon to break into three lists: announce, talk and help. I would expect announce and help to be relatively low volume. Both should be moderated. Talk can (minus announcements and help requests) remain exactly the way it is today. We seem to have some consensus that an "announce" list is a good idea. What about a moderated-only help list? and point.. 2) This group is open to all users, especially beginners. Working with email and email lists is fast and efficient for all of us because we're all uberdorks. If we want to promote the spread of BSD into new frontiers, we need to realize that many people will want to interact with NYCBUG through a web-based interface. Frankly, I think we wan't these people posting using a web-based system that enforces decent quoting polcies and keeps things relatively on topic. Otherwise this list will also have 20 "please unsubscribe me" requests a day. Thus, I think when practical, there should definitely be a forum/list connection. I will work to make this happen as soon as possible, using one system or another! Wes From George Tue Jan 27 16:03:33 2004 From: George (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 16:03:33 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: Greetings from Apple - LinuxWorld In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6128.68.167.77.98.1075237413.squirrel@mail.sddi.net> A wise person once said. . . Leslie M. Schwartz > We have our very own genius, Ed Eigerman, Sr. Systems Engineer, who can > address many thing technical. If it gets past Ed (and it hardly ever > does), we have other resources we could bring in. Id like to start > with Ed! Our idea is to get the message out that Apple is serious > about moving into the Linux space and we have some great tools to do it > with. We want your users to carry that message (which they may or may > not know) back to their organizations, and bring us in there too. that sounds great leslie. we'll have nycbug discuss an appropriate topic for our meetings, and keep you informed. however, i must note, we are a BSD Unix group, not a linux group. BSD as in the foundation of OSX. i think that one possible topic, and i have to get back to the list, may be to talk about the origins of OSX, and its relation to its BSD origins. thanks for your followup Leslie. we look forward to working with you in the future. g From George Tue Jan 27 16:12:48 2004 From: George (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 16:12:48 -0500 (EST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: References: <20040127105659.76c91c55.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <14858.68.167.77.98.1075237968.squirrel@mail.sddi.net> > A dispassionate comparison of Linux (Debian & Gentoo are particularly > of interest to me) and FreeBSD (others also if desired). Just some > ideas on how you do things in *BSD that you do in Linux, where each > shine, etc. i think this is a great idea. not to sound snotty, but i remember seeing some post somewhere which talked about this "cool port system on gentoo" that just kicks ass, including *bsd's. do i have to explain more? i really have find it. . . g From mspitze1 Tue Jan 27 17:12:04 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 17:12:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <55274.38.233.93.150.1075235604.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> <20040127133927.7ba4a1d6.mspitze1@optonline.net> <55274.38.233.93.150.1075235604.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <20040127171204.0f7d974f.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 15:33:24 -0500 (EST) Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > >> It would also be nice to start segmenting general talk discussions > >into: > ... > > > I think that this would be a bad idea at the present time, the > > volume is still low enough that the exposure to other sub groups is > > good. My personal threshold is around 150-200 messages/day before > > it becomes an issue for me. After all everything goes in a folder > > and you do not have to read it. > > I'm thinking 3 mailing lists: > announce (corresponding to the NYCBUG forum category) > talk (corresponding to the *BSD Technical) > help (corresponding to the *BSD Help) I would use announce: meetings etc tech: technical issues, includes requests for help talk: for general/social discussion and job postings And going forward I would hope there is enough job post to warrant a jobs group also. marc From lists Tue Jan 27 17:06:26 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 17:06:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <14858.68.167.77.98.1075237968.squirrel@mail.sddi.net> References: <20040127105659.76c91c55.lists@genoverly.net> <14858.68.167.77.98.1075237968.squirrel@mail.sddi.net> Message-ID: <20040127170626.20be25a7.lists@genoverly.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 16:12:48 -0500 (EST) "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > A dispassionate comparison of Linux (Debian & Gentoo are > > particularly of interest to me) and FreeBSD (others also > > if desired). > i think this is a great idea. > > g > I could offer up a lot on Gentoo, I run it on several servers and desktops. It has been described as the most BSD of the Linux Distros. Frankly, that is what drove me to BSD. If Gentoo had emulated it in a few ways, then why not find out why, eh?. I'm still relatively new to BSD but I may be able to add to the discussion. The technical differences beg for a deeper discussion. Having said that, the appearance and feel are surprisingly similar. Here's my (unsolicited) take on that. Server: Once I got bash and nano installed I felt quite at home. Much of the directory structure and command syntax is similar. It is like jumping into your buddy's car.. you might not know how to crank the AC with searching for it for a second, but, you're gonna know how to drive it without even thinking. After one lap around the"cvsup portsfile"(emerge sync) and "cd /appname ; make install"(emerge appname) you'll be ready to compile a new kernel. Desktop: Once you get X and fluxbox (or openbox, kde, gnome, etc) loaded it will look just like any linux box. Add a browser, email, text editor, chat, and whatever else you usually run and you won't know the difference. Obviously a meeting topic wouldn't be about *fluff* like that but about gnarly tech stuff Michael -- --- From pete Tue Jan 27 17:55:13 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 17:55:13 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Laptop Needs Home Message-ID: <4016EC51.1080407@nomadlogic.org> Hey all, I have recently upgraded my IBM X23 Laptop to an X31, which leaves me with an X23 that I wish sell. Now obviously I would like to see it get into the hands of a fellow *nix hacker in my local community than to someone i don't know off e-bay or something. Right now it's got Slackware on it, but it used to run FreeBSD with no problems (I even saved my KERNEL_CONFIG for the box if you want it). If anyone is interested in this drop me a line off list. cheers, pete wright -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From mspitze1 Tue Jan 27 18:02:40 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:02:40 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <61159.38.233.93.150.1075236427.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B1F1@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> <40166C1A.11063.670DFA6@localhost> <61159.38.233.93.150.1075236427.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <20040127180240.028ade26.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 15:47:07 -0500 (EST) Wes Sonnenreich wrote: > I think people might be overlooking two major points here... > > 1) regarding volume... we all have different thresholds and time > constraints. I'd like to be able to help the group, but I simply can't > deal with reading more than a handful of messages a day. Therefore, > I'd like to ensure that I see all the critical messages... Don't worry about it, near as I can tell you are doing more then your share already. After all you wore a *Suit and Tie* at the BOF. > > To me, critical messages are announcements and help requests. I want > to make sure that people get their questions answered, vs. lost in > "chat". Most people will put Help or Problem in the subject line. > > Therefore, even though the volume is "light" for some people, I don't > think it's too soon to break into three lists: announce, talk and > help. I would expect announce and help to be relatively low volume. > Both should be moderated. Talk can (minus announcements and help > requests) remain exactly the way it is today. > > We seem to have some consensus that an "announce" list is a good idea. > > What about a moderated-only help list? Who moderates? This person will be hated, "what do you mean its not a problem???! YOU ASSHOLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!". Moderating a news group is a shitty job that I really do not think any of us want. And we would need at least 3 to ensure that messages go through the system in a timely manner, vacations , sick time, long days at work, etc. Now we need a policy to ensure consistent moderation, who is going to write it and how do we agree to it as a group? Think UDP best effort is all we guarantee. If on the other hand people need professional levels of support then let them hire/contract someone for the job. > > and point.. > > 2) This group is open to all users, especially beginners. Working with > email and email lists is fast and efficient for all of us because > we're all uberdorks. If we want to promote the spread of BSD into new > frontiers, we need to realize that many people will want to interact > with NYCBUG through a web-based interface. I am sorry, but I disagree everybody knows how to use email. They know how to create folders and filter rules(its real easy with current software). > > Frankly, I think we wan't these people posting using a web-based > system that enforces decent quoting polcies and keeps things > relatively on topic. Otherwise this list will also have 20 "please > unsubscribe me" requests a day. And who decides what the policies are? Where are they posted? And how is this different from them just not coming back to the web page? > > Thus, I think when practical, there should definitely be a forum/list > connection. I will work to make this happen as soon as possible, using > one system or another! In all honesty the forum I could live without. Better archiving software for the list and good searching/rating software for the archive would be useful. The highest rated messages would come up first in the system on a search and people could say this is good or bad, it helped me or it did not. What I want is for the list archive to turn into a self generating FAQ. marc From ike Tue Jan 27 18:11:08 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:11:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] list volume, starting web-forums and other lists In-Reply-To: <55274.38.233.93.150.1075235604.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> References: <13052.38.233.93.150.1075227185.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> <20040127133927.7ba4a1d6.mspitze1@optonline.net> <55274.38.233.93.150.1075235604.squirrel@intranet.sagesecure.com> Message-ID: <16ECB737-511E-11D8-912D-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> On Jan 27, 2004, at 3:33 PM, Wes Sonnenreich wrote: >> I think that this would be a bad idea at the present time, the volume >> is >> still low enough that the exposure to other sub groups is good. My >> personal threshold is around 150-200 messages/day before it becomes an >> issue for me. After all everything goes in a folder and you do not >> have >> to read it. > > I'm thinking 3 mailing lists: > announce (corresponding to the NYCBUG forum category) > talk (corresponding to the *BSD Technical) > help (corresponding to the *BSD Help) > > I think we can handle those three at the moment, which corresponds to > your > thoughts. I'd be cool with this- 3 lists isn't too wild to manage, and separates content nicely IMHO- especially announce, so folks who aren't talking in the group daily, can keep informed of what's going on and not get totally out of the loop- Rocket- .ike From ike Tue Jan 27 18:17:08 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 18:17:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Possible topics for future meetings In-Reply-To: <20040127170626.20be25a7.lists@genoverly.net> References: <20040127105659.76c91c55.lists@genoverly.net> <14858.68.167.77.98.1075237968.squirrel@mail.sddi.net> <20040127170626.20be25a7.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: On Jan 27, 2004, at 5:06 PM, michael wrote: > On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 16:12:48 -0500 (EST) > "G. Rosamond" wrote: > >>> A dispassionate comparison of Linux (Debian & Gentoo are >>> particularly of interest to me) and FreeBSD (others also >>> if desired). > >> i think this is a great idea. >> >> g >> > > I could offer up a lot on Gentoo, I run it on several > servers and desktops. It has been described as the most BSD > of the Linux Distros. Frankly, that is what drove me to > BSD. If Gentoo had emulated it in a few ways, then why not > find out why, eh?. I'm still relatively new to BSD but I > may be able to add to the discussion. > > The technical differences beg for a deeper discussion. > Having said that, the appearance and feel are surprisingly > similar. Here's my (unsolicited) take on that. > > Server: Once I got bash and nano installed I felt > quite at home. Much of the directory structure and command > syntax is similar. It is like jumping into your buddy's > car.. you might not know how to crank the AC with > searching for it for a second, but, you're gonna know how to > drive it without even thinking. After one lap around > the"cvsup portsfile"(emerge sync) and "cd /appname ; make > install"(emerge appname) you'll be ready to compile a new > kernel. > > Desktop: Once you get X and fluxbox (or openbox, kde, > gnome, etc) loaded it will look just like any linux box. > Add a browser, email, text editor, chat, and whatever else > you usually run and you won't know the difference. > > Obviously a meeting topic wouldn't be about *fluff* like > that but about gnarly tech stuff > > Michael Michael, this equivalents list for Gentoo totally rocks. I'd love to see this information go up somewhere more formally- as your experiences here provide an excellent bridge. Rocket- .ike From lists Tue Jan 27 16:22:19 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 21:22:19 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: Greetings from Apple - LinuxWorld In-Reply-To: <6128.68.167.77.98.1075237413.squirrel@mail.sddi.net> References: <6128.68.167.77.98.1075237413.squirrel@mail.sddi.net> Message-ID: <20040127211825.O77560@zoraida.natserv.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > that sounds great leslie. we'll have nycbug discuss an appropriate topic > for our meetings, and keep you informed. Trimmed the To/CC list a bit... One thing that I would find very interesting is to find out how much can be done under the hood with OS X for those of us coming from a BSD background. For example what open source packages can be installed and which ones Apple is actually supporting/porting(?) officialy. From joshmccormack Tue Jan 27 23:01:06 2004 From: joshmccormack (Josh McCormack) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:01:06 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] still a ways from done In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <40173402.2040307@travelersdiary.com> G. Rosamond wrote: > > ->At the risk of being blasphemous, I'm going to open my mouth. > ->I really like the work that Jeff has done but... do you think > ->it might be a little too 'daemonic'. Granted we ALL > ->understand the mascot -- and the history that goes back to > ->very early users manuals (4.3?), but, imagine seeing that for > ->the first time. As someone said about other art.. this would > ->be a cool t-shirt. > > see you're point, and you're right in many ways.. .but. . .you're being > blashphemous > > ->I'll admit, it is a subtle and creative use of a very > ->over-used theme, but does it fit what we were hoping to > ->evoke? Michael > > yes. . .we want to piss off jerry falwell. > > g As a Christian, and someone with a sense of humor (I like to think, at least), who also understands that a daemon is not an angel of the devil, how about taking it up a notch - if this is about NYC, why not have an apple on there, too? A pointed red tail and an apple - what a cool double entendre. Imagine that logo in front of a scene of central park (Eden)... is that a triple entendre? Josh From george Tue Jan 27 23:28:01 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:28:01 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] slashdot fbsd discussion Message-ID: okay, okay. . .i know we don't want a list that echos slashdot, but this is great. . .osnews does a mediocre at best review of fbsd 5.2, a new technology release that the author doesn't quite get, and slashdot explodes with. . .insight, not trolls. . . http://bsd.slashdot.org/bsd/04/01/28/0151236.shtml?tid=122&tid=185&tid=1 90 here's the best one of the lot. . . What kind of crack are they smoking? (Score:1) by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday January 27, @09:43PM (#8108306) Not usable as a desktop? Over 10,000 apps available now. Not usable as a desktop? Gnome2, Openoffice, Mozilla, Gaim, Linux binary compatability, DVD-R support, over 100 different email apps. Not usable as a desktop? Because DHCP and USB don't work? Here's an idea: GET A FUCKING CLUE. I just installed 5.2 on a Toshiba Laptop. EVERYTHING WORKS. USB, DHCP, CDRW, NIC, EVERYTHING. if the OP is too much of a moron to figure out FreeBSD 5.2, he'd better stick to Windows. *shakes head* FreeBSD is ugly to install...but once done it's a damned fine OS for the money. This review was typical of the kind of simpleton garbage seen from OSNews. A slashdot-wannabe in a field of 1000s. -30- again, i'll apologize, but it's a riot to read . . . g From george Tue Jan 27 23:44:23 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:44:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . Message-ID: okay. ..how about this. . . jobs: to be sent out by whoever to various headhunters and used by anyone who knows something available. . . newusers: for new users with basic questions announce: an infrequent listing of events. ..monthly meetings, bsdcan, etc talk: the current list, which would cover everything else. . .logos, future meeting topics, etc. g From george Tue Jan 27 23:47:36 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:47:36 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] tekserve. . . Message-ID: wes: did you talk to tekserve. . . with the list almost 80 members and almost 50 in the bof last thursday, i'm a little concerned about feb 4. . .plus a number of people at the ny php meeting come up to me and said they'd be there. . .i didn't ask them. . . tekserve would be easy, since it's across the street. . . g From george Wed Jan 28 06:33:14 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 06:33:14 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: Greetings from Apple - LinuxWorld In-Reply-To: <401651AF.21990.609AD32@localhost> Message-ID: ->Anyone replying to the above message: please be very discreet and ->careful with what you say and to whom. It wouldn't help to go ->flaming off in some direction and have that CC'd to Apple... thanks dan . . . how does everyone feel about the way i dealt? i think i represented the attitude of the group. it's a general question we should have more discussion about though. g From lists Wed Jan 28 06:36:16 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 06:36:16 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040128063616.05cd80e5.lists@genoverly.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:44:23 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > okay. ..how about this. . . > > newusers: for new users with basic questions > I'm uncomfortable with the elitist label 'newuser'. Where would you post *your* questions? Do you even have questions anymore, have you stopped learning, George? "support" is a bridge. "support" sounds -inclusive-... not -us&them-. "support" is a welcome place where you get answers not RTFM. My List of Lists admin - not public - administrative list announce - read only - user group news and public announcements support - public - discussion/help list talk - public - current list, very open if needed:jobs - public - optimistic, thanks george I'm NOT volunteering for moderator on any of these (today) so they may stay open for a while until a group of people step up. Provided this gets wildly popular, like we all hope, the support structure can be expanded to support.hardware, support.installation, support.desktop, support.grid, etc.. The same goes for the admin list. The small group of people re-working the web site may want a private list composed of non-admin people: admin.website. Or another group may be plotting: admin.ShutMichealUp You get the idea, Michael -- From george Wed Jan 28 06:42:14 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 06:42:14 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: <20040128063616.05cd80e5.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: ->> okay. ..how about this. . . ->> newusers: for new users with basic questions ->I'm uncomfortable with the elitist label 'newuser'. Where 'elitest'? then call it support.. . ->would you post *your* questions? Do you even have questions ->anymore, have you stopped learning, George? i'm the only one who has patience with me. . . ->"support" is a bridge. ->"support" sounds -inclusive-... not -us&them-. ->"support" is a welcome place where you get answers not RTFM. okay tiger. ->My List of Lists ->admin - not public - administrative list ->announce - read only - user group news and public announcements ->support - public - discussion/help list ->talk - public - current list, very open ->if needed:jobs - public - optimistic, thanks george things are happening around with jobs. . .it could at least be a vehicle for headhunters. . .people will learn that nycbug has a higher quality of technical people than your average ug. agree on all except admin. . .what goes in there, concretely? ->I'm NOT volunteering for moderator on any of these (today) so ->they may stay open for a while until a group of people step up. ah, great. lots of proposals, no volunteering. . . what is this, congress? ->Provided this gets wildly popular, like we all hope, the ->support structure can be expanded to support.hardware, ->support.installation, support.desktop, support.grid, etc.. ->The same goes for the admin list. The small group of people ->re-working the web site may want a private list composed of ->non-admin people: admin.website. Or another group may be ->plotting: admin.ShutMichealUp *i'll* volunteer for the last one. . . ;-) seriously, i do that that would be the appropriate trajectory. i like these ideas michael, i just don't see the point of admin yet. we don't have much of an infrastructure, and i think the 'admin' related issues fit under talk/general for now. . . g From john Wed Jan 28 06:50:32 2004 From: john (John Bacalle) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 06:50:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040128115032.GB3026@dancer> * George Rosamond [20040127 23:44]: > jobs: to be sent out by whoever to various headhunters and used by > anyone who knows something available. . . > talk: the current list, which would cover everything else. . .logos, > future meeting topics, etc. You should merge jobs@ with -talk at . It works fine at other organizations. John From ike Wed Jan 28 07:17:57 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 07:17:57 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: Greetings from Apple - LinuxWorld In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <01F88B6F-518C-11D8-AF4F-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Word G, On Jan 28, 2004, at 6:33 AM, G. Rosamond wrote: > ->Anyone replying to the above message: please be very discreet and > ->careful with what you say and to whom. It wouldn't help to go > ->flaming off in some direction and have that CC'd to Apple... > > thanks dan . . . > > how does everyone feel about the way i dealt? > > i think i represented the attitude of the group. > > it's a general question we should have more discussion about though. While I thought your response was sharp, I believe it was perfectly appropriate and clearly communicated things that the Apple Sales-Marketing teams are grappling with right now; they are obviously very green with Open Source. I would also throw out that it may be in their best interest for them to attend some NYCBUG meetings first, so they can begin to listen and understand what's going on, to gain some contextual understanding in order to be able to formulate a meaningful exchange in the future...(?) Rocket- .ike From mspitze1 Wed Jan 28 08:21:28 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 08:21:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040128082128.465d8be5.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:44:23 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > okay. ..how about this. . . > > jobs: to be sent out by whoever to various headhunters and used by > anyone who knows something available. . . not yet, we do not have enough volume for it. Ok we do not have any volume for it now. Besides it gives everybody a good feeling to see jobs/contracts posted even if you are not looking at this moment, put it in talk and/or tech(see below) > > newusers: for new users with basic questions Why segregate the "new user" from the rest of us? Just call it "Tech" where we deal with technical questions. No problems with announce or talk. marc From lists Wed Jan 28 03:24:14 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 08:24:14 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040128082212.U83414@zoraida.natserv.net> On Tue, 27 Jan 2004, G. Rosamond wrote: > jobs: to be sent out by whoever to various headhunters and used by > anyone who knows something available. . . > > newusers: for new users with basic questions > > announce: an infrequent listing of events. ..monthly meetings, bsdcan, > etc > > talk: the current list, which would cover everything else. . .logos, > future meeting topics, etc. I think too many lists for such little traffic may be counterproductive. Personally I vote for keeping the single list for now. From george Wed Jan 28 08:22:59 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 08:22:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: <20040128082128.465d8be5.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: ->> jobs: to be sent out by whoever to various ->headhunters and used by ->> anyone who knows something available. . . ->not yet, we do not have enough volume for it. Ok we do not ->have any volume for it now. Besides it gives everybody a ->good feeling to see jobs/contracts posted even if you are not ->looking at this moment, put it in talk and/or tech(see below) agree. ->> newusers: for new users with basic questions ->Why segregate the "new user" from the rest of us? ->Just call it "Tech" where we deal with technical questions. agree. ->No problems with announce or talk. okay. ..how does everyone else feel? g From hans Wed Jan 28 08:42:13 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 05:42:13 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B2CA@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > I think too many lists for such little traffic may be > counterproductive. > Personally I vote for keeping the single list for now. I agree. I think we've seen 3 or 4 posts that were actual technical questions... no reason to segregate them. Also, a moderated announce list is an important part of building an audience for attending meetings, events, etc. so I'm for that. H From dan Wed Jan 28 08:46:08 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 08:46:08 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B2CA@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <401776D0.28489.A82C9B6@localhost> On 28 Jan 2004 at 5:42, Hans Zaunere wrote: > > > I think too many lists for such little traffic may be > > counterproductive. > > Personally I vote for keeping the single list for now. > > I agree. I think we've seen 3 or 4 posts that were actual technical > questions... no reason to segregate them. Also, a moderated announce > list is an important part of building an audience for attending > meetings, events, etc. so I'm for that. So far, talk is sufficient for our needs. An announcement list is needed for those who do not wish to follow the talk list, but do wish to be informed of upcoming events. That list should be moderated. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From mspitze1 Wed Jan 28 08:48:26 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 08:48:26 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: <20040128063616.05cd80e5.lists@genoverly.net> References: <20040128063616.05cd80e5.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <20040128084826.0d7b8bc5.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 06:36:16 -0500 michael wrote: > On Tue, 27 Jan 2004 23:44:23 -0500 > "G. Rosamond" wrote: > > > okay. ..how about this. . . > > > > newusers: for new users with basic questions > > > > I'm uncomfortable with the elitist label 'newuser'. Where would you > post *your* questions? Do you even have questions anymore, have you > stopped learning, George? > > "support" is a bridge. "support" is kind of elitist also, after all there are those that provide support and those who ask for it. Also what if I want to have a technical discussion where does it go? To beat the dead horse of "tech" the list it is a place to put support questions after all, "why cann't I start X?" is technical and so is "what do you think of the new features in *BSD ver X?" > "support" sounds -inclusive-... not -us&them-. > "support" is a welcome place where you get answers not RTFM. > > My List of Lists > admin - not public - administrative list I do not think we have the user base for it, possibly later if admin stuff swamps the list it can fork off. Right now if you need to highlight admin requests just put [Admin] in the subject for the first message. marc > > Provided this gets wildly popular, like we all hope, the support > structure can be expanded to support.hardware, support.installation, > support.desktop, support.grid, etc.. The same goes for the admin list. > The small group of people re-working the web site may want a private > list composed of non-admin people: admin.website. Or another group > may be plotting: admin.ShutMichealUp In all honesty if this get really popular I would like to turn it into a news server instead of mailing lists or web board, That way if I go away for 2 weeks I do not get mail bombed when I check it and important messages do not get rejected because my mailbox is full. Again outlook, outlook express, thunderbird have very easy news client setups as does emacs. Just do not expire news and instant archive, slap a web front end for searching/reading/posting and you are done. marc > > You get the idea, > Michael > > -- > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From george Wed Jan 28 09:17:24 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 09:17:24 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: <20040128141301.22316.qmail@web60605.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: ->Hi George, -> It was nice to meet you at the LWE. Always good to ->put a face to the name. I would volunteer to moderate ->a list such as newuser or support or tech or whatever ->it gets called. I am definitely new to BSD and Linux ->but work from home and am on and off the computer many ->times during the day. I can recognize spam and or the ->beginnings of a flame war as well as anyone. -> The group seems to be off to a good start and is ->comprised of some really nice folks. -> all the best, pleasure meeting you face-to-face also Bob. i think we need to make some decisions about what list or lists first, then we can move on. . . but i'm sure all appreciate your offer. let's all keep that in mind. i personally don't feel that strongly about either route, but will move with whatever the collective decision is wholeheartedly. . . i agree we're off to a good start, and am pretty excited for the feb 4th meeting. . .and was stunned at the success of the LWE bof. g g From jschauma Wed Jan 28 11:00:00 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:00:00 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: <401776D0.28489.A82C9B6@localhost> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B2CA@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> <401776D0.28489.A82C9B6@localhost> Message-ID: <20040128160000.GA29820@netmeister.org> Dan Langille wrote: > So far, talk is sufficient for our needs. An announcement list is > needed for those who do not wish to follow the talk list, but do wish > to be informed of upcoming events. That list should be moderated. Agreed. -Jan -- This one's tricky. You have to use imaginary numbers, like eleventeen... -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040128/08bfa5a6/attachment.bin From pete Wed Jan 28 10:58:11 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 10:58:11 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B2CA@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> References: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B2CA@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> Message-ID: <4017DC13.8040803@nomadlogic.org> Hans Zaunere wrote: >>I think too many lists for such little traffic may be >>counterproductive. >>Personally I vote for keeping the single list for now. >> >> > >I agree. I think we've seen 3 or 4 posts that were actual technical questions... no reason to segregate them. Also, a moderated announce list is an important part of building an audience for attending meetings, events, etc. so I'm for that. > >H > >_______________________________________________ >talk mailing list >talk at lists.nycbug.org >http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > her here, an annouce list i think should be the first non "talk" list we might want to fork off. i know of atleast one person that is interested on the NycBug, but does not really have time to participate in the daily talk list. as for other lists, i think they should grow organically as we need them, altho a little planning ahead would be nice ;) cheers, pete -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From george Wed Jan 28 11:00:18 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:00:18 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: <4017DC13.8040803@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: ->Hans Zaunere wrote: ->>>I think too many lists for such little traffic may be ->>>counterproductive. ->>>Personally I vote for keeping the single list for now. ->>I agree. I think we've seen 3 or 4 posts that were actual technical ->>questions... no reason to segregate them. Also, a moderated ->announce ->>list is an important part of building an audience for attending ->>meetings, events, etc. so I'm for that. ->>H ->her here, -> an annouce list i think should be the first non "talk" ->list we might ->want to fork off. i know of atleast one person that is interested on ->the NycBug, but does not really have time to participate in the daily ->talk list. as for other lists, i think they should grow ->organically as ->we need them, altho a little planning ahead would be nice ;) -> ->cheers, -> pete i agree . . .that makes the most sense. no, i'm not wishy washy, but i do hear what people are saying. . . others? yes or no. . . g From mspitze1 Wed Jan 28 11:02:54 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:02:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: References: <4017DC13.8040803@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20040128110254.62b9f39f.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:00:18 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > ->Hans Zaunere wrote: > ->>>I think too many lists for such little traffic may be > ->>>counterproductive. > ->>>Personally I vote for keeping the single list for now. > ->>I agree. I think we've seen 3 or 4 posts that were actual technical > ->>questions... no reason to segregate them. Also, a moderated > ->announce > ->>list is an important part of building an audience for attending > ->>meetings, events, etc. so I'm for that. > ->>H > ->her here, > -> an annouce list i think should be the first non "talk" > ->list we might > ->want to fork off. i know of atleast one person that is interested on > ->the NycBug, but does not really have time to participate in the daily > ->talk list. as for other lists, i think they should grow > ->organically as > ->we need them, altho a little planning ahead would be nice ;) > -> > ->cheers, > -> pete > > i agree . . .that makes the most sense. > > no, i'm not wishy washy, but i do hear what people are saying. . . > > others? > > yes or no. . . > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From okan Wed Jan 28 11:06:04 2004 From: okan (Okan Demirmen) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:06:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: References: <4017DC13.8040803@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20040128160626.GW3905@stravinsky.khaoz.org> On Wed 2004.01.28 at 11:00 -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > ->Hans Zaunere wrote: > ->>>I think too many lists for such little traffic may be > ->>>counterproductive. > ->>>Personally I vote for keeping the single list for now. > ->>I agree. I think we've seen 3 or 4 posts that were actual technical > ->>questions... no reason to segregate them. Also, a moderated > ->announce > ->>list is an important part of building an audience for attending > ->>meetings, events, etc. so I'm for that. > ->>H > ->her here, > -> an annouce list i think should be the first non "talk" > ->list we might > ->want to fork off. i know of atleast one person that is interested on > ->the NycBug, but does not really have time to participate in the daily > ->talk list. as for other lists, i think they should grow > ->organically as > ->we need them, altho a little planning ahead would be nice ;) > -> > ->cheers, > -> pete > > i agree . . .that makes the most sense. > > no, i'm not wishy washy, but i do hear what people are saying. . . > > others? > > yes or no. . . yes. announce@ and talk@ > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk -- From mspitze1 Wed Jan 28 11:10:44 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:10:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] the lists. . . In-Reply-To: References: <4017DC13.8040803@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <20040128111044.45946099.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:00:18 -0500 "G. Rosamond" wrote: > ->Hans Zaunere wrote: > ->>>I think too many lists for such little traffic may be > ->>>counterproductive. > ->>>Personally I vote for keeping the single list for now. > ->the NycBug, but does not really have time to participate in the daily > ->talk list. as for other lists, i think they should grow > ->organically as > ->we need them, altho a little planning ahead would be nice ;) > -> > ->cheers, > -> pete > > i agree . . .that makes the most sense. > > no, i'm not wishy washy, but i do hear what people are saying. . . > > others? > > yes or no. . . yes announce and talk, with more to follow as needed. And if we do move to nntp I will admin it, unless someone else wants to do it. On a somewhat related point I think a lot of the gateway between web and list would go away with nntp. I do believe that there are good mail-list <->nntp<-> web gateways, like gmane.org, out there. And there is no need to use intergrated package there are mail to news gateways and news to web gateways out there also. marc > > g > > _______________________________________________ > talk mailing list > talk at lists.nycbug.org > http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From pete Wed Jan 28 11:58:39 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:58:39 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBI at user group? Message-ID: <4017EA3F.8020308@nomadlogic.org> dont' know how many of you caught this article, has some interesting info, like how the FBI uses OSX on the Desktop. http://theregister.co.uk/content/55/35175.html The conclusion is what caught my eye, for the impatient: "My advice: call your local FBI and see if they won't come visit your class, or Users Group, or club. I guarantee you'll learn something." ...learn something indeed ;^) -pete -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From ike Wed Jan 28 12:14:41 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 12:14:41 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBI at user group? In-Reply-To: <4017EA3F.8020308@nomadlogic.org> References: <4017EA3F.8020308@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <7610D046-51B5-11D8-AF4F-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> On Jan 28, 2004, at 11:58 AM, Pete Wright wrote: > dont' know how many of you caught this article, has some interesting > info, like how the FBI uses OSX on the Desktop. > http://theregister.co.uk/content/55/35175.html > > The conclusion is what caught my eye, for the impatient: > "My advice: call your local FBI and see if they won't come visit your > class, or Users Group, or club. I guarantee you'll learn something." > > ...learn something indeed ;^) OMG. Now THAT's a wild meeting guest suggestion! Bring em' in! Rocket- .ike From pete Wed Jan 28 12:21:28 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 12:21:28 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBI at user group? In-Reply-To: <7610D046-51B5-11D8-AF4F-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> References: <4017EA3F.8020308@nomadlogic.org> <7610D046-51B5-11D8-AF4F-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> Message-ID: <4017EF98.3090505@nomadlogic.org> Isaac Levy wrote: > On Jan 28, 2004, at 11:58 AM, Pete Wright wrote: > >> dont' know how many of you caught this article, has some interesting >> info, like how the FBI uses OSX on the Desktop. >> http://theregister.co.uk/content/55/35175.html >> >> The conclusion is what caught my eye, for the impatient: >> "My advice: call your local FBI and see if they won't come visit your >> class, or Users Group, or club. I guarantee you'll learn something." >> >> ...learn something indeed ;^) > > > OMG. Now THAT's a wild meeting guest suggestion! > Bring em' in! > > Rocket- > .ike > hey if it works out i'd even bring fake glasses and mustache's for everyone to wear ;) -pete -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From ike Wed Jan 28 12:26:22 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 12:26:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBI at user group? In-Reply-To: <4017EF98.3090505@nomadlogic.org> References: <4017EA3F.8020308@nomadlogic.org> <7610D046-51B5-11D8-AF4F-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> <4017EF98.3090505@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <175E45DF-51B7-11D8-AF4F-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> On Jan 28, 2004, at 12:21 PM, Pete Wright wrote: > hey if it works out i'd even bring fake glasses and mustache's for > everyone to wear ;) > -pete That'd be SOOOOO HOT. .ike From rbrown Wed Jan 28 12:33:54 2004 From: rbrown (Rodrick R. Brown) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 12:33:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBI at user group? In-Reply-To: <4017EA3F.8020308@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <200401281732.i0SHW2GV089379@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> I have some contacts with a few FBI agents in the computer crime division maybe I can get one of them to give a talk at the next meet up or something someone contact me off list if interested. - RB -----Original Message----- From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org [mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Pete Wright Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2004 11:59 AM To: talk at lists.nycbug.org Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBI at user group? dont' know how many of you caught this article, has some interesting info, like how the FBI uses OSX on the Desktop. http://theregister.co.uk/content/55/35175.html The conclusion is what caught my eye, for the impatient: "My advice: call your local FBI and see if they won't come visit your class, or Users Group, or club. I guarantee you'll learn something." ...learn something indeed ;^) -pete -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete _______________________________________________ talk mailing list talk at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk From ike Wed Jan 28 12:39:27 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 12:39:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBI at user group? In-Reply-To: <200401281732.i0SHW2GV089379@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> References: <200401281732.i0SHW2GV089379@kremlin.eliteplanet.net> Message-ID: On Jan 28, 2004, at 12:33 PM, Rodrick R. Brown wrote: > I have some contacts with a few FBI agents in the computer crime > division > maybe I can get one of them to give a talk at the next meet up or > something > someone contact me off list if interested. > Rodrick: go for it, says me!!! (though I'm in no position to decide this), Seriously folks, I've never heard of a user-group having the FBI give a talk. This could be pretty interesting- now I'll go splash some cold water on my face or something here and get back to work. Rocket- .ike From joshmccormack Wed Jan 28 12:44:50 2004 From: joshmccormack (joshmccormack at travelersdiary.com) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 11:44:50 -0600 (CST) Subject: [nycbug-talk] FBI at user group? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 28 Jan 2004, Isaac Levy wrote: > On Jan 28, 2004, at 12:33 PM, Rodrick R. Brown wrote: > > > I have some contacts with a few FBI agents in the computer crime > > division > > maybe I can get one of them to give a talk at the next meet up or > > something > > someone contact me off list if interested. > > > > Rodrick: go for it, says me!!! (though I'm in no position to decide > this), > > Seriously folks, I've never heard of a user-group having the FBI give a > talk. This could be pretty interesting- now I'll go splash some cold > water on my face or something here and get back to work. > > Rocket- > .ike Me too! Maybe we could ask the NSA to stop just lurking and start contributing, too! :) Josh From pete Wed Jan 28 13:10:31 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 13:10:31 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Bacula Message-ID: <4017FB17.1080208@nomadlogic.org> i have a quick question regarding Bacula for anyone that was at the demo at LWE. i'm implementing Bacula at my job using FreeBSD (go figure) and was wondering if Bacula spools data to the machine which controlls the Tape drive like Amanda. I've read a fair amount of the doc/FAQ's and havn't seen anything yet. I know this is the NYCBUG list, but hopefully someone that saw the demo might remember/know. cheers, pete -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright email: pete at nomadlogic.org mobile: 917.415.9866 web: www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From george Wed Jan 28 13:12:42 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 13:12:42 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Bacula In-Reply-To: <4017FB17.1080208@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of Pete Wright ->Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2004 1:11 PM ->To: 'NYC Bug List' ->Subject: [nycbug-talk] Bacula ->i have a quick question regarding Bacula for anyone that was ->at the demo ->at LWE. i'm implementing Bacula at my job using FreeBSD (go ->figure) and ->was wondering if Bacula spools data to the machine which ->controlls the ->Tape drive like Amanda. I've read a fair amount of the doc/FAQ's and ->havn't seen anything yet. I know this is the NYCBUG list, ->but hopefully ->someone that saw the demo might remember/know. -> -> ->cheers, -> pete dan, the presenter, happens to be on this list. . . so, live from ottawa. . . g From dan Wed Jan 28 14:44:46 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 14:44:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Bacula In-Reply-To: <4017FB17.1080208@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <4017CADE.11952.BCB2880@localhost> On 28 Jan 2004 at 13:10, Pete Wright wrote: > i have a quick question regarding Bacula for anyone that was at the demo > at LWE. i'm implementing Bacula at my job using FreeBSD (go figure) and > was wondering if Bacula spools data to the machine which controlls the > Tape drive like Amanda. I've read a fair amount of the doc/FAQ's and > havn't seen anything yet. I know this is the NYCBUG list, but hopefully > someone that saw the demo might remember/know. Get then onto the Bacula Users mailing list at http://www.bacula.org/ It does, in a way. But it's not like Amanda. Sorry, I'm on my way out and can't type more than that now. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From george Wed Jan 28 18:58:38 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2004 18:58:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] RE: Feb 4th meeting In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20040128163733.00a57f00@pop-server.nyc.rr.com> Message-ID: ->-----Original Message----- ->From: Brillig [mailto:brillig at nyc.rr.com] ->Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2004 4:55 PM ->To: george at nycbug.org ->Subject: Feb 4th meeting -> -> ->Hello NYCBUG, -> ->While looking for interesting sites about BSD, I came across your ->announcement of the Feb 4th meeting at ->http://www.nycbug.org/futuremeetings.html. I'm very ->interested in attending ->and am just verifying that there have been no changes in the ->time or place. -> ->I look forward to attending. -> ->Regards, ->Jim Chadwick greetings jim. we're on for feb 4th, and look forward to meeting you. same time, same place. . . join us on the mailing list. g From dan Thu Jan 29 08:12:48 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 08:12:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Conference registration system Message-ID: <4018C080.26130.F8AB75B@localhost> Does anyone happen to have, sitting around, a conference registration system? Databases and website are what I do, but I'd rather not write one if there's one available. Freshmeat has one, phpmyconferences, but it's not in good shape. The other solutions for conference do not include registration. Cheers. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From lists Thu Jan 29 10:03:38 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 10:03:38 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] google bsd news Message-ID: <20040129100338.4a26ee4e.lists@genoverly.net> I found this google feature that you may not know about. You type in a search term and google automatically delivers an email with fresh links from that day's spidering. I've had it for a few weeks for "BSD" and it is pretty cool. Getting one email a day is barely noticable and I've gotten great links from sites I don't normally visit. http://www.google.com/newsalerts?hl=en Would it interest anyone to have it delivered to the list? Michael -- --- From jschauma Thu Jan 29 10:17:33 2004 From: jschauma (Jan Schaumann) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 10:17:33 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] google bsd news In-Reply-To: <20040129100338.4a26ee4e.lists@genoverly.net> References: <20040129100338.4a26ee4e.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <20040129151733.GC22981@netmeister.org> michael wrote: > http://www.google.com/newsalerts?hl=en > > Would it interest anyone to have it delivered to the list? I think that signing up a mailing list for any service is a Very Bad Idea. People interested in signing up for this service can do so themselves -- no need to increase regular list traffic. We wouldn't sign up talk at lists.nycbug.org to, say, netbsd-advocacy at netbsd.org or netbsd-help at netbsd.org either, even though surely the posts would be ``on topic''. -Jan -- You can blame it all on the Internet. Larry Wall -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040129/dd467113/attachment.bin From dan Thu Jan 29 10:16:07 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 10:16:07 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] google bsd news In-Reply-To: <20040129100338.4a26ee4e.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <4018DD67.2444.FFB9F7F@localhost> On 29 Jan 2004 at 10:03, michael wrote: > Would it interest anyone to have it delivered to the list? It's a great service. I use it. I would rather not have it delivered to the list. Those interested can subscribe to the Google service. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From lists Thu Jan 29 10:14:47 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 10:14:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] google bsd news In-Reply-To: <20040129151733.GC22981@netmeister.org> References: <20040129100338.4a26ee4e.lists@genoverly.net> <20040129151733.GC22981@netmeister.org> Message-ID: <20040129101447.1d018f0b.lists@genoverly.net> got it... google service : good add to list : bad -- --- From george Thu Jan 29 11:00:15 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 11:00:15 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] google bsd news In-Reply-To: <20040129101447.1d018f0b.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: ->-----Original Message----- ->From: talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org ->[mailto:talk-bounces at lists.nycbug.org] On Behalf Of michael ->Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2004 10:15 AM ->To: talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] google bsd news ->got it... -> ->google service : good ->add to list : bad ditto. .. From vaibhav Thu Jan 29 13:43:54 2004 From: vaibhav (VaibhaV Sharma) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 13:43:54 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] How to enable pccard/PCMCIA cards? Message-ID: <1075401833.5537.5.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> Hello, I am trying to use a Netgear MA401 on my laptop which is running FB5.1. I think I am not able to enable the pccard service. :) I did the following - - Put in these in /etc/rc.conf pccard_enable="YES" pccard_mem="DEFAULT" pccard_beep="2" pccard_ifconfig="YES" pccardd_flags="-z" pccard_conf="/etc/defaults/pccard.conf" pccard_ether_delay="5" rebooted and nothing seems to happen related to the pccard. Tried starting it manually too - -------------------------------------- -su-2.05b# /etc/rc.d/pccard start -su-2.05b# -su-2.05b# /etc/rc.d/pccard rcvar # pccard -su-2.05b# -------------------------------------- Any ideas what I might be missing here? Thanks, VaibhaV http://vsharma.net From lists Thu Jan 29 13:52:10 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 13:52:10 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] How to enable pccard/PCMCIA cards? In-Reply-To: <1075401833.5537.5.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> References: <1075401833.5537.5.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> Message-ID: <20040129135210.3d443a63.lists@genoverly.net> On Thu, 29 Jan 2004 13:43:54 -0500 VaibhaV Sharma wrote: > Hello, > I am trying to use a Netgear MA401 on my laptop which is > running FB5.1. > I don't think I see it on the supported hardware list... http://www.freebsd.org/releases/5.2R/hardware-i386.html#ETHERNET -- --- From vaibhav Thu Jan 29 14:04:34 2004 From: vaibhav (VaibhaV Sharma) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 14:04:34 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] How to enable pccard/PCMCIA cards? In-Reply-To: <20040129135210.3d443a63.lists@genoverly.net> References: <1075401833.5537.5.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <20040129135210.3d443a63.lists@genoverly.net> Message-ID: <1075403074.5537.9.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> On Thu, 2004-01-29 at 13:52, michael wrote: > On Thu, 29 Jan 2004 13:43:54 -0500 > VaibhaV Sharma wrote: > > > Hello, > > I am trying to use a Netgear MA401 on my laptop which is > > running FB5.1. > > > > I don't think I see it on the supported hardware list... > http://www.freebsd.org/releases/5.2R/hardware-i386.html#ETHERNET MA401 is a wifi card, supposed to work with the wi driver. I found the details here - http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=wi&sektion=4&manpath=FreeBSD+5.2-RELEASE The page lists MA401 as - Netgear MA401 Prism-II/2.5 PCMCIA But even before I can get to the driver loading stage, need to enable pccard service. Which I am not able to figure out. VaibhaV http://vsharma.net From its Thu Jan 29 14:24:22 2004 From: its (Brad Schonhorst) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 14:24:22 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] re:Conference registration system Message-ID: >Does anyone happen to have, sitting around, a conference registration >system? I'm not sure what types of information you need but MRBS (meeting room booking system) seems to work well for us. Its a php/mysql solution: http://mrbs.sourceforge.net/ -brad ______________ Brad Schonhorst Network Administrator Village Community School 272 West 10th St. NY NY 10014 212-691-5146 Ext. 222 From vaibhav Thu Jan 29 14:40:03 2004 From: vaibhav (VaibhaV Sharma) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 14:40:03 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] How to enable pccard/PCMCIA cards? In-Reply-To: <40195C5A.9070205@nomadlogic.org> References: <1075401833.5537.5.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <20040129135210.3d443a63.lists@genoverly.net> <1075403074.5537.9.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <40195C5A.9070205@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <1075405202.5537.15.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> On Thu, 2004-01-29 at 14:17, Pete Wright wrote: > >>I don't think I see it on the supported hardware list... > >>http://www.freebsd.org/releases/5.2R/hardware-i386.html#ETHERNET > >> > >> > > > >The page lists MA401 as - > > > >Netgear MA401 Prism-II/2.5 PCMCIA > i assume you have the Prism driver compiled into your kernel? not to > point out the obvious tho...if you do what does dmesg say about the card > on bootup? Yup. I have that in the kernel. Config file - # Wireless NIC cards device wlan # 802.11 support device an # Aironet 4500/4800 802.11 wireless NICs. device awi # BayStack 660 and others device wi # WaveLAN/Intersil/Symbol 802.11 wireless NICs. #device wl # Older non 802.11 Wavelan wireless NIC. The wi driver supports MA401. Correct me if I am wrong, my point is that even before the kernel can get to the PCMCIA card, it should have the driver for the pcmcia subsystem. How do I enable the pcmcia services? /etc/rc.d/pccard start does not seem to do anything. VaibhaV http://vsharma.net From pete Thu Jan 29 14:51:55 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 14:51:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] How to enable pccard/PCMCIA cards? In-Reply-To: <1075405202.5537.15.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> References: <1075401833.5537.5.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <20040129135210.3d443a63.lists@genoverly.net> <1075403074.5537.9.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <40195C5A.9070205@nomadlogic.org> <1075405202.5537.15.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> Message-ID: <4019645B.7030601@nomadlogic.org> VaibhaV Sharma wrote: >On Thu, 2004-01-29 at 14:17, Pete Wright wrote: > > >>>>I don't think I see it on the supported hardware list... >>>>http://www.freebsd.org/releases/5.2R/hardware-i386.html#ETHERNET >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>The page lists MA401 as - >>> >>>Netgear MA401 Prism-II/2.5 PCMCIA >>> >>> > > > >>i assume you have the Prism driver compiled into your kernel? not to >>point out the obvious tho...if you do what does dmesg say about the card >>on bootup? >> >> > >Yup. I have that in the kernel. Config file - > ># Wireless NIC cards >device wlan # 802.11 support >device an # Aironet 4500/4800 802.11 wireless NICs. >device awi # BayStack 660 and others >device wi # WaveLAN/Intersil/Symbol 802.11 wireless NICs. >#device wl # Older non 802.11 Wavelan wireless NIC. > >The wi driver supports MA401. > >Correct me if I am wrong, my point is that even before the kernel can >get to the PCMCIA card, it should have the driver for the pcmcia >subsystem. How do I enable the pcmcia services? /etc/rc.d/pccard start >does not seem to do anything. > > i'm not a PCMCIA expert, but that should do it aslong you have support in your kernel for PCMCIA. In your dmesg log, how does it report PCMCIA detection? -pete -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From vaibhav Thu Jan 29 15:00:05 2004 From: vaibhav (VaibhaV Sharma) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 15:00:05 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] How to enable pccard/PCMCIA cards? In-Reply-To: <4019645B.7030601@nomadlogic.org> References: <1075401833.5537.5.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <20040129135210.3d443a63.lists@genoverly.net> <1075403074.5537.9.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <40195C5A.9070205@nomadlogic.org> <1075405202.5537.15.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <4019645B.7030601@nomadlogic.org> Message-ID: <1075406404.5537.20.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> On Thu, 2004-01-29 at 14:51, Pete Wright wrote: > VaibhaV Sharma wrote: > > >Correct me if I am wrong, my point is that even before the kernel can > >get to the PCMCIA card, it should have the driver for the pcmcia > >subsystem. How do I enable the pcmcia services? /etc/rc.d/pccard start > >does not seem to do anything. > > > > > i'm not a PCMCIA expert, but that should do it aslong you have support > in your kernel for PCMCIA. In your dmesg log, how does it report PCMCIA > detection? Ah! Thanks for making me do that again. I missed the cardbus dmesg output the last time I checked. Just for the records if anyone else is searching for this, dmesg had this - cbb0: Could not grab register memory Googled and someone suggested putting this in /boot/loader.conf - hw.pci.allow_unsupported_io_range=1 and viola! it works now - ------------------------------- cbb0: irq 10 at device 6.0 on pci2 cardbus0: on cbb0 pccard0: <16-bit PCCard bus> on cbb0 wi0: at port 0x100-0x13f irq 10 function 0 config 1 on pccard0 wi0: 802.11 address: 00:30:ab:14:07:8f wi0: using RF:PRISM2 MAC:HFA3841 CARD:HWB3163-SST-flash wi0: Intersil Firmware: Primary (0.3.0), Station (1.3.4) wi0: supported rates: 1Mbps 2Mbps 5.5Mbps 11Mbps ------------------------------- Thank you very much, VaibhaV http://vsharma.net From pete Thu Jan 29 15:13:29 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 15:13:29 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] How to enable pccard/PCMCIA cards? In-Reply-To: <1075406404.5537.20.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> References: <1075401833.5537.5.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <20040129135210.3d443a63.lists@genoverly.net> <1075403074.5537.9.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <40195C5A.9070205@nomadlogic.org> <1075405202.5537.15.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> <4019645B.7030601@nomadlogic.org> <1075406404.5537.20.camel@dalfry.ishisystems.com> Message-ID: <40196969.7020003@nomadlogic.org> VaibhaV Sharma wrote: >On Thu, 2004-01-29 at 14:51, Pete Wright wrote: > > >>VaibhaV Sharma wrote: >> >> >> >>>Correct me if I am wrong, my point is that even before the kernel can >>>get to the PCMCIA card, it should have the driver for the pcmcia >>>subsystem. How do I enable the pcmcia services? /etc/rc.d/pccard start >>>does not seem to do anything. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>i'm not a PCMCIA expert, but that should do it aslong you have support >>in your kernel for PCMCIA. In your dmesg log, how does it report PCMCIA >>detection? >> >> > >Ah! Thanks for making me do that again. I missed the cardbus dmesg >output the last time I checked. > >Just for the records if anyone else is searching for this, dmesg had >this - > > cbb0: Could not grab register memory > >Googled and someone suggested putting this in /boot/loader.conf - > > hw.pci.allow_unsupported_io_range=1 > >and viola! it works now - > >------------------------------- >cbb0: irq 10 at device 6.0 on pci2 >cardbus0: on cbb0 >pccard0: <16-bit PCCard bus> on cbb0 > >wi0: at port 0x100-0x13f irq 10 >function 0 config 1 on pccard0 >wi0: 802.11 address: 00:30:ab:14:07:8f >wi0: using RF:PRISM2 MAC:HFA3841 CARD:HWB3163-SST-flash >wi0: Intersil Firmware: Primary (0.3.0), Station (1.3.4) >wi0: supported rates: 1Mbps 2Mbps 5.5Mbps 11Mbps >------------------------------- > >Thank you very much, > >VaibhaV >http://vsharma.net > > >_______________________________________________ >talk mailing list >talk at lists.nycbug.org >http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk > > woo hoo! good to hear it. -pete -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From dan Thu Jan 29 15:39:09 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 15:39:09 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] re:Conference registration system In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4019291D.32518.112366B0@localhost> On 29 Jan 2004 at 14:24, Brad Schonhorst wrote: > >Does anyone happen to have, sitting around, a conference registration > >system? > > I'm not sure what types of information you need but MRBS (meeting room > booking system) seems to work well for us. Its a php/mysql solution: > > http://mrbs.sourceforge.net/ Do you use it to take the registrations of attendees? I didn't see anything like that when I looked at it. Basically I need a way to enter speakers, their topic, their venue, their bio. And when you register for BSDCan, it takes your email address, name, postal address, etc. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From george Thu Jan 29 17:54:32 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 17:54:32 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] greetings to new subscribers. . . Message-ID: since linux world expo, this list has exploded with posts and new subscribers. welcome to the mailing list for nycbug, and we are looking forward to seeing you at our Feb 4th meeting on obsd security, given by one of the list members, wes sonnenreich. feel free at any point to introduce yourself to the list. and we are currently looking to revise the www site, including areas to post software and book reviews. it looks like nycbug/nyphp member jeff is going to be finalizing our official logo soon. . . g From ike Thu Jan 29 17:57:55 2004 From: ike (Isaac Levy) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 17:57:55 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] greetings to new subscribers. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9334456E-52AE-11D8-BB49-000393B2B406@lesmuug.org> On Jan 29, 2004, at 5:54 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > it looks like nycbug/nyphp member jeff > is going to be finalizing our official logo soon. . . Go Jeff!!! rocket- .ike From jeffknight Thu Jan 29 17:59:04 2004 From: jeffknight (PUTAMARE) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 17:59:04 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] greetings to new subscribers. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Jan 29, 2004, at 5:54 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: > it looks like nycbug/nyphp member jeff is going to be finalizing our > official logo soon. . . I'm also trying to get the site converted to XHTML as soon as possible, so we can begin a redesign using only .css which will make collaboration much easier. Jeff Knight jeff not junkmail at lushmedia.com 212/213-6558 x 203 LUSH media 110 W 40th St #1502 New York, NY 10018 From george Thu Jan 29 18:01:47 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 18:01:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] greetings to new subscribers. . . In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ->On Jan 29, 2004, at 5:54 PM, G. Rosamond wrote: ->> it looks like nycbug/nyphp member jeff is going to be finalizing our ->> official logo soon. . . ->I'm also trying to get the site converted to XHTML as soon as ->possible, ->so we can begin a redesign using only .css which will make ->collaboration much easier. ->Jeff Knight nice jeff. . .that would be great. . . g From pete Thu Jan 29 19:06:47 2004 From: pete (Pete Wright) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 19:06:47 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] greetings to new subscribers. . . In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4019A017.6030903@nomadlogic.org> G. Rosamond wrote: >feel free at any point to introduce yourself to the list. > > don't mind if i do :) my name is pete wright, i'm a sys admin at a visual effect studio here in the city. basicly i get paid to hack IRIX, Linux and BSD, which ain't too bad. i'm pretty excited about joining the BUG, and think i'll prolly be going the BSDCAN con. in May. so enough with the AA type intro, i guess all i have to say is i'm pretty excited to be meeting you all, and hopefully we'll all have some fun hacking in the future ;^) -pete -- ~~~oO00Oo~~~ Pete Wright pete at nomadlogic.org www.nomadlogic.org/~pete From mspitze1 Thu Jan 29 19:40:23 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 19:40:23 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Fw: Mailing list creation request for list announce-nycbug Message-ID: <20040129194023.0a26a720.mspitze1@optonline.net> Am I the only one getting these things? marc Begin forwarded message: Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 17:57:29 -0500 (EST) From: dummy-owner at lists.nycbug.org To: dummy-owner at lists.nycbug.org Subject: Mailing list creation request for list announce-nycbug The mailing list `announce-nycbug' has been created via the through-the-web interface. In order to complete the activation of this mailing list, the proper /etc/aliases (or equivalent) file must be updated. The program `newaliases' may also have to be run. Here are the entries for the /etc/aliases file: announce-nycbug: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman post announce-nycbug" announce-nycbug-admin: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman admin announce-nycbug" announce-nycbug-bounces: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman bounces announce-nycbug" announce-nycbug-confirm: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman confirm announce-nycbug" announce-nycbug-join: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman join announce-nycbug" announce-nycbug-leave: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman leave announce-nycbug" announce-nycbug-owner: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman owner announce-nycbug" announce-nycbug-request: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman request announce-nycbug" announce-nycbug-subscribe: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman subscribe announce-nycbug" announce-nycbug-unsubscribe: "|/usr/local/nycbugmailman/mail/mailman unsubscribe announce-nycbug" _______________________________________________ Dummy mailing list Dummy at lists.nycbug.org http://lists.nycbug.org/mailman/listinfo/dummy From lists Thu Jan 29 15:35:28 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 20:35:28 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Taking the plunge to self-employment Message-ID: <20040129202900.Y2678@zoraida.natserv.net> As a new year present my employer made me join the unemployment line. :-( Although I keep an eye on the market and have been sending resumes, I am considering trying to work for myself.. I am on my second consulting company (had to close the first due to having issues with partners). I have a handfull of clients that produce steady, but relatively little, income. Anyone else has gone self-employed in the last few years in the NYC area? Specially in the computer area. As for health insurance, one of my clients is going to see if he can help me by including me into his health insurance as a part time employee. The most difficult part for me is going to be without a doubt learning to market myself and looking for new clients. Although I have been doing consulting for 10+ years it was always a side venture and new clients were always referals. I am also looking for business forums. Anyone knows of any? In particular small business or entepreneur forums. From mspitze1 Thu Jan 29 22:39:02 2004 From: mspitze1 (Marc Spitzer) Date: Thu, 29 Jan 2004 22:39:02 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Taking the plunge to self-employment In-Reply-To: <20040129202900.Y2678@zoraida.natserv.net> References: <20040129202900.Y2678@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: <20040129223902.20368005.mspitze1@optonline.net> On Thu, 29 Jan 2004 20:35:28 +0000 (GMT) Francisco Reyes wrote: > Anyone else has gone self-employed in the last few years in the NYC > area? Specially in the computer area. yes > The most difficult part for me is going to be without a doubt learning > to market myself and looking for new clients. Although I have been > doing consulting for 10+ years it was always a side venture and new > clients were always referals. Manhattan chamber of commerce might be worth a look > > I am also looking for business forums. Anyone knows of any? In > particular small business or entepreneur forums. ICCA(icca.org) has monthly meetings, some are good some are not so good. marc From george Fri Jan 30 00:08:05 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 00:08:05 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc conference? Message-ID: as i told everyone last week, there was a meeting of various user groups and tech associations last week. the model is linuxtag, an open source conference held in germany. nils and klaus (of linux knoppix) attended and set the direction. at this point a meeting is planned for feb 8th, to include two delegates from each group. i notified some people in the group, as the meeting was arranged less than 24 hours before, and only michael attended with me. . .of course hans was there, but he's ny php. and john, but he's nylug. and ike, but he's lesmuug. i was going to wait until our feb 4th meeting, but it seems like we really should determine our delegates asap. currently, michael and i have been involved in the discussions pretty heavily, so i'd propose become the official nycbug delegates. but let me give everyone some background in the issue. . . there's a number of linux user groups in nyc, almost as many as there were distros in 1999. my attitude, and i think michael's also, was hey, we're all in this together, let's be cool. some people i mentioned earlier, had more experience with some of the people and groups. i knew some people, as in "hey how you doing" kind of way, but not much more. since the first meeting, things have gotten a bit out of hand. there are endless discussions about trivial points, feigned personal attacks, oversensitivity, and so on. so far, i think a number of us have been pretty sober and attempted to move things forward, and haven't been provoking, as some are, or leading things off in a stupid direction. let me wrap up here, since i'm being a bit vague. if anyone has a problem with me and michael, if he wants, being the delegates, speak up now. i know that some of you others are capable of becoming delegates from other groups, and i strongly encourage you to do so if possible. the more sanity in the room, the better. i'd gladly provide more details if anyone is interested. in general, there's a real great possibility to fill the vacuum filled by macworld and linux world expo fleeing nyc (it's starting to feel like the 70's again). however, sober thought and a collective approach are incumbent upon all parties involved, and without those things, the effort is doomed. g From john Fri Jan 30 05:22:36 2004 From: john (John Bacalle) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 05:22:36 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc conference? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20040130102236.GB1589@dancer> * George Rosamond [20040130 00:08]: > i know that some of you others are capable of becoming delegates from > other groups, and i strongly encourage you to do so if possible. Your point cannot be overstated. > however, sober thought and a collective approach are incumbent upon > all parties involved, and without those things, the effort is doomed. (Your point cannot be overstated) * 2. John -- John Bacalle Put that NIC in my hand and let me flit out the jams! From its Fri Jan 30 09:33:27 2004 From: its (Brad Schonhorst) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 09:33:27 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: Conference registration system In-Reply-To: <4019291D.32518.112366B0@localhost> References: <4019291D.32518.112366B0@localhost> Message-ID: <44C64FE7-5331-11D8-B063-000A9573D036@vcsnyc.org> On Jan 29, 2004, at 3:39 PM, Dan Langille wrote: > On 29 Jan 2004 at 14:24, Brad Schonhorst wrote: > >>> Does anyone happen to have, sitting around, a conference registration >>> system? >> >> I'm not sure what types of information you need but MRBS (meeting room >> booking system) seems to work well for us. Its a php/mysql solution: >> >> http://mrbs.sourceforge.net/ > > Do you use it to take the registrations of attendees? I didn't see > anything like that when I looked at it. Basically I need a way to > enter speakers, their topic, their venue, their bio. And when you > register for BSDCan, it takes your email address, name, postal > address, etc. > -- > Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ > BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ > Actually we are using it to reserver computer equipment (digital cameras, laptops, digital projectors, etc) rather than rooms. It sounds like MRBS may not be what you are looking for. I guess I wasn't sure what you needed. -brad From dan Fri Jan 30 09:38:02 2004 From: dan (Dan Langille) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 09:38:02 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Re: Conference registration system In-Reply-To: <44C64FE7-5331-11D8-B063-000A9573D036@vcsnyc.org> References: <4019291D.32518.112366B0@localhost> Message-ID: <401A25FA.24215.14FF382A@localhost> On 30 Jan 2004 at 9:33, Brad Schonhorst wrote: > > On Jan 29, 2004, at 3:39 PM, Dan Langille wrote: > > > On 29 Jan 2004 at 14:24, Brad Schonhorst wrote: > > > >>> Does anyone happen to have, sitting around, a conference registration > >>> system? > >> > >> I'm not sure what types of information you need but MRBS (meeting room > >> booking system) seems to work well for us. Its a php/mysql solution: > >> > >> http://mrbs.sourceforge.net/ > > > > Do you use it to take the registrations of attendees? I didn't see > > anything like that when I looked at it. Basically I need a way to > > enter speakers, their topic, their venue, their bio. And when you > > register for BSDCan, it takes your email address, name, postal > > address, etc. > > -- > > Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ > > BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ > > > Actually we are using it to reserver computer equipment (digital > cameras, laptops, digital projectors, etc) rather than rooms. It > sounds like MRBS may not be what you are looking for. I guess I wasn't > sure what you needed. But then, I wasn't very specific. -- Dan Langille : http://www.langille.org/ BSDCan - http://www.bsdcan.org/ From george Fri Jan 30 09:50:51 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 09:50:51 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc conference? In-Reply-To: <20040130102236.GB1589@dancer> Message-ID: ->> i know that some of you others are capable of becoming ->delegates from ->> other groups, and i strongly encourage you to do so if possible. ->Your point cannot be overstated. thanks john. ->> however, sober thought and a collective approach are incumbent upon ->> all parties involved, and without those things, the effort ->is doomed. ->(Your point cannot be overstated) * 2. thanks x2 john. i said this before, but the slogan should be pessimism of the mind, optimism of the will. there's a good core of people who i think are incredibly intelligent, have the right approach, and want to move forward. that should be the focus. if list members are interested in this discussion, we can continue. or we can take it off list if you're bored out of your mind. g From george Fri Jan 30 11:08:14 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 11:08:14 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] feb 4th meeting Message-ID: as everyone knows, our first monthly meeting will be feb 4th with wes sonnenreich speaking about openbsd security. this weekend will be a great time to advertise the meeting, and get a reminder out to the various channels. . . i'll hit daemon news, the fbsd lists. any other volunteers. you can use the listing on the www site as a guide for text. g From hans Fri Jan 30 12:14:08 2004 From: hans (Hans Zaunere) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 09:14:08 -0800 Subject: [nycbug-talk] feb 4th meeting Message-ID: <41EE526EC2D3C74286415780D3BA9F8752B634@ehost011-1.exch011.intermedia.net> > this weekend will be a great time to advertise the meeting, and get a > reminder out to the various channels. . . > > i'll hit daemon news, the fbsd lists. any other volunteers. > > you can use the listing on the www site as a guide for text. I'll get something out to NYPHP on Sunday. H From george Fri Jan 30 12:14:49 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 12:14:49 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sco on netcraft. . . Message-ID: if you're not on netcraft's list, you're missing out on some great humor and insight from the premier www server stat site. often used as the evidence that "bsd is dying" by the slashdot.org trolls, netcraft.com runs on bsd. this article, in particular, is very humorous. it's related to the mydoom virus and the countdown to the ddos attack on sco feb 1. http://news.netcraft.com/archives/2004/01/30/wwwscocom_is_a_weapon_of_ma ss_destruction.html g From lists Fri Jan 30 08:08:15 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 13:08:15 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Taking the plunge to self-employment In-Reply-To: <20040129223902.20368005.mspitze1@optonline.net> References: <20040129202900.Y2678@zoraida.natserv.net> <20040129223902.20368005.mspitze1@optonline.net> Message-ID: <20040130130702.P9787@zoraida.natserv.net> On Thu, 29 Jan 2004, Marc Spitzer wrote: > > Anyone else has gone self-employed in the last few years in the NYC > > area? Specially in the computer area. > > yes How long have you been doing it? > Manhattan chamber of commerce might be worth a look Thanks. From truk Fri Jan 30 13:25:59 2004 From: truk (Kurt Miller) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 13:25:59 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] feb 4th meeting References: Message-ID: <03e601c3e75e$82bc5ab0$200110ac@truk> From: "G. Rosamond" > as everyone knows, our first monthly meeting will be feb 4th with wes > sonnenreich speaking about openbsd security. > > this weekend will be a great time to advertise the meeting, and get a > reminder out to the various channels. . . > > i'll hit daemon news, the fbsd lists. any other volunteers. > I submitted it to www.deadly.org. From george Fri Jan 30 20:15:50 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 20:15:50 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] feb 4th meeting In-Reply-To: <03e601c3e75e$82bc5ab0$200110ac@truk> Message-ID: ->-----Original Message----- ->From: Kurt Miller [mailto:truk at optonline.net] ->Sent: Friday, January 30, 2004 1:26 PM ->To: george at sddi.net; talk at lists.nycbug.org ->Subject: Re: [nycbug-talk] feb 4th meeting >I submitted it to www.deadly.org. nice. . .let's see if they run it before march now. . . g From george Fri Jan 30 20:19:20 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 20:19:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sco & netcraft. . . Message-ID: for more. . .there's now a discussion on fbsd chat. . . g From ray Fri Jan 30 22:37:44 2004 From: ray (Ray) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 22:37:44 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] feb 4th meeting In-Reply-To: References: <03e601c3e75e$82bc5ab0$200110ac@truk> Message-ID: <20040131033743.GG29828@cybertron.cyth.net> On Fri, Jan 30, 2004 at 08:15:50PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > >I submitted it to www.deadly.org. > nice. . .let's see if they run it before march now. . . They generally don't take very long to post. -Ray- From truk Fri Jan 30 22:42:56 2004 From: truk (Kurt Miller) Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 22:42:56 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] feb 4th meeting References: <03e601c3e75e$82bc5ab0$200110ac@truk> <20040131033743.GG29828@cybertron.cyth.net> Message-ID: <051401c3e7ac$50639300$200110ac@truk> From: "Ray" > On Fri, Jan 30, 2004 at 08:15:50PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > >I submitted it to www.deadly.org. > > nice. . .let's see if they run it before march now. . . > > They generally don't take very long to post. > More can submit and it may increase the likelihood it gets posted. -Kurt From george Sat Jan 31 02:46:37 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 02:46:37 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] recommended purchase. . . Message-ID: couldn't recommend this any better. . . http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/watches/5eec/ a sans instructor of mine had this, and booted a pc with netbsd off it. haven't gotten around to that yet, but it's a great resource. and *not* bulky at all. . . i wasn't and am still not the type to wear calculator watches. g From john Sat Jan 31 02:35:41 2004 From: john (John Bacalle) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 02:35:41 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] feb 4th meeting In-Reply-To: <051401c3e7ac$50639300$200110ac@truk> <20040131033743.GG29828@cybertron.cyth.net> References: <03e601c3e75e$82bc5ab0$200110ac@truk> <20040131033743.GG29828@cybertron.cyth.net> <051401c3e7ac$50639300$200110ac@truk> <03e601c3e75e$82bc5ab0$200110ac@truk> <20040131033743.GG29828@cybertron.cyth.net> Message-ID: <20040131073541.GA6291@dancer> * Ray [20040130 22:37]: > On Fri, Jan 30, 2004 at 08:15:50PM -0500, G. Rosamond wrote: > > >I submitted it to www.deadly.org. > > nice. . .let's see if they run it before march now. . . > > They generally don't take very long to post. Jose took 24+ hours to *post* my submission in Jan 7. However, he added the information I relayed within 15 minutes to source-changes at . Go figure. Wasn't like there any fresh postings during the same timespan. * Kurt Miller [20040130 22:42]: > More can submit and it may increase the likelihood it gets posted. Jose is busy, it's a one man operation, I'd think you'd just peeve him off. I'd write him a nice brief mail asking him politely for timeliness. John From george Sat Jan 31 10:52:41 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 10:52:41 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] sco, once again. . . Message-ID: well, in light of the ddos attacks set for tomorrow by the mydoom virus, sco made a change with their web hosting operating system. http://uptime.netcraft.com/perf/graph?site=www.sco.com it makes total sense from the security angle. . . wonder if the *bsd family is still in the sights of sco's ip foolishness. . . g From lists Sat Jan 31 12:08:20 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 12:08:20 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYCBUG LIbrary Message-ID: <20040131120820.02d22187.lists@genoverly.net> ALL, O'Reilly would like to welcome NYCBUG to their User Group program and has released their first title for our review. While only one was directly BSD related, it was still a very generous gesture. All books in our 'Library', are available for any member to 'check-out'. In return, it would be nice to have a written review. The Complete FreeBSD, 4th Edition Documentation from the Source By Greg Lehey April 2003 ISBN: 0-596-00516-4 This new edition, covering version 5 of FreeBSD, is now available through O'Reilly Community Press. It is an eminently practical guidebook that explains not only how to get a computer up and running with the FreeBSD operating system, but also how to turn it into a highly functional and secure server that can host large numbers of users and disks, support remote access, and provide web service, mail service, and other key parts of the Internet infrastructure Linux Security Cookbook By Daniel J. Barrett, Richard Silverman, Robert G. Byrnes June 2003 ISBN: 0-596-00391-9 The Linux Security Cookbook includes real solutions to a wide range of targeted problems, such as sending encrypted email within Emacs, restricting access to network services at particular times of day, firewalling a webserver, preventing IP spoofing, setting up key-based SSH authentication, and much more. With over 150 ready-to-use scripts and configuration files, this unique book helps administrators secure their systems without having to look up specific syntax. The NYCBUG Library messages will continue to be sent to the list until the Library web pages are finished. Michael -- From lists Sat Jan 31 12:08:46 2004 From: lists (michael) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 12:08:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] NYCBUG LIbrary Message-ID: <20040131120846.60dee2b4.lists@genoverly.net> ALL, Addison-Wesley & Prentice Hall PTR would like to welcome NYCBUG to their User Group program and has released their first title for our review. While this may not be directly BSD related, it was still a very generous gesture. This book, as all books in our 'Library', is available for any member to 'check-out'. In return, it would be nice to have a written review. > You have just been shipped a review copy of the new book, "C++ GUI > Programming with Qt 3", by Mark Summerfield and Jasmin Blanchette. > > This is the first official Qt book guide from Trolltech-the developers > of the Qt technology- and authored by Jasmin Blanchette, > Trolltech's senior software engineer and Mark Summerfield, > Trolltech's documentation manager. > > "C++ GUI Programming with Qt 3" is designed to teach solid > Qt programming practices, while including the most current > information on Qt 3.2.x and a CD-ROM exclusive to the book, > which features a non-commercial edition for Windows, > as well as a Borland C++ 5 non-commercial edition, > a Borland C++ 6.0 Trial Edition, and a Qt 3.2 edition > for UNIX/Linux and Mac OS X. > The NYCBUG Library messages will continue to be sent to the list until the Library web pages are finished. Michael -- From lists Sat Jan 31 17:22:09 2004 From: lists (Francisco Reyes) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 22:22:09 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mail message headers Message-ID: <20040131221900.J23087@zoraida.natserv.net> Anyone knows of a good link on how to read message headers? I have an idea, but would welcome understanding it better. In particular how to determine the point of origin. I don't think the email below came from me,but want to double check. Am I reading the email below correctly by saying it was sent from IP 24.236.105.243? ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: 1 Feb 2004 01:55:20 -0000 From: System Anti-Virus Administrator To: francisco at natserv.com Subject: virus found in sent message "hello" Attention: francisco at natserv.com A virus was found in an Email message you sent. ............... --- MAILFROM: francisco at natserv.com Received: from user-24-236-105-243.knology.net (HELO natserv.com) (24.236.105.243) by mx3.hrnoc.net with SMTP; 1 Feb 2004 01:55:19 -0000 From: francisco at natserv.com To: john at scalabium.com Subject: hello Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 20:55:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_F84A52BD.46D0F411" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal --- From george Sat Jan 31 23:21:48 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 23:21:48 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] Mail message headers In-Reply-To: <20040131221900.J23087@zoraida.natserv.net> Message-ID: ->Anyone knows of a good link on how to read message headers? ->I have an idea, but would welcome understanding it better. ->In particular how to determine the point of origin. ->I don't think the email below came from me,but want to double check. -> ->Am I reading the email below correctly by saying it was sent ->from IP 24.236.105.243? -> ->---------- Forwarded message ---------- ->Date: 1 Feb 2004 01:55:20 -0000 ->From: System Anti-Virus Administrator ->To: francisco at natserv.com ->Subject: virus found in sent message "hello" -> -> ->Attention: francisco at natserv.com -> -> ->A virus was found in an Email message you sent. -> ->............... ->--- ->MAILFROM: francisco at natserv.com ->Received: from user-24-236-105-243.knology.net (HELO ->natserv.com) (24.236.105.243) -> by mx3.hrnoc.net with SMTP; 1 Feb 2004 01:55:19 -0000 ->From: francisco at natserv.com ->To: john at scalabium.com ->Subject: hello ->Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 20:55:33 -0500 ->MIME-Version: 1.0 ->Content-Type: multipart/mixed; -> boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_F84A52BD.46D0F411" ->X-Priority: 3 ->X-MSMail-Priority: Normal did some googling. . . http://support.shaw.ca/networks/internetabuse.htm check out section E. this virus has been spoofing addresses left and right. up to 85% of my mail has been this virus. it would be logical that if mail servers were performing dns lookups, this whole mess would cease. my domain has been rbl'd a few times, but frankly, it's completely idiotic if mail servers aren't authenticating incoming mail in the most basic way. . . but then again, i wouldn't be able to send out mail via my business domain if verizon didn't allow me to use their smtp servers. . . g From george Sat Jan 31 23:39:52 2004 From: george (G. Rosamond) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 23:39:52 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] /. Message-ID: this isn't the *first* time i got mod 5, but it's the first time *not* as an anon coward. . . Yahoo! small business account? (Score:5, Interesting) by GMan00 (747881) on Saturday January 31, @04:39PM (#8146130) (http://www.nycbug.org/) At LWE, while tabling for NYC *BSD User Group [nycbug.org], someone from SCO approached me. I asked him his thoughts about SCO's foolish crusade, and he said, "Hey, we would have been out of business in December if they didn't." So I guess Solution Number 1 may be plausible for fiscal reasons also. [ Reply to This ] it's in reference to the humorous netcraft.com story about how sco should deal with the ddos attacks starting feb 1. . . and yes, this happened at the table. . . g From scottro Sat Jan 31 23:56:46 2004 From: scottro (Scott Robbins) Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 23:56:46 -0500 Subject: [nycbug-talk] nyc.rr.com trouble? Message-ID: <20040201045646.GA14385@scottro11.homeunix.net> I'm just wondering if anyone else is having this happen. It seems that since the snowstorm, or perhaps since mydoom, that my nyc.rr.com has been iffy, fading in and out, losing connectivity for 30-60 seconds, then going back to normal. I'm wondering any other rr.com users are having the same trouble. Thanks -- Scott Robbins PGP keyID EB3467D6 ( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 D575 EB34 67D6 ) gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6 Riley: Buffy . . . I feel like we've gotten really close. At least I thought we had. I don't know much about Angel or your relationship with him . . but . . . all I ask is . . if you're gonna break heart, do it fast. Buffy: What? You think that Angel and I... Riley: Didn't you? Buffy: No. Of course not. How can you even ask me that? Riley: I don't know. Xander said... Buffy: Xander?! Oh, he's the deadest man in Deadonia. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 187 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://lists.nycbug.org/pipermail/talk/attachments/20040131/84eb54d5/attachment.bin